Doping in other sports?

[Maxiton]

It's not a cherrypicked record at all. It's very much a relevant distinction to make because africans have superior running economy* (this has been proven in numerous scientific studies) so you would expect them to outperform whites.
And it's not like white runners is a particularly small or clean group, is it?

I picked the marathon because that is clearly where an improvement in TTE would have the greatest effect on performance.

* Well, eastern africans anyway. Perhaps the northeners are not more efficient runners.The best performance by a northern african is about 3% better than the WR from the 60's.

What a load of racist trash. Don't think you can come into a public forum and spout this KKK krap without being called on it. Let's see some reliable studies cited - and not these anecdotal articles you've been trying to pass off to prove your other points. I asked you earlier to explain your low-grade asides. If this is the best you can do you need to go away.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Guys, let's cut all the race references in this thread, immediately. This thread has been moving along quite well without such comments, and let's keep it in that direction.

Next person who makes a racial reference in this thread takes a week vacation from posting.

 

[kukiniloa]

The big picture

What makes you SO SURE, that the NFL or the english premier league are any better?

right. I am surprised at the naivete on this forum. Hasn't anybody spent any time at health clubs, or in the college athletics training rooms? It's not about one sport or the other - trainers these days are the prime peddlers of PEDs...
Hasn't anybody talked to college trainers about PEDs? - perhaps over a few beers?

If you can get past the shame - the code of silence - you'll find that doping goes on everywhere, in every college athletic program in the USA.

It's a culture that's very real and very ubiquitous.

 

[Maxiton]

right. I am surprised at the naivete on this forum. Hasn't anybody spent any time at health clubs, or in the college athletics training rooms? It's not about one sport or the other - trainers these days are the prime peddlers of PEDs...
Hasn't anybody talked to college trainers about PEDs? - perhaps over a few beers?

If you can get past the shame - the code of silence - you'll find that doping goes on everywhere, in every college athletic program in the USA.

It's a culture that's very real and very ubiquitous.

+1. Well there you are. Says it all.

 

[auscyclefan94]

It is funny that in a country like Australia that in the sports media, cycling will only reported about when there is a doping story. That means the general public have an attitude that cycling is the only sport that has drugs problems. The media keep that myth alive.

 

[The Hitch]

right. I am surprised at the naivete on this forum. Hasn't anybody spent any time at health clubs, or in the college athletics training rooms? It's not about one sport or the other - trainers these days are the prime peddlers of PEDs...
Hasn't anybody talked to college trainers about PEDs? - perhaps over a few beers?

If you can get past the shame - the code of silence - you'll find that doping goes on everywhere, in every college athletic program in the USA.

It's a culture that's very real and very ubiquitous.

Thats exactly what ive been saying.

It is funny that in a country like Australia that in the sports media, cycling will only reported about when there is a doping story. That means the general public have an attitude that cycling is the only sport that has drugs problems. The media keep that myth alive.

Same here.

Cav just got nominated as one of 10 britons for sports personality of the year here.

In one of the articles the motherless ***** dismissed this, saying that no one will vote for a sport with so much doping.

 

[D-Queued]

...Cav just got nominated as one of 10 britons for sports personality of the year here.

In one of the articles the motherless ***** dismissed this, saying that no one will vote for a sport with so much doping.

What is he talking up that we don't know about?

Sorry, typo.

What is he taking up that we don't know about?

Better.

Dave.

 

[The Hitch]

What is he talking up that we don't know about?

Sorry, typo.

What is he taking up that we don't know about?

Better.

Dave.

I dont understand. You asking what drugs Cavs takes?

I dont know, but I have my suspicions

 

[D-Queued]

I dont understand. You asking what drugs Cavs takes?

I dont know, but I have my suspicions

Well, he certainly quacks like a duck and walks like a duck.

Dave.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Bumping an old thread for the Clinic's perspective on this issue.

An NCAA runner was held for almost 4 hours after her race waiting to produce a sample, until 1:30 AM the morning before another championship race.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/stevekelley/2017741547_kelley14.html

The article itself is a little bit of a sob story, but it is an interesting point. Especially in the developing anti-doping system in the US collegiate sports.

