Doping in XC skiing

[BullsFan22]

I guess the Asthmatics were a little angry after getting trounced by the Russians in three straight races last week. Came back with a vengeance today. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and a few other hovering near the top as well. Hats off to Manificat and Legkov for sticking with the Asthma train for as long as the did.

Yes, today was another slap in the face by the asthmatic red army. When something looks, behaves and smells like a fish - it usually is a fish. This won't hold up. Someone is going to break the omertà.

I don't think that will happen anytime soon. Sad as it is.

 

[May0maniac]

The previously suspended Austrian cross-country skier Harald Wurm has admitted doping.

Source (german):
http://derstandard.at/2000031443811/Doping-Langlaeufer-Harald-Wurm-gestaendig

Obviously Austria has a much smaller population of competitive cross country skier and biathletes, but I am sure if we take the percentages of dope cases in these two sports and compare them to the Russians, the Austrians wouldn't be too far back. You'd expect the Russians to have more, mostly due to such a massive number of racers there, but the Austrians, percentage wise, per skier, would be pretty close. Just my feeling.

You also have to consider the fact that XC skiing is a 2nd rate winter sport in Austria, alpine skiing is still king, so they don't get the same kind of protection that athletes from the bigger skiing nations get.
2 months ago a read an interview with Walter Mayer, he said, if I was still in charge Dürr would have used Xenon just like the Russians and not EPO (he admitted that Dürr porbably just used it to stabilize his blood values to hide blood transfusions). Sadly I can't find an online version of the interview, but it was interesting, he tried to portrait himself as a victim, but there were a few interesting comments about the Russian doping scandal and even about the Brits and Lord Coe.

 

[Blaaswix]

http://www.dagbladet.no/2016/02/21/sport/langrenn/therese_johaug/lahti/vm/43233317/Dagbladet has an article today where a Swedish commentator describes Johaug's performances as 'incredible' ." Doesn't she get tired, doesn't she get stiff?" .

 

[TMobile41]

Only incredible? She makes the rest of the competition look like amateur skiërs... I wonder if she will keep this ridiculous form in Canada.... Will she escape the peloton in the first 200 metres like today? ... On the good side, at least Sundby does not look so uber-dominant anymore, though he kind of just pulled a gear in one climb and that was more than enough

 

[Discgear]

Only incredible? She makes the rest of the competition look like amateur skiërs... I wonder if she will keep this ridiculous form in Canada.... Will she escape the peloton in the first 200 metres like today? ... On the good side, at least Sundby does not look so uber-dominant anymore, though he kind of just pulled a gear in one climb and that was more than enough

Sundby not uber-dominat depends if you compare him with the red army or normal skiers. Magnificat had one of those days when everything's working and clearly visible superior skis. Still beaten with a minute, despite Sundby falling and loosing some 20 s during the first half of the race. The real shocker today was Krogh who competed yesterday in the sprint, still looking like a million dollars today. Krogh being the skier that train less hours than anyone else.

 

[Blaaswix]

Krogh being the skier that train less hours than anyone else.

Well that can't be right. If you read this http://www.nrk.no/sport/norsk-sykkelsuksess_-_-de-trener-mer-enn-utlendingene-1.12814288 you'll see that Norwegian endurance success is down to the superior culture - Norwegians get out there and train while foreigners are presumably sat on the sofa all winter eating doughnuts. It makes sense when you think about it.

 

[Cloxxki]

Sundby is pacing himself, Johaug is not.

