Coronavirus: How dangerous a threat?

[Ultrairon]

Terrible news with cases. New York is 7th in vax public near 72% and yet they are experiencing the most cases since the pandemic began.

https://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-vi...es-daily-7&data-source=jhu&xaxis=right#states

They need to rename this shot to something other than a vax. Someone else here has said that in the past. This is more like the flu shot now.
Good news for New York so far seems the hospitalizations are not following the same dramatic increase. They are noticing more hospitalizations but I don't think the ventilator status is out of control.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Terrible news with cases. New York is 7th in vax public near 72% and yet they are experiencing the most cases since the pandemic began.

They need to rename this shot to something other than a vax. Someone else here has said that in the past. This is more like the flu shot now.
Good news for New York so far seems the hospitalizations are not following the same dramatic increase. They are noticing more hospitalizations but I don't think the ventilator status is out of control.

Antivaxxers big talking point is trying to give the vaccine a different name. Not surprised to see this repeated here by the usual subjects.. There is no difference between a shot and a vaccine. A flu shot is a vaccine. The flu vaccine would love to have the efficacy of any of the covid vaccines.

Notice that you ignore the cases from Florida. Setting new records. But the cruises must go on.

https://news.yahoo.com/florida-breaks-another-record-covid-191617511.html

 

[movingtarget]

Omicron: bleak new year or beginning of the end for the pandemic?

Scientists are cautiously optimistic that the variant may be a sign the virus is losing its power, despite the high infection figures

www.theguardian.com

 

[Cookster15]

Scientists really need to get a handle on omicron virulence it’s going crazy …

Another 995 people get negative COVID results in error

Sydney's St Vincent's Hospital pathology confirms an additional 995 people were prematurely sent an SMS advising them their test was negative.

www.abc.net.au

In Sydney we have long queues for PCR tests. Testing can’t cope with the demand. Why? Because it’s the traditional holiday season here and the holiday capital of Australia, the state of Queensland, in their wisdom have decided to implement proof of passing a negative PCR test before being allowed into Queensland.

Some solid data on the virulence of omicron would negate this pandemonium. There are massive spikes in cases in Australia and I truly doubt this is delta strain based upon multfactors including very low rates of hospitalisations and deaths.

 

[Cookster15]

Antivaxxers big talking point is trying to give the vaccine a different name. Not surprised to see this repeated here by the usual subjects.. There is no difference between a shot and a vaccine. A flu shot is a vaccine. The flu vaccine would love to have the efficacy of any of the covid vaccines.

Notice that you ignore the cases from Florida. Setting new records. But the cruises must go on.

https://news.yahoo.com/florida-breaks-another-record-covid-191617511.html

Cases….mmmm. When will we see the data on omicron virulence? I am becoming very suspicious of the continued hyping of case counts. Hospitalisations are what we should be focusing on.

 

[Cookster15]

Good news for New York so far seems the hospitalizations are not following the same dramatic increase. They are noticing more hospitalizations but I don't think the ventilator status is out of control.

Not sure that vaccination stops transmission or cases? But it will likely keep you from getting seriously ill. Omicron is on the march but hospitalisations are not. Those which are still being hospitalised are overwhelmingly unvaccinated.

 

[movingtarget]

Scientists really need to get a handle on omicron virulence it’s going crazy …

Another 995 people get negative COVID results in error

Sydney's St Vincent's Hospital pathology confirms an additional 995 people were prematurely sent an SMS advising them their test was negative.

www.abc.net.au

In Sydney we have long queues for PCR tests. Testing can’t cope with the demand. Why? Because it’s the traditional holiday season here and the holiday capital of Australia, the state of Queensland, in their wisdom have decided to implement proof of passing a negative PCR test before being allowed into Queensland.

Some solid data on the virulence of omicron would negate this pandemonium. There are massive spikes in cases in Australia and I truly doubt this is delta strain based upon multfactors including very low rates of hospitalisations and deaths.

Much too late, the cat is already out of the bag. At the least they could have mandated social distancing for groups and pushed mask wearing again but after going completely in the other direction a certain amount of people won't be complying now anyway and with the latest variant being so virulent............so much for double vaxxing your way out of trouble and dropping all of the social distancing and masking rules..........but the economy is improving................ Wonder what hospital staff think. Now the NSW minister for health is just shrugging and saying we will all catch it anyway............

 

[Cookster15]

Much too late, the cat is already out of the bag. At the least they could have mandated social distancing for groups and pushed mask wearing again but after going completely in the other direction a certain amount of people won't be complying now anyway and with the latest variant being so virulent............so much for double vaxxing your way out of trouble and dropping all of the social distancing and masking rules..........but the economy is improving................ Wonder what hospital staff think. Now the NSW minister for health is just shrugging and saying we will all catch it anyway............

