Teams & Riders Everybody needs a little bit of Roglstomp in their lives

[acm]

I would be so incredibly surprised if he doesn't retire after this season.

Why would he retire? He has a contract for next year, Suisse and another Vuelta are waiting for him...

 

[noob]

Why would he retire? He has a contract for next year, Suisse and another Vuelta are waiting for him...

Because he's Roglič. Anyone else I wouldn't expect to do it in the same situation. But he's Roglič

 

[Red Rick]

All this talk about how Roglic should actively work for Lipowitz, Vingegaard, Kuss…when was the last time a big GT winner acted as a good, committed domestique instead of pursuing their own agenda?

Trying to think here…
Froome? No.
Geraint Thomas? Not really.
Contador? No.
Quintana? No.
Wiggins? No way.
Nibali? No.
Lance? lol no.

Even looking down to the lesser GT riders, a lot of them either win or ride in total obscurity. Like has Jai Hindley been of any help at all really as a helper? Tao? Bernal? No, no, and no.

Once you win a GT, and definitely once you win multiple, you do not go on donkey duty to help someone else win, much less just get third place.

Kuss and Yates are full time domstiques in the Tour right as we speak.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Big GT winner. Kuss was and is a domestique who fluked / was gifted a win. Yates is a little more interesting. He might be the exception, but he never settled into the full time GT winner role. Do you disagree with the general assessment and are you nitpicking for kicks, or do you disagree in general? Seems more like the exception that proves the rule to me…

 

[QueenStagiaire]

All this talk about how Roglic should actively work for Lipowitz, Vingegaard, Kuss…when was the last time a big GT winner acted as a good, committed domestique instead of pursuing their own agenda?

Trying to think here…
Froome? No.
Geraint Thomas? Not really.
Contador? No.
Quintana? No.
Wiggins? No way.
Nibali? No.
Lance? lol no.

Even looking down to the lesser GT riders, a lot of them either win or ride in total obscurity. Like has Jai Hindley been of any help at all really as a helper? Tao? Bernal? No, no, and no.

Once you win a GT, and definitely once you win multiple, you do not go on donkey duty to help someone else win, much less just get third place.

Why is Wiggins a big GT winner, but Bernal, who has won a Tour as well and has a Giro that Wiggins doesn‘t have, a lesser GT rider?

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Bunch of nitpickers on here…

You can mentally move Wiggins down or Bernal up. Same with G (who was a great domestique until he won).

 

[zlev11]

sounds like he did exactly what the team asked him to do. discussion should be over.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Beautiful ride, great to see the beast unleashed in natural habitat. On how it's almost a guarantee, for the break to succeed, when initiated by Rogla to demonstrating some serious descending skills, really strong ride and great bike handler.

On why no reward for it, yesterday it was Jonas and his team, chasing a wild goose, today it was UAE and Pogi, hogging the race with obsession of stage wins. Interestingly Rogla wasn't rewarded for it in the past two days and neither where the aliens.

Tomorrow is another day and another stage suitable for the break and we all know what that means. Rogla to go in the break again and hopefully this time to win the stage. Lets hope the legs are still up for such task.

 

[dazaau]

UAE chased Roglic just for Pogacar to let Arensman win the stage, what a dumb stage

Couldn't believe my eyes.

 

[perico]

Big GT winner. Kuss was and is a domestique who fluked / was gifted a win. Yates is a little more interesting. He might be the exception, but he never settled into the full time GT winner role. Do you disagree with the general assessment and are you nitpicking for kicks, or do you disagree in general? Seems more like the exception that proves the rule to me…

Delgado, Fignon, Riis, Roche, Kelly, Sastre, you could even sort of argue Hinault in 1986…

 

[Rackham]

All this talk about how Roglic should actively work for Lipowitz, Vingegaard, Kuss…when was the last time a big GT winner acted as a good, committed domestique instead of pursuing their own agenda?

Trying to think here…
Froome? No.
Geraint Thomas? Not really.
Contador? No.
Quintana? No.
Wiggins? No way.
Nibali? No.
Lance? lol no.

Even looking down to the lesser GT riders, a lot of them either win or ride in total obscurity. Like has Jai Hindley been of any help at all really as a helper? Tao? Bernal? No, no, and no.

Once you win a GT, and definitely once you win multiple, you do not go on donkey duty to help someone else win, much less just get third place.

It's the same garbage we've been hearing for years and years, basically, i.e. latent disrespect for Rog and a refusal to allow him at the seat of big champions. He's gotta do donkey work for 24 year olds who sit 3rd in GC over ten minutes down, didn't you know?