The thing about the Norwegian women is not the dominance by Johaug IMO. She's physically and mentally without anyone's doubt the most talented for this sport. Everything about her gets her real, scientific, advantages. The thing is that the second finisher happens to Norwegian as well. And in her turn a good bit ahead of a pair of Norwegian sprint specialists. Before the rest of the nameless Norwegians arrive in a mix with some untalented unmotivated foreigners.
Who is supposed to be the first clean finisher, in the womens and the mens? Not the first non-Norwegians, because they are too close to an obviously too dominant nation.
I wonder what Sundby has that the other Norwegian men don't. Just full ***?
With Johaug, at least we can SEE why she'd be beating the likes of Weng and Oestberg. And Johaug IS pushing like a maniac Duracell bunny. Sundby, just seems to be taking part in a different sport. On mountainbikes, it would look motorized. Just, who on her suspects the finisher behind Sundby to be clean? Those who got outdone by Lance Armstrong all turned out doped. And really, Sundby seems to have it easier. Without being an outstanding skier before his sudden rise to fame. Johaug at least came in with a bang. Slow twitch fibres on a small frame, high cadence, positive attitude. And she doesn't go about double poling classic sprints. Is actually a distance specialist, can't advance far in a 3m30 Lahti sprint.

 

[BullsFan22]

Re:

Sundby is pacing himself, Johaug is not.

The thing about the Norwegian women is not the dominance by Johaug IMO. She's physically and mentally without anyone's doubt the most talented for this sport. Everything about her gets her real, scientific, advantages. The thing is that the second finisher happens to Norwegian as well. And in her turn a good bit ahead of a pair of Norwegian sprint specialists. Before the rest of the nameless Norwegians arrive in a mix with some untalented unmotivated foreigners.
Who is supposed to be the first clean finisher, in the womens and the mens? Not the first non-Norwegians, because they are too close to an obviously too dominant nation.
I wonder what Sundby has that the other Norwegian men don't. Just full ***?
With Johaug, at least we can SEE why she'd be beating the likes of Weng and Oestberg. And Johaug IS pushing like a maniac Duracell bunny. Sundby, just seems to be taking part in a different sport. On mountainbikes, it would look motorized. Just, who on her suspects the finisher behind Sundby to be clean? Those who got outdone by Lance Armstrong all turned out doped. And really, Sundby seems to have it easier. Without being an outstanding skier before his sudden rise to fame. Johaug at least came in with a bang. Slow twitch fibres on a small frame, high cadence, positive attitude. And she doesn't go about double poling classic sprints. Is actually a distance specialist, can't advance far in a 3m30 Lahti sprint.

The only argument you have on Johaug is 'scientifically' she is perfect for this sport. She's 160 cm, and what....45 kilos or something like that? No, I am not suggesting you need to be built like a tank, but to suggest that's a perfect makeup for a skier is crazy. At least when Bjoergen was racing, and when Kowalczyk wasn't so bad, those 3 wouldn't go away form the field after only 30 seconds of skiing. Certainly not that viciously. This is Muehlegg 2.0. Not normal. I don't care what your physical makeup is or if you are pure distance skier. Only one woman double poled a classic sprint on the WC, as far as I know, and that was a Belarusian skier in Stockholm, so the chances of Johaug doing it are slim to none. She actually did pretty well in the Lahti sprint, but the conditions and the tougher course helped her out.

 

[Cloxxki]

I am saying that Johaug skiing away from Weng is within the realm of normality. But Weng being chased by sprinters of the same nation on a skiathon, before the specialists of other nations get a placing, THAT's not normal. I cannot see Johaug clean, but then Wen is on the same stuff and Falla/Oestberg on something even more potent.

And the doublepoling referred to technician Sundby who's gone out of his way to show off his transformation.

I'll TRY to be brief:
Skiing is for a large part about glide resistance. Glide resistance is about how much snow is being compressed. Everyone has 4cm skis. Everyone gets to used about the same length. So the lightest skiers have the lowest pressure per cm² of ski on the snow. It doesn't make evvery twig bea every powerhouse, but it's a factor when you have thousands of talented women training for the same goal, being distance skiing.
How Bjoergen ever beat Johaug on a distance over 5km, I cannot explain other than with full *** doping. Sprinter becomes a bodybuilder who wins everything including 30k's.
Johaug beating everyone on a skiathlon is OK to me, in the WC field she has probably the best physical starting point, and her natural high tempo low strength technique works a charm.
But, being so many minutes faster than the first non-Norwegian, that's not normal. And why would we even presume that first non-Norwegian clean? It's pro sports. And a XC skiing is a big deal in places such as Finland, Sweden, Germany, Russia.