I imagine if a cyclist faced a long night and couldn't produce a sample, it may be called sandbagging, and trying to get out of the test. Similarly, one reaction is to say that 21 and 22 year olds are on a different playing field than pros, but we also know the young guns can be quite savvy.

Was it the right decision to force the issue and carry out a test without mercy? Does the character/difference of the sport (amateur collegians as opposed to professionals) change peoples stance?

 

[meat puppet]

Good discussion and interesting stuff above!

Dehydration, eh?

Wonder if chugging up a litre would help.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Bumping an old thread for the Clinic's perspective on this issue.

An NCAA runner was held for almost 4 hours after her race waiting to produce a sample, until 1:30 AM the morning before another championship race.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/stevekelley/2017741547_kelley14.html

The article itself is a little bit of a sob story, but it is an interesting point. Especially in the developing anti-doping system in the US collegiate sports.

The problem here is timing is everything in getting a false negative for doping. And in typical cheater's fashion, if you give an inch, "Go get some rest we'll get it tomorrow" they will take a mile and use the loophole to great effect.

Was the response a strategic response to cover doping? No way to know. But, I agree with what the NCAA did.

 

[9000ft]

Pro sports fans both casual and rabid want whatever version of bigger, faster, stronger, more exciting, etc fits their sport. Everyone loves a winner and nobody loves a looser. Pro athletes are compensated according to results, especially their latest results. In this dynamic, is it any wonder PEDs are common in pro sports?

If you ask most fans they'll tell you that PEDs are "bad" and "cheaters" should be punished, but with the same breath, they'll denigrate whatever athlete doesn't perform up to expectations or applaud politely at a "clean" athletes solid, but not particularly exciting performance, but cheer wildly at a "dirty" athletes highlight performance.

 

[Caruut]

Was it the right decision to force the issue and carry out a test without mercy? Does the character/difference of the sport (amateur collegians as opposed to professionals) change peoples stance?

Absolutely right not to let it slide. If I were an athlete who was pumped full of drugs (having just had a big win, in which I'd put in an excellent performance), then "sorry, I just can't seem to pee" is exactly what I'd say. I have no idea whether the girl is on drugs or not, but either way, she would say to her teammates "I couldn't/said I couldn't pee, and they let me go", then that would spread. People would learn that the way to avoid a urine test was to not pee, testing would be completely undermined. Athletes must accept that they are going to be tested.

Also, what was she doing dehydrated after 1600m, especially in Seattle in spring?

 

[DirtyWorks]

....People would learn that the way to avoid a urine test was to not pee, testing would be completely undermined. Athletes must accept that they are going to be tested.

And prepare accordingly. Now, I'll cut a college athlete a little slack here. It wouldn't be the first time a college kid was caught unprepared...

Also, what was she doing dehydrated after 1600m, especially in Seattle in spring?

The way the story was written it had a heavy bias towards the eeevil NCAA. Hard to know what her hydration situation really was.

 

[DirtyWorks]

It is funny that in a country like Australia that in the sports media, cycling will only reported about when there is a doping story. That means the general public have an attitude that cycling is the only sport that has drugs problems. The media keep that myth alive.

The UCI has gone above and beyond to earn the general consensus that the sport is internationally dope friendly.

There's little record online about the riders dying in the 1980's from heart attacks. (presumably early EPO users) Hein/UCI's response was a shrug of the shoulders. It took several internationally embarrassing doping stories to get the IOC/UCI to do anything. And then when they did, it's an elaborate system designed to protect riders from killing themselves that randomly and obviously protects riders.

The UCI has earned their status as common knowledge doping haven. If they let WADA handle the testing process then introduced back testing and increased blood sampling then we'd have a federation that's changed course on doping.

 

[T_S_A_R]

tiger woods is back on form today after being carried off the course a couple of weeks ago with a leg injury.

is doctor galea out of prison?

 

[hiero2]

. . .
2 on the few occasions that people have looked for drugs in football, theyve found drugs in football

3 Many say that the greatest benefit of peds would be in injury recovery. Footballers get injured more than other sports. . . .

