GB Track Team

[lemoogle]

OMG you are so badly informed. The skinsuits they used in Beijing were essentially rubber and have since been outlawed by the UCI. There was a popular rumour that they were destroyed after the games but it was rubbish, doesn't stop you regurgitating it here.

Our tech is within UCI rules, end of story. Oh apart from our magic flying wheels

He said it himself that they destroyed them after beijing, you could probably even find that with a quick search on bbc. then he suddenly said they found them on top of a box.

http://www.metro.co.uk/sport/extra/521753-olympic-cycling-suits-destroyed-in-bid-to-outwit-rivals
Now who's badly informed? Seriously don't call out someone on something with completely false information.

it's not a rumor if Brailsford says it.

 

[red_death]

It's not a game when some countries pour hundreds of thousands into tech for the sport. Even if you really want to believe Team GB's track team isn't doped , can't you see what their own british media is saying about their domination? all I see is articles about how they're ahead technologically etc. etc.
Even brailsford said something about their cutting edge skin suits after beijing , only to retract that after the UCI investigated when he said he destroyed the suits.
Even if we listen to the British media's excuses for their sudden domination, this isn't a game anymore, it's Formula 1.
At least in Formula one, the technology is regulated and you can't dope the drivers ( yet ).

So basically it all boils down to jealousy - the UK has the best tech /coaching /training / magic wheels.

Of course sport is still essentially a game. Sure the age of the glorious amateur (not that there was ever really such a thing) is long gone, but that is life - things evolve and progress.

 

[Hawkwood]

I don't really disagree. But as it was a bit (well actually quite a lot in some cases) before my time, I got the impression that the athletes you mentioned were outstanding individuals and the overall team performance wasn't anywhere near as good as today.

When I got into following cycling 15 or so years ago, Australia, France, Germany, Netherlands were to my mind better teams. Of course it could be that it was a low point in British track cycling, so my perception is a bit clouded.

I also don't disagree, we tended to have some outstanding individuals who succeeded despite British Cycling, or should I say the old BCF (British Cycling Federation). The big changes I think started under Peter Keen, and were continued by Brailsford, they decided to run things in a completely different way. Up to the 90s UK cyclists could go to international competitions and come back with a 10th place and everyone would be happy, there was virtually no funding and most of our cyclists worked full or part-time (even the professionals). Keen and Brailsford introduced a system where only winners got the trips, and others were simply kicked out. I read about this a long time ago, and my recollection is hazy, however I believe there was concern intially in BC about the very ruthless system the two introduced.

 

[red_death]

it's not a rumor if Brailsford says it.

He also said the wheels (supplied by a French company) were rounder than the other teams...you're really scraping the barrel now....

 

[lemoogle]

So basically it all boils down to jealousy - the UK has the best tech /coaching /training / magic wheels.

Of course sport is still essentially a game. Sure the age of the glorious amateur (not that there was ever really such a thing) is long gone, but that is life - things evolve and progress.

I said IF you believe they're clean , then that's what it comes down to. If you want to win with better tech rather than better athletes then sure.
Although you have a point, where is the limit where it's too much? a motor in your bike is too much but what about all the things in between? This is why there is regulations for F1 and other motor sports.

People compete with the same canoes in canoeing , there are no more suits in swimming, one day people will compete with the same equipment in cycling.

 

[lemoogle]

He also said the wheels (supplied by a French company) were rounder than the other teams...you're really scraping the barrel now....

There is a difference between a joke and something he seriously says to the media which they took very seriously , even the UCI did.
I say loads of stupid stuff to my friends it doesnt mean that I can't say something serious ever. You're the one scraping the barrel here.

"That can't be true, here is a joke he made once"

 

[Morbius]

The university of Ferrara (Conconi) and Freiburg were running doping programmes for athletes, which pretty much constitutes state sponsored doping.

Of course, for large scale and long term organised doping programmes you can look at pretty much any cycling team between (say) 1992 an 1998, probably a lot sooner and later as well.

Those are nothing like the scale of what BC are being accused of. A few rogue doctors that sports people visit? Riders supporting themselves doping with teams turning a blind eye? They are nothing compared to the alleged top down, highly effective, tightly managed and unique (not replicated by any other team or country) programme that BC are supposed to have run

 

[Monty Dog]

Are folks really dumb enough to believe that with such a free press, competitors of News Corp and foreign media have not been determindly looking for a single -shred of evidence to show there was any form of doping going on at BC/Sky? This single -minded approach also means plenty of promising riders have been rejected from the programme and not one has witnessed or heard of any illicit deeds?