Are we seeing a doping race BETWEEN the Norwegians, where they a a nation are protected or just have a drug no-one else's been told about? Sundby could be a top responder, and Johaug forced to partake, or be the one chasing the sprinters in 30k's, just before the (un?)clean foreigners.

On Petter Northug. What's he OFF? Was he the first to get ON and now the rest are all doing it? Or just over his peak, unable to put it together consistently anymore? Targeted locally after his unflttering car escapades? He should be peaking aerobically.

 

[python]

in the absence of real positives (or the next best indirect evidence like warnings for missed tests, leaked weird blood values or credible cover ups), all we have left is to speculate on the statistically significant out-of-line performances and gaps...

so, what comes to my mind when i observed the ladies lately, was the dramatic effect the testosterone/steroids would have on women even in trace amounts. it is based on the physiological fact that women produce about 1/10th the testo of men... i mean, the steroids in the endurance sports are an old trick for both genders. men use small amounts to improve their day-to-day recovery mainly. however, the steroids used by women can literally turn them into 'temporary men' performance wise. the dramatic effect in a woman's body is amplified b/c she has fewer muscles, fewer red blood cells/haematocrit etc..

in a strength-endurance sport like xc some gaps i see in a a ladies field are consistent with either steroid use ('little cute therese') or a withdrawal ('poor justyna'). of course, a suspicion is far from a proof. btw, for a well advised, smart cheater (either gender) to beat a steroid test is as easy as it ever was..the techniques include the use of very short half-life variants, the meticulous sticking to micro doses and schedules, masking or better yet, the designer steroids... as dr. catlin pointed many times - of the 300+ testosterone variants only 40 to 50 are being tested for...

 

[Discgear]

Re:

Krogh being the skier that train less hours than anyone else.

Well that can't be right. If you read this http://www.nrk.no/sport/norsk-sykkelsuksess_-_-de-trener-mer-enn-utlendingene-1.12814288 you'll see that Norwegian endurance success is down to the superior culture - Norwegians get out there and train while foreigners are presumably sat on the sofa all winter eating doughnuts. It makes sense when you think about it.

Got the irony. Apparently Espen O Saether isn’t the only Norwegian producing articles that sounds like they had their journalistic training in North Korea.

Before the rest of the nameless Norwegians arrive in a mix with some untalented unmotivated foreigners.

And then…

But, being so many minutes faster than the first non-Norwegian, that's not normal.

I can’t really follow your arguments. Clearly the foreigners would end several minutes behind TJ and the Red Army if they all are so untalented and unmotivated as you are claiming.

You obviously have a fabless for the Scream Queen. I don’t. In many ways she has an inferior skiing technique. Being so short might help her climbing Alp Cermis but not enough leverage in the pooling, diagonal stride and skating parts. What really sticks out is her unlimited stamina. And of course it’s quite hard to take the ever-changing Norwegian arguments. When Marit Bjoergen was superior everyone was told that it was due to a new era in XC-skiing where strength- and weight training were a major part of building a skier.

By the way, yesterday MJS came forward and told that he’s enjoying to fool people with different false claims. When asked if it also involved his training hour claims, he just rolled with his eyes.

in a strength-endurance sport like xc some gaps i see in a a ladies field are consistent with either steroid use ('little cute therese') or a withdrawal ('poor justyna'). of course, a suspicion is far from a proof. btw, for a well advised, smart cheater (either gender) to beat a steroid test is as easy as it ever was..the techniques include the use of very short half-life variants, the meticulous sticking to micro doses and schedules, masking or better yet, the designer steroids... as dr. catlin pointed many times - of the 300+ testosterone variants only 40 to 50 are being tested for...

Interesting and also quite depressing.

