Teams & Riders Everybody needs a little bit of Roglstomp in their lives

[cellardoor]

Most of the time you can just look for a guy wearing a leader's jersey.

Sean Kelly made that mistake when most of Jumbo crashed and he said Primoz must have escaped as he couldn't see the red jersey (Odd was wearing it of course)

 

[cellardoor]

I googled it a bit and it looks like it's a bit of both. He is in attacking position (his back is a lot more horizontal) a lot of times when others are not and his frame does appear to be smaller:

Is it just a question of spending more time on the drops than others?

 

[southwards]

Even if Gesink went to the drops he would be higher than Roglic.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I googled it a bit and it looks like it's a bit of both. He is in attacking position (his back is a lot more horizontal) a lot of times when others are not and his frame does appear to be smaller:

Primoz knows the laws of physics well:
smaller height -> smaller impact force

 

[bNator]

Is it just a question of spending more time on the drops than others?

I'm not a specialist, but there's a couple of other factors as well. First it's the arms-to-legs legnth ratio, then its the elbow angle, the way you are holding drops and finally stem angle and length.

Primoz knows the laws of physics well:

There was an interview with him on Slovenian national TV where he hinted he was pretty good at school...

 

[Red Rick]

I'm not a specialist, but there's a couple of other factors as well. First it's the arms-to-legs legnth ratio, then its the elbow angle, the way you are holding drops and finally stem angle and length.


There was an interview with him on Slovenian national TV where he hinted he was pretty good at school...

Heared he gave up on studying when he figured out he wasn't the #1 smartest kid alive.

 

[southwards]

Being from Brazil, winter sports are a complete mystery to me. But does this riding position have any influence of his ski-jumping? I mean, to jump longer one needs to be very aero.

 

[Red Rick]

Being from Brazil, winter sports are a complete mystery to me. But does this riding position have any influence of his ski-jumping? I mean, to jump longer one needs to be very aero.

I'd think so. Mostly because there would likely be more emphasis on flexibility and strength/power in the jump from a very deep position.

 

[bNator]

Being from Brazil, winter sports are a complete mystery to me. But does this riding position have any influence of his ski-jumping? I mean, to jump longer one needs to be very aero.

There should be some benefits - but as @Red Rick mentioned it has to do with deep position:

I'm pretty sure he is far less uncomfortable in attacking position than some other cyclists because of his background.

Edit: Bracing for "wait, he was a ski jumper?" joke

 

[Red Rick]

There should be some benefits - but as @Red Rick mentioned it has to do with deep position:

I'm pretty sure he is far less uncomfortable in attacking position than some other cyclists because of his background.

Yeah. I've read studies that elite athletes were actually more often engaged in other sports in the early development of their sports career than subelite athletes.

 

[Bolder]

There should be some benefits - but as @Red Rick mentioned it has to do with deep position:

I'm pretty sure he is far less uncomfortable in attacking position than some other cyclists because of his background.

Edit: Bracing for "wait, he was a ski jumper?" joke

I'd love to see him do a "ski jump" victory celebration one day. Although if he takes his hands off the bars...bad things could happen...

Regarding his current form: Roglic has dominated in a very low key way. Given that I think he's significantly better than the rest of the field and has the strongest team, it's a bit surprising that he's only 2-3 minutes up over the Movi duo. Of course that will likely grow by 1-2 minutes after the ITT. He still needs to be very attentive on Stage 20 -- Bernal is likely to go on the attack, which could blow things up early...

 

[southwards]

Before I've never considered how ski jumping may have helped him, but now it seems to have given him advantages in some areas. Remember that Roglic's breakthroughs came in TT's. It's easier to understand how a thriathlete or runner (like woods) can cross over to cycling, but perhaps ski jumping (or God knows what other sport) can give a sharper edge if the athlete has a great aerobic capacity.

I'd think so. Mostly because there would likely be more emphasis on flexibility and strength/power in the jump from a very deep position.

You talked about power, so the pull the ski jumper does is essential to a good jump? I wonder if a good ski jumper who crossed over to cycling would have a strong acceleration...

Even so, it is impressive that someone with such a great aerobic capacity would grow in a almost totally anaerobic/position sport.

 

[southwards]

Given that I think he's significantly better than the rest of the field and has the strongest team, it's a bit surprising that he's only 2-3 minutes up over the Movi duo.

Mas and MAL are in great form and are great riders, Lopez can beat everyone on climbs like yesterday's, he beat Pogacar last year. Mas was with Pogacar, Carapaz and Vingegaard at the Tour, and it looks he was peaking to the Vuelta. But the small amount of ITT so far helped their position, I imagine in a 33 km flatish TT a top-form Roglic might put 2 to 3 minutes on them.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Before I've never considered how ski jumping may have helped him, but now it seems to have given him advantages in some areas. Remember that Roglic's breakthroughs came in TT's. It's easier to understand how a thriathlete or runner (like woods) can cross over to cycling, but perhaps ski jumping (or God knows what other sport) can give a sharper edge if the athlete has a great aerobic capacity.

There are other factors as well. Initially he had problems with riding in a group without falling. It's easier to stay on a bike during TTs

You talked about power, so the pull the ski jumper does is essential to a good jump? I wonder if a good ski jumper who crossed over to cycling would have a strong acceleration...

