Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[ChewbaccaD]

So that is a yes?

Is that a question?

 

[kingjr]

Is that a question?

It is.

____

 

[ChewbaccaD]

It is.

____

Yes.

..............

 

[oldcrank]

I thought calling another poster a 'troll' was
regarded as a banning offence, my friends.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

I thought calling another poster a 'troll' was
regarded as a banning offence, my friends.

There is an exemption when the poster really is a troll. (there isn't, but hey, it's worth a shot, right?)

 

[Cycle Chic]

So Froome has appeared and given an interview from the Nice training base.

Strange the way he tweeted and interviewed a day and 2 days after stutue and I had our little spat.

Cant believe thats the reason but the timing is spooky. Maybe stutue is dawg afterall.

 

[Afrank]

I thought calling another poster a 'troll' was
regarded as a banning offence, my friends.

It doesn't belong here at the very least.

If you have suspicions that a member is trolling don't go posting about it, just bring the posts in question to the attention of the mods.

(Note, I'm not taking any stance as to what Taxus's posts are.)

Oh, and Cycle chic, please don't purposefully mispell other posters names. We've come down on others in the past for it.

 

[Cycle Chic]

....Oh, and cycle chick, please don't purposefully mispronounce (yes, I know it's in written form, can't think of a better word for it though) other posters names. We've come down on others in the past for it.

I take umbrage at that Afrank......my user name is Cycle Chic...NOT Chick !

[Chic /ˈʃiːk/, meaning "stylish" or "smart", is an element of fashion.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Oh, and cycle chick, please don't purposefully mispronounce (yes, I know it's in written form, can't think of a better word for it though) other posters names. We've come down on others in the past for it.

Misspell

 

[Afrank]

Yes, my bad, didn't look close enough.

Thanks DW, that's the word I was looking for.

Have edited.

 

[Futuroscope]

Except Wiggo 2009 was pre-Sky.

I'd also like to understand how Sky 2010 are matching any other team who already have 2 years of ABP practice to beat the system. They are not only beating those teams, but being experts with the ABP from the get go.

Given the utter mess they have made of things during their time - no wind tunnel for Froome, burning riders out, etc.

Sky was a new team but that didn't mean they were starting from scratch. Actually it was the perfect moment to start a new team.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Sky was a new team but that didn't mean they were starting from scratch. Actually it was the perfect moment to start a new team.

I am not sure I am following you?

Are you saying they had BP running, or knew how it worked well enough to dope without tripping it?

 

[Futuroscope]

I am not sure I am following you?

Are you saying they had BP running, or knew how it worked well enough to dope without tripping it?

Yes, why not? They (Brailsford) probably had a good idea how to manipulate the system even before the team was officially started. Even if they didn't they obviously learned quickly.

Brailsford (british cycling - lots of medals)
Wiggins
Geert Leinders
Sean Yates
Bobby Julich
Steven de Jongh

None of the above where beginners and last four names have doped/been involved with doping.

 

[del1962]

Yes, why not? They (Brailsford) probably had a good idea how to manipulate the system even before the team was officially started. Even if they didn't they obviously learned quickly.

Brailsford (british cycling - lots of medals)
Wiggins
Geert Leinders
Sean Yates
Bobby Julich
Steven de Jongh

None of the above where beginners and last four names have doped/been involved with doping.

Is there any proof Sean was involved in doping?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

At an average 3 tests / year for OOC testing, there is not enough data to work out what works or does not and how.

For your theory to fit, they would have to be doing what JV does and carry out internal testing.

Particularly given doping response is so specific to a rider - I do not believe you could get a response to doping measure based on other riders and then project it onto the riders in your team.

IMO. Of course.

 

[Futuroscope]

At an average 3 tests / year for OOC testing, there is not enough data to work out what works or does not and how.

For your theory to fit, they would have to be doing what JV does and carry out internal testing.

Particularly given doping response is so specific to a rider - I do not believe you could get a response to doping measure based on other riders and then project it onto the riders in your team.

IMO. Of course.

Brailsford must have had plenty of experience of that from track/british cycling. Wiggins is also a link. Then they brought in people with doping experience from road cycling.

 

[The Hitch]

Taxus says he knew in 2010 Froome would be the greatest rider ever.

I know it sounds ridiculous but I am willing to hear him out.

Go on Taxus. Show us a post of yours from before Vuelta 2011 where you had Froome as a future GT winners.

Put up or shut up.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Brailsford must have had plenty of experience of that from track/british cycling. Wiggins is also a link. Then they brought in people with doping experience from road cycling.