Exactly. So why doesn’t the Queensland government drop the ridiculous PCR test requirement? Also I think you conflate virulence with transmissibility? Hospitalisations suggest omicron has low virulence or else if this is actually due to vaccination either way that’s a good thing and the panic over case counts is unjustified.

 

[movingtarget]

Exactly. So why doesn’t the Queensland government drop the ridiculous PCR test requirement? Also I think you conflate virulence with transmissibility? Hospitalisations suggest omicron has low virulence or else if this is actually due to vaccination either way that’s a good thing and the panic over case counts is unjustified.

Right, if these were all Delta infections they would be in big trouble and we would be in lockdown again. It seems the amount of people going into ICU and needing maximum treatment isn't rising really. As much as I have queried some of the NSW decision making, QLD is on another planet and WA have kept it simple by going for zero case approach from the start. I think the QLD premier may have lost the plot completely with some of the people she is not allowing to cross the border like some cancer patients who were crossing the border for treatment to go to a closer hospital and also the parents of a young woman who took her life. All they wanted to do was to claim her body and return home..........bizarre.

 

[Cookster15]

Right, if these were all Delta infections they would be in big trouble and we would be in lockdown again. It seems the amount of people going into ICU and needing maximum treatment isn't rising really. As much as I have queried some of the NSW decision making, QLD is on another planet and WA have kept it simple by going for zero case approach from the start. I think the QLD premier may have lost the plot completely with some of the people she is not allowing to cross the border like some cancer patients who were crossing the border for treatment to go to a closer hospital and also the parents of a young woman who took her life. All they wanted to do was to claim her body and return home..........bizarre.

Stop press: Common sense at last Queensland have now dropped the PCR test. A while back in this thread a poster accused Australia of “small village mentality”. I think this still applies to pockets of the country and a few politicians.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Cases….mmmm. When will we see the data on omicron virulence? I am becoming very suspicious of the continued hyping of case counts. Hospitalisations are what we should be focusing on.

Cite case numbers and people ask about hospitalizations.
Cite hospitalizations and people say that they are there with covid, not for covid.

It is hard to find good data on how much of the new cases are omicron, let alone what the comparative severity is. In Maryland, we are seeing record case numbers and omicron is about 40% of the sequenced virions. The modeling suggests that we will have more hospitalizations next month than we have ever had during the pandemic. If omicron is less severe on a case to case basis, it might make up for that on volume.

 

[Koronin]

Cite case numbers and people ask about hospitalizations.
Cite hospitalizations and people say that they are there with covid, not for covid.

It is hard to find good data on how much of the new cases are omicron, let alone what the comparative severity is. In Maryland, we are seeing record case numbers and omicron is about 40% of the sequenced virions. The modeling suggests that we will have more hospitalizations next month than we have ever had during the pandemic. If omicron is less severe on a case to case basis, it might make up for that on volume.

The different sports leagues are saying they are seeing the vast majority of their cases (near 90%) are Omicron variant. Now how many in different states are Omicron vs Delta I have no clue.

 

[jmdirt]

Exactly. So why doesn’t the Queensland government drop the ridiculous PCR test requirement? Also I think you conflate virulence with transmissibility? Hospitalisations suggest omicron has low virulence or else if this is actually due to vaccination either way that’s a good thing and the panic over case counts is unjustified.

I think that this is a big part of the equation, but without a way to answer it. Does it appear to be less virulent because of the millions of people who have some level of protection, or is it actually less virulent.

EDIT: like you and I agreed a few days ago, there isn't much need for you and I to track case counts, but its very important for epidemiologists.

 

[Ultrairon]

Antivaxxers big talking point is trying to give the vaccine a different name. Not surprised to see this repeated here by the usual subjects.. There is no difference between a shot and a vaccine. A flu shot is a vaccine. The flu vaccine would love to have the efficacy of any of the covid vaccines.

Notice that you ignore the cases from Florida. Setting new records. But the cruises must go on.

https://news.yahoo.com/florida-breaks-another-record-covid-191617511.html

I'm not anti vax, what do you mean "usual subjects"? I will go back and find who mentioned the vax should be called a shot or something like that and its not going to be who you accuse with that "usual subjects" statement.

EDITED: Do you djpbaltimore want to give it a shot on guessing who made the "call it a shot not a vaccine" statements in a post? Give it a try. Ahh never mind you Can't make it up SMH. I will just reply to it so you can read it.

I only pointed out the cases in New York because of the vax percentage. Florida's vax percentage is 62% so I would expect them to have high case rates.

