Edvald Boasson Hagen Versus Peter Sagan - Who is the better rider?

[Captain_Cavman]

EBH has shown that he has the ability to be an all-time great. Trouble is, he has shown it very rarely and only in isolated instances.

Sagan may well get a decent haul of wins but I don't think he will be particularly dominant.

So in the hope and expectation that he is able to find some consistency and freedom from injury, I'll say EBH.

 

[maltiv]

But who were those "other contenders"... I seem to remember a group with guys like Tankink and Hayman, which formed quite early in the race. And that's the level of rider that Sagan could drop as well. Mind you, we're talking about the two biggest talents in cycling, I'm not saying this wasn't impressive by EBH or anything.


Yes. I've seen him climbing impressively elsewhere as well. But I think Sagan has more of a punch in the hills.

Yes, well the peloton split in the wind, but that's how classics work. Sagan could potentially do that as well though. Sagan probably has more punch in the hills though, which he particularly showed in P-N last year. Edvald hadn't shown too much climbing abilities at the same age, mostly because he was 77 kg then (way too much upper-body muscles from XC-skiing) vs 74 kg now.

The most exciting part is to see when/if they'll handle races over 250 kilometers. I imagine EBH will do so next year if he stays free of injury, but Sagan might still be too young.

 

[Mambo95]

They're both fantastically talented, but when they've both retired, I'd fancy EBH to have the superior palmares.

 

[El Pistolero]

To be honest, EBH hasn't really grown all that much over the years. I know all his injury stories, but perhaps he's just the type of guy that gets easily injured or sick... Perhaps he's just not though enough for the big races.

This year he was pretty good at the Tour. He won a difficult sprint, but we already knew he could do that. His other stage was from a breakaway where he even had a teammate to help him out. Other than that he hasn't impressed me all that much besides at the Dauphiné. Sure, he won Vattenfall. Big deal... He was second there last year, but this year it had a weak field. He also won Eneco Tour, a race that's perfectly suited to him. But we already knew he could win such a stage race and it's not like he was that great at the hilly stages there... In the stage he did win his opponents conveniently crashed for him And Greipel would have won that stage anyway if OPL didn't force him to work for Phil that day. What I mean is, I haven't seen all that much progression since he first broke through and I don't know if that will ever come...

Great rider, but Sagan was something else this season and he's 3 years younger than EBH.

 

[velosiped]

To very different riders.
Sagan has had free reigns from his team to hunt breaks, while Hagen often has had domestic duties for teammates - like Pologne 2009 where he won 2 stages as Greipels leadout.
What is certain is that Sagan will be a marked man in one-day classics and not be allowed to go so easy.
Hagen seems to climb better each year, but I don't think he really has that as a priority in his training regime; it just comes natural.
The only way to see who's better is to set an age measurement. Hagen will be 25 after the coming spring season; can't possibly think he will not win anything there if he's healthy.
Then Sagan has 2,5 seasons before he reach the same age.
Lets count the big victories until that time has expired.

 

[craig1985]

Its a very tough one but Ill go with Sagan. In a similar thread a year ago I went with EBH and in 4 or 5 months I might go with him again, but atm Im edging to Sagan.

Was that the EBH and TGBM thread?

 

[kanari]

This year he was pretty good at the Tour. He won a difficult sprint, but we already knew he could do that. His other stage was from a breakaway where he even had a teammate to help him out.

No he didn't. He was in the first break of the day with G. Thomas but that was reeled in so he instigated another break in which he was the sole Sky rider. On the final climb he just blew away from the rest of the break including that fantastic Mollema guy...

 

[theyoungest]

No he didn't. He was in the first break of the day with G. Thomas but that was reeled in so he instigated another break in which he was the sole Sky rider. On the final climb he just blew away from the rest of the break including that fantastic Mollema guy...

Yeah, I don't see how he got that win thanks to a teammate either.

As for Mollema: he was sick in the Tour, getting second in a stage was a feat in itself.

 

[Swabian Lass]

Interesting question. They're different types of rider (imo) which makes it difficult to compare them in some ways. If you're going on current palmares then I suspect that EBH is ahead. However, he's never really quire achieved his potential (imo again) and although he's had reasons for that, I'm beginning to wonder if we've seen everything we're going to see. He'll do well, no doubt, but I'm not sure that there's going to be any significant improvement of breakthrough now, that will take him to the next level.

Sagan still has potential for development. I think that he could, just possibly be the next Phil Gil. However, next year he's going to be marked very heavily so I think that it will be interesting to see what happens.

So I guess I would go for Sagan.

 

[maltiv]

To be honest, EBH hasn't really grown all that much over the years. I know all his injury stories, but perhaps he's just the type of guy that gets easily injured or sick... Perhaps he's just not though enough for the big races.

This year he was pretty good at the Tour. He won a difficult sprint, but we already knew he could do that. His other stage was from a breakaway where he even had a teammate to help him out. Other than that he hasn't impressed me all that much besides at the Dauphiné. Sure, he won Vattenfall. Big deal... He was second there last year, but this year it had a weak field. He also won Eneco Tour, a race that's perfectly suited to him. But we already knew he could win such a stage race and it's not like he was that great at the hilly stages there... In the stage he did win his opponents conveniently crashed for him And Greipel would have won that stage anyway if OPL didn't force him to work for Phil that day. What I mean is, I haven't seen all that much progression since he first broke through and I don't know if that will ever come...

Great rider, but Sagan was something else this season and he's 3 years younger than EBH.

