Teams & Riders Everybody needs a little bit of Roglstomp in their lives

[Divergence]

E

Lol, he would easily get 21 stages with free reign.

Easily.

 

[bNator]

Well, if it would be such a fact, then JV would find a way to push Jonas in front of Kuss. Just like it isn't a fact that Jonas is better GC rider then Rogla. That is currently at best a moot point, based on some inconclusive data. People just like to spread this theory. Like the flat earth one. Both are currently popular. On why this needs to be said from time to time is as spreading this theory has some actual effects. That is JV is rather reluctant to give Rogla leadership at the Tour. They rather result to some "Joker" crap.

At best a moot point, based on some inconclusive data? Like flat earth? Dude, I’m as much of a fan as you are (ok, maybe not…), but seriously… Even if it’s not proven, (which it isn’t) it’s very likely and more importantly, it is perceived as such by the general public. And team managers and DS and more or less everyone. And this plays a huge role when taking about rider status within a team. That’s why if you consider it a fact for the purpose of discussing and understanding a rider status within a team, you will come to more accurate conclusions than it you consider it a moot point. Seriously, you should try it…

 

[Oldermanish]

If this merger is true, then it retroactively makes Jumbo's behavior during the Vuelta even worse. They jerked Roglič around with bad strategies which saw him painted as a quasi villain on social media before the team imposed orders to freeze GC positions. It was a total waste of time going to the Vuelta. The only thing he got out of it was the Angliru.

If this is the end, I at least hope Jumbo give him a proper send off & farewell at Lombardia.



If I could handpick a Jumbo rider to take with him, I'd choose Bouwman. He's super reliable & plays a key role in the bunch (spare bike as well).

He just scored a top 10 overall GC finish in Luxembourg as well.

I'd say he should go to UAE with Kuss and maybe someone else. It's be perfect karma for JV to get beat by their old guys in the Tour and Giro, wouldn't it?

 

[CyclistAbi]

At best a moot point, based on some inconclusive data? Like flat earth? Dude, I’m as much of a fan as you are (ok, maybe not…), but seriously… Even if it’s not proven, (which it isn’t) it’s very likely and more importantly, it is perceived as such by the general public. And team managers and DS and more or less everyone. And this plays a huge role when taking about rider status within a team. That’s why if you consider it a fact for the purpose of discussing and understanding a rider status within a team, you will come to more accurate conclusions than it you consider it a moot point. Seriously, you should try it…

Did you lately actually talk with the general public about some semi-important subject? Don't say you actually agree with the conclusions? Point being such judgements are premature. Remco and Jonas didn't annihilate Rogla just yet on a GC stage race. Did general public ever apologise for claiming that, for years? AFAIK no. Do such insinuations affect Rogličes status at JV? AFAIK yes. So sorry to ruin your, DS's and general public parade but Roglič is going to the Tour as team leader and to win.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Hopefully for Rogličes Tour victory to be achieved a bit unprofessionally. So he can be a moral victor too. Just like Kuss at Vuelta 23. Kuss took it all.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Did you lately actually talk with the general public about some semi-important subject? Don't say you actually agree with the conclusions? Point being such judgements are premature. Remco and Jonas didn't annihilate Rogla just yet on a GC stage race. Did general public ever apologise for claiming that, for years? AFAIK no. Do such insinuations affect Rogličes status at JV? AFAIK yes. So sorry to ruin your, DS's and general public parade but Roglič is going to the Tour as team leader and to win.

Let us know when Roglic does to Pog; what Vinge did to Pog and Pog did to everyone else over two seasons.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Let us know when Roglic does to Pog; what Vinge did to Pog and Pog did to everyone else over two seasons.

Roglič is doing that in stage racing since about 2019. And likely for years to come.

 

[Rackham]

Roglič is doing that in stage racing since about 2019. And likely for years to come.

It's not about who the strongest is, it's about competing.

Roglič has said a few times in interviews over the years how he doesn't just want people to remember his wins once he's done as a pro cyclist, but his overall journey. The 'battles', the story, that sort of stuff.

