Contador blasts LA

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the vagabond

Jul 23, 2009
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Most respondents are underestimating the seriousness of the protocol violation of Contador's attacking move on Wednesday. Things were getting better until then, and that changed a lot. And now he has gone off verbally and contradicted himself - he has earlier said many times that he looked up to and respected Lance. No one is denying Contador has been in a tough spot all along, but he's the one who has escalated the situation, not Lance. And I agree, Lance has a lot more friends in the peloton than Contador. 26-year-old prima donnas don't cut it - AC has made a big mistake.
 
scribe

scribe

Jul 22, 2009
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This is hilarious! I love how journalists are mining forums and message areas for news.....

http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/tourdefrance/2009/07/28/1248546709218.html

The picture is the best part. Surely this author posts here, right????

470-contador.jpg
 
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richwagmn

Jun 18, 2009
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What's so interesting about Lance's latest tweets is how he tries to turn AC's comments about himself into a comment about the team. AC said nothing about Astana at all.

Is LA inferring that AC couldn't have won the tour without him there? Or does he think HE is the team?
 
Publicus

Publicus

Mar 17, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
JB does not need a "guaranteed job". WTF? He retired after Discovery went south. What else does he need to accomplish?

Contador put the MJ at total risk because he is not team oriented. Not wanting to be team oriented in a sport that demads it = uncoachable.
Click to expand...

You asked a question, I provided the logical answer. The MJ was NEVER in jeopardy. It sounds good to say that, but the only argument you can build to support is built on a bunch of conditional statements that you can't support. He was on the road, with two GC contenders, thought he could get away and didn't. Once he realized he couldn't he shut it down. How that put the MJ jeopardy is beyond me--Kloden NEVER paced Contador on that ride (he was sitting on Contador's wheel). If there was an attack Contador couldn't respond to, do you think Kloden was going to close it down? I never saw that the entire Tour, but maybe I missed a stage or two where he did it.
 
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richwagmn

Jun 18, 2009
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Thoughtforfood said:
I saw a real one of those on the ceiling of the Tour of Nevada City Bike Shop. Pretty sweet Serotta (I think)
Click to expand...

Are you saying the Treks are rebadged? Be a lot of work to have a another company produce a bike that looks just like the one you produce so you can put your badge on it.

I'm confused.
 
Publicus

Publicus

Mar 17, 2009
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richwagmn said:
What's so interesting about Lance's latest tweets is how he tries to turn AC's comments about himself into a comment about the team. AC said nothing about Astana at all.

Is LA inferring that AC couldn't have won the tour without him there? Or does he think HE is the team?
Click to expand...

I tweeted him that question. I wonder if I'll get a response. :rolleyes:
 
P

pmcg76

Mar 6, 2009
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There is a few thing that need to be ironed out here.

Lance gained time on stage 3 when he didnt need to/Contador gained time on the stage to Andorra when he didnt need to.

Kloeden lost out when Contador attacked/Kloeden lost out when he paced Lance on the stage to Verbier even though he was clearly stronger than Lance and could have dropped him by more than 6 seconds.

Nobody at Astana other than the Lance stooges have criticised Contador, dont hear the Kazakh sponsors saying AC should have waited on Kloeden.

Either Kloeden or Lance could have finished on the podium, not both as A.Schleck was 2nd best in the Tour.

Kloeden has not criticised AC at any time for his actions so cannot be too bothered even though he was clearly angry with his final TT, he wasnt strong enough to be on the peloton.

AC has not criticised anyone at Astana other than Lance/Lance has not criticised anyone at Astana other than AC.

Perhaps AC made a mistake in attacking but who remembers Lance bonking and almost losing the Tour in 2000 or once riding too strongly for his team in the TTT dropping them. He made mistakes also and it would have been far more costly for his them team-mates financially if he didnt win.

Everything at Postal was dedicated to Lance even though there were guys like Hamilton, Heras, Landis who were capable of possibly winning the Tour themselves or stages at the least. If Bruyneel had grasped the bull by the horns and used the same format and made AC team leader based on performances over the last few years, all other problems would have been solved and maybe Contador may have been more supportive of his team-mates. Contador has been favourite to win this Tour since last July. Bruyneel created the problems himself.

Getting another team-mate on the podium is not the priority or obligation of the team leader, never has been or never will be.

The weak route did not sort out the GC situation early enough as AC would have been a clear leader after the first week.
 