 

[Ultrairon]

I ran into an old friend on the trail today (almost literally), and he made a really good point that if the doctors, politicians, media, etc. would have called it the covid shot less people would be scared of it. Vaccine might seem scary, unknown, and political. Obviously there is no way to determine how much that would have helped, but just to throw a number out there, what if 10% more people would have gotten the shot in June and July?

EDIT: I'm going to edit another conversation that may illustrate this point (granted only one anecdotal piece of data): A lady who used to work at my site was standing outside talking with some people the other day and I overheard her say "(husbands name) decided that god doesn't want us to get this vaccine." I didn't find out until the next day that she was at our site to get her flu shot!

I almost agree with you and your old friend. In fact I might actually make a post that they should call it the covid shot or something along those lines. But if I was to make that statement then it would be a "typical antivaxxxxer" blah blah blah.
thumbs up. lol smh.

 

[Cookster15]

Cite case numbers and people ask about hospitalizations.
Cite hospitalizations and people say that they are there with covid, not for covid.

It is hard to find good data on how much of the new cases are omicron, let alone what the comparative severity is. In Maryland, we are seeing record case numbers and omicron is about 40% of the sequenced virions. The modeling suggests that we will have more hospitalizations next month than we have ever had during the pandemic. If omicron is less severe on a case to case basis, it might make up for that on volume.

You should check what is happening in Australia - delta is ancient history and that is what the trained professionals are saying. The cases explosion is omicron. Hospitalisations are not exploding. Modelling in Australia has proven to be less than accurate and mostly extremely pessimistic. With very high levels of full vaccination not sure how hospitalisations can explode?

 

[Cookster15]

Does it appear to be less virulent because of the millions of people who have some level of protection, or is it actually less virulent.

I am not sure why it matters if what is happening with hospitalizations is due to virulence or vaccination. Epidemiologists can study these things without the public being unnecessarily scared to leave their homes due to widely published case counts rather than what really matters.

Case counts were important pre vaccination. Not now.

 

[yaco]

My guess is that the virulence of the Omicron variant will lead to COVID becoming endemic - Though this is still 6 to 9 months away.

 

[Mayomaniac]

I am not why it matters if what is happening with hospitalisations is due to virulence or vaccination. Epidemiologists can study these things without the public being unnecessarily scared to leave their homes due to widely published case counts rather than what really matters.

Case counts were important pre vaccination. Not now.

Tell that to Italian newspapers who have been putting the daily body count and war report on the first page for almost 2 years...

There is that Hong Kong study how Omnicron spreads faster, but causes less severe lung imfections.
https://www.med.hku.hk/en/news/press/20211215-omicron-sars-cov-2-infection

 

[Ultrairon]

You should check what is happening in Australia - delta is ancient history and that is what the trained professionals are saying. The cases explosion is omicron. Hospitalisations are not exploding. Modelling in Australia has proven to be less than accurate and mostly extremely pessimistic. With very high levels of full vaccination not sure how hospitalisations can explode?

Check out what is happening in South Africa.

Jubilant South Africa lifts curfew as Omicron wave subsides rapidly with minimal Covid hospital admissions and Delta killed off: 'Expect the same in other countries'

Optimism is growing rapidly in South Africa as Omicron wave of Covid infections seems to subside as quickly as it came.

www.cityam.com

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/covid-cases-per-day-jhu-ecdc?country=~ZAF

 

[Cookster15]

Check out what is happening in South Africa.

Jubilant South Africa lifts curfew as Omicron wave subsides rapidly with minimal Covid hospital admissions and Delta killed off: 'Expect the same in other countries'

Optimism is growing rapidly in South Africa as Omicron wave of Covid infections seems to subside as quickly as it came.

www.cityam.com

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/covid-cases-per-day-jhu-ecdc?country=~ZAF

Very good news for the world, not just South Africa. A few western nations showing the usual covid hesitancy. I hope the UK gets held to account for prematurely placing South Africa on its red list causing economic losses.

But what is also very interesting is South Africa's vaccination rate which shows just 26.6%.

Google Search

 

[Koronin]

I almost agree with you and your old friend. In fact I might actually make a post that they should call it the covid shot or something along those lines. But if I was to make that statement then it would be a "typical antivaxxxxer" blah blah blah.
thumbs up. lol smh.

I agree with you on this and have thought it should be called the Covid Shot for a while now.

 

[Nomad]

Right, if these were all Delta infections they would be in big trouble and we would be in lockdown again.

IDK - Would we? Maybe Delta has been overrated & overblown, especially for healthy, fit people in society? As I detailed previously here, my 22 yr old son (21 yrs old at the time) & I survived Delta with overlapping cases this past Sept needing no medical intervention whatsoever. For my son, he experienced "cold" like symptoms that didn't slow him down one bit as he was able to keep his training going. My symptoms were similar to flu-like symptoms that slowed me down for a few days & was more of an annoyance than anything (no other immediate family members in the household to compare). And according to the MSM, a 60 yr old stiff like me should have died or at the very least been fighting for my life in an ICU ward (I'm sure CNN would love to a story on me. Lol).

