Do You Care If Your Favourite Cyclist Is a "Nice Person"??

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Do you care if your favourite cyclist is a 'nice' person?

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Feb 15, 2011
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LaFlorecita said:
:confused: What the ****?

MY OPINION.

Just wondering how caring about what other people think of you makes you a nice person? I don't see how that as a good trait at all.

So if Rico decided to start caring about what other people thought of him he would become a nice guy all of the sudden. Seriously, that's totally nonsensical.

I could give you some very harsh examples of people that cared about what other people thought about them that were actually evil sons of b**ches.
 
May 15, 2011
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Christian said:
Damn Florecity gotta warn you next time you get an e-mail from a Nigerian prince asking for money ... he might want to seem nice but I don't think he is!!!

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
May 15, 2011
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@Boomcie

Alberto is a gentle, shy person. Also, he wants to be liked by everybody. I see that as a good trait, yes.

Ricco has nothing to do with it. It makes ALBERTO a nice person, I'll never say it makes everyone a nice person.
 

airstream

BANNED
Mar 29, 2011
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LaFlorecita said:
Do you know why he said that? Because he doesn't want people TO HATE HIM. If he had just said "Yes, I saw it, but I didn't wait because I didn't think I should have." then everyone would be whining about how unsportsmanlike he is, so he said he didn't see it instead.
He just preferred blatant lie to severe truth. The number of mentions "MY OPINION" doesn't make your point more valid.
 
May 15, 2011
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airstream said:
He just preferred blatant lie to severe truth. The number of mentions "MY OPINION" doesn't make your point more valid.

Yeah, because he's just that. A big, fat liar.
 
Jul 16, 2010
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Back to the question posed by the OP: I answered yes. If personality didn't matter I suppose I would have been a fan of LA. He revealed himself quite candidly in his own book - reading that showed me enough about who he is to know that I'm not a fan.

Realistically, 99.9% of these guys have HUGE, monstrous egos. You don't get to the elite in any sport without that. The drive to compete, be the best and train at that level is only found in people who have tremendous belief in themselves and put themselves first. I get that.

That said, there are other dimensions to the personalities of most elite athletes. To echo an earlier comment - I can appreciate, perhaps even admire someone's riding without "liking" their personality, but to be a true fan of someone - I have to find something more than good riding. Something compelling about them that makes me yell at the TV and get excited about their wins.

The point of pretty much all media interviews with athletes is to get to know the person - otherwise all interviews would be the same, "I did my best, felt (great, bad), I wanted to win (I won)..." ad nauseum. And we know we all watch those interviews and hang on every word of our heroes!
 
Aug 18, 2010
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Christian said:
That's one of the reasons (national bias aside) why I prefer Andy to Contador - I'm lazy, show up to work hung over and say stupid stuff.

Post of the day!

I don't know why people here want to knock the very traits out of Andy Schleck that actually make him interesting - his tactically unwise concern for his brother, his lack of work ethic*, his fondness for a badly timed drink, his propensity for saying stupid things. These are about the only things I actually like about him!

*By the standards of top level professional cyclists. I suspect that his work ethic would seem ferocious to most other people.
 
May 6, 2011
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What a joke. How do they have a stronger work ethic than other professionals? They practically work part time hours.
 
Aug 18, 2010
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richtea said:
What a joke. How do they have a stronger work ethic than other professionals? They practically work part time hours.

Are you nuts?

Nobody becomes one of the best athletes in the world at a major endurance discipline without putting in hour after hour of pain. For that matter, how do you think even finishing the Tour de France stacks up against a few weeks of a normal job when it comes to the efforts involved?
 
May 5, 2010
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Bavarianrider said:
Obviously, i can only support a person, who i like.

Same here. But I don't think they have to be nice for me to like them... of course it just so happens that I personally think all the riders are nice...

Winterfold said:
1) what is 'nice'?

2) how do you know without meeting them?

1) I'd say genuine and polite...

2) I guess you can't...

Christian said:
You know what they say ... nice guys finish last. Nice or not nice is difficult to say though as some have pointed out, I don't actually know any cyclists so I try not to judge them on their personalities (or what might come across as their personality in the media).

