Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[Robert5091]

as early as 2014

https://twitter.com/asthmauk/status/486100114360893441

@letour arrives in London today! If you’re inspired by cyclists with asthma like @chrisfroome then check out our tips

June 9 2014 (tweet is from July 7 2014) was when Dawg was seen huffin' on his inhaler at the Critérium du Dauphiné. Anyone come up with something with Dawg and his asthma before then?

 

[CTQ]

Re:

2016

Chris Froome fined €184 for punching idiotic fan on way to Tour de France stage victory

https://www.independent.ie/sport/ot...to-tour-de-france-stage-victory-34870952.html

Who's started it? :lol:

who? the Colombian flag near from his wheels

 

[glassmoon]

It's been statistically proven* that kids who keep pet snakes are more likely to become dopers in later life.

*Disclosure: I just made that up. Completely.

Thx, I laughted, sincerely. But I'm also drunk.

 

[gregrowlerson]

Re: Re:

I see that not much is happening here in the last few days.

But then again, Chrismas came early this year for The Clinic

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

I see that not much is happening here in the last few days.

But then again, Chrismas came early this year for The Clinic

Turkeys are probably full of chemicals.............

 

[Merckx index]

Re:

In seeing some parallels with LA. Didn't or should I say doesn't Lance display a certain level of on one his books as well?

According to Juliet Macur, in Cycle of Lies, LA had a grandfather, I think it was, who kept jars full of body parts in his basement. Can't remember exact details, but I think he tortured animals, or something like that.

Worth a read -
http://www.velonews.com/2017/12/news/ulissi-lawyer-froome-risk-longer-ban_453938

I made the same point upthread, where I noted Froome is making the same kind of gamble that Contador tried.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

2016

Chris Froome fined €184 for punching idiotic fan on way to Tour de France stage victory

https://www.independent.ie/sport/ot...to-tour-de-france-stage-victory-34870952.html

Who's started it? :lol:

I remember our old friend sniper posted a video from the 09 tour. There is a fan on the road. Contador, Lance. Andy and Frank ride past him. The last rider of the 5 Bradley wiggins, for some totally unexplained reason reaches out and pushes the fan into a ridge.

Viewable here : https://youtu.be/TXqLYH1k7Lo

Who wouldn't punch some of these idiots ? Contador punched a guy that waved a syringe in his face. Fan probably said something to Wiggins. I was more impressed with Wiggins parking abilities when he pushed bike from a distance and made a perfect park up against a rock wall.

 

[red_flanders]

as early as 2014

https://twitter.com/asthmauk/status/486100114360893441

@letour arrives in London today! If you’re inspired by cyclists with asthma like @chrisfroome then check out our tips

June 9 2014 (tweet is from July 7 2014) was when Dawg was seen huffin' on his inhaler at the Critérium du Dauphiné. Anyone come up with something with Dawg and his asthma before then?

Several here went through that exercise in 2014 when he got caught huffing during the Dauphine stage. Nothing before 2014 was found then. I’d be pretty shocked if it were now. Books have literally been written that don’t mention it.

 

[skidmark]

Yeah the disproportionate focus on Froome, like on Armstrong before him, is pretty simple. Success + hubris + people being sick of being lied to and having the broader casual fanbase accept those lies uncritically. That is a recipe that is on a different scale of egregiousness than if, say, Aru or Quintana or Simon Yates (oh wait, that's not a hypothetical) tested positive and banned as an open-and-shut case. That would be just another doper, this is a crack in the dominant narrative in cycling, the gravitational pull of which the bulk of money and power in cycling has circled around for the last 5 years. It's just particularly galling that Team Sky came onto the scene with much pomp and $$$ and has preached transparency while practicing obfuscation, preached zero tolerance while practicing 'get away with every advantage in every grey area possible', has preached a new start to clean sport while backing the most suspicious performance transformation since the heyday of EPO, has preached diligence and attention to detail while losing crucial medical records and somehow not being able to tell Jonathan Tiernan-Locke was glowing red hot for an entire year they decided his magical performance was worthy of a contract.

