Teams & Riders Everybody needs a little bit of Roglstomp in their lives

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bNator

bNator

Apr 14, 2021
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FroomeWagon said:
Not much faith from the betting markets in Primoz right now.

early-TDF-odds.png
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Looks like guys from Remco thread are obsessive gamblers :)
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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Good attempt at Lombardia, finishing third. Racing like that i feel that it's safe to add Lombardia to the main goals left list.

Season as an overall was in my opinion one of the best if not the best. Really consistent this season and peaking twice in the season. With full team support he might have done even better, when it comes to the results.

A beast.

Now a move to Bora. First of all i feel both Rogla and Bora choose wisely. A common goal and in depth understanding of each other. Bora with the ambition to assert itself as one of the strongest teams in 2024 season. It won't be easy, leaving arguably the best team in the peloton. For whatever reasons involved, such moves don't always pan out. Said that i am rather optimistic, for Rogla to not forget on how to win and for Bora to take a step further, supporting that. Now i guess the anticipation to start building, waiting for the very first win with Bora!
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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I don't bet. If you bet you lose.

P.S. Still it will likely be a rather substantial dividend next year. Rogla bearing fruit. If the fruit in mention will be more of a prune. Then it's a guess a bit of a pickle. Luckily i am down with all that. It's healthy to have all this variety. It keeps you focused. Tour here we come! And ToS and Lombardia ... Licking fingers already like it it's scheduled tomorrow. Still, around 300 days to get in best shape in a while. Better to focus on that now, and not all the fruit.
 
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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Oldermanish said:
anyone that wins the Tour with all major combatants there will need good prep, good luck, great tactics and a team that will back them up. Vingegaard has had Roglic to help him for his Tour wins however you want to grade that help. He doesn't now.
What ifs apply to every rider. All of them.
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Roglic helped Vingegaard in the Tour this year by not riding it :)

I think the way Jumbo rode the Tour the last two years is not necessarily to Roglic' benefit. Make it as hard as possible on every stage. They won't suddenly change that tactic next year. Roglic knows they're going to do it, and he'll train for it, but he's not naturally suited to it. You could see it in the stage that most resembled a Tour stage in the Vuelta this year, the stage to Tourmalet. He was visibly suffering all day. Still finished 3d of course, but that was thanks to his sprint. When he tried to really attack and drop the others he couldn't.
 
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Rackham

Rackham

Jul 16, 2015
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Ben Zwiehoff impressed in the Tour of Turkey today with Bora (& Lipowitz as well).

Any rider who can climb such a monster like Babadağ almost as fast as Alexey Lutsenko has some serious climbing qualities. So I think Bora's got some good strength in depth in terms of climbers.

I'm posting this here because obviously these sorts of riders will be very helpful for Rog. That's in any of his races next year (Rolf Aldag theorized Rog could have about 65 race days next season).
 
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Oldermanish

Jan 31, 2016
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theyoungest said:
Roglic helped Vingegaard in the Tour this year by not riding it :)

I think the way Jumbo rode the Tour the last two years is not necessarily to Roglic' benefit. Make it as hard as possible on every stage. They won't suddenly change that tactic next year. Roglic knows they're going to do it, and he'll train for it, but he's not naturally suited to it. You could see it in the stage that most resembled a Tour stage in the Vuelta this year, the stage to Tourmalet. He was visibly suffering all day. Still finished 3d of course, but that was thanks to his sprint. When he tried to really attack and drop the others he couldn't.
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Yes and Pogacar folded spectacularly so Jonas had a cakewalk Tour.
Previous tours I'd totally agree with you on JV tactics. I'm not sure it was tempo setting that compromised him as much as he was expected to set tempo and respond to attacks in support of the tactics. As for how he was supported after the hay bale shunt; that said it all. He put his shoulder back into place and went as deep into that Tour as he could to support his teammate.
His actual reward is now going to Bora. Hopefully it goes well but I wouldn't lose any sleep reminiscing about the good times at JV is I were him.
 
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pablohidalgo7

Aug 31, 2014
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Rackham said:
Ben Zwiehoff impressed in the Tour of Turkey today with Bora (& Lipowitz as well).

Any rider who can climb such a monster like Babadağ almost as fast as Alexey Lutsenko has some serious climbing qualities. So I think Bora's got some good strength in depth in terms of climbers.

