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Doping In Athletics

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Jul 21, 2012
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Anyone else find it hillarious that *** is hitting the fan right after Baron Coe gets elected? Couldn't have happened to a better person.
 
the sceptic said:
oldcrank said:
now this is a believable "exotic" backstory for someone who against all odds managed to escape poverty and make something for themselves by hard work and talent, rather than spoiled white kid Chris Froome attending private schools in South Africa and riding bikes on his spare time.
Thank you for your mature contribution to the debate ...
 
Either Russians are extremely incompetent at using and covering up PED's, or someone is trying to get at them and them alone, or both or something else is going on. I don't doubt the Russian doping, but I strongly doubt they are the only ones involved in bribing and having special interests. What, with current anti-Russian sentiments going on with regards to the Ukraine crisis, Syria and the usual drivel coming from the US and the US media. It's sort of like the UCI and WADA busting Spanish and Italian cyclists, while Armstrong, the Belgiums, Riis, French, Germans, the Brits (in recent memory) get away scot free. I hope this blows up even more. Interesting to see what will come out, although I am not convinced EVERYTHING will come out.
 
Jul 16, 2012
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BullsFan22 said:
Either Russians are extremely incompetent at using and covering up PED's, or someone is trying to get at them and them alone, or both or something else is going on. I don't doubt the Russian doping, but I strongly doubt they are the only ones involved in bribing and having special interests. What, with current anti-Russian sentiments going on with regards to the Ukraine crisis, Syria and the usual drivel coming from the US and the US media. It's sort of like the UCI and WADA busting Spanish and Italian cyclists, while Armstrong, the Belgiums, Riis, French, Germans, the Brits (in recent memory) get away scot free. I hope this blows up even more. Interesting to see what will come out, although I am not convinced EVERYTHING will come out.
I teach in a day and boarding school in England with a high proportion of pupils from Russia. Now don't get me wrong. I don't believe that my lot don't dope but the attitude of the Russian students, inevitably linked to the culture in which they are brought up in, is astonishing. My colleague who teaches business and economics is appalled by their responses to questions focusing on how a company should succeed in business. What other nations see as corruption is, to many of them, par for the course. The reason they are getting caught is, I suspect, that many more of them dope than in other countries. When they caught they assess their options and follow the path which is, for many of them, part of the cultural norm.

We have over thirty different nationalities. The Russian students are almost unique in this regard.
 
Jul 10, 2010
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So the latest is that the French police have raided the IAAF offices in Monaco. I wonder what IAAF spokesman and Brit, Nick Davies has to say about that. Remember he was the guy when the Radcliffe story first started to roll came out with the following.

"Athletes with a “red flag” reading may well be guilty of doping, but equally (and we can prove it in the majority of names on this list) they may be innocent – which is why this information should always have remained locked up in the safe of the anti-doping department in Monaco."

http://www.letsrun.com/news/2014/12/iaaf-spokesman-nick-davies-writes-letsrun-com-reports-iaaf-not-follow-retesting-150-suspicious-samples-2006-2008/

So what equals "proof of not doping" ? Starting to look now like that evidence comes in the form of a formal written response from the subject of the "non-negative" which starts off "Please pay the bearer of this cheque..........."

Ok, given that McLaren has been allowed to give tasters of what is coming out tomorrow and Barron Coe is able to get in some early pr defence, it looks like no-one big is going down, but rather some ex Soviet block athletes and some Africans. The question is - is doping so individualised in athletics that dopers will be taken down separately or will one of the Kenyan's who gets busted be able to turn around and cry for leniency by busting a bigger western star ? I am thinking a Balco-esque record of sales from one of those German doctors who set up home in Kenya and had everything the good enduro athlete needed, available in a one stop shop, at a nice location the Kenyan anti-doping agency agreed they would never go to.

As an aside, what has been leaked so far makes cycling look way ahead of the game. Such a crude system, so easy to follow, a positive and then a payment; comparatively medieval. T & F how far behind the times were its programs ? Tom Weisel and all those investment vehicles based out of New York that so many cycling enthusiasts invested in. All of them turning out to be such good financial advice. Thank the Lord Lance only ever sent in that one cheque to support the fight against the dopers.

"No sport on the planet is doing more to combat .........."
 
Sep 8, 2015
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Re:

Freddythefrog said:
will one of the Kenyan's who gets busted be able to turn around and cry for leniency by busting a bigger western star ? I am thinking a Balco-esque record of sales from one of those German doctors who set up home in Kenya and had everything the good enduro athlete needed
Talking of "record of sales", when the WADA recently signed an information sharing agreement with the Chinese govt sports department, I recall WADA referred in the press release to something like "access to records and information which will be very helpful in the fight against doping".

Have I remembered it wrong, or was that a sign that they now have a bunch of historical records they can comb through, potentially showing who bought what when?
 
Jul 11, 2013
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In today's bbc5 interview Reedie said the report would be robust in terms of it's goal to examine Russian wrongdoing.
He then seemed to correct himself and added something about other areas as well.

It was also said that the report would be revealing ADRV's rather than criminal offences as those finds have been forwarded relevant authorities.