 

[Cloxxki]

@Discgear
Sarcasm, look it up ;-)

I was/am indeed a fan of Johaug, not hiding that. But her beating the other Norwegians with some margin to me is in itself not suspect. The other Norwegians beating the the rest of the world, is. And with that, the insane gap of Johaug to non-Norwegians.

 

[Armchaircyclist]

I guess the Asthmatics were a little angry after getting trounced by the Russians in three straight races last week. Came back with a vengeance today. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and a few other hovering near the top as well. Hats off to Manificat and Legkov for sticking with the Asthma train for as long as the did.

---------------------------

It's funny to see the bitterness against the Norwegians ! Anyway, enjoy the hate-Club while it lasts. There will be no positives, the only likely thing is that we have some legal medicine that gives advantages (asthma med.) or that we have some ski-advantages (less likely). The huge advantage we do have, is a massive cross-country culture, where Our best endurance athletes all do cross country, this is where the Money is.

By the way, here's some fuel to the fire: A Danish article claims that asthma medicine helps the nerve receptors in the muscles, and is in fact performance enhancing. Unfortunately I cannot find the link to the article.

Take a look at Belgium's dominance in cyclo-cross, Norway in cross-country is much the same. In a culture where hundreds of athletes go all in to be the best, you have a much better shot at creating champions, than in countrys where the sport is not so much in focus, and alternative sports enjoy more popularity.

 

[Armchaircyclist]

P.S. skisprint is no sprint, this is middle-distance. And as most People interested in athletics know, coming from middle-distance to long distance is a quite normal thing for an athlete. It's also not unusual that a top 1500 runner can also be good at a 5 or 10k. On a track the athlete gets no rest, on a ski course, the faster skier gets a bit of rest on the downhill, making longer distances easier.

 

[BullsFan22]

Re:

P.S. skisprint is no sprint, this is middle-distance. And as most People interested in athletics know, coming from middle-distance to long distance is a quite normal thing for an athlete. It's also not unusual that a top 1500 runner can also be good at a 5 or 10k. On a track the athlete gets no rest, on a ski course, the faster skier gets a bit of rest on the downhill, making longer distances easier.

That I don't disagree with. Plus you add the fact that, if there are all rounders or some distance skiers that make the heats, you'll see them getting stronger or at least lasting longer than a 'pure sprinter.' Endurance in play.

However, lets be realistic here. This is an endurance sport. One of the hardest sports on the planet. But it's also a sport that has had many doping issues, suspicious athletes and performances, and involvement from infamous people like Michele Ferrari, among others. These things like 'better grinds, better skis, better culture, better training, nobody would risk doping because they would be humiliated in public, etc, etc, we have higher standards, etc' Those are stories that just aren't gonna fly as easily as before. I'm sorry, like Lance Armstrong suggested of some 'naysayers' in the past, maybe I don't believe in 'miracles.'

 

[Armchaircyclist]

Re: Re:

I don’t know, but either EOS is completely stupid or he managed to – in a quite clever way – to raise questions that wouldn’t have been possibly to raise in a direct way.

It's the first one.

Other great comments from him:

Praising Katusha for bringing in Stein Ørn to save them from having to dope to cope. Now the whole team can succeed with his magic training formula like Kristoff. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/10/16/sport/sykkel/stein_orn/alexander_kristoff/41535178/) Not going well so far, though.

Praising Edvald for "giving away his silver" to help Kristoff in Richmond because he will benefit from it in the long run. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/09/28/sport/sykling/sykkel-vm2015/alexander_kristoff/edvald_boasson_hagen/41260056/)

Sundby is the greatest of Norwegian sports. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/01/11/sport/langrenn/tour_de_ski_2015/martin_johnsrud_sundby/37120440/)

----------------------

Here is where you hit the nail: " EOS is completely stupid ". His commentary on football is maybe even worse and more moronic than in endurance sports..

 

[Armchaircyclist]

Re: Re:

P.S. skisprint is no sprint, this is middle-distance. And as most People interested in athletics know, coming from middle-distance to long distance is a quite normal thing for an athlete. It's also not unusual that a top 1500 runner can also be good at a 5 or 10k. On a track the athlete gets no rest, on a ski course, the faster skier gets a bit of rest on the downhill, making longer distances easier.