I don't agree, about the nice guys finish last. There's a difference between being nice and letting other people walk over you.
 
Oct 15, 2009
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I don't really care much, mainly because it's hard to know whether they are really nice persons or not by what we get from the media, or social networks, etc. Of course, if a rider I like comes across as a good bloke it's a plus, and if he makes sure that everybody gets the impression he's a ****, that might be too much for me to like him.
 
Jun 10, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
Do you know why he said that? Because he doesn't want people TO HATE HIM. If he had just said "Yes, I saw it, but I didn't wait because I didn't think I should have." then everyone would be whining about how unsportsmanlike he is, so he said he didn't see it instead.

Also, you do know that video was Riis's idea, right?
It's still a lie, and he still went along with Riis's idea. He's an adult.
Ye, he did say that. But it's not lying. There were still things they had to agree about, and apparently they didn't in the end.
Yeah right, and conveniently it all fell apart just after finishing the Tour. And he was following Riis's advice (and got Riis's advice in the first place) even though there was nothing linking him to Riis. Right.
Do you have a link? I can't remember he said that.
http://www.as.com/ciclismo/articulo...pio-marcho-emocionado/20111125dasdaicic_1/Tes
"Nunca me he dopado y siempre me he rodeado de personas que rechacen el uso de sustancias dopantes"
(Yes, I worded it as a slight hyperbole because I honestly thought you'd know what quote I was referring to)
Everybody lies. You do, I do, everyone does. But should I call you, myself, and everybody liars then?
If I, you or everybody does it often enough, then yes.
Alberto isn't a bad person. You can tell me otherwise, go ahead, but I'm not going to agree with you anyway.
Translation: "Nanana I can't year you"
 
May 6, 2011
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Zinoviev Letter said:
Are you nuts?

Nobody becomes one of the best athletes in the world at a major endurance discipline without putting in hour after hour of pain. For that matter, how do you think even finishing the Tour de France stacks up against a few weeks of a normal job when it comes to the efforts involved?

People in other professions work just as hard to be successful as professional cyclists (if not harder), at different things. How can you be so dismissive of 'a normal job'?
 
May 15, 2011
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hrotha said:
It's still a lie, and he still went along with Riis's idea. He's an adult.

Yeah right, and conveniently it all fell apart just after finishing the Tour. And he was following Riis's advice (and got Riis's advice in the first place) even though there was nothing linking him to Riis. Right.

http://www.as.com/ciclismo/articulo...pio-marcho-emocionado/20111125dasdaicic_1/Tes
"Nunca me he dopado y siempre me he rodeado de personas que rechacen el uso de sustancias dopantes"
(Yes, I worded it as a slight hyperbole because I honestly thought you'd know what quote I was referring to)

If I, you or everybody does it often enough, then yes.

Translation: "Nanana I can't year you"

Okay, you've proven your point now:

Alberto is a liar. Therefore he's a bad person.

I disagree.
 
Aug 18, 2010
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richtea said:
People in other professions work just as hard to be successful as professional cyclists (if not harder), at different things. How can you be so dismissive of 'a normal job'?

I'm not dismissive of normal jobs. I have one after all. But riding the Tour is considerably tougher than my normal job.

You are the person being dismissive of the amount of work that goes into being a top level endurance athlete by describing those athletes as practically part timers. From which I can only conclude that you are a nutcase.
 
Feb 20, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
Okay, you've proven your point now:

Alberto is a liar. Therefore he's a bad person.

I disagree.
hrotha's point was never that Alberto was a bad person, the point was that he was a nice guy, but that that doesn't stop him also being a liar.

I met Patrik Sinkewitz, found him a really nice guy, good to talk to and welcoming of those fans interested in talking to him. He's not going to win any popularity contests anytime soon, nor will he ever be considered a morally upstanding member of the péloton. But that didn't stop him being a nice guy.
RedheadDane said:
I don't agree, about the nice guys finish last. There's a difference between being nice and letting other people walk over you.

Of course. Otherwise Miguel Indurain wouldn't have won nearly as much as he did.
 
