Froome Vs. Contador

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

07- Rasmussen
08- ricco
09- Alberto
10- schleck
11- schleck
12- purito
13- froome
14- nibali
15- landa
16- too early to decide but so far Quintana

Disappointed you could not find a stronger climber for 2009. It's like you're not even trying

It depends on how you define strongest climber. Contador was often extremely strong for a whole season while riders like Schleck mainly peaked for the tour. IMO Schleck was the slightly better climber in the tdf 2010 which was the race where both Contador and Schleck peaked so you can definitely argue that he was better in that year.
2011 is definitely more difficult since Contador was riding the giro but you have to admit that Contadors rivals in the giro 2011 weren't the strongest. I also think that Contador was the best climber of the year but thats only an assumption, not a fact.
In 2014 however I agree with you and in 2008 I don't know because I didnt see the giro.

 

[Tonton]

It's tough to compare the two: Sky has a team that really steamrolls the opposition. And Froome's third week may look average bot in '13 and '15, although IMO he manages his lead more than anything.

2007 - Leonardo
2008 - Ricky
2009 - Bertie
2010 - Andy
2011 - Bertie
2012 - Purito
2013 - Dawg
2014 - Bertie
2015 - Dawg
2016 - So Far Nairito edging Bertie

 

[Campervan man]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

I thought you'd suggested Alberto had raced against Pantani?! Anyway did they ever line up together, as Alberto started in '03 and Marco finished then? Anyhow, I think comparing riders from generations is tough, also riders peaking at different stages in a season. Nibali Tour '14 was great climbing but Alberto was on fire that season. So who's better? I'd say Alberto but then him and Froome may not have matched Nibali's July peak! So difficult. 2012 is another year I'm not convinced about. Purito the best? Maybe Froome was better with his July shape IDK.

 

[ray j willings]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

I don't understand your logic, froome won the tour twice convincingly. Maybe the opposition isn't the greatest ever but nibali and Quintana are no slouches. As far as I know the itt and the wind are part of the race and Quintana is not good enough that's all. Take the tt out of the 2015 giro because landa and aru are weak in it and I can assure Contador doesn't win that race. Take schlecks mecanical and the tt out of 10 tdf and Contador doesn't win the race. Leave Rasmussen 07 tdf contador doesn't win the race. Take out Quintana crash in 2014 vuelta Contador doenst win the race. If purito wasn't so bad tactically 2012 vuelta Alberto doesn't win the race. Put pantani and peak Armstrong and giro 2011 and tdf 2009 Alberto doesn't win the race.... Following your logic Alberto is not a great rider.

 

[ray j willings]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

LOL this is so full of nonsense I don't know where to begin..... You completely ignore Race situation and tactics in reference to the Tour. You think Sky care about the Giro when compared to the Tour? they made CF ride the Tour instead. the rest is ........

Yes they made him ride the tour , why was that? Oh yeah Bertie was racing the Giro.
Had Bertie decided to just race the tour that year 2015 then Froome and Sky would have raced the giro instead.
They played the odds for a victory and fair play it worked "wind lucky victory"

 

[Jspear]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

LOL this is so full of nonsense I don't know where to begin..... You completely ignore Race situation and tactics in reference to the Tour. You think Sky care about the Giro when compared to the Tour? they made CF ride the Tour instead. the rest is ........

Yes they made him ride the tour , why was that? Oh yeah Bertie was racing the Giro.
Had Bertie decided to just race the tour that year 2015 then Froome and Sky would have raced the giro instead.
They played the odds for a victory and fair play it worked "wind lucky victory"

No they wouldn't have. Sky is the new Postal...especially when it comes to what races they deem important. They will race the Tour regardless of how strong AC is. If what you are saying was true then Froome would already be stating that he's going to race the Giro this year. Truth is Froome ain't scared of anyone. AC and Froome both respect each other, but neither is afraid of the other.

 

[dacooley]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

LOL this is so full of nonsense I don't know where to begin..... You completely ignore Race situation and tactics in reference to the Tour. You think Sky care about the Giro when compared to the Tour? they made CF ride the Tour instead. the rest is ........

Yes they made him ride the tour , why was that? Oh yeah Bertie was racing the Giro.
Had Bertie decided to just race the tour that year 2015 then Froome and Sky would have raced the giro instead.
They played the odds for a victory and fair play it worked "wind lucky victory"

No they wouldn't have. Sky is the new Postal...especially when it comes to what races they deem important. They will race the Tour regardless of how strong AC is. If what you are saying was true then Froome would already be stating that he's going to race the Giro this year. Truth is Froome ain't scared of anyone. AC and Froome both respect each other, but neither is afraid of the other.

I presume had bertie bombed the 2014 vuelta, by beating quintana, froome, valverde and others by 10 minutes, we would've had a premise to give ray's theory more credit.