It's why he repeated yesterday that it's not about victories, it's about showing what he can do. I mean nobody knows if he can win the Tour de France. He doesn't either. There's so many variables & when he gets beaten fair & square, he'll be the first to congratulate the winner. But he has to have that freedom to compete. That's what he's after. It's something he didn't get in the Vuelta, so obviously he wants that sorted before the TdF, wherever he is (Jumbo or elsewhere).

I also didn't become a fan if this rider because I thought he was the strongest, no, but because he always got back up after a setback. Like after losing the podium in the 2018 TdF & finishing third in the 2019 Giro (something he was very proud of), he then went on & won his first GT. That was a good story. I'd like to imagine this story has one last good twist in it for next year's TdF. And if it doesn't, c'est la vie.

He's still one of the top 3 GT riders in the world though. Of that I'm pretty certain.

 

[Rackham]

I'd say he should go to UAE with Kuss and maybe someone else. It's be perfect karma for JV to get beat by their old guys in the Tour and Giro, wouldn't it?

Bruyneel said some stuff (corroborated by other journalists) about the contractual situation of riders in a merger scenario like this. He made it sound like there's potentially room for riders under contract who 'refuse the merger' to sign elsewhere, no strings attached.

If that was the case, then any destination is possible, whereas it was previously assumed (& maybe it's still the case) any prospective employer would have to negotiate with Jumbo, i.e. something which would probably eliminate all possibility of Rog going to UAE.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Roglič is doing that in stage racing since about 2019. And likely for years to come.

There’s Roglic’s stomp and then there’s what Pog and Vinge do. Roglic’s only done that once at the 2021 Vuelta and arguably (and most likely) could have done it at 2023 Vuelta without Vinge being there and Kuss gaining the time.

 

[tobydawq]

Poor, poor Primoz. The multi millionaire living in a tax haven. You think these other riders don't have to do any training?

You explain literally everything as a plot against Roglic. It's getting a bit tiresome. This is just conspiracy theory territory. Bahrain (or Trek, or wherever he'll go) won't know what's coming for them with this unique following he has

The other riders who do training are allowed to reap the benefits of that training in the races. No matter how you see it, Roglic was not allowed to do his best in the Vuelta.

 

[Salvarani]

The other riders who do training are allowed to reap the benefits of that training in the races. No matter how you see it, Roglic was not allowed to do his best in the Vuelta.

He is also part of a team and sometimes that means being a team player.

 

[SHAD0W93]

He is also part of a team and sometimes that means being a team player.

There’s no “I” in team but there is in Primoz Roglic…

 

[Valv.Piti]

The other riders who do training are allowed to reap the benefits of that training in the races. No matter how you see it, Roglic was not allowed to do his best in the Vuelta.

And neither was the 2 time TdF-winner Vingegaard. I really cannot see what's so controversial about it from Roglics pov, although every cycling fan in the world should want them to actually race for the win.

Jumbo was not out to get him, some peculiar tactical situations rose due to Sepp being ahead but clearly not being the strongest while trying to consolidate 3 places on the podium. Roglic AND Jonas was told in week 3 how the race was gonna pan out and they both lost out on a potential victory, even though its incredibly hard to have watched the race and believe Roglic was actually stronger than Jonas in the 3rd week had they actually raced.

 

[Netserk]

And neither was the 2 time TdF-winner Vingegaard. I really cannot see what's so controversial about it from Roglics pov, although every cycling fan in the world should want them to actually race for the win.

Jumbo was not out to get him, some peculiar tactical situations rose due to Sepp being ahead but clearly not being the strongest while trying to consolidate 3 places on the podium. Roglic AND Jonas was told in week 3 how the race was gonna pan out and they both lost out on a potential victory, even though its incredibly hard to have watched the race and believe Roglic was actually stronger than Jonas in the 3rd week had they actually raced.

It seems that Vingegaard was free up to the moment where he preferred not to be free. That is a difference.