Smells a bit different from earlier accounts saying the report would uncover corruption on a whole new level.

Well maybe that part will be removed from the public eye, as they don't need see "what is already forwarded" to Interpol etc.

Wonder how much will be redacted.

p.s. I would have to find a replay to give the exact wording, but that was my take on it.
 
the sceptic said:
oldcrank said:
now this is a believable "exotic" backstory for someone who against all odds managed to escape poverty and make something for themselves by hard work and talent, rather than spoiled white kid Chris Froome attending private schools in South Africa and riding bikes on his spare time.
Froome killed rabbits, this lady handled guns!
 
Jul 21, 2012
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"I'm just angry, bloody angry," Coe told the AP. "I'm angry about the position our sport is in today. I'm shocked, I'm angered and dismayed. These are dark days."
I thought the sport was cleans just a few months ago when he got elected :D
 
May 26, 2010
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Re:

the sceptic said:
"I'm just angry, bloody angry," Coe told the AP. "I'm angry about the position our sport is in today. I'm shocked, I'm angered and dismayed. These are dark days."
I thought the sport was cleans just a few months ago when he got elected :D
The guy was IAAF VP for 7 years! What a liar Coe is!

These allegations were printed in July this year, so why the shock?
 
Jul 21, 2012
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Re: Re:

Benotti69 said:
the sceptic said:
"I'm just angry, bloody angry," Coe told the AP. "I'm angry about the position our sport is in today. I'm shocked, I'm angered and dismayed. These are dark days."
I thought the sport was cleans just a few months ago when he got elected :D
The guy was IAAF VP for 7 years! What a liar Coe is!

These allegations were printed in July this year, so why the shock?
Isn't it beautiful that everything is blowing up in Baron Coe's face? He was trying to do a "new generation" like Cookson and then this happens :D loving it!
 
Aug 2, 2012
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........dark days indeed mr coe.........but are you part of the solution.....or the problem.......

Mark L
 
Time will tell. I don't have much faith in Coe, but he is a fairly shrewd political operator.... so he may have to turn on the old guard to, at the very least, present himself as part of the solution. It won't be for altruistic reasons, but it may have a positive effect.
 
Jul 11, 2013
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armchairclimber said:
Time will tell. I don't have much faith in Coe, but he is a fairly shrewd political operator.... so he may have to turn on the old guard to, at the very least, present himself as part of the solution. It won't be for altruistic reasons, but it may have a positive effect.
Yes time will tell.

I think he already has the advantage of help from WADA in terms of the narrative being sold.

This is what Coe said in todays bbc5 interview:

“We do know we are taking a disproportionate amount of damage from a relatively few number of nations out there.
And Reedie followed up with this regarding the scope of the investigation/report that is released monday:

“I think it will be very robust in terms of what it was set up to do, which was to examine serious breaches of doping rules in Russia, and the anti-doping community and sport should be ready for that.”
http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/these-are-dark-days-for-athletics-says-iaaf-president-sebastian-coe-704608.html

Containment of main guilt towards Russia seems to be the order of the day.

Of course the attention has to be proportinate in terms of the original investigation by Seppelt was rooted in a Russian angle. But it does seems a bit convenient to onesidedly focus so much on Russia.

I wonder how are they going to make the russians take all the blame for this?
 
Renee Ann Shirely took a dig at Coe on twitter:

Renee Anne Shirley ‏@RAnneShirley 4h4 hours ago
I expect to see Elite T&F aths speaking out as the IAAF scandal unfolds...Hope some comments shared privately during Beijing WC will surface

Renee Anne Shirley
@RAnneShirley
Not sure @sebcoe understands the sense of frustration clean aths feel...They know how much they have lost to cheats in past & still are!
Not an accusation (she wouldn't know anything, and would make it clear if she did), I just appreciated the perspective.

EDIT: I also want to preempt the ones who Believe in Miracles. Tomorrows report is WADA's response to Seppelt's information. It is independant of the French Police investigation, and the Russian Farah article. Just because a name doesn't appear in the report tomorrow doesn't mean they're exonerated and that their hands are clean.

The report is based on Seppelt's information of Russian athlete and federation doping, federation's corruption and complacency, Kenyan athletes' and doctors' doping, and Kenyan Federation bribery. If WADA found more info, it did so from those strands. No reason to think this is a comprehensive look into Jamaica, US, UK, or anyone else.
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Just imagine what would happen if WADA went into World War with a big organization as IAAF?

Who would survive?

What would other major interests not do to protect their interests, power and monetary flow.

I don't necessarily think WADA and Reedie are ill-intended. Rather they are realists and try to do what they can to influence sports to moderate "acceptaple" behavior not causing media storms.

On the other hand, WADA has to maintain it's legitimacy and has to prove their relevance from time to time.

Let's not kid ourselves, People at WADA may be anti-doping to the core (most of them) but those in real power are rather politicians and carreer oriented much like in the private sector. They have a job and salary to protect, so no reason to go full genius on much bigger and powerful institutions.

I think WADA will back Seb Coe, and that Diack and a couple of Russians may well be what providees them to acheive two goals at once.
 

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