Even so, it is impressive that someone with such a great aerobic capacity would grow in a almost totally anaerobic/position sport.

Explosivity needed during a ski-jump may have indeed helped him develop his punch on a bike.

 

[Red Rick]

Before I've never considered how ski jumping may have helped him, but now it seems to have given him advantages in some areas. Remember that Roglic's breakthroughs came in TT's. It's easier to understand how a thriathlete or runner (like woods) can cross over to cycling, but perhaps ski jumping (or God knows what other sport) can give a sharper edge if the athlete has a great aerobic capacity.



You talked about power, so the pull the ski jumper does is essential to a good jump? I wonder if a good ski jumper who crossed over to cycling would have a strong acceleration...

Even so, it is impressive that someone with such a great aerobic capacity would grow in a almost totally anaerobic/position sport.

I don't know about the aerobic capacity of a ski jumper, but the aero position and explosive jump should come extremely natural to a ski jumper. The real question for me is the muscle fiber ratio.

Runners going into cycling basically select for high aerobic capacity, but have no inherent benefit otherwise.

Mind you, we also don't know where Roglic would've been had he taken up cycling as a 12 year old.

 

[Bolder]

Mas and MAL are in great form and are great riders, Lopez can beat everyone on climbs like yesterday's, he beat Pogacar last year. Mas was with Pogacar, Carapaz and Vingegaard at the Tour, and it looks he was peaking to the Vuelta. But the small amount of ITT so far helped their position, I imagine in a 33 km flatish TT a top-form Roglic might put 2 to 3 minutes on them.

Oh, definitely. MAL is one of my favorite riders -- nothing like seeing a pure climber in full flight!

It's just not a Froome- or Armstrong-level dominance, but maybe that's a good thing.

 

[southwards]

It's just not a Froome- or Armstrong-level dominance, but maybe that's a good thing.

O God please, no. There's no comparison between bionic Captain America (not counting even the dope and the dirty politics) and "no risk, no glory."

 

[roundabout]

I think a lot of people can be more flexible on the bike, but for them the added flexibility will be at the cost of power. I mean it's one thing to hold the position for 6 seconds in ski jumping vs riding on a TT bike for an hour.

 

[southwards]

Went to youtube to become more acquainted to the sport, and look at the recommended video:

ski hosted at ImgBB

Image ski hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

The algorithm knows it all. I guess if i searched 'como sacar leche de una vaca' they'd show me Carapaz RR, and if I searched "Narcissistic personality disorder" I'd get Armstrong's Oprah Interview.

 

[Rackham]

Before I've never considered how ski jumping may have helped him, but now it seems to have given him advantages in some areas. Remember that Roglic's breakthroughs came in TT's. It's easier to understand how a thriathlete or runner (like woods) can cross over to cycling, but perhaps ski jumping (or God knows what other sport) can give a sharper edge if the athlete has a great aerobic capacity.

I always thought there were some parallels between Roglic & Tyler Hamilton.

Hamilton was a downhill ski racer who also came into cycling a bit later. And like Roglic, Hamilton's first real breakthrough & impressive display was in an individual TT (it's all in his book). Also, Hamilton was another rider with a pretty low profile on a bike.

 

[Rackham]

O God please, no. There's no comparison between bionic Captain America (not counting even the dope and the dirty politics) and "no risk, no glory."

I do think the Roglic off the saddle position on climbs can look a bit like Lance. It's just an aesthetic thing. It's like he's a combination of several schools of positioning thought & cadence to maximize his potential.

 

[southwards]

I always thought there were some parallels between Roglic & Tyler Hamilton.

Hamilton was a downhill ski racer who also came into cycling a bit later. And like Roglic, Hamilton's first real breakthrough & impressive display was in an individual TT (it's all in his book). Also, Hamilton was another rider with a pretty low profile on a bike.

Haven't read it, interesting, didn't know about his background.

I do think the Roglic off the saddle position on climbs can look a bit like Lance. It's just an aesthetic thing. It's like he's a combination of several schools of positioning thought & cadence to maximize his potential.

It seems to me that Roglic stays on the saddle much more and has a far lower profile than Lance (I'm comparing Lance at Sestriere and Roglic yesterday). But I was talking much more how they raced than their riding style (which is very different).

 

[cen]

He hasn't been a ski jumper for 10 years already, whatever that might have helped him in transition to cycling is long gone so I'm not sure why it's still discussed. His current form and bike handling has nothing to do with him being a ski jumper in the past, surely..

 

[southwards]

He hasn't been a ski jumper for 10 years already, whatever that might have helped him in transition to cycling is long gone so I'm not sure why it's still discussed. His current form and bike handling has nothing to do with him being a ski jumper in the past, surely..

I dunno. There are two facts about Roglic:

1. He is a very unique rider (very low riding position, enormous punch and a great TT'er)
2. He has a very unique background

It may be simply a coincidence, I don't deny it, but I think it is interesting to consider if his ski jumping origin helped his unique constitution. Anyway, this began after discussing his riding position.

 

[topt]

It's then not the frame, just the riding position?

I dont think he rides a very small frame; his Bianchi was size 53 dont know about Cervelo