May 6, 2011
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Zinoviev Letter said:
I'm not dismissive of normal jobs. I have one after all. But riding the Tour is considerably tougher than my normal job.

You are the person being dismissive of the amount of work that goes into being a top level endurance athlete by describing those athletes as practically part timers. From which I can only conclude that you are a nutcase.

It was a comment on the number of hours involved: do cyclists spend upwards of 10 hours a day training or racing, every week? There are many jobs harder than being a cyclist, involving more complicated tasks with much more at stake. Do you really think riding the Tour for 3 weeks is as difficult as swapping shoes with a hospital surgeon for the same period, or the CEO of a large multinational business?
 
Apr 10, 2009
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Yes I do. Call me old fashioned, but I don't think athletic ability gives you license to be a jerk. I used to watch all kinds of sports and considered myself a fan of many but the attitudes espoused by some current professionals in a number of sports has turned me off. Be gracious in victory and defeat. Like an old timer used to say when I was young, "Act like you've been there before."
 
Feb 24, 2012
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I didn't vote, because the original question, in my opinion, doesn't quite cover the topic. The term "nice guy" is little more than a social/cultural construct and it implies a certain objectivity that doesn't seem to have much to do with what this is all about. It's much more subjective than that. For me, "nice" takes second place to things like "sympathetic", someone I can identify with and feel sympathetic towards in a much more subjective manner. We can all watch the same interviews and the same races and come out with a hundred different views of just what we saw. It has more to do with us, individually, than with the riders in question.

As for Contador... He might be a liar. He might not be. Some of the things he's said and done point in the direction of him not always having the closest relationship with honesty. Does that make him less sympathetic to me? No. When I get backed into a corner, I'll say whatever I think will get me out fastest. When I'm in a tight spot, I'm a bit of a coward. Would I call myself a pathological liar? No. Am I, occasionally, a liar? Fvck yes. It's not something I'm particularly proud of, but that's how it is. It's not all I am, though. It's not all that defines me. I'm also empathic and creative and passionate and a million other things. Every personality in the world has many facets. That's what makes people interesting.

As Christian said some posts ago, a complete and total perfect automaton is ultimately boring. I agree with that completely. What I don't agree with is casting Contador in the role as "perfect". He's not, obviously. He seems to be a bit of a liar, sometimes, and a bit of a coward when he's put on the spot. That doesn't make him bad in my eyes. It makes him human. And for me, because these are weaknesses I see in myself, it makes him someone I can easily identify with. What takes him the next step to someone I can also admire is the fact that he also appears to have some traits I truly respect. Unlike others, he doesn't tend to use his illness as an excuse. He's a fighter. He never gives up. The combination of being able to see myself in his weaknesses and admiring his strength is really what makes him someone I want to root for.

Schleck on the other hand... human and flawed as well, quite obviously. Maybe he's the one I'd have identified with more back when I was a teenager, because I also did stupid sh!t and spewed all sorts of nonsense I hadn't thought through beforehand. I grew out of that, however, and that makes it harder for me to like him than it probably would've been when I was younger. Again, subjective and different for every single person.

Of course, on the other hand, popularity is ALSO a social/cultural construct. We see it with the Dutch and Belgian and British (and others; these are just examples) posters who loudly root for their compatriots. We see it in Denmark, where I'm from, where, to fifty per cent of cycling fans a couple of years ago, Contador was the villain standing in the way of Riis's next Tour de France triumph and Schleck was Riis's champion and the white knight who could do no wrong (probably didn't hurt that he has blond hair and blue eyes). Then Leopard TREK happened and those same fifty per cent grew a grudge the size of China and turned to the new champion. Of course, those same fifty per cent are just as prepared to extend the same grudge to Contador if he leaves Riis neck deep in sh!t and doesn't come back to help pull him out. In a case like that, the sympathy is not given to Contador or Schleck as individuals, but to them as extensions of Riis, on a nationalistic basis.

My point is that to be able to answer the original question, we first have to agree on who the "nice guys" are, and I doubt that will ever happen. Who we root for is too individual, too subjective, has too much to do with who we see little pieces of ourselves in.