 

[ultimobici]

If you look at the pursuit, Britain has a long long history at the highest level. Of the last 50 world champions almost a third have been British.

 

[hrotha]

Are folks really dumb enough to believe that with such a free press, competitors of News Corp and foreign media have not been determindly looking for a single -shred of evidence to show there was any form of doping going on at BC/Sky? This single -minded approach also means plenty of promising riders have been rejected from the programme and not one has witnessed or heard of any illicit deeds?

Kind of like what's happened on the road since forever?

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Those are nothing like the scale of what BC are being accused of. A few rogue doctors that sports people visit? Riders supporting themselves doping with teams turning a blind eye? They are nothing compared to the alleged top down, highly effective, tightly managed and unique (not replicated by any other team or country) programme that BC are supposed to have run

U gotta be friggin kidding. Just google a bit on Francesco Conconi, Donati, hell, why don't you even go further an do a little google on Fuentes and the Spanish Athletics?

U Brits are so naive.

Are folks really dumb enough to believe that with such a free press, competitors of News Corp and foreign media have not been determindly looking for a single -shred of evidence to show there was any form of doping going on at BC/Sky? This single -minded approach also means plenty of promising riders have been rejected from the programme and not one has witnessed or heard of any illicit deeds?

Ballestere, Walsh, Kimmage not, the rest just want to keep their nine to five suckers job.

Welcome in cycling Brits.

 

[buckle]

China has 4 times as many failed dope tests for swimming than any other nation. They recently had a 16 year old banned for EPO use. They are a controlled totalitarian state. They have had entire squads banned. They came from nowhere to dominate women's distance running and once athletes started getting caught, just as quickly disappeared again. Their history on doping absolutely stinks. Balding was absolutely right to at the very least ask the question of an outlying performance.

What's GB Track Cycling's history on doping? Nothing. No failed tests, just a consistent winning record with a team that since Boardman has run to hundreds of people, none of whom have ever 'squeeled'. Not one shred of evidence that even suggests doping. You think The Guardian or The Daily Telegraph wouldn't want to put one over on Murdoch, even if it meant destroying the sport? So we are well within our rights to give it hoorays and Britannia rules the waves, cause in certain sports, we do.

Boardman doped as did Yates, Millar and the late Tom Simpson. The UCI grants free passes to certain countries. Hilariously, the Americans were convinced that there was a conspiracy against Armstrong because of rumours. They blamed the French for their "jealousy" but in the end it was his own people who dumped him. Bizarrely, the British continue to hold Tom "put me back on my bike" Simpson as a sports icon. Even if a mole emerged, the British would continue to believe their own publicity as the tragic and pathetic Simpson case demonstrates.

 

[lemoogle]

If you look at the pursuit, Britain has a long long history at the highest level. Of the last 50 world champions almost a third have been British.

Noone here is denying that. But the manner in which they won the pursuit is pretty unbelievable. Noone would have been surprised by Team GB winning the pursuit, but winning it 5 seconds ahead of Australia and beating their world record on each single ride is suspect, even more so in conjunction with the other other-worldly performances form the Team GB track team.

 

[Morbius]

U gotta be friggin kidding. Just google a bit on Francesco Conconi, Donati, hell, why don't you even go further an do a little google on Fuentes and the Spanish Athletics?

U Brits are so naive.

Sure, the doctors are out there, selling their wares - and there may well be (probably are) Brits visiting them. This isn't the same as a top down organised drug programme encompassing both a national and a pro team.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Boardman doped

I am interested in this. Do you have a sliver of evidence?

 

[Catwhoorg]

I am interested in this. Do you have a sliver of evidence?

He won bike races, that's evidence enough here isn't it ?

 

[2008885]

I am interested in this. Do you have a sliver of evidence?

I'll have a wild guess at "No, he doesn't"

 

[Hawkwood]

Boardman doped as did Yates, Millar and the late Tom Simpson. The UCI grants free passes to certain countries. Hilariously, the Americans were convinced that there was a conspiracy against Armstrong because of rumours. They blamed the French for their "jealousy" but in the end it was his own people who dumped him. Bizarrely, the British continue to hold Tom "put me back on my bike" Simpson as a sports icon. Even if a mole emerged, the British would continue to believe their own publicity as the tragic and pathetic Simpson case demonstrates.

Which `British', 99% will never of heard of Simpson. There was a radio documentary about him that centred on his drug use. I can't remember reading anything British about Simpson that didn't say he died of drugs. David Millar took a hammering in the press for drug use.

