Doping In Athletics

[thehog]

Re: Re:

Well adidas dropping their links to the IAAF is nothing in the context of the reported new deal with Real Madrid.

Along with their contrasting stance to FIFA and the ISL, it just proves it was a stunt to end their sponsorship with the IAAF.

Yes, lets blame ADIDAS and not Coe or the IAAF. I believe the real "stunt' was Coe pretending their was no corruption when he was VP. Stunt man indeed, rolling through that one

Yet, I said nothing of the sort.

Their deal with the IAAF is peanuts in comparison to the reported Madrid deal.

And why haven't they addressed the ISL bribes to Havelange and members of the FIFA ExCo. Funny because Lamine Diack also accepted bribes off them back then.

Why are you comparing? Its not necessary to make a comparison. Corruption is corruption and Coe is knee deep in it.

'Don't look at the British corruption, check out the Spanish guys over there, they are even worse'... good grief

Again, never said that. Its about the enormous sponsorship with Madrid which is the highest in the game's history. The IAAF sponsorship pales into significance and is dwarfed by it. It's no big deal dropping it.

Yes, corruption is corruption. So why haven't they said anything about the bribes by ISL to FIFA officials? The same ISL who's founder was Horst Dassler, who also established Adidas. No way they would drop that as their place would be taken in a heartbeat. Plus it's invaluable to them.

This has been spinned by them as taking the moral high ground when it's anything but that.

Who is 'they'? David Walsh?




In other Real Madrid news...

Real Madrid’s players were preparing for this week’s huge Champions League and La Liga games against Juventus and Barcelona, 500 children aged between six and thirteen were attending training sessions at the Spanish football club’s two new academies in East Timor.

In recent weeks the foundation has also organised a training course for 43 Colombian youth coaches, provided new sports kit to 100 ‘at-risk’ children aged between six and nine at its academy in Mozambique, and hosted tournaments for over 1,000 children in Japan and Panama.

Madrid president Florentino Pérez told the club’s AGM in September that it currently operates 317 projects in 68 countries, which help more than 60,000 people on five continents.

Facilities have been opened in Middle East countries including Kuwait, Jordan, Palestine, Israel, Bahrain and Saudi Arabia, while one is even planned for Iraq / Kurdistan.

Funding for these projects comes from the club - the richest in the world with an annual turnover of over $687 million – and includes the proceeds from ‘legends’ games featuring former Madrid stars such as Butragueño and current first team assistant coach Zinedine Zidane.

Corporate partnerships are also a major source of the foundation's resources however. For example Microsoft has provided computer software worth a reported $1.38 million to an initiative to reach 20,000 children in Argentina, Brazil, Colombia, Ecuador and Mexico.

http://www.realmadrid.com/en/about-real-madrid/foundation

For Barcelona;

Barcelona have extended to 2016 a deal with UNICEF under which the La Liga side pay £1.25-a-year to display the name of the United Nations Children's Fund on the back of their shirts.

The current agreement was due to expire next year and the Barca directors approved a two-year extension at a board meeting today, the Spanish champions said on their website.

Barca and UNICEF first joined forces in 2006 and Barca's Argentine World Player of the Year Lionel Messi is one of the fund's global goodwill ambassadors.

Maybe Lord Coe might donate some of his Nike money?

 

[King Boonen]

Spun.

 

[arcus]

Pound: “The real issue seems to be that I failed to participate in a lynching. I don’t do lynchings”
http://athleticsillustrated.com/editorial/***-pound-the-real-issue-seems-to-be-that-i-failed-to-participate-in-a-lynching-i-dont-do-lynchings/

In an Athletics Illustrated article, I suggested that something had happened between the IC’s two reports for example, that Pound was perhaps intercepted and coerced or bullied or perhaps even begged into not bringing the sport down any further. In response Pound said, “Why would you even think, if you had taken any care with your background research on me that I would permit myself to be “intercepted” in a matter of such importance?” One of the (many) reasons why I was never president of the IOC (International Olympic Committee) was that I did not fail to act on a principled basis on many contentious issues within the IOC and within WADA, regardless of the impact on my personal advancement within each organization and regardless of what the media may have thought of any such decision.
“The conclusions of the IC were not the result of any intervention by anybody. There was certainly no sell-out by anybody, including your humble servant, and we stand by those conclusions.
I think there was probably a general awareness that there was a lot of doping going on in Russia (among other countries), but there was an absence of proof to enable sanctions to be imposed, other than positive tests, of which there were many. You cannot suspend a country on the basis of suspicion, even strong suspicion.

 

[gooner]

I remember her well racing against Sonia O'Sullivan in '90s. Not that it is a surprise.

Wang Junxia, the 3000 and 10,000 metres women's world record holder, has seemingly admitted to doping in a letter which has emerged in China.

If genuine, the letter, reportedly signed in 1995 by Wang and other members of the national team coached by Ma Junren, and known colloquially as "Ma's Army", is the most concrete evidence yet of a systemic doping system within the Chinese distance-running squad in the 1990s.

The letter, written in Mandarin and orginally published by Tencent Sports, claims she and other runners were forced to take "large doses of illegal drugs over the years".