 

[burning]

In 2010, Contador won on Mende, Malhao and Alpe, he was really strong in Ardennes and he matched Andy in all HC climbs except Morzine. For whole season, he was better climber imo

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

In 2010, Contador won on Mende, Malhao and Alpe, he was really strong in Ardennes and he matched Andy in all HC climbs except Morzine. For whole season, he was better climber imo

Exactly. On balance, what was the time difference between Andy and Berto in the mountains (ignoring Port de Bales)? I may be wrong but thought it was 0 (+10s Morzine, -10s Mende)

 

[del1962]

I would put andy Schleck above Contador for 2010 and 2011
Froome for 2012

 

[del1962]

Re:

How would you rank the strongest climber by year, Flo?

2007: The Chicken?
2008: Contador
2009: Contador
2010: Contador
2011: Contador
2012: ?
2013: Froome
2014: ?
2015: Froome
2016: ?

2010-2011 Schleck
2012 Froome

2016 so far Quintana

 

[ray j willings]

I know Froome did not race Pantani . I was making a opinion about riders who IMO are superior to Froome.
Froomes early mountain attack did not work in the 2014dauphine did it? and it did not work in the Vuelta last year.
Froome got his gap in last years tour due to wind and in 2013 with his ITT against a weak field he got a gap again.
Froome made it clear that he preferred the Giro in 2015 yet bottled out when he knew Bertie was racing and opted for the tour where he knew he would Face a tired Bertie and have more chance of a win.

Froome has to many bad days in a GT to be classed as a great rider and he his lost without team mates.

LOL this is so full of nonsense I don't know where to begin..... You completely ignore Race situation and tactics in reference to the Tour. You think Sky care about the Giro when compared to the Tour? they made CF ride the Tour instead. the rest is ........

Yes they made him ride the tour , why was that? Oh yeah Bertie was racing the Giro.
Had Bertie decided to just race the tour that year 2015 then Froome and Sky would have raced the giro instead.
They played the odds for a victory and fair play it worked "wind lucky victory"

No they wouldn't have. Sky is the new Postal...especially when it comes to what races they deem important. They will race the Tour regardless of how strong AC is. If what you are saying was true then Froome would already be stating that he's going to race the Giro this year. Truth is Froome ain't scared of anyone. AC and Froome both respect each other, but neither is afraid of the other.

I presume had bertie bombed the 2014 vuelta, by beating quintana, froome, valverde and others by 10 minutes, we would've had a premise to give ray's theory more credit.

Come on now you know full well that there was no pressure on Froome or Bertie to perform at the Vuelta.
They both came back from injury. It was not a goal for either rider so a loss is not a disaster and a win is a bonus. It would be good to see how Froome would race in the Giro .

 

[Taxus4a]

I go on here from Froome thread:

His director, Yates:

The 33-year-old Contador is currently on Tenerife, honing his form with a high-altitude training camp ahead of what’s a very ambitious season. Contador wants to leave the sport at the absolute peak (so I understand he is peaking, not old nor similar), and that means trying to win another Tour de France. He’s also targeting a medal at the Rio de Janeiro Olympics.

The Olympics present a one-off opportunity for Contador, so it’s the Tour that is the central focus of his racing calendar. And Yates said trying to beat a rider as complete and dominant as Froome only motivates Contador more.

“We all know that Froome is great on the uphill, and he’s great in the time trial, but he’s not unbeatable,” Yates said. “Alberto is motivated to beat him. When Froome is good, you have to be at the top of your game to beat him. Alberto will not go for a lack of trying.”



So he is not unbeatable...if Contador is better than Froome he should say: Froome is a hard rival, but the normal situation is Contador win, becouse he is better. Or simply. Froome is a great and complete rider and could beat Contador...but he doenst say that.

Merxks wanst unbeateble, some people did, Ocaña, maybe the best spanish rider ever, did. Several people did.

 

[Taxus4a]

More examples where people dont see Contador the man to beat at le Tour. If Contador is better and this year is focused on le Tour, he should be.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/hinault-2016-tour-de-france-offers-a-chance-to-take-on-froome/

 

[Taxus4a]

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2016/01/13/569673ece2704e94758b4575.html

I cant find the interview in english.

Froome said his main rival will be Quintana becouse it has been his hardest rival ever.
in that interview the journalist said Merkx has said Froome wont have rival in le Tour.

Froome said: My priority is the Tour, the place you demostrate who is the stronger.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Holy *** Taxus, just let it go and quit analyzing every word someone says.

 

[Miburo]

Re:

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2016/01/13/569673ece2704e94758b4575.html

I cant find the interview in english.

Froome said his main rival will be Quintana becouse it has been his hardest rival ever.
in that interview the journalist said Merkx has said Froome wont have rival in le Tour.

Froome said: My priority is the Tour, the place you demostrate who is the stronger.

If Contador is at his 2014 level, froome knows he's the man. Furthermore Quintana doesn't have the balls, he's weak, fragile. Contador is way more dangerous.

And until now when froome went full ***, only one man was able to follow him. Contador at the dauphine 2 years ago.

Quintana rekt Froome in the last week of the tour but he already lost too much before and the same will happen now with the ITT and the first 2 week of MTF. That won't happen to a Contador at 100%, he will lose way less time than quintana in those first 2 weeks.

 

[Matteo.]

Re: Re:

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2016/01/13/569673ece2704e94758b4575.html

I cant find the interview in english.