Even yesterday during the stage the commentators on Eurosport just couldn't help themselves and at first started insulting his descending skills when Valentin Paret-Peintre got a gap, and then when Rog gapped both of them they started saying he was descending badly anyway and only got a gap because of his weight.

But hey, at least Rog was evidently enjoying himself, right? That's already a way bigger win than those guys sitting one-two in GC (especially the guy in yellow) who rides with the look of a kid in school detention and forced to do something he hates, i.e. radiating nothing but depression, disinterest and grumpiness over the past week.

 

[Rackham]

Delgado, Fignon, Riis, Roche, Kelly, Sastre, you could even sort of argue Hinault in 1986…

Doing work for a guy fighting for the win (like Riis did with Ullrich back in 1997) is not the same as doing work for a rider sitting ten minutes down (Lipowitz in 2025) who was actually only a couple of minutes ahead of Rog anyway before yesterday.

 

[Red Rick]

Big GT winner. Kuss was and is a domestique who fluked / was gifted a win. Yates is a little more interesting. He might be the exception, but he never settled into the full time GT winner role. Do you disagree with the general assessment and are you nitpicking for kicks, or do you disagree in general? Seems more like the exception that proves the rule to me…

Riders who win multiple Grand Tours are usually leaders for most of their career, because they're usually the best rider on their team for most of their career. And even when they are the strongest, they'll play a good teammate do some work when the risk or cost of that effort isn't too high.

Roglic has worked for Vingegaard when the situation arose, Vingegaard has done frigging sprint leadouts, Evenepoel has done sprint leadouts or stuck with teammates higher placed on GC. Nibali worked for Aru in the Tour in 2016, Contador even went as far as protecting Armstrong's 3rd place on GC in the Tour de France in 2009.

 

[Rackham]

Contador even went as far as protecting Armstrong's 3rd place on GC in the Tour de France in 2009.

I think that might have had something to do with Contador fearing waking up with a severed horse head on his bed - or worse.

 

[Red Rick]

I think that might have had something to do with Contador fearing waking up with a severed horse head on his bed - or worse.

All the more reason he should've done it.

 

[Rackham]

Rog is going to be 36. Are we seriously discussing his future as a super domestique? I mean I guess he could earn good money but he's such a low profile rider (as in literally low aero profile on the bike) that I'm really not sure he's well suited to riding a tempo for anyone. That's notwithstanding all the other factors as well.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Rog is going to be 36. Are we seriously discussing his future as a super domestique? I mean I guess he could earn good money but he's such a low profile rider (as in literally low aero profile on the bike) that I'm really not sure he's well suited to riding a tempo for anyone. That's notwithstanding all the other factors as well.

Hopefully he will go out like Valverde, riding his own race like he has always done and should be doing while giving space for potential stronger riders in the team and take a backseat if thats what makes sense in given scenario.

 

[Red Rick]

Rog is going to be 36. Are we seriously discussing his future as a super domestique? I mean I guess he could earn good money but he's such a low profile rider (as in literally low aero profile on the bike) that I'm really not sure he's well suited to riding a tempo for anyone. That's notwithstanding all the other factors as well.

It's not about his future, but really about what happens when you do have a teammate that's the better option for a given race. And Roglic has usually sacrificed himself for that teammate in those rare circumstances.

He's not gonna sign another deal somewhere where the primary aim is to be a domestique and make some $$. Frankly that would be a *** deal for any team.

He has a deal for next year, my guess is he retires after that.

 

[skippo12]

Why would he retire? He has a contract for next year, Suisse and another Vuelta are waiting for him...

Obviously shouldn't retire but I doubt that he will stay with RBH. Transfer is in the best interests of both parties. Roglic can get all the freedom he wants on a different team. RBH could use some money if Evenepoel is incoming.

 

[Rackham]

It's not about his future, but really about what happens when you do have a teammate that's the better option for a given race. And Roglic has usually sacrificed himself for that teammate in those rare circumstances.

I have distinct memories of Rog helping Vingegaard back in Itzulia 2022. He blew up the foot of the Krabelin climb for him.

But I'll add a caveat here: that was an attempt to go for the overall win with Vingegaard. That's the thing, i.e. what I've been seeing over the past couple of weeks is people saying Rog should ride into the ground for a guy sitting third ten minutes down. Obviously a little assistance here or there is expected but I think people continually overestimate the importance of lower placings in a GT.