Publicus

Publicus

Mar 17, 2009
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the vagabond said:
Most respondents are underestimating the seriousness of the protocol violation of Contador's attacking move on Wednesday. Things were getting better until then, and that changed a lot. And now he has gone off verbally and contradicted himself - he has earlier said many times that he looked up to and respected Lance. No one is denying Contador has been in a tough spot all along, but he's the one who has escalated the situation, not Lance. And I agree, Lance has a lot more friends in the peloton than Contador. 26-year-old prima donnas don't cut it - AC has made a big mistake.
Click to expand...

But a 38 year old prima donna can? Lance's aura of invincibility, bad a$$ness is gone.
 
boalio

boalio

May 1, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
Tell me a time similar to stage 17 that Lance attacked only dropping his own teamate? NEVER happened. Why? Because it makes no tatical sense. You saying that LA, Levi, Horner and Bruyneel are all wrong? Horner called the move "amateurish". Go to his twitter and watch the TV interview. But I guess he's in the tank for LA too, right?
Click to expand...

Yes, a multiple grand tour winner like Horner should be schooling Contador. :rolleyes: Contador could learn a lot from him. He won the Tour of White Rock, and Alberto has only ALL 3 Grand Tours, including the Tour twice.

Don't get me started on Levi 'The Donkey' Leipheimer. Lance's girlfriend.
 
Hugh Januss

Hugh Januss

Jul 9, 2009
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powerste said:
True, and AC's decision to take a big risk for a dubious payoff says a lot about both his:
-relative immaturity/stupidity/whatever-you-want-to-call-it
AND
-justified confidence in his raw talent
The disconnect between the two will be the story of next July.

No teammate of Lance's was ever expected to have a podium chance. All this talk about the wildly successful "Bruyneel/Armstrong Plan" and AC's disdain for it is a complete red herring. Slow-down-so-your-mates-can-podium has never been part of that plan. But all of a sudden, in 2009, AC is expected to adopt the new and improved you're-not-quite-in-charge-so-ride-more-easily-for-your-teammates'-chances Bruyneel Plan?
Click to expand...

Bruyneel really wanted to stack the podium. Probably thought that would cement his rep. as the greatest DS of all time. When he looked at Lance, Alberto, Levi and Kloden he had to think he had a pretty good chance.
Only trouble he knew that neither AC or LA would accept not being top dog. Why should AC, it was his team and he was on the hottest GT streak of all time, 3 in 2 years. Less argueably true but still a point, why should LA, he had won more TDF than anyone in history. So he decided to let them each think they were leader.
It might have worked if Levi hadn't crashed out, but then they were down to plan B. It still might have worked if he could have just gone to Contador early on and said "don't worry about a thing we are all solid behind you as team leader, but we want to try to stack the podium". But Armstrong would never have stood for that.
So he tried to stroke the weaker one while still supporting the stronger one, but didn't offer enough support to gain his trust.
Result wise it turned out OK, but now it seems there is a bit of fall-out.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
richwagmn said:
Are you saying the Treks are rebadged? Be a lot of work to have a another company produce a bike that looks just like the one you produce so you can put your badge on it.

I'm confused.
Click to expand...

No, I am saying that the sweetest bikes in the US are not Treks or Specialized or any of the other major brands, and that bikes made by people like Vanilla and Serotta and others have never been ridden in the Tour unless they were badged as something else. Same goes with bikes like Pegoretti (Italian) etc.
 
ptensioned

ptensioned

Jul 8, 2009
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TrapperJohn said:
Well, what did you expect? Bruyneel owes Armstrong, without LA he would be a nobody. Of course he's going to support Armstrong. He needs a team to run next year, and it won't be Astana. LA can offer him that, AC cannot.

The alliances within Astana had little to do with this Tour. They had everything to do with what team they will be riding for next year. You can go with JB and LA to the new team, go with AC if his new team will have you, or you can stay on Astana with shaky finances and Mr Bloodbags calling the shots. If you aren't Kazakh, you'd better have an exit plan.

Wow, two previous Tour winners on the same team, having a problem. I'm shocked, shocked, to discover that large egos are involved.
Click to expand...

Finally a bit of perspective. Once Contador established he was going to win on Verbier, the wheels came off the Astana Magical Mystery Tour. All this nonsense is all about positioning for next year.

Those who question where the support for Contador is from within his team, perhaps you ought to look at where those who spoke out are next year. Leipheimer et al. will be in RadioShack kit. The supporters of Contador are not secure enough with jobs to feel confident about jawing with Armstrong and by extension, Bruyneel. They have both proven themselves to be vindictive (check Bruyneel's relationship with Sporza for evidence), so why risk future employment? It may be a different story next year if Alonso and Contador can make something happen.