EPO and steroids are a given.

Most injuries - stats have been published many times that put American football at the top of the injury list in sports. I don't recall soccer/football being in the top 5. You might want to clarify. Boxing comes in several sports down - well below American football and basketball.

Steroids are certainly a given in American football. All the way down to the high school level. I would think, also, along with thyroid abuse and uppers (ephedra, coke, speed). They would give much more advantage in such sports that are based on short term peak efforts. Got to remember that ephedra is now illegal in the US because of a basketballer's death. I can't see EPO being considered very useful in these sports, especially given the cost and effort, but, hey, what do I know?

Other "sports"? Pro wrestling - steroids guaranteed. Mixed martial arts competition - steroids guaranteed. Body-building - steroids guaranteed. We might actually have people in this forum who won't believe this - but hey, ostriches stick their head in the sand, right? The physical evidence is so overwhelming it is incontrovertible. I believe that one could find some competitors in those sports who are honest and above board - but figuring out who they are would be like trying to figure out which TdF contenders DIDN'T dope between 1993 and 2003.

I happen to be in the group of people that think cycling is not among the worst dopers in sports - just one of the most tested. Go back to "A Dog in a Hat" - what is the first thing he talks about? How all his American buddies warned him about doping in the European peloton. When the American cycling culture hit the European cycling culture - there was a definite culture clash. And, since the American audience brought so much money to the sport - I think it is pretty obvious why there was a push to "clean up the sport" - simple economic motivation.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Alistair Overeem’s positive for PEDs infuriates Dana White; it’s time the UFC stepped

http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/news?slug=ki-iole_alistair_overeem_failed_test_dana_white_040412

 

[hiero2]

Yeah, Brock Lesnar, champ for how many years? Came from WWF. And we know those guys have about a 90% positive rate. So now he quit MMA, and went back to WWF. What does that say? Sheesh.

 

[The Hitch]

Most injuries - stats have been published many times that put American football at the top of the injury list in sports. I don't recall soccer/football being in the top 5. You might want to clarify. Boxing comes in several sports down - well below American football and basketball.

Those werent the emergency room stats?

Because on seriousness, soccer is not famed for its injuries. But for frequency I think it is. They get knocks that put you out for a few weeks maybe even only a few days all the time.

You dont need anything past a team medic to tell you that swollen knee or bruised ankle, should be all right in 4 days. But you got a match in 3 well, you take some cortisone or something else maybe. Wont show up in no stats.

Yeah, Brock Lesnar, champ for how many years? Came from WWF. And we know those guys have about a 90% positive rate. So now he quit MMA, and went back to WWF. What does that say? Sheesh.

In pro wrestling, it would be worrying if they werent doping. You need to be able to execute those manouvers as best as possible even after 25 minutes in the ring, or you could end up even killing your so called "opponent" (in reality close friend) . Stone cold for example, the big wwf star of the 1990's had to take a year out during his golden age because he had his neck broken in a slightly botched simple manouvre that gets performed multiple times in the average match. He was almost paralysed for life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQoJRYHuWSY

This happens all the time. Adam Copeland known as "Edge", their second biggest star of the last 5 years just had to retire a few months ago because doctors told him he could die if any simple manouvre was botched in the ring.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

How the hell are all these MMA-fighters getting TUE's for testo?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...thletes-are-using-performance-enhancing-drugs

 

[blackcat]

This happens all the time. Adam Copeland known as "Edge", their second biggest star of the last 5 years just had to retire a few months ago because doctors told him he could die if any simple manouvre was botched in the ring.

acromegaly from the camp of a Bond villain eh?

 

[slowspoke]

Here's another one -
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/...itish-MPs-son-banned-for-taking-drug-cocktail

17 years old..... Nothing on where he got them all from

 

[starnason]

Translation from a Spiegel article concerning Angel Heredia, PED dealer of many top American athletes:

http://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/scjly/with_all_the_overeemped_business_going_on_heres_a/

Original German;

http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/0,1518,571031-3,00.html

Sad commentary on the task facing the testers.

Edit: from 2008 but sadly still fresh