Coronavirus: How dangerous a threat?

[Oldermanish]

Meanwhile, in the same time frame, Old-Age-19 has killed one out of every 90 Americans--many of whom were attributed to Covid-19 though they would have died from Old-Age-19 anyway.

I joke. I joke. Well, sort of. You need to keep this in perspective.

The whole mask use thing seems weird to me, like not wearing a helmet while cycling.

Like not wearing a helmet or a chamois when cycling. You may not die but you'd know that something wasn't quite right.

 

[Chris Gadsden]

There have been about two dozen shooting/stabbing deaths resulting from protests and rallies. There have probably been about 2000 cases deriving just from church services--and this is just among attendees, or people in close contact with them. Assuming a CFR of 2%, that would be about 40 deaths. Depending on how you define assembly, there are many, many more.

Oh. So how many positives from all of the protests, burning of cities, rioting do ya think?

More or less than 2000? Or you could argue how well Covid can righteously differentiate.

 

[yaco]

The tone of my posts does nothing of the sort.

Yes I am aware of your opinions on Australia’s quarantine but it has worked very well as any glance of the numbers proves. Of course it could be tightened but what happened in Victoria was due to incompetence followed by hopeless contact tracing.

So in consecutive sentences you state s it worked well, then in the next sentence it is incompetent and hopeless - Think you like whinging and victim blaming.

 

[movingtarget]

Covid infections in England down by nearly a third since second lockdown

R number now stands below 1 after 30% drop in cases across country over almost a fortnight

www.theguardian.com

 

[movingtarget]

A year after Wuhan alarm, China seeks to change Covid origin story

Reports in state media signal an intensifying propaganda effort to place the birth of the virus in other countries

www.theguardian.com

 

[Swamp Holland]

Nah, that story about Japan's suicides must have been fake news. It was reported by CNN, and everyone knows they have a leftist agenda, and would never run a story that suggests lockdowns result in a lot of extra deaths.



I seem to remember your guy trying to break up free assemblies in several large cities, on safety concerns. In fact, assemblies are frequently banned, or at least require permits, for that reason.



Very good comparison. I don't ride a motorcycle, but aren't there a lot of people who do who won't wear a helmet? I saw some pictures of guys at Sturgis on their bikes w/o helmets, but that was in town, in a sort of slow parade. I don't know what the situation was when they were out on the highway. Of course, a helmet mostly predicts you, not others.

I have no idea what you are taking exception with but I did not create that media. The news is news until it is slanted and biased.

 

[Swamp Holland]

Covid infections in England down by nearly a third since second lockdown

R number now stands below 1 after 30% drop in cases across country over almost a fortnight

www.theguardian.com

Maybe they eradicated this time. No way it will come back after this lockdown.

 

[Swamp Holland]

There have been about two dozen shooting/stabbing deaths resulting from protests and rallies. There have probably been about 2000 cases deriving just from church services--and this is just among attendees, or people in close contact with them. Assuming a CFR of 2%, that would be about 40 deaths. Depending on how you define assembly, there are many, many more.

You got any solid numbers on riots and looters?

 

[Cookster15]

So in consecutive sentences you state s it worked well, then in the next sentence it is incompetent and hopeless - Think you like whinging and victim blaming.

That isn’t victim blaming. Please quote from what I have written or else give it a rest.

 

[movingtarget]

There’s a social pathogen stalking the world that’s as deadly as Covid-19 | Kenan Malik

The endurance of TB and malaria shows how health resources are hoarded by the wealthy

www.theguardian.com

 

[Merckx index]

Oh. So how many positives from all of the protests, burning of cities, rioting do ya think?

More or less than 2000? Or you could argue how well Covid can righteously differentiate.

Propose any number you care to, you're only supporting my point that the government has a right to ban assemblies when they are deemed unsafe.

But the virus does not survive a fire.

I have no idea what you are taking exception with but I did not create that media. The news is news until it is slanted and biased.

It was referring to another post, by someone else. You're just caught in the cross-fire, so to speak.

You got any solid numbers on riots and looters?