For me, well, in a case of the wolf and the sheep, I'm going to root for the wolf. The wolf is not necessarily "bad", it simply understands the rules of the game (and in my opinion, the sheep are often TSTL anyway).

And now that I've spent my first ever post boring you all to death and painting myself in the worst light possible, I think I'll just go back to lurking.
 
Jun 10, 2010
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Libertine Seguros said:
hrotha's point was never that Alberto was a bad person, the point was that he was a nice guy, but that that doesn't stop him also being a liar.
Actually, I was saying he wasn't a jerk, i.e. that he was nice, not good. To be honest I think he's into lying beyond the call of duty and I consider him a fundamentally dishonest and, yes, bad person.
 
Aug 18, 2010
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richtea said:
Do you really think riding the Tour for 3 weeks is as difficult as swapping shoes with a hospital surgeon for the same period, or the CEO of a large multinational business?

I'm reasonably confident that with the requisite years of training I could be a doctor. I'm equally confident that no matter how long I spent trying I could not be a professional cyclist. Nevertheless, the comparison is pretty revealing: I think that most people would expect someone who manages to become a surgeon to have displayed an unusual ability to work long hours and would consider it a notably difficult job.

Being an elite professional athlete in a major endurance sport takes a combination of lucky genetics and long hours of hard work. I am genuinely startled that you seem to think that this is somehow a controversial statement.

As for the businessman example, I think that the modern cult of the allegedly heroic, hardworking, businessman, wealth creator and job creator and motor of economic progress and all that rubbish is a pernicious myth. Most businessmen are neither notably hard working, nor notably talented as compared to their employees, but that's an off topic discussion.
 
Oct 1, 2010
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Christian said:
You know what they say ... nice guys finish last. Nice or not nice is difficult to say though as some have pointed out, I don't actually know any cyclists so I try not to judge them on their personalities (or what might come across as their personality in the media).

I like riders I can relate to. That's why I always prefered Ullrich to Armstrong, it was like human vs. machine. I am sure though if you are invited to Lance's ranch he is an awesome host and you'll have a great BBQ with some nice cold Coors Light. That's one of the reasons (national bias aside) why I prefer Andy to Contador - I'm lazy, show up to work hung over and say stupid stuff. Contador is perfection in every way, which is great but also incredibly boring. I respect and acknowledge perfection when I see it but it bores me and I do not aspire to reach it. Same reason I had no interest in Gilbert last season. Cancellara getting beaten on the other hand made him seem flawed, thus human. Same reason I have no interest whatsoever in Real Madrid, Barcelona or Bayern München. I have heard a saying "The French like losers" (was it maybe even Armstrong himself who said it?) and there's probably something to it. Coming from my corner of the world I suppose you must get used to losing in sports otherwise it's gonna be tough. My favourite Lance was the post-comeback one and the moment Berto was most interesting to me was when they worked him over in Paris Nice '09.



THANK YOU finally someone who has the guts to say it

I think Armstrong did say something like that, but also that he wasn't going to lose or look like he was suffering during races just to please the French. Fair enough too. He was wrong about the French hating him, though.

Hinault said something like the French did not like (or appreciate) winners because they themselves were not winners. Perhaps that's why Poulidor was so popular in France compared to Anquetil.

To the original question: I have to have a certain amount of respect for a cyclist's qualities as a person before I can consider myself a "fan" of that cyclist. Strangely enough, I judge them mostly on how they handle defeat. For example, my respect of Merckx came not from all the races he won, but for the manner in which he handled his defeat to Thevenet in 1975. But that's just me and I tend to support the underdog in any contest, even if the favourite is someone from my own country.

I don't consider myself a fan of any particular cyclist now (too many cases of my favourite cyclist testing positive for PEDs) except Stefano Garzelli (yes, I know he tested positive back in the 2002 Giro). I can't explain it but for some reason I really like it when he wins or places well in races. The positive test aside, I haven't heard anything really bad about him...yet.
 
May 6, 2011
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I'm not saying rising to the level of elite professional athlete does not involve hard work. Its your implication that it is somehow harder than becoming one of the best in the world at something less glamorous that I take issue with.