I'm posting this here because obviously these sorts of riders will be very helpful for Rog. That's in any of his races next year (Rolf Aldag theorized Rog could have about 65 race days next season).
Click to expand...
In fact it was said in 2020 or 2021 that he has the best numbers in lab of the whole Jumbo Visma testing or somtehing like that (he was between Bora and Jumbo due to Robert Wagner conections I believe), ok maybe they exaggerated a bit, but this former mtb rider definetely can climb and this year he had his breakthrough season. I would definitely take it next year as a mountain domestique over Buchmann for example, since the latter has a certain tendency to save some energy even when a teammate is fighting for an important goal
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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theyoungest said:
Okay, I don't see how this is a reaction to my post?
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It should in my opinion be much harder for Jonas to drop Rogla, without the team orders, that is to let Jonas ride away and after for Rogla to eventually be allowed to close the gap, only if a rival not on his back wheel. And indeed at the end of the stage Rogla should have a better kick. So JV riding the stage hard/soft shouldn't make all that much difference to Rogla. As Bora will still get Rogla there. Jonas pacing hard will likely only help Rogla. To potentially drop Pogi and/or Remco. We'll see.
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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This is one of the main benefits, for Rogla. Now when riding at the Tour, once Jonas or Pogi or Remco ... attacks. Rogla, or one of the Bora team members, can react instantly. This was not possible any more, for Rogla, riding for JV and participating at the Tour. So the way it worked at JV is Rogla would lose seconds here and there. To Jonas and possibly others. Due to team racing for Jonas and his preferences. That is not on how Rogla races. Rogla doesn't give seconds away. And that is in the end usually enough. With Bora Rogla should again be able to race like that. As in the end he only needs 1s on Jonas. If Jonas is the one to finish second.
 
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Filippo_3467

May 2, 2019
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Rackham said:
Ben Zwiehoff impressed in the Tour of Turkey today with Bora (& Lipowitz as well).

Any rider who can climb such a monster like Babadağ almost as fast as Alexey Lutsenko has some serious climbing qualities. So I think Bora's got some good strength in depth in terms of climbers.

I'm posting this here because obviously these sorts of riders will be very helpful for Rog. That's in any of his races next year (Rolf Aldag theorized Rog could have about 65 race days next season).
Click to expand...
They have enough riders that can go Top 15-20 riders in a GT mountain stage, but the question is can they get someone who is with the last 5-6 riders and enough roleur support throughout the year. Zwiehoff is impressive but I think Martinez, Buchmann, Jungels or Kämna could be already plenty of support in that area they need a top mountain domestique and the flat guys really performing on. a great level. It will be interesting what the rumours will be who will got with Primoz to the Tour out of Cian, Vlasov, Hindely and Higuita. They won't let all four of those guys out of the lineup for the Tour I think. To me thinking about it more I believe Vlasov could be the chosen one although Hindley is the more mainstream pick.
 
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SHAD0W93

SHAD0W93

Aug 13, 2011
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dennisdy said:
Has Remco ever defeated the other three in a stage race? (not counting the 2022 Vuelta when Roglic crashed out)
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Woah woah woah, Nibali gets created for the win when Kruijswijk caused his own crash due to being put under pressure by Nibali. Roglic was over a minute and half back while the previous stages of Jumbo’s plan to blow up Evenepoel on the hard climbs like Pog in the Tour, was blowing up in their own face because Evenepoel wasn’t cracking and Roglic had to resort to his stomp to gain time. This caused Roglic to panic, attack at the end of a stage while his opponent was having a mechanical issue, and at the end of it crash into another rider because he had a mental lapse in judgment. Just like Kruijswijk crashing into the snow was due to being under pressure and having a mental lapse causing his crash. With that same logic sounds like he got beat to me.
 
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dennisdy

dennisdy

Aug 10, 2023
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Oldermanish said:
Yes and Pogacar folded spectacularly so Jonas had a cakewalk Tour.
Previous tours I'd totally agree with you on JV tactics. I'm not sure it was tempo setting that compromised him as much as he was expected to set tempo and respond to attacks in support of the tactics. As for how he was supported after the hay bale shunt; that said it all. He put his shoulder back into place and went as deep into that Tour as he could to support his teammate.
His actual reward is now going to Bora. Hopefully it goes well but I wouldn't lose any sleep reminiscing about the good times at JV is I were him.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't say that Vingegaard had a cakewalk tour. He was only ten seconds ahead going into stage 16.
 
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