At least 25 Americans were killed during protests and political unrest in 2020

Findings from Armed Conflict Location and Event Data raise concerns about continued violence during and after election day

www.theguardian.com

 

[Jagartrott]

Moderna applying for approval in the US and EU today. They released more data: 196 infected, 11 in the vaccine group. Thirty got seriously ill, none in vaccine group.

 

[djpbaltimore]

That is great news. I think only one person died in the placebo group, illustrating why it is difficult to use death as an endpoint in a study like this. Even so, a drop in serious illness was what I was hoping for.

Fox offers another window into the American psyche this morning. "Americans just are not going to follow guidance no matter how sensible it might be." The amazing part is this was not said derisively at all. If any thing it was mentioned like this was a positive American value (we don't like being told what to do). As jmdirt has said before, COVID-19 has really laid bare the true nature of many people in this country.

 

[yaco]

That isn’t victim blaming. Please quote from what I have written or else give it a rest.

Well at least now Andrews will be testing ( daily ) all staff who will work in the rebooted quarantine centres, something which should have been done from the beginning - Even South Australia which had a recent outbreak escaping from quarantine earlier this month has now decided it's a good idea to regularly test these workers - This is what I mean by being lucky.

 

[Castman]

As jmdirt has said before, COVID-19 has really laid bare the true nature of many people in this country.

Very true. Unfortunately many only see a preconditioned, singular side of that statement.

 

[djpbaltimore]

I just don't see how we can skip health care workers and first responders from being in the first wave as Birx and Azar are suggesting in their recent comments. The least that we can do it put them first in line with the nursing home residents.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1333416457720487938

View: https://twitter.com/HelenBranswell/status/1333416457720487938

 

[jmdirt]

A colleague asked me this morning: "since I already had Covid in June I won't need the vaccine...right?" My reply: "ask an epidemiologist". I followed with: "I assume that they will recommend that you still get the vaccine."

I do wonder though, if someone had a great enough immune response, do you need to get the vaccine in the spring? I know they really can't know if immunity lasts for a year because they don't have that data yet. We will have a small sample test from a lady here at work. She was traveling for work (Asia locations) in March, returned home, and was really sick with Covid for about 20 days. She is now taking care of her husband who has a pretty severe case so we'll see if she has immunity. (Interesting note to this, he didn't get it from her in March/April).

 

[Chris Gadsden]

As jmdirt has said before, COVID-19 has really laid bare the true nature of many people in this country.

BroDeal nailed it earlier.

Look no further than the press cannibalizing's their own credibility. Could be Americans know they are being lied to most of the time.

As for 'true nature'.... plenty to go around. The Cuomo's Newsom's and Whitmer's of the Country behaving like "do as I say, not as I do" tin-horn despots making up unconstitutional executive action at will. If they can take your liberty that you so willingly give - this time - what will prevent them from doing so next time?

As for jmdirt's comments, I'll go ahead and assume he would be okay with what the CCP did in Wuhan. Give credit where it's due; welding exit doors shut to hi-rise apartment buildings in forced quarantine measures seems to have been effective. So yeah, the nature of many to embrace authoritarianism is pretty shocking.

 

[dusty red roads]

Should isolation periods be shorter for people with COVID-19?

People with COVID-19 are most infectious about two days before symptoms begin and for five days afterward, according to a new analysis of previous research.

www.japantimes.co.jp

 

[Nomad]

Nomad, do you think the appropriate course of action is to let everybody get infected?

Not everyone. There's a clear understanding of the nature of this virus: Very deadly for the elderly with pre-existing conditions and far less of a problem for those under 70 (99.95% survival rate for under 70 and less deadly than the seasonal flu for children).

I like Dr. Bhattacharya's strategy (Great Barrington Declaration) of focus protection for the high risk group while letting the low risk group get exposure to the virus (this seems to be happening anyway as the virus is so widespread and virtually everywhere).

But as no surprise, this strategy is met with fierce retribution by Fauci et al and the majority of the Democrats. And the mainstream media seems to imply it's almost treasonous to suggest any such strategy.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1324824099756023808

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/jama_current/status/1324824099756023808

View: https://youtu.be/vPj5yYAgee8


Bhattacharya: "Harm from Covid is less than the harm from lockdowns."