If you haven't noticed that his climbing has improved this year then you haven't payed attention at all really. He has lost 3 kgs without losing power.

 

[Netserk]

Which of the two do you think resembles Bettini the most? I think it's Sagan, although EBH has a higher top speed.

 

[craig1985]

Sagan is a hard ****, remember him racing in the TDU when he got in the break with Lulu, Valverde, and Evans with 17 stitches in his knee. Now for a training race he had an excuse to drop out, but he was in an all-star breakaway.

 

[Walkman]

To very different riders.
Sagan has had free reigns from his team to hunt breaks, while Hagen often has had domestic duties for teammates - like Pologne 2009 where he won 2 stages as Greipels leadout.
What is certain is that Sagan will be a marked man in one-day classics and not be allowed to go so easy.
Hagen seems to climb better each year, but I don't think he really has that as a priority in his training regime; it just comes natural.
The only way to see who's better is to set an age measurement. Hagen will be 25 after the coming spring season; can't possibly think he will not win anything there if he's healthy.
Then Sagan has 2,5 seasons before he reach the same age.
Lets count the big victories until that time has expired.

Why would we do this? The OP ask who is the best rider, not who will be remembered as the best rider at the age up to 25.

I'd say EBH at the moment and I think he will have a great 2012!

 

[Netserk]

Why would we do this? The OP ask who is the best rider, not who will be remembered as the best rider at the age up to 25.

I'd say EBH at the moment and I think he will have a great 2012!

Yes the question was who's the better rider atm and:

Who has the greatest potential?
What are their advantages/disadvantages compared to each other?

 

[El Pistolero]

If you haven't noticed that his climbing has improved this year then you haven't payed attention at all really. He has lost 3 kgs without losing power.

He's never going to become a climber, so in all honesty I don't give a crap about his climbing. He climbed good at the Dauphiné, but not really at the Tour. Thor Hushovd was a better climber then.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

He's never going to become a climber, so in all honesty I don't give a crap about his climbing. He climbed good at the Dauphiné, but not really at the Tour. Thor Hushovd was a better climber then.

well that is stupid

ofc he will not be a Contador or Valverde that is possibly more his type of cyclist, but his advantage against cav, grepiel, Farrar is the climbing, togheter with guys like Goss, Sagan, probably Gilbert he will dominate the not that hard hilly finishes the next 10 years, so dont giving a crap about his climbing you really dont give a crap about the rider, so why debate here?

 

[Old School]

Right now, EBH.

In the future, Sagan will rule!

 

[El Pistolero]

well that is stupid

ofc he will not be a Contador or Valverde that is possibly more his type of cyclist, but his advantage against cav, grepiel, Farrar is the climbing, togheter with guys like Goss, Sagan, probably Gilbert he will dominate the not that hard hilly finishes the next 10 years, so dont giving a crap about his climbing you really dont give a crap about the rider, so why debate here?

What has hills to do with climbing mountains? Gilbert must be one heck of a climber then!

Here's a not so hard hilly stage for you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl9u_J-0rwM

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Right now, EBH.

In the future, Sagan will rule!

i suspect Sagan is a over average east eurpoean wonderkid, who is not far from reaching his peak
could be wrong thought

 

[maltiv]

He's never going to become a climber, so in all honesty I don't give a crap about his climbing.

That makes no sense whatsoever. That's like saying Hushovd is a much worse rider now than he was in 2004 because he's a weaker sprinter now and he'll never become a climber anyway

 

[El Pistolero]

That makes no sense whatsoever. That's like saying Hushovd is a much worse rider now than he was in 2004 because he's a weaker sprinter now and he'll never become a climber anyway

He's never going to do well in a GT. He's never going to win on a MTF. Why would he even chose to become a better climber? We're not going to call hilly classics specialists climbers now are we?

We saw his climbing at the Tour, it wasn't all that good...

Anyway, he hasn't improved in the classics since his breakthrough. His time trial ditto. His sprint? Ditto. That's what I'm getting at here.

 

[kanari]

We saw his climbing at the Tour, it wasn't all that good...

No it only won him a medium mountain stage...

Guess it wa stupid to become a better climber then...

 

[El Pistolero]

No it only won him a medium mountain stage...

Guess it wa stupid to become a better climber then...

From a breakaway. He wouldn't have been there anymore if he had to face off against the likes of Contador, Schlecks, Cadel Evans, etc

Tony Martin got second on Mont Ventoux. Brice Feillu won a real mountain stage. I can go on and on.

 

[kanari]

From a breakaway. He wouldn't have been there anymore if he had to face off against the likes of Contador, Schlecks, Cadel Evans, etc

Tony Martin got second on Mont Ventoux. Brice Feillu won a real mountain stage. I can go on and on.

Well, that day I think he could actually have followed that group. My point however was that you said it was pointless of him to beome a better climber which isn't true as it gets him wins like this one in the TdF. Personally I think he can win both LBL and GdL in the future but of course I am a big fan of him...

 

[El Pistolero]

Well, that day I think he could actually have followed that group. My point however was that you said it was pointless of him to beome a better climber which isn't true as it gets him wins like this one in the TdF. Personally I think he can win both LBL and GdL in the future but of course I am a big fan of him...

But for me those are hills and not actual climbs. When I say climbing I mean mountains, real mountains.

He can definitely win those classics in the future, but he will have to improve. And sadly I haven't seen much improvements in the classics over the past 3 years. Of course that's partly due to his injuries. But I think he's just the type of guy that gets easily injured or sick to be honest.

But anyway, I tipped him to win the Olympics next year, we'll see.