That I don't disagree with. Plus you add the fact that, if there are all rounders or some distance skiers that make the heats, you'll see them getting stronger or at least lasting longer than a 'pure sprinter.' Endurance in play.

However, lets be realistic here. This is an endurance sport. One of the hardest sports on the planet. But it's also a sport that has had many doping issues, suspicious athletes and performances, and involvement from infamous people like Michele Ferrari, among others. These things like 'better grinds, better skis, better culture, better training, nobody would risk doping because they would be humiliated in public, etc, etc, we have higher standards, etc' Those are stories that just aren't gonna fly as easily as before. I'm sorry, like Lance Armstrong suggested of some 'naysayers' in the past, maybe I don't believe in 'miracles.'

----------------------
Take the comparison to Belgium and cyclocross then... How can belgium dominate such a sport ? It's very comparable, to cross-country in Norway.
The sport has had scandals surely, and I think this has caused a lot of harm to the sport in Finland and Russia. Finnish women however are on the right track and will soon be really competitive to the Norwegians. Sweden is doing really badly at the moment, but there is never a guarantee that new talented skiers come along when the old ones are losing it. At least the swedes have some good sprinters that have a chance to move on to longer distances. Russian men are a bit on and off, but will surely be dangerous in the next season. The Russian women seem to prefer other sports if they have any talent...The best russian woman is quoted saying they will try to copy Norwegian training methods after being shocked by how different the Norwegian training is compared to what they do: http://www.dagbladet.no/2016/02/14/sport/ski/langrenn/natalja_matvejeva/marit_bjorgen/43141166/

 

[BullsFan22]

Re: Re:

P.S. skisprint is no sprint, this is middle-distance. And as most People interested in athletics know, coming from middle-distance to long distance is a quite normal thing for an athlete. It's also not unusual that a top 1500 runner can also be good at a 5 or 10k. On a track the athlete gets no rest, on a ski course, the faster skier gets a bit of rest on the downhill, making longer distances easier.

That I don't disagree with. Plus you add the fact that, if there are all rounders or some distance skiers that make the heats, you'll see them getting stronger or at least lasting longer than a 'pure sprinter.' Endurance in play.

However, lets be realistic here. This is an endurance sport. One of the hardest sports on the planet. But it's also a sport that has had many doping issues, suspicious athletes and performances, and involvement from infamous people like Michele Ferrari, among others. These things like 'better grinds, better skis, better culture, better training, nobody would risk doping because they would be humiliated in public, etc, etc, we have higher standards, etc' Those are stories that just aren't gonna fly as easily as before. I'm sorry, like Lance Armstrong suggested of some 'naysayers' in the past, maybe I don't believe in 'miracles.'

----------------------
Take the comparison to Belgium and cyclocross then... How can belgium dominate such a sport ? It's very comparable, to cross-country in Norway.
The sport has had scandals surely, and I think this has caused a lot of harm to the sport in Finland and Russia. Finnish women however are on the right track and will soon be really competitive to the Norwegians. Sweden is doing really badly at the moment, but there is never a guarantee that new talented skiers come along when the old ones are losing it. At least the swedes have some good sprinters that have a chance to move on to longer distances. Russian men are a bit on and off, but will surely be dangerous in the next season. The Russian women seem to prefer other sports if they have any talent...The best russian woman is quoted saying they will try to copy Norwegian training methods after being shocked by how different the Norwegian training is compared to what they do: http://www.dagbladet.no/2016/02/14/sport/ski/langrenn/natalja_matvejeva/marit_bjorgen/43141166/

Well, at least we are both civil about this so we can have a good conversation. Regarding the Belgians and cyclo-cross, I have to be honest, I don't know that much when it comes to cyclo-cross or cycle-cross racing. I've seen some races in person years ago, it was cool, and I love riding my mountain bike in the woods and I also love running. I hardly know any top cycle-cross riders. I am not gonna speculate that much, but wouldn't shock me if the Belgians are doing it with PED's either. If their top road riders are anything to go by, then I see the Belgians being equally suspicious in cyclo-cross.