 

[BroDeal]

That is great news. I think only one person died in the placebo group, illustrating why it is difficult to use death as an endpoint in a study like this. Even so, a drop in serious illness was what I was hoping for.

Fox offers another window into the American psyche this morning. "Americans just are not going to follow guidance no matter how sensible it might be." The amazing part is this was not said derisively at all. If any thing it was mentioned like this was a positive American value (we don't like being told what to do). As jmdirt has said before, COVID-19 has really laid bare the true nature of many people in this country.

Who would have thought a country founded by people fleeing persecution by authorities would not blindly accept edicts from authorities? Americans have always had the attitude of "It's a free country. I'll do whatever I want. F you." It's problematic during something like a pandemic. On the other a business like Uber would never be started in a country like Germany because the founders would ask permission first instead of just doing it.

I will place bets the US economy recovers from this a lot better than the EU.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Not everyone. There's a clear understanding of the nature of this virus: Very deadly for the elderly with pre-existing conditions and far less of a problem for those under 70 (99.95% survival rate for under 70 and less deadly than the seasonal flu for children).

I like Dr. Bhattacharya's strategy (Great Barrington Declaration) of focus protection for the high risk group while letting the low risk group get exposure to the virus (this seems to be happening anyway as the virus is so widespread and virtually everywhere).

But as no surprise, this strategy is met with fierce retribution by Fauci et al and the majority of the Democrats. And the mainstream media seems to imply it's almost treasonous to suggest any such strategy.

The problem that Fauci and others have with the herd immunity strategy is that it just doesn't work in practice. If you could protect the high risk groups, the number of deaths should not increase with the increase in cases. Yet, look at the numbers below and it is clear that we haven't been able to divorce those two metrics in the second or third waves of infection. And the reason is pretty clear. The people who work in nursing homes live in the community. If the spread there is out of control, keeping it out of the nursing homes is just not possible in the real world. Around 8% of the nursing home residents have been killed by COVID-19 already despite the wealth of knowledge gained about the nature of this virus. We know who the vulnerable ones are, but we can't do anything about it if we have uncontrolled community spread. That is the reality.

For example, shouldn't South Dakota have known how to minimize the mortality after witnessing what it did to the rest of the country, while their geography largely spared them in the spring. They are the closest thing to the Barrington Project in action this fall. But once they got hit, their mortality shot up and they now have the 9th worst per capita rate in the country with little end in sight. JMO, but the advocates of herd immunity presuppose an agency over the virus that we clearly do not have.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1333203797179392003

View: https://twitter.com/COVID19Tracking/status/1333203797179392003

Who would have thought a country founded by people fleeing persecution by authorities would not blindly accept edicts from authorities? Americans have always had the attitude of "It's a free country. I'll do whatever I want. F you." It's problematic during something like a pandemic. On the other a business like Uber would never be started in a country like Germany because the founders would ask permission first instead of just doing it.

I will place bets the US economy recovers from this a lot better than the EU.

Listing Uber as a success story is...... interesting. 'Blindly' is also doing quite a bit of heavy lifting in that sentence.

 

[hrotha]

Lol at the American exceptionalism in this thread. It's a global pandemic - try to look at it from that perspective.

 

[jmdirt]

Who would have thought a country founded by people fleeing persecution by authorities would not blindly accept edicts from authorities? Americans have always had the attitude of "It's a free country. I'll do whatever I want. F you." It's problematic during something like a pandemic. On the other a business like Uber would never be started in a country like Germany because the founders would ask permission first instead of just doing it.

I will place bets the US economy recovers from this a lot better than the EU.

The thing is, there is no "blindly" to it, they are just closing their eyes.

 

[Koronin]

Moderna applying for approval in the US and EU today. They released more data: 196 infected, 11 in the vaccine group. Thirty got seriously ill, none in vaccine group.

That should mean the panel that makes recommendations to approve or not should be able to review both Moderna and Pfizer vaccines during their Dec 8-10 meeting and come a decision of yes or no.

The information also sounds very hopeful.