Froome said his main rival will be Quintana becouse it has been his hardest rival ever.
in that interview the journalist said Merkx has said Froome wont have rival in le Tour.

Froome said: My priority is the Tour, the place you demostrate who is the stronger.

If Contador is at his 2014 level, froome knows he's the man. Furthermore Quintana doesn't have the balls, he's weak, fragile. Contador is way more dangerous.

And until now when froome went full ***, only one man was able to follow him. Contador at the dauphine 2 years ago.

Quintana rekt Froome in the last week of the tour but he already lost too much before and the same will happen now with the ITT and the first 2 week of MTF. That won't happen to a Contador at 100%, he will lose way less time than quintana in those first 2 weeks.

i'm not so sure for this year. In catalunya i saw him more aggressive with multiple attacks in both mountains stages. maybe he has learned the lesson of the tour 2015...

 

[Metabolol]

I think at this point Froome sees Quintana and Contador as more or less equally dangerous opponents.

 

[del1962]

Re: Re:

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2016/01/13/569673ece2704e94758b4575.html

I cant find the interview in english.

Froome said his main rival will be Quintana becouse it has been his hardest rival ever.
in that interview the journalist said Merkx has said Froome wont have rival in le Tour.

Froome said: My priority is the Tour, the place you demostrate who is the stronger.

If Contador is at his 2014 level, froome knows he's the man. Furthermore Quintana doesn't have the balls, he's weak, fragile. Contador is way more dangerous.

And until now when froome went full ***, only one man was able to follow him. Contador at the dauphine 2 years ago.

Quintana rekt Froome in the last week of the tour but he already lost too much before and the same will happen now with the ITT and the first 2 week of MTF. That won't happen to a Contador at 100%, he will lose way less time than quintana in those first 2 weeks.

Saying Quintana is weak and fragile is just complete nonsense

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re: Re:

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2016/01/13/569673ece2704e94758b4575.html

I cant find the interview in english.

Froome said his main rival will be Quintana becouse it has been his hardest rival ever.
in that interview the journalist said Merkx has said Froome wont have rival in le Tour.

Froome said: My priority is the Tour, the place you demostrate who is the stronger.

If Contador is at his 2014 level, froome knows he's the man. Furthermore Quintana doesn't have the balls, he's weak, fragile. Contador is way more dangerous.

And until now when froome went full ***, only one man was able to follow him. Contador at the dauphine 2 years ago.

Quintana rekt Froome in the last week of the tour but he already lost too much before and the same will happen now with the ITT and the first 2 week of MTF. That won't happen to a Contador at 100%, he will lose way less time than quintana in those first 2 weeks.

Froome, along with half of team sky, was ill during the last week.
In 2013, sure he faded hard. But in 2015, illness contributed a lot to the time losses. Sure he faded in that theres no way he was taking 1 min on Quintana and 2 or more on the rest on Alpe d'Huez.

 

[Gigs_98]

Its just so hard to say how the tour will be.

Generally Froome is my favorite, simply because he was the strongest climber in the last three tours he finished. However this is the absolute only reason why have the feeling Froome might be the most likely winner, objectively I give Contador and Quintana an almost equal chance. I know many people say Quintana doesn't have a chance, because he doesnt attack enough, because he isnt a good TTer, because he is too fragile,... I really think most arguments like that are pretty nonsensical, especially in a tour with so many mountain stages like this year. If he is the strongest climber for the whole tour and doesnt loose any stupid time like in cross winds, he will win. His TT's were actually pretty good last year (he was 6th in the vuelta ITT 3 seconds behind world champion Kiryienka) and there are more than enough mtf's where he can get back the little time he will loose in the TT.
Contador maybe has the small advantage that he will probably take the highest risks to win. If he is a few minutes back after the ITT he will just go berserk on the remaining multi climb stages (and there will still be 4 left) and make it extremely hard for whoever leads at that point. This is something I just wouldnt expect Froome to do.

Then lets not forget there are other riders too. Aru will probably attack left and right and although I don't think he has a chance he will make it very difficult for the teams which try to control the race. Porte still has to show that he can ride well for three weeks but if he does he could be very dangerous, even for the win. TJVG probably has to improve his climbing a bit if he wants to win but especially since he and Porte are in the same team they could make it very difficult for the other favorites if they work well together.

 

[rick james]

You wouldn't expect Froome to do that because he's never had to do it

 

[DFA123]

Re:

I think at this point Froome sees Quintana and Contador as more or less equally dangerous opponents.

Froome probably doesn't care about rivals that much any more. He looks like a rider who is super-confident in his own ability these days. If he is on top form and doesn't make any major tactical errors, he will win the TdF.

 

[rick james]

Re: Re:

I think at this point Froome sees Quintana and Contador as more or less equally dangerous opponents.

Froome probably doesn't care about rivals that much any more. He looks like a rider who is super-confident in his own ability these days. If he is on top form and doesn't make any major tactical errors, he will win the TdF.

I think it was Roche that said that Froome is super confident in his own form..I think he knows if he hits TDF in top form then it doesn't really matter what the others do...it's a risky strategy but works for the dawg....but then again everybody is expecting Bertie 2009 to come roaring into the race