I am not gonna blast the Norwegians anymore, for now, but as far as the Russians are concerned, they've had their history, no doubt. The only head scratcher for me is the 90's and perhaps the early 2000's. So, post USSR up to right before Rotchev won the world championship sprint. They had guys like Botvinov and Prokurorov who were up there winning medals and placing fairly consistently in the top 10, but by and large, nowhere near the domination of their women. Ok, so their talent pool at the time wasn't as deep as it was before or as it is now, and perhaps they lost top skiers like Smirnov, the Estonians who emerged later (Veerpalu, Mae) and others, due to the breakup of the USSR and the economy took some time to recover, so they weren't able to support as much as they wanted to or needed to, AND they probably put a lot of their support to the women. Obviously the results have to be looked at with a pinch of salt, but so do the Italians, Germans, Finns, etc at the time when EPO and blood doping was widespread and hardly any testing for it (if any). The French website, ski-nordique, had an interesting article on the Russian women and why they aren't that good these days. One of their older coaches is still the head coach, working from Moscow, and they say he implements similar training programs as he did in the past, when the women were as the Norwegian women are now, dominant. They also wrote that since it's more than likely doping was involved, they could recover faster and take in the training load easier and thus cope with it later on. Now, when it's more than likely that the Russian women are 'clean' they can't handle the load and it's harder to recover, hence the average at best results.

 

[John de Savage]

Cloxxi is a delusional Johaug fan. He needs to tell himself that she'd destroy everyone on a level playing field because he fancies her. TJ's "real, scientific advantages" is wishful thinking. There is no evidence that she is "without anyone's doubt" physically and mentally the most talented skier. This is Armstrong level fan boy nonsense.

 

[Discgear]

Re: Re:

I don’t know, but either EOS is completely stupid or he managed to – in a quite clever way – to raise questions that wouldn’t have been possibly to raise in a direct way.

It's the first one.

Other great comments from him:

Praising Katusha for bringing in Stein Ørn to save them from having to dope to cope. Now the whole team can succeed with his magic training formula like Kristoff. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/10/16/sport/sykkel/stein_orn/alexander_kristoff/41535178/) Not going well so far, though.

Praising Edvald for "giving away his silver" to help Kristoff in Richmond because he will benefit from it in the long run. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/09/28/sport/sykling/sykkel-vm2015/alexander_kristoff/edvald_boasson_hagen/41260056/)

Sundby is the greatest of Norwegian sports. (http://www.dagbladet.no/2015/01/11/sport/langrenn/tour_de_ski_2015/martin_johnsrud_sundby/37120440/)

----------------------

Here is where you hit the nail: " EOS is completely stupid ". His commentary on football is maybe even worse and more moronic than in endurance sports..

You know Armchaircyclist: Being stupid, EOS still managed to raise extremely relevant questions that wouldn’t have been possibly to raise in a direct way. As an example, he points out that your and many others explanation about Norwegian dominance due to being the biggest ski nation, vast economical resources, number of skis sold etc. is dead wrong. Russia is bigger and still can't be competitive. And so on. It was actually quite funny to see how this stupid man (in your opinion) unintentionally managed to address all the usual Norse explanations with a devastating blow.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

The Russians also have the drawback of some volatile and pretty crazy selection decisions sometimes. The Lillehammer relay when they stuck Ustiugov somewhere in the middle of Russia II and Larkov anchoring Russia I, for example. In the biathlon you have the more extreme example of the World Championships where they withdrew Andrey Makoveev, who a couple of weeks before had won the last Individual raced on the World Cup, and put in Ustyugov, who had got injured. The men are at least pretty good in both XC and biathlon even if not the absolute elite (as with Germany and quite a few 'lesser' skiing nations, potential XC talents can be hæmorrhaged to the biathlon development teams because of less predictable results meaning more chances of at least a moderate level of success) but the women are a long way from the best in both, and they seem to be reluctant to gamble on younger prospects either, which is resulting in a talent drain to other nations, mainly Belarus and Ukraine but also others.