 

[Skijumper Roglic fan]

Just saw both Rog and Pog do Emilia-Varesine-Lombardia!…

That is very good. Feels like it‘s Giro d‘Italia…

 

[Divergence]

It seems that Vingegaard was free up to the moment where he preferred not to be free. That is a difference.

Additionally, not being allowed to show what you have whist being the best is worse than the same thing whilst being at best second best.

 

[bNator]

Did you lately actually talk with the general public about some semi-important subject? Don't say you actually agree with the conclusions? Point being such judgements are premature. Remco and Jonas didn't annihilate Rogla just yet on a GC stage race. Did general public ever apologise for claiming that, for years? AFAIK no. Do such insinuations affect Rogličes status at JV? AFAIK yes. So sorry to ruin your, DS's and general public parade but Roglič is going to the Tour as team leader and to win.

Not with that team, he isn’t…

 

[barakuda]

Bruyneel said some stuff (corroborated by other journalists) about the contractual situation of riders in a merger scenario like this. He made it sound like there's potentially room for riders under contract who 'refuse the merger' to sign elsewhere, no strings attached.

If that was the case, then any destination is possible, whereas it was previously assumed (& maybe it's still the case) any prospective employer would have to negotiate with Jumbo, i.e. something which would probably eliminate all possibility of Rog going to UAE.

Bruyneel said that "any rider who is under contract on the team who would forfeit or sell their World Tour license and doesn’t want to be part of this merger will be free to go to another team". So, if QS will give up their licence and be merged to JV (which is currently rumoured), I'm afraid JV riders (Primož) might not have this option.

 

[ManicJack]

Bruyneel said that "any rider who is under contract on the team who would forfeit or sell their World Tour license and doesn’t want to be part of this merger will be free to go to another team". So, if QS will give up their licence and be merged to JV (which is currently rumoured), I'm afraid JV riders (Primož) might not have this option.

Bruyneel said that.....blah, blah, blah. He's probably the only one getting anything out of this nonsense. A whole ten extra listeners who will tune into his podcast to get the latest rumor and spew it all over the Internet. 🙄

 

[Blanco]

its incredibly hard to have watched the race and believe Roglic was actually stronger than Jonas in the 3rd week had they actually raced.

Actually not at all. If not stronger in the 3rd week, he was not weaker either, but in the first two weeks he was definitelly stronger.

 

[proffate]

Roglič is doing that in stage racing since about 2019. And likely for years to come.

Who is the absolute best GC rider Rog has beaten in a GT?

• 37yo Geraint Thomas (by 14 seconds) + Joao Almeida
• Enric Mas (who's never won any GC outside of China) + Jack Haig
• Carapaz (I have nothing bad to say about Carapaz, but this is also more of a cult winner than a world beater) + Who? Carthy
• 39 year old Valverde + 20 year old Pog

You have your head firmly stuck in the sand if you think Roglic has ever beaten an on-form generational talent in a GT GC. This vuelta might have been his chance but we didn't get to see it.

 

[CyclistAbi]

It's not about who the strongest is, it's about competing.

Still, Rogla was the strongest, on most stage races he did since 2019.

 

[CyclistAbi]

There’s Roglic’s stomp and then there’s what Pog and Vinge do.

So when Remco and Rogla went, that was not the same as when Jonas and Pogi went?

P.S. Rogla stomping at the end was just a bonus.

 

[CyclistAbi]

And neither was the 2 time TdF-winner Vingegaard. I really cannot see what's so controversial about it from Roglics pov, although every cycling fan in the world should want them to actually race for the win.

Jumbo was not out to get him, some peculiar tactical situations rose due to Sepp being ahead but clearly not being the strongest while trying to consolidate 3 places on the podium. Roglic AND Jonas was told in week 3 how the race was gonna pan out and they both lost out on a potential victory, even though its incredibly hard to have watched the race and believe Roglic was actually stronger than Jonas in the 3rd week had they actually raced.

The team has sent Jonas up the road on multiple occasions. Hence if he could he would have won this GT. That is racing until and including Angliru.