Just look at Vinge, i.e. even he doesn't have 7 perfect little gregarios doing his bidding at Visma. Carapaz certainly didn't either when he podiumed the Tour a few years ago, nor did G Thomas. Hell, people laughed at Gaudu when he demanded a team full of helpers to try and get on the podium with FdJ a couple of years ago.

So I don't think what Rog is doing here in this Tour as a teammate is out of character with regards what modern cycling is.

 

[acm]

Obviously shouldn't retire but I doubt that he will stay with RBH. Transfer is in the best interests of both parties. Roglic can get all the freedom he wants on a different team. RBH could use some money if Evenepoel is incoming.

Naah, I don't think so. He won't change team again and Denk is more than happy to have a guy who can win any one-week race and Giro and Vuelta.

 

[Red Rick]

I have distinct memories of Rog helping Vingegaard back in Itzulia 2022. He blew up the foot of the Krabelin climb for him.

But I'll add a caveat here: that was an attempt to go for the overall win with Vingegaard. That's the thing, i.e. what I've been seeing over the past couple of weeks is people saying Rog should ride into the ground for a guy sitting third ten minutes down. Obviously a little assistance here or there is expected but I think people continually overestimate the importance of lower placings in a GT.

Just look at Vinge, i.e. even he doesn't have 7 perfect little gregarios doing his bidding at Visma. Carapaz certainly didn't either when he podiumed the Tour a few years ago, nor did G Thomas. Hell, people laughed at Gaudu when he demanded a team full of helpers to try and get on the podium with FdJ a couple of years ago.

So I don't think what Rog is doing here in this Tour as a teammate is out of character with regards what modern cycling is.

Vingegaard is under no threat to lose 2nd. Lipowitz had 22s on 3rd. There is a legit argument Roglic should have sat pretty and tried to help Lipowitz. The TdF podium is not nothing, it's not the difference between 5th and 6th, and certainly not for Lipowitz, a German rider on a German team. Then you have Roglic attacking on a stage where it's very clear very early the breakaway is a hopeless proposition.

Realistically, Redbull completely messed up on Loze and if they hadn't done that there would be 0 issues with yesterday.

 

[Links2003]

I'm curious to see how it continues. I can't imagine changing teams. Either he stays another year or quits. He was so relaxed this year at the Giro and the Tour. Maybe he lacked the will to fight for every second because it was a farewell performance inside.

The fact that he wanted to win yesterday also speaks for it. The chance was small but it was okay to try. With 2 or 3 riders in front and UAE defensive. Maybe it could have worked.

Vlasov was there for Lipo. And if Lipo had had problems on the climb, 3rd place would have been gone anyway.

 

[topcat]

Delgado, Fignon, Riis, Roche, Kelly, Sastre, you could even sort of argue Hinault in 1986…

and Nibali. What a list!

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Vingegaard is under no threat to lose 2nd. Lipowitz had 22s on 3rd. There is a legit argument Roglic should have sat pretty and tried to help Lipowitz. The TdF podium is not nothing, it's not the difference between 5th and 6th, and certainly not for Lipowitz, a German rider on a German team. Then you have Roglic attacking on a stage where it's very clear very early the breakaway is a hopeless proposition.

Realistically, Redbull completely messed up on Loze and if they hadn't done that there would be 0 issues with yesterday.

He was at 22 seconds because he spontaneously attacked in a strange situation without team alignment and potentially cat Rog 4th, so it’s a little complicated.

Riders who win multiple Grand Tours are usually leaders for most of their career, because they're usually the best rider on their team for most of their career. And even when they are the strongest, they'll play a good teammate do some work when the risk or cost of that effort isn't too high.

Roglic has worked for Vingegaard when the situation arose, Vingegaard has done frigging sprint leadouts, Evenepoel has done sprint leadouts or stuck with teammates higher placed on GC. Nibali worked for Aru in the Tour in 2016, Contador even went as far as protecting Armstrong's 3rd place on GC in the Tour de France in 2009.

I’m not saying Roglic should never help. Of course he should and should look out for team interests. But none of those guys showed up to a GT they were targeting and were expecting to turn themselves inside out for a teammate to try to get third. Also, Lipowitz was already in third, nowhere close to second, pretty clear of fourth, and Roglic was fifth. No stage wins for the team.

Also, the Contador reference is a stretch. I’d like to say Aru too but not confident.

You guys are a stubborn lot if you won’t admit that the great champions typically ride like champions until the day they retire, even if their legs don’t cooperate.