So there's a bit more to it than not liking a rider.

Success and hubris vs doping. Which do you find more egregious, more repugnant?

Well to me it depends on the context. I'm not really sure how to answer that simplistically, but if you're asking about this case, which involves both hubris and doping, I'd say the combo of both is worse than either alone, in general. But if you clarify what you're asking after more specifically, I can maybe answer better.

 

[skidmark]

Bob Roll's take on all this:

https://youtu.be/s_TZAj93jOQ

I have just discovered the combination of words preceding a link that most guarantee I will never click on said link.

 

[Alpe73]

Re: Re:

In seeing some parallels with LA. Didn't or should I say doesn't Lance display a certain level of on one his books as well?

According to Juliet Macur, in Cycle of Lies, LA had a grandfather, I think it was, who kept jars full of body parts in his basement. Can't remember exact details, but I think he tortured animals, or something like that.

Worth a read -
http://www.velonews.com/2017/12/news/ulissi-lawyer-froome-risk-longer-ban_453938

I made the same point upthread, where I noted Froome is making the same kind of gamble that Contador tried.

Reckon you could spin it as a new thread, MI, if you dig deeper.

 

[Merckx index]

Re: Re:

Reckon you could spin it as a new thread, MI, if you dig deeper.

No need to, the thread already exists. And this is what I was referring to:

Both of Armstrong’s grandfathers had been heavy drinkers whose wives fled with their children after one sodden mishap or another. His paternal grandfather was so mean that he would put kittens in fruit jars to smother them. Armstrong’s father was an alcoholic with as many wives as his mother would have husbands— four.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=21959&p=1409456&hilit=Cycle+of+Lies#p1409456

Have to say that with genes like that in his ancestry, LA turned out pretty well.

 

[Alpe73]

Yeah the disproportionate focus on Froome, like on Armstrong before him, is pretty simple. Success + hubris + people being sick of being lied to and having the broader casual fanbase accept those lies uncritically. That is a recipe that is on a different scale of egregiousness than if, say, Aru or Quintana or Simon Yates (oh wait, that's not a hypothetical) tested positive and banned as an open-and-shut case. That would be just another doper, this is a crack in the dominant narrative in cycling, the gravitational pull of which the bulk of money and power in cycling has circled around for the last 5 years. It's just particularly galling that Team Sky came onto the scene with much pomp and $$$ and has preached transparency while practicing obfuscation, preached zero tolerance while practicing 'get away with every advantage in every grey area possible', has preached a new start to clean sport while backing the most suspicious performance transformation since the heyday of EPO, has preached diligence and attention to detail while losing crucial medical records and somehow not being able to tell Jonathan Tiernan-Locke was glowing red hot for an entire year they decided his magical performance was worthy of a contract.

So there's a bit more to it than not liking a rider.

Success and hubris vs doping. Which do you find more egregious, more repugnant?

Well to me it depends on the context. I'm not really sure how to answer that simplistically, but if you're asking about this case, which involves both hubris and doping, I'd say the combo of both is worse than either alone, in general. But if you clarify what you're asking after more specifically, I can maybe answer better.

Thanks for the reply, S.

Just wondering if response to hubris varies between cultures. I’m sure it does.

No further action required.

Thanks, again.

 

[Robert5091]

Since Salbutamol is used for cats and dogs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salbutamol), what's the chance that Froome will try the "I took Coco's (https://www.instagram.com/froomecat/) medicine by mistake" defence?

 

[sittingbison]

Re:

Since Salbutamol is used for cats and dogs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salbutamol), what's the chance that Froome will try the "I took Coco's (https://www.instagram.com/froomecat/) medicine by mistake" defence?

Internet meltdown if Dawg uses the old "I took Fido's medicine"

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

2016

Chris Froome fined €184 for punching idiotic fan on way to Tour de France stage victory

https://www.independent.ie/sport/ot...to-tour-de-france-stage-victory-34870952.html

Who's started it? :lol:

I remember our old friend sniper posted a video from the 09 tour. There is a fan on the road. Contador, Lance. Andy and Frank ride past him. The last rider of the 5 Bradley wiggins, for some totally unexplained reason reaches out and pushes the fan into a ridge.