 

[Hawkwood]

Boardman doped as did Yates, Millar and the late Tom Simpson. The UCI grants free passes to certain countries. Hilariously, the Americans were convinced that there was a conspiracy against Armstrong because of rumours. They blamed the French for their "jealousy" but in the end it was his own people who dumped him. Bizarrely, the British continue to hold Tom "put me back on my bike" Simpson as a sports icon. Even if a mole emerged, the British would continue to believe their own publicity as the tragic and pathetic Simpson case demonstrates.

I should add that Tom Simpson is almost certainly better known in France, than in Britain, they liked his bowler hat and umbrella antics.

 

[saosinfangirl]

I am interested in this. Do you have a sliver of evidence?

osteoporosis = steroid

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

I should add that Tom Simpson is almost certainly better known in France, than in Britain, they liked his bowler hat and umbrella antics.

Apparently he was quite popular there. Spoke fluent French and played up to the English man abroad stereotype.

Also, he never said 'put me back on my bike'.

 

[buckle]

I am interested in this. Do you have a sliver of evidence?

2009 Interview:

'I always analysed my performance, looking for ways to improve,' says Chris. 'But I seemed to fatigue faster than other competitors. For years we assumed that I needed to improve my climbing skills because I would fall back in the later mountainous stages. 'But in 1996, I entered a race in Spain where the mountains came first and I performed very well - so my climbing skills weren't at fault. I was scratching my head until the following year, when my team doctor analysed previous blood tests and recognised a persistently low level of testosterone.' Although low levels of testosterone were noted before, it was assumed this was only because of Chris's excessive training. But his doctor discovered a persistent pattern both in and out of training and said he would normally recommend that a patient with such low levels have a bone scan.

When Chris returned to England in late 1997 he was referred to the head of metabolic bone disease at the Royal Liverpool University Hospital where a scan revealed a density level below normal. Chris was recommended HRT.
'Testosterone supplements were banned in cycling and classed as a performance-enhancing drug,' he says. 'So I applied to the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) in early 1998 to be allowed the therapy on medical grounds, supplying scans to support my case. They said they thought it would be fine but then Festina happened.'

'Festina' was the drugs busts during the 1998 Tour de France. French police raided team hotels and confiscated a haul of banned substances, arresting a member of the Festina team. Cyclists pulled out of the race in droves, which that year was dubbed the 'Tour of Shame' . 'The UCI had to tighten up after the scandal and so they denied me permission,' he says. 'I would have to stop my career for the treatment or carry on.

 

[Hawkwood]

Apparently he was quite popular there. Spoke fluent French and played up to the English man abroad stereotype.

Also, he never said 'put me back on my bike'.

He was popular in France, he hammed it up for the press and they loved it. I was in France during the Tour and start of the Olympics and their press was using the the same stereotypes of the British as they did in Simpson's day. I guess we're (the British) the same in our love of national stereotypes. I first started cycling amongst riders some of whom had known Simson, my recollection is that his memory was an embarrasment to them. If anything recent British books and articles have been harsher on Simpson, moving from he took the odd bit of dope, to he was hitting it so hard others tried to warn him.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

2009 Interview:

'I always analysed my performance, looking for ways to improve,' says Chris. 'But I seemed to fatigue faster than other competitors. For years we assumed that I needed to improve my climbing skills because I would fall back in the later mountainous stages. 'But in 1996, I entered a race in Spain where the mountains came first and I performed very well - so my climbing skills weren't at fault. I was scratching my head until the following year, when my team doctor analysed previous blood tests and recognised a persistently low level of testosterone.' Although low levels of testosterone were noted before, it was assumed this was only because of Chris's excessive training. But his doctor discovered a persistent pattern both in and out of training and said he would normally recommend that a patient with such low levels have a bone scan.

When Chris returned to England in late 1997 he was referred to the head of metabolic bone disease at the Royal Liverpool University Hospital where a scan revealed a density level below normal. Chris was recommended HRT.
'Testosterone supplements were banned in cycling and classed as a performance-enhancing drug,' he says. 'So I applied to the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) in early 1998 to be allowed the therapy on medical grounds, supplying scans to support my case. They said they thought it would be fine but then Festina happened.'

'Festina' was the drugs busts during the 1998 Tour de France. French police raided team hotels and confiscated a haul of banned substances, arresting a member of the Festina team. Cyclists pulled out of the race in droves, which that year was dubbed the 'Tour of Shame' . 'The UCI had to tighten up after the scandal and so they denied me permission,' he says. 'I would have to stop my career for the treatment or carry on.

So he had low levels of Testosterone and never used drugs to raise it. I must have missed the evidence?

 

[Hawkwood]

So he had low levels of Testosterone and never used drugs to raise it. I must have missed the evidence?

I was scratching my head as well.