I'm no big fan of either rider on either side (Rabobank, if you must know. Thank God for Garate. Gesink in the Vuelta!). But I read a relatively innocuous comment from Contador about not liking Lance on a personal level (surprise!) and then a very bitter response from someone who just lost. Most seem to think Armstrong is winning the psychological battle, but in hindsight I think we'll see that Contador is winning in spades. He did win the real race, after all.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
boalio said:
Yes, a multiple grand tour winner like Horner should be schooling Contador. :rolleyes: Contador could learn a lot from him. He won the Tour of White Rock, and Alberto has only ALL 3 Grand Tours, including the Tour twice.

Don't get me started on Levi 'The Donkey' Leipheimer. Lance's girlfriend.
Click to expand...

I think of him more as Lance's accessory dog.
 
Publicus

Publicus

Mar 17, 2009
11,341
1
22,485
pmcg76 said:
There is a few thing that need to be ironed out here.

Lance gained time on stage 3 when he didnt need to/Contador gained time on the stage to Andorra when he didnt need to.

Kloeden lost out when Contador attacked/Kloeden lost out when he paced Lance on the stage to Verbier even though he was clearly stronger than Lance and could have dropped him by more than 6 seconds.

Nobody at Astana other than the Lance stooges have criticised Contador, dont hear the Kazakh sponsors saying AC should have waited on Kloeden.

Either Kloeden or Lance could have finished on the podium, not both as A.Schleck was 2nd best in the Tour.

Kloeden has not criticised AC at any time for his actions so cannot be too bothered even though he was clearly angry with his final TT, he wasnt strong enough to be on the peloton.

AC has not criticised anyone at Astana other than Lance/Lance has not criticised anyone at Astana other than AC.

Perhaps AC made a mistake in attacking but who remembers Lance bonking and almost losing the Tour in 2000 or once riding too strongly for his team in the TTT dropping them. He made mistakes also and it would have been far more costly for his them team-mates financially if he didnt win.

Everything at Postal was dedicated to Lance even though there were guys like Hamilton, Heras, Landis who were capable of possibly winning the Tour themselves or stages at the least. If Bruyneel had grasped the bull by the horns and used the same format and made AC team leader based on performances over the last few years, all other problems would have been solved and maybe Contador may have been more supportive of his team-mates. Contador has been favourite to win this Tour since last July. Bruyneel created the problems himself.

Getting another team-mate on the podium is not the priority or obligation of the team leader, never has been or never will be.

The weak route did not sort out the GC situation early enough as AC would have been a clear leader after the first week.
Click to expand...

+1. Once again you post a clear and concise analysis of the situation.
 
Publicus

Publicus

Mar 17, 2009
11,341
1
22,485
boalio said:
Yes, a multiple grand tour winner like Horner should be schooling Contador. :rolleyes: Contador could learn a lot from him. He won the Tour of White Rock, and Alberto has only ALL 3 Grand Tours, including the Tour twice.

Don't get me started on Levi 'The Donkey' Leipheimer. Lance's girlfriend.
Click to expand...

Where I come from this is call a smackdown.
 
palmerq

palmerq

Mar 19, 2009
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I think we need to get t-shirts made up of team berto and team lance, like when brad left jennifer. The truth will come out when we see which team paris hilton is on :S
 
powerste

powerste

Jun 15, 2009
353
0
0
Publicus said:
You asked a question, I provided the logical answer. The MJ was NEVER in jeopardy. It sounds good to say that, but the only argument you can build to support is built on a bunch of conditional statements that you can't support. He was on the road, with two GC contenders, thought he could get away and didn't. Once he realized he couldn't he shut it down. How that put the MJ jeopardy is beyond me--Kloden NEVER paced Contador on that ride (he was sitting on Contador's wheel). If there was an attack Contador couldn't respond to, do you think Kloden was going to close it down? I never saw that the entire Tour, but maybe I missed a stage or two where he did it.
Click to expand...

Absolutely correct.
Attacking (thereby dropping Klodi and picking up the Shlecks) that far from the line with a descent to the finish was (in hindsight) poor tactical decision making, but to suggest that it jeopardized the MJ is one hell of a stretch. AC was obviously feeling strong, and took a calculated risk to really feel out the Schlecks' strength and see if he could put time into Andy. Turned out they were plenty strong and he wasn't going to dent Andy so he rode conservatively to the finish. So that basically eliminated the risk of a crash - however a puncture could have been a serious problem. The risk-averse among us would call that a bad decision. Those of us who like to watch a more exciting bike race were psyched. What LA and Klodi (neither of whom could hang on to Andy, let alone AC) thought of it is . . . totally irrelevant.
 
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