An interesting theory, no question.

It's pretty cold / hard nosed / doping (vs performance) -focused though. They had more than a few riders burn out, and if they're doing internal testing of their riders (to track doping parameters) then they should be able to track overtraining parameters as well - which I would posit they failed to do? Mind you that fits into the narrative of pineapple juice, pillows and post-stage warm downs, whilst leaving the greatest road rider in the world out of the wind tunnel after he caned the 2011 Vuelta TT and came 2nd at the Tour.

 

[Futuroscope]

An interesting theory, no question.

It's pretty cold / hard nosed / doping (vs performance) -focused though. They had more than a few riders burn out, and if they're doing internal testing of their riders (to track doping parameters) then they should be able to track overtraining parameters as well - which I would posit they failed to do? Mind you that fits into the narrative of pineapple juice, pillows and post-stage warm downs, whilst leaving the greatest road rider in the world out of the wind tunnel after he caned the 2011 Vuelta TT and came 2nd at the Tour.

Maybe they managed to use some of the stuff they learnt from track but other things didn't work out so well. They also probably knew how Wiggins reacted to various things but maybe not so for all of the riders on the team.

 

[red_flanders]

Is there any proof Sean was involved in doping?

Proof? You decide. Yates initially tested positive for testosterone after winning the 1989 Torhout - Werchter Classic but additional samples showed negative and there were procedural errors in the testing process. Yates was not subject to any sanctions.

http://www.dopeology.org/incidents/Yates,-S-adverse-analytical-finding/

http://archives.lesoir.be/delgado-r...positif-au-t-w-classic_t-19891011-Z021PC.html
http://web.archive.org/web/20070613100545/http://www.gva.be/dossiers/-d/doping/40jaar.asp

 

[Colonel]

Brailsford must have had plenty of experience of that from track/british cycling. Wiggins is also a link. Then they brought in people with doping experience from road cycling.

Im not convinced Wiggins was doping during his track years, his TDF win yes, but not the track.

My 2c.

 

[Futuroscope]

Im not convinced Wiggins was doping during his track years, his TDF win yes, but not the track.

My 2c.

Maybe, I don't know , but it's still a link because Brailsford knew Wiggins from track and Wiggins already had plenty of road experience so it was perfect to build a team around him. So they had a bunch of data on him both from track and from road.

And it's not just about Wiggins. Brailsford must have had access to a lot of data on the track cyclists he worked with. I'm not saying it's all about doping, they probably improved on many fronts. But you can't focus only on legal 'marginal gains' when you know that your competitors are doping.

It was a perfect time to start a team, less doping meaning that their legitimate marginal gains resereach wasn't overwhelmed by the effect of drugs in combination with knowledge about how to manipulate the bio passport.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Im not convinced Wiggins was doping during his track years, his TDF win yes, but not the track.

My 2c.

That said - someone elsewhere mentioned he did a 4:13 in training. How is it he went 2 seconds quicker in training than his best time ever in comp?

Or was it like the recent Giro MTT where the last rider can pace themselves to perfection, and win, without going all out?

Would also explain how Wiggins managed to so reliably back up his qualifying times in the heats or final - he was never going au bloc.

 

[oldcrank]

My friend, without entering into any discussions of
doping or conspiracy theories, I can address your
'faster in training' question.

It actually is not that unusual: (1) you can get a
better warm-up by being on the track and perhaps
even behind a derny instead of just warming up
on rollers and fitting into the meet/carnival schedule;
(2) the pads may not be out; (3) there may be a
pace line of riders above the blue line which will
give you a little bit of advantage.

By turning out 'PB's' in training, even if the rider is
aware he/she had a bit of an advantage over an
actual competition performance it can still give
a confidence boost and set them in a good frame
of mind going into the carnival or championship.

 

[Taxus4a]

Taxus says he knew in 2010 Froome would be the greatest rider ever.

I know it sounds ridiculous but I am willing to hear him out.

Go on Taxus. Show us a post of yours from before Vuelta 2011 where you had Froome as a future GT winners.

Put up or shut up.

I have said i wouldnt be surprised if that, as a lot of riders of his generation: Mollema, Gesink, Urán, etc..,
If you read the article, I talk about that, and there is a post in 2009 of another forum member, an important one in Spain, that talk about Froome as posible whrite yersey in 2009 Giro de Italia.
My article is full or new, interviws and article about Froome in those years, it seems as if you didnt read all of that.
I always argument or prof what I said, so maybe is another people who should shut up.