"We are humans, not animals," it reads, as reported in English by the South China Morning Post.

"For many years, [he] forced us to take a large dose of illegal drugs.

"It was true.

“Our feelings are sorry and complex when exposing his [Ma’s] deeds.

“We are also worried that we would harm our country’s fame and reduce the worth of the gold medals we have worked very hard to get.”

An investigation has been launched by the IAAF to verify the letter, which was also reportedly signed by nine team-mates and was sent to a journalist named Zhao Yu, only to remain unpublished until now.

It is not yet clear why it did not emerge earlier.

http://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1034019/chinese-3000-and-10000m-world-record-holder-reportedly-admits-to-doping-in-20-year-old-letter

 

[Freddythefrog]

Wang Junxia - Ma's army - yes of course the signs were all there, we should have all seen it. A country from which there was not great history of achievement in the sport, has a charismatic coach/team leader who suggests the reason why all of a sudden his athletes are dominating and setting new world records and his athletes can beat all the athletes from established teams is because of modest gains from studying each aspect of the sporting performance independently and adding together each of those gains. fundamental better coaching, better eating, and better resting.

It was obviously far fetched and undoubtedly behind that sudden rise to success and domination there just had to be a dark, hidden story, that Ma and the coaching and admin staff riding on their coat-tails wanted to keep hidden.

Have you ever seen anything like it since ?

 

[slowspoke]

Re:

Wang Junxia - Ma's army - yes of course the signs were all there, we should have all seen it. A country from which there was not great history of achievement in the sport, has a charismatic coach/team leader who suggests the reason why all of a sudden his athletes are dominating and setting new world records and his athletes can beat all the athletes from established teams is because of modest gains from studying each aspect of the sporting performance independently and adding together each of those gains. fundamental better coaching, better eating, and better resting.

It was obviously far fetched and undoubtedly behind that sudden rise to success and domination there just had to be a dark, hidden story, that Ma and the coaching and admin staff riding on their coat-tails wanted to keep hidden.

Have you ever seen anything like it since ?

I finished Hank Paulson's book on China. In it he says in a meeting just after the 1996 Olympics, with a very senior Chinese official, the Chinese official said that China's success was down to "Chinese hard work and Western technology." Which Hank took to mean doping.

 

[gooner]

To be fair on this forum you have declared Paula Radcliffe clean and told people to "stop their doping view of everything'. You told us Wiggins and Dan Martin are clean and their performances are in line with cycling cleaning up.

You mean like this:

Paul Kimmage ‏@PaulKimmage Jan 14
Shussssh, don't tell anyone this but I actually used to admire @paulajradcliffe

I gave Radcliffe the benefit of doubt before. So what? Did we know what we do now? I also think O'Sullivan should be getting her medals upgraded after what's come out with the Chinese runners. If anything comes out similar as with her, the same applies.

Why quote Kimmage?

Sonia won silver height of EPO use? Care to explain how?

Why do you think he moved from his admiration to a critical point of view with Radcliffe? I wasn't criticising him for it.

As for Sonia, I don't know for certain but then she has never been implicated. Therefore she has grounds to get an upgrade for her medals.

 

[Benotti69]

To be fair on this forum you have declared Paula Radcliffe clean and told people to "stop their doping view of everything'. You told us Wiggins and Dan Martin are clean and their performances are in line with cycling cleaning up.

You mean like this:

Paul Kimmage ‏@PaulKimmage Jan 14
Shussssh, don't tell anyone this but I actually used to admire @paulajradcliffe

I gave Radcliffe the benefit of doubt before. So what? Did we know what we do now? I also think O'Sullivan should be getting her medals upgraded after what's come out with the Chinese runners. If anything comes out similar as with her, the same applies.

Why quote Kimmage?

Sonia won silver height of EPO use? Care to explain how?

Why do you think he moved from his admiration to a critical point of view with Radcliffe? I wasn't criticising him for it.

As for Sonia, I don't know for certain but then she has never been implicated. Therefore she has grounds to get an upgrade for her medals.

`O'Sullivan has said 2 gold medals in the post now would be meaningless!!! Not the mindset of someone who was clean.

Kimmage is a big exponent of athletes being very vocal in their anti-doping stance and Radcliffe was when it came to others!

 

[gooner]

`O'Sullivan has said 2 gold medals in the post now would be meaningless!!! Not the mindset of someone who was clean.

That's not what I seen on her twitter today. And of course, the moment has taken away. It is nearly 23 years ago.

I understand you can't be certain at the same time.

Kimmage is a big exponent of athletes being very vocal in their anti-doping stance and Radcliffe was when it came to others!

Isn't that the point I'm making. I welcomed Radcliffe's stance over the years.

 

[Catwhoorg]

I thought Ma's army ran on turtle soup this whole time...

*chuckle*

 

[Benotti69]

`O'Sullivan has said 2 gold medals in the post now would be meaningless!!! Not the mindset of someone who was clean.

That's not what I seen on her twitter today. And of course, the moment has taken away. It is nearly 23 years ago.