Viewable here : https://youtu.be/TXqLYH1k7Lo

Who wouldn't punch some of these idiots ? Contador punched a guy that waved a syringe in his face. Fan probably said something to Wiggins. I was more impressed with Wiggins parking abilities when he pushed bike from a distance and made a perfect park up against a rock wall.

1- why does innocent until proven guilty only apply to sky? We have no proof the fan said anything.

2- even if he had, words aren't violence and don't deserve violent reactions

3- if you actually see the incident you will see that the fan is in front of Wiggins and running forward with his face and focus in the opposite direction to bw. He gets pushed from behind. The group is riding at 20 miles an hour-they are all doping after all (apart from the track rider who was of course totally clean :arrow

So I don't see how it's possible for the fan to have said anything to Wiggins. When you say something to a rider you usually face them not the other way around.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

[quote="
1- why does innocent until proven guilty only apply to sky? We have no proof the fan said anything.

2- even if he had, words aren't violence and don't deserve violent reactions

3- if you actually see the incident you will see that the fan is in front of Wiggins and running forward with his face and focus in the opposite direction to bw. He gets pushed from behind. The group is riding at 20 miles an hour-they are all doping after all (apart from the track rider who was of course totally clean :arrow

So I don't see how it's possible for the fan to have said anything to Wiggins. When you say something to a rider you usually face them not the other way around.

Yeah it was strange. It can only be that he thought the runner was too close to him or might veer to the left. Something obviously ticked off Wiggins but compared to others I don't think the road runner was doing anything that bad.

 

[HelloDolly]

2009 Mount Ventoux stage was the procession of the dopers ....Armstrong, both Schlecks, Contador, Wiggins, Kloden ....


And when Tony Martin was a climber and future winner of the Tour

 

[Alpe73]

Re: Re:

I remember our old friend sniper posted a video from the 09 tour. There is a fan on the road. Contador, Lance. Andy and Frank ride past him. The last rider of the 5 Bradley wiggins, for some totally unexplained reason reaches out and pushes the fan into a ridge.

Viewable here : https://youtu.be/TXqLYH1k7Lo

Who wouldn't punch some of these idiots ? Contador punched a guy that waved a syringe in his face. Fan probably said something to Wiggins. I was more impressed with Wiggins parking abilities when he pushed bike from a distance and made a perfect park up against a rock wall.

1- why does innocent until proven guilty only apply to sky? We have no proof the fan said anything.

2- even if he had, words aren't violence and don't deserve violent reactions

3- if you actually see the incident you will see that the fan is in front of Wiggins and running forward with his face and focus in the opposite direction to bw. He gets pushed from behind. The group is riding at 20 miles an hour-they are all doping after all (apart from the track rider who was of course totally clean :arrow

So I don't see how it's possible for the fan to have said anything to Wiggins. When you say something to a rider you usually face them not the other way around.

Unless, my learn-ed Hitch .... unless!!! .... the fan said .... “Monsieur Wiggins .... I fart in your general direction.”

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Bob Roll's take on all this:

https://youtu.be/s_TZAj93jOQ

I have just discovered the combination of words preceding a link that most guarantee I will never click on said link.

I get what you are saying, but if you can get through the "Bobke speak", he brings up some very good points. He talks about similar positive tests other riders have had, laughs at the damage control being attempted by both Froome, Sky and the sport as a whole, and also thinks most of this will be whitewashed away, with Froome only stripped of his WC results, allowed to keep his Vuelta win, and any suspension will be served in the off-season, with Froome able to come back for the Giro if he wishes.

Basically, it's what most true cycling fans fear, and there's too much money and greed influencing decisions.

 

[Alpe73]

Bob Roll's take on all this:

https://youtu.be/s_TZAj93jOQ

I have just discovered the combination of words preceding a link that most guarantee I will never click on said link.

