For the "pedaling technique doesn't matter crowd"

[FrankDay]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21193924

It's surprising considering no one has found any performance gains or even phsyiological gains (questionable as they may be) since Luttrell that these studies finding no benefits keep getting published.

But while they are lets celebrate another nail in the coffin

LOL. When are you (and the people running these studies) ever going to learn that 6 weeks is not enough time to see these differences. This would be especially true in this cohort who were described as being "highly trained" compared to Luttrell's "trained" cyclists. Although, from the abstract it does appear that they did reach a P of .15 in some studied variables. With a little more time who knows what might have happened. LOL.

Of course, you will read into this what you want. If someone came to me and said "I would like to use these for 6 weeks during the off season then stop, what do you think?" I would probably say, "Don't bother!"

If one wants to demonstrate that a different pedaling style makes or does not make a difference the study needs to demonstrate that the pedaling style actually changed. It would appear this study failed in that regard. Hey folks, a study shows 6 weeks isn't enough to effect the necessary changes. BFD.

Thanks for the link though.

 

[CoachFergie]

That is just an opinion Frank, you don't have any evidence to support that. Like Noel be a good boy and let us know when you have some real data to support your claims.

 

[FrankDay]

That is just an opinion Frank, you don't have any evidence to support that. Like Noel be a good boy and let us know when you have some real data to support your claims.

Of course it is just an opinion but it is an opinion based upon the data we have gotten back from lots of users and our own personal experience. Of course, your opinion that these 6 week studies are adequate for this purpose are only your opinion based on zero experience. Time (and, of course, enough of the proper studies) will tell.

 

[CoachFergie]

You have data, or is it like the IAT data you claimed you had from original testing but could never find

Yeah sure Frank.

 

[CoachFergie]

Of course it is just an opinion but it is an opinion based upon the data we have gotten back from lots of users and our own personal experience. Of course, your opinion that these 6 week studies are adequate for this purpose are only your opinion based on zero experience. Time (and, of course, enough of the proper studies) will tell.

Was enough for Bohm (2008) and Fernandez-Pena (2009) to show a change in neuromuscular function so I have data to support my claims. No study has suggested time frame of the study was a limitation nor time taken to learn to use a Gimmickcrank.

 

[FrankDay]

You have data, or is it like the IAT data you claimed you had from original testing but could never find

Yeah sure Frank.

IAT data????

 

[CoachFergie]

IAT data????

Nice dodge Frank.

Lets talk about this new data you have.

 

[M Sport]

Frank, how many forums are you going to spam about your cranks? You got booted from Slowtwitch, how many others?

Off the top of my head at least these cycling ones,

CyclingForums - absolute gold for a good laugh between Frank and Noel argueing (179 pages!!!)
Cyclingnews
Weight Weenies
Slowtwitch
Cyclebanter

One of the best had to be one I found on a marathon (runners) forum where Frank was claiming his PC's would improve marathon runners speed and decrease injuries lol

 

[FrankDay]

Off the top of my head at least these cycling ones,

CyclingForums - absolute gold for a good laugh between Frank and Noel argueing (179 pages!!!)
Cyclingnews
Weight Weenies
Slowtwitch
Cyclebanter

One of the best had to be one I found on a marathon (runners) forum where Frank was claiming his PC's would improve marathon runners speed and decrease injuries lol

Do you really have a problem with my coming to an internet forum and discussing issues about which I have an interest. Do you object if there is a discussion about wheels (or wetsuits, or anything else) if a manufacturer chimes in on the issue? I would only be concerned if the manufacturer didn't identify his association with a product that might bias their view. Everyone knows about my association with PowerCranks so my posts are unlikely to "fool" anyone.

Anyhow, don't you think your time would have been better spent addressing the study that started this thread rather than bashing me for bringing it up or for my participation here and in other forums? I suspect others didn't bring up the study in question because it doesn't support their bias. Ignorance is bliss.

 

[CoachFergie]

Do you really have a problem with my coming to an internet forum and discussing issues about which I have an interest.

Of course not Frank. The issue is when someone makes extraordinary claims and does not provide any real evidence to support them.

 

[FrankDay]

Of course not Frank. The issue is when someone makes extraordinary claims and does not provide any real evidence to support them.

Don't you think he could have answered that himself?

 

[CoachFergie]

Will Frank Day claim Evan's Tour de France success for Gimmickcranking?

When it is clear that Cadel fails to meet Franks own criteria of 6-9 months riding solely on a Gimmickcrank and has used normal cranks in every race he won this year.