 

[TMobile41]

"Take the comparison to Belgium and cyclocross then... How can belgium dominate such a sport ? It's very comparable, to cross-country in Norway." No, i dont think the two things are comparable, XC-skiing is much more international. How many cyclocross pros outside of BENELUX? How many nordic skiërs outside of Norway? Well there you have it. However, i admit that there are some "technical" stuff (ski preparation) that may play a larger role than in cycling. And given that they have tons of money invested in it, i would not be surprised if Norway would be the dominant nation, if all XC-skiërs were clean. But what we are seeing this year is not normal, and TJ IS NOT NORMAL, and as we all Clinic-readers know, if something looks to good to be true, then....

 

[kingjr]

Re:

The Russians also have the drawback of some volatile and pretty crazy selection decisions sometimes. The Lillehammer relay when they stuck Ustiugov somewhere in the middle of Russia II and Larkov anchoring Russia I, for example.

Has there ever been an explanation for that decision? I remember banging my head on my desk when I saw the line-up and then again after the race was over...

 

[BullsFan22]

Re:

The Russians also have the drawback of some volatile and pretty crazy selection decisions sometimes. The Lillehammer relay when they stuck Ustiugov somewhere in the middle of Russia II and Larkov anchoring Russia I, for example. In the biathlon you have the more extreme example of the World Championships where they withdrew Andrey Makoveev, who a couple of weeks before had won the last Individual raced on the World Cup, and put in Ustyugov, who had got injured. The men are at least pretty good in both XC and biathlon even if not the absolute elite (as with Germany and quite a few 'lesser' skiing nations, potential XC talents can be hæmorrhaged to the biathlon development teams because of less predictable results meaning more chances of at least a moderate level of success) but the women are a long way from the best in both, and they seem to be reluctant to gamble on younger prospects either, which is resulting in a talent drain to other nations, mainly Belarus and Ukraine but also others.

Yep. I think one of the reasons was they felt that Larkov was in better form at the time, even though Ustiugov is the better skier, generally, and obviously a better finisher, but they probably felt form wise, Larkov was the way to go. The bigger issue, though, is that the Russian leadership has shown continued disdain towards the foreign coaches, specifically Burgermeister/Knauthe. Remember that Vaelbe was always criticizing Legkov and how he could never put things together and win a big championship race? I remember her criticizing Legkov after every race that Legkov failed to medal in, even the ones he did medal in, there was always something he didn't do right. Same things happening now with the Burgermeister/Knauthe's skiers Ustiugov, Belov and Volzhentsev. Those two coaches have had, arguably, the most success of all the Russian coaches since taking over Legkov and Chernousov in 2010. Kaminskiy has had great success with Kriukov, Petukhov and the other Russian sprinters, so too Perevozchikov with Vylegzhanin, Bessmertnykh, but Burgermeister/Knauthe seem to have had the most success (Sochi gold and bronze in the 50, TDS win for Legkov, Holmenkollen 50 for Legkov, etc) and that isn't sitting very well with Vaelbe and I am assuming, most of the federation. They feel like if there are coaches in their federation that are going to have the most success, they should be Russian. So the coaches probably still feeling salty about that group and felt like even a slight dip in form and Ustiugov wasn't gonna be named to the 1st team.

 

[BullsFan22]

Re: Re:

The Russians also have the drawback of some volatile and pretty crazy selection decisions sometimes. The Lillehammer relay when they stuck Ustiugov somewhere in the middle of Russia II and Larkov anchoring Russia I, for example.

Has there ever been an explanation for that decision? I remember banging my head on my desk when I saw the line-up and then again after the race was over...

See comment above. Definitely some politics/bitterness going on.