I understand you can't be certain at the same time.

1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

Kimmage is a big exponent of athletes being very vocal in their anti-doping stance and Radcliffe was when it came to others!

Isn't that the point I'm making. I welcomed Radcliffe's stance over the years.

Yep. Radcliffe's stance was welcome but it was a smoke screen, that is obvious now.

 

[BullsFan22]

Doping aside, which record is more impressive, the 10000m record or Paula's 2:15 marathon?

 

[gooner]

1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

True regarding that era and why you can't be certain giving her a clean bill of health. I wouldn't disagree you with you on that and up thread I did say I felt she could have spoken out more at the time over this. There were lots of rumours even back then. The Irish media could have pushed her a bit more on it.

That being said, I do think for now it's right for her and the Irish federation to push for an upgrade in the medals. It's within her rights to do so.

Yep. Radcliffe's stance was welcome but it was a smoke screen, that is obvious now.

Agree.

 

[thehog]

1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

True regarding that era and why you can't be certain giving her a clean bill of health. I wouldn't disagree you with you on that and up thread I did say I felt she could have spoken out more at the time over this. There were lots of rumours even back then. The Irish media could have pushed her a bit more on it.

That being said, I do think for now it's right for her and the Irish federation to push for an upgrade in the medals. It's within her rights to do so.

Yep. Radcliffe's stance was welcome but it was a smoke screen, that is obvious now.

Agree.

Why the doping view of everything?

 

[gooner]

1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

True regarding that era and why you can't be certain giving her a clean bill of health. I wouldn't disagree you with you on that and up thread I did say I felt she could have spoken out more at the time over this. There were lots of rumours even back then. The Irish media could have pushed her a bit more on it.

That being said, I do think for now it's right for her and the Irish federation to push for an upgrade in the medals. It's within her rights to do so.

Yep. Radcliffe's stance was welcome but it was a smoke screen, that is obvious now.

Agree.

Why the doping view of everything?

You can when you use reasoned logic.

 

[happytramp]

[quote="


1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

Yeah, no way of knowing buy she's right that they are fairly meaningless now...she should have had them at the time when the meant something.. She knew it and so did the media, we're not talking Andy Schleck here, were talking a quarter of century. Nobody here is in a position to say how an athlete should feel about something 20+ years after the fact.

 

[Benotti69]

[quote="


1993 was EPO central! If she was clean she would welcome the medals with great joy no matter how long she has had to wait and no doubt it would be big publicity for her and her sponsors, but to have a meh attitude kind of says i wont make too much noise as i was not clean.......

Yeah, no way of knowing buy she's right that they are fairly meaningless now...she should have had them at the time when the meant something.. She knew it and so did the media, we're not talking Andy Schleck here, were talking a quarter of century. Nobody here is in a position to say how an athlete should feel about something 20+ years after the fact.

Getting two gold medals20+ years later cannot compare to winning on the day. But getting them later is still great news for a clean athlete and it can be shared with family (children) and current sponsors and capitalised upon. But the meh attitude suggests keep head down and hope no one points out that EPO was the prevalent dope of choice and no test for it!

Sonia doped. No doubt!

 

[happytramp]

“Just knowing something that you questioned, something that you didn’t believe in all those years ago, that you were right and you were right to not believe it, that would give me a lot of satisfaction,”

Doesn't sound very 'Meh' now does it?

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Wang Junxia - Ma's army - yes of course the signs were all there, we should have all seen it. A country from which there was not great history of achievement in the sport, has a charismatic coach/team leader who suggests the reason why all of a sudden his athletes are dominating and setting new world records and his athletes can beat all the athletes from established teams is because of modest gains from studying each aspect of the sporting performance independently and adding together each of those gains. fundamental better coaching, better eating, and better resting.

It was obviously far fetched and undoubtedly behind that sudden rise to success and domination there just had to be a dark, hidden story, that Ma and the coaching and admin staff riding on their coat-tails wanted to keep hidden.

Have you ever seen anything like it since ?

Australia in 2000?

 

[sniper]

Because of the virus or because their massive doping issues are coming to the fore?
www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/feb/09/kenya-rio-2016-olympics-zika-virus

 

[thehog]

Re:

Because of the virus or because their massive doping issues are coming to the fore?
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/feb/09/kenya-rio-2016-olympics-zika-virus

Get everyone to pull out, then Britain can win all the medals. I like Coe's plan

 

[The Carrot]

What about the mosquitoes? If they bite an athlete at the games and get some of that 'high octane' blood, they'll fly off at the speed of sound while concurrently developing increased muscle size.

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

guys i'm drinking a 15 dollar Montepulciano 2012 here.
don't make me spill it.

 

[yaco]

Gee the Clinic is full of big ego's. It's commonsense that 90% of athletes dope - But yet we have part of a forum speculating if athlete A or Athlete B is doping ! I have no idea why some follow sport !

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Gee the Clinic is full of big ego's. It's commonsense that 90% of athletes dope - But yet we have part of a forum speculating if athlete A or Athlete B is doping ! I have no idea why some follow sport !

and those in the front half of the peloton, 99% will be doping