Will be watching the Gimmicksite cranks with interest (as aside from my own normal reason to read Franks site: amusement) to see if he will contradict himself by claiming Cadel as a Gimmickcranker when he clearly isn't

 

[pedaling squares]

What is the point of this thread Fergie? Imagine how much fun it is for the rest of us to log in and see you and Frank chase each other across the interwebs, trolling and bickering incessantly about each other's beliefs. It gets old fast, too bad neither of you matures at a similar rate.

 

[Damiano Machiavelli]

Personally I think that anything that mocks Day's con job is a good thing. The guy is the buttt of jokes on slowtwitch. If not even triathletes buy into the bogus marketing of a scam product then you know it is beyond ridiculous. Those guys will believe just about anything.

 

[CoachFergie]

What is the point of this thread Fergie?

My own amusement. Always fun watching Frank contradict himself.

 

[Tapeworm]

Pfffft. Everyone knows it's a strong cleft chin, small fluffy dog, squeaky voice and hot Italian wife that wins tours... but I'll get some of those cranks as well, just in case!

 

[CoachFergie]

Pfffft. Everyone knows it's a strong cleft chin, small fluffy dog, squeaky voice and hot Italian wife that wins tours... but I'll get some of those cranks as well, just in case!

Very true, why take the risk!

 

[FrankDay]

Fergie, Thanks for alerting the folks that there is a reason PowerCranks might be especially proud today. You forgot to mention KOM champ Sammy Sanchez as another name we might drop. Anyhow, I don't think you have to take my word as to whether Cadel is a PC'er or not. This was posted on the weight weenies forum as an excerpt from Cadel's book, "Close to Flying".

In the shed is a bike that has a special crank configuration. It is aluminium but golden coloured. You notice the difference immediately when you see the frame, without wheels, hanging from a hook as you enter the shed. It's on the back wall and it's really a bike of pain devised to perfect pedalling. He doesn't like to talk about it. 'It's something I do,' he says, trying to dismiss any enquiry. 'It's to force me to use my hamstrings as well as my quadriceps.' The idea is this: the pedals have a freewheel, clutched axle assembly and unless you pull the crank arm up, it will not follow the natural flow and the urge of the other crank arm. You can push them down, but first you have to pull back, and up, and forward - or else it just hovers at the bottom of the pedalling arc. 'It took me ages to perfect,' he says of the first rides, 'but now I'll use this bike, especially at the start of the season when I'm reminding my legs of what's about to come.'

Anyhow, putting on my MD hat now: I have said it before and I will say it again, your obsession regarding this topic is probably not healthy. But, despite my concerns for your mental health, thanks again for bringing this topic up.

 

[CoachFergie]

Are you still a licensed MD Frank?

Just because Cadel has won the tour makes him in no way qualified to speak on the biomechanics of cycling in just the same way a ex Anaesthesiologist can't make comments about Psychiatry.

Good to see you will continue lying to people about your product

 

[FrankDay]

Just because Cadel has won the tour makes him in no way qualified to speak on the biomechanics of cycling

In no possible way? Is that really your position?

 

[CoachFergie]

In no possible way? Really, that is your position?

Yes celebrity endorsement and appeals to authority do not impress me.

If Cadel can quantify the gains made from such a minimal exposure to Gimmickcranks in the off season on his Tour de France win six months later I'm all ears.

That is my position.

 

[Megalodon]

Pedals have a freewheel? Sounds like Powerpedals, another failed "invention."

 

[FrankDay]

Yes celebrity endorsement and appeals to authority do not impress me.

Aren't celebrity endorsements and appeals to authority somewhat different than your saying a TDF winner has no basis to talk about pedaling biomechanics? Just to remind you, this is the quote I was questioning.

Just because Cadel has won the tour makes him in no way qualified to speak on the biomechanics of cycling

And, just to remind you, you started this thread. not me.

(edit: just so this statement isn't confusing to someone who just stumbled across this thread, the posts starting on 7/23/2011 started as a separate thread and was merged into this one by the moderators)

 

[FrankDay]

Pedals have a freewheel? Sounds like Powerpedals, another failed "invention."

Power pedals weren't gold, weren't a "crank configuration" and one wouldn't "notice the difference immediately" on a bike hanging on the wall. Only one product meets those criteria that I know of.

 

[CoachFergie]

Aren't celebrity endorsements and appeals to authority somewhat different than your saying a TDF winner has no basis to talk about pedaling biomechanics? Just to remind you, this is the quote I was questioning.

Cherry picking arguments is also pretty lame Frank.

If Cadel can quantify how using Gimmickcranks for a very small portion of the off season played a role in his success six months later I'm all ears.

And, just to remind you, you started this thread. not me.

Guess you can say "non-significant" things amuse me