I get what you are saying, but if you can get through the "Bobke speak", he brings up some very good points. He talks about similar positive tests other riders have had, laughs at the damage control being attempted by both Froome, Sky and the sport as a whole, and also thinks most of this will be whitewashed away, with Froome only stripped of his WC results, allowed to keep his Vuelta win, and any suspension will be served in the off-season, with Froome able to come back for the Giro if he wishes.

Basically, it's what most true cycling fans fear, and there's too much money and greed influencing decisions.

Tell ya what, mate. Let’s skip the pro stuff this summer and we’ll all go over and watch you and the club lads put on a Wed. Eve crit. Circuit will be packed with about 18 of us. Spot on with the “true cycling fans” comment. In the 1950s me old man rode Flanders on square wheels. Nowt complainin from him, was there!

 

[rhubroma]

Yeah the disproportionate focus on Froome, like on Armstrong before him, is pretty simple. Success + hubris + people being sick of being lied to and having the broader casual fanbase accept those lies uncritically. That is a recipe that is on a different scale of egregiousness than if, say, Aru or Quintana or Simon Yates (oh wait, that's not a hypothetical) tested positive and banned as an open-and-shut case. That would be just another doper, this is a crack in the dominant narrative in cycling, the gravitational pull of which the bulk of money and power in cycling has circled around for the last 5 years. It's just particularly galling that Team Sky came onto the scene with much pomp and $$$ and has preached transparency while practicing obfuscation, preached zero tolerance while practicing 'get away with every advantage in every grey area possible', has preached a new start to clean sport while backing the most suspicious performance transformation since the heyday of EPO, has preached diligence and attention to detail while losing crucial medical records and somehow not being able to tell Jonathan Tiernan-Locke was glowing red hot for an entire year they decided his magical performance was worthy of a contract.

So there's a bit more to it than not liking a rider.

Your post sums it up rather nicely. And I'm no moralist, but...if you're going to feign gentlemanliness and preach (with the team) a "holier than though" attitude, then you better not be a total farcking douwchebag/s. As it has so often been said, great power comes with great responsibility. And great success and money come with much accountability (well, in most cases, in our corporate kleptocracy, such as it is, this is actually not the case, most simply getting away with murder - primarily where power and money are concerned). Sky came in baldly announcing how "different" they were, how "morally impeccable" they were and, of course, with typical British snobbery, went about in a rather uppity manner spouting claims of superior training/lifestyle methodologies (toward "marginal gains"). Oh were have we heard this before? All this was done chidingly against the rubes of cycling's continental tradition, while incredibly turning track stars and chronically infirm middlings into Grand Tour champs and contenders, among other such outlandish things. Nibali has intimated, for these reasons, as well as their insupportable pomposity, that Sky is loathed among the other teams. Naturally this makes all the spotlight attention on Froome and Sky, emerging from the most gloomy Caravaggesque tenebrism, a rather befitting upcomence at which to have a good sardonic laugh. It is always the case with those who make implied claims of superiority that, when the common vileness and deception gets released, a general mocking at the pillory and stocks is a foregone conclusion.

 

[aphronesis]

Although Caravaggesque tenebrism couched a wan and transient ethics of emergent semi-secular economies. Sky don’t nearly rise to that.

edit: dropped a g

 

[rick james]

Re:

2009 Mount Ventoux stage was the procession of the dopers ....Armstrong, both Schlecks, Contador, Wiggins, Kloden ....


And when Tony Martin was a climber and future winner of the Tour

you should maybe tell Tony Martin you're calling him a drug cheat, Facebook him, I'm sure he'd love to hear that

 

[aphronesis]

Re: Re:

2009 Mount Ventoux stage was the procession of the dopers ....Armstrong, both Schlecks, Contador, Wiggins, Kloden ....


And when Tony Martin was a climber and future winner of the Tour

you should maybe tell Tony Martin you're calling him a drug cheat, Facebook him, I'm sure he'd love to hear that

You understand that being a media visible professional entails potential negatives, risks and public judgments, yes?