So, is the Delta variant overrated & overblown? Or was it my superior fitness & health status not obese/overweight & not having any preexisting conditions that won the day? Or maybe my son & I experienced "memory B cells" in action with our adaptive immune system from prior infection from the original SARS-COV-2 that we both had way back in early February, 2020? Interestingly, neither one of us experienced any of the symptoms of the "SARS" component of the virus in either cases. And neither one of us have experience any of the "long Covid" symptoms that you hear about with other survivors. In fact, other than my post-traumatic OA, I've never felt better in my life. Either way neither one of us is very worried about "Omicron," or whatever other variant looms on the horizon.

And here's a fellow boomer who survived Covid with flying colors - a 59 yr old Ironman triathlete from NYC:

"Unvaccinated Ex-CRO-MAGS Singer John Joseph Says He Beat Omicron By "Investing" In His Immune System."

Unvaccinated Ex-CRO-MAGS Singer JOHN JOSEPH Says He Beat Omicron By 'Investing' In His Immune System

Former CRO-MAGS frontman John Joseph says that he beat COVID-19 by "investing" in his immune system. The 59-year-old, who is also an author, Ironman triathlete and proponent of a vegan, clean-living lifestyle, shared the news of his diagnosis in an Instagram video earlier today (Monday, December...

www.blabbermouth.net

It almost seems preposterous in this day & age of Covid fearmongering that anyone would want to invest in their immune system to fight off respiratory viruses. Lol.

 

[BlueRoads]

IDK - Would we? Maybe Delta has been overrated & overblown, especially for healthy, fit people in society? As I detailed previously here, my 22 yr old son (21 yrs old at the time) & I survived Delta with overlapping cases this past Sept needing no medical intervention whatsoever. For my son, he experienced "cold" like symptoms that didn't slow him down one bit as he was able to keep his training going. My symptoms were similar to flu-like symptoms that slowed me down for a few days & was more of an annoyance than anything (no other immediate family members in the household to compare). And according to the MSM, a 60 yr old stiff like me should have died or at the very least been fighting for my life in an ICU ward (I'm sure CNN would love to a story on me. Lol).

So, is the Delta variant overrated & overblown? Or was it my superior fitness & health status not obese/overweight & not having any preexisting conditions that won the day? Or maybe my son & I experienced "memory B cells" in action with our adaptive immune system from prior infection from the original SARS-COV-2 that we both had way back in early February, 2020? Interestingly, neither one of us experienced any of the symptoms of the "SARS" component of the virus in either cases. And neither one of us have experience any of the "long Covid" symptoms that you hear about with other survivors. In fact, other than my post-traumatic OA, I've never felt better in my life. Either way neither one of us is very worried about "Omicron," or whatever other variant looms on the horizon.

And here's a fellow boomer who survived Covid with flying colors - a 59 yr old Ironman triathlete from NYC:

"Unvaccinated Ex-CRO-MAGS Singer John Joseph Says He Beat Omicron By "Investing" In His Immune System."

Unvaccinated Ex-CRO-MAGS Singer JOHN JOSEPH Says He Beat Omicron By 'Investing' In His Immune System

Former CRO-MAGS frontman John Joseph says that he beat COVID-19 by "investing" in his immune system. The 59-year-old, who is also an author, Ironman triathlete and proponent of a vegan, clean-living lifestyle, shared the news of his diagnosis in an Instagram video earlier today (Monday, December...

www.blabbermouth.net

It almost seems preposterous in this day & age of Covid fearmongering that anyone would want to invest in their immune system to fight off respiratory viruses. Lol.

Do you have a basic understanding of statistics?

I'm against the constant super-warnings myself, but no, just because you survived unharmed, doesn't mean everyone does, and no, it doesn't mean everyone who's healthy does. Dude.

 

[Cookster15]

Do you have a basic understanding of statistics?

I'm against the constant super-warnings myself, but no, just because you survived unharmed, doesn't mean everyone does, and no, it doesn't mean everyone who's healthy does. Dude.

I agree with you about Nomad's post. But what needs discussing is that omicron seems to be replacing delta. All reports I am reading suggests that omicron is massively less virulent (dangerous). If proven to be true across the world this should be a cause for celebration by all of us. For example, let me recopy the article from Ultrairon:

Jubilant South Africa lifts curfew as Omicron wave subsides rapidly with minimal Covid hospital admissions and Delta killed off: 'Expect the same in other countries'

Optimism is growing rapidly in South Africa as Omicron wave of Covid infections seems to subside as quickly as it came.

www.cityam.com