Giro 2017, stage 10: Foligno - Montefalco 39,8km (ITT)

[Valv.Piti]

Re: Re:

This Giro is shaping up beautifully. The first 7 stages were awful but since then it has improved a lot. The second week is pretty abysmal but it also means that the gaps will probably be very close to what they are now, unless someone cracks on Oropa(!). Stelvio will be great and this means the short dolomite stage could be very good, instead of crap. Even the Grappa stage can be good.

Oropa... Seems to be a silly stage, but I think it will deliver... Last 5k should be nice!

Yeah, Oropa will be an all out effort for the last 6,5 km at this point, but its still such an easy stage its hard to see Dumoulin lose more than 20-30 seconds.

 

[Scarponi]

Tom D the new Cadel?

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

Apparently Nibali had a proplem with his bike computer and he was only able to see his speed on his powermeter and Slongo told him on the Radio that he had a high cadence and that he should keep it high.

It sucks to have a problem, but if a rider (not saying Nibali was this today) can't ride 100% without a computer, they are not a complete rider/competitor.

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

 

[Scarponi]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

Good on shirt punchy climbs ( veulta 15) TTs well ( probably better then Cadel but Cadel on form wouldn't lose more then a minute) grind type of climber who finishes 30 seconds to 1 min back. Or do you rate Cadel higher ?

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

Good on shirt punchy climbs ( veulta 15) TTs well ( probably better then Cadel but Cadel on form wouldn't lose more then a minute) grind type of climber who finishes 30 seconds to 1 min back. Or do you rate Cadel higher ?

Evans was a diesel climber with a punchy kick who used to blow himself up every climb. Dumoulin has done that like once. Furthermore, Evans was a natural mix between a climber, Dumoulin is a natural TT'er who happened to be thin enough to climb very well.

That's not to start talking about the style and charisma.

 

[deValtos]

The race is on! Good to see there are still stages where the TT lads (Dumo/Jungles/Thomas) can get their own back and make up a couple of minutes.

Biggest loser today I guess is Pinot, I'd have to go back and look at all his good TT results but were they all in hilly courses and so obfuscated his actual raw power on the flat? I mean even Quintana has won TT's when they chuck some hills in them.

Quintana's ride wasn't great but I don't really think it was bad either, he barely lost any time on the rest of the contenders like Mollema, Nibali, Pinot which is what you'd expect from a tiny Colombian.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Just watched

Big Tom _O_

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

This Giro is shaping up beautifully. The first 7 stages were awful but since then it has improved a lot. The second week is pretty abysmal but it also means that the gaps will probably be very close to what they are now, unless someone cracks on Oropa(!). Stelvio will be great and this means the short dolomite stage could be very good, instead of crap. Even the Grappa stage can be good.

Oropa... Seems to be a silly stage, but I think it will deliver... Last 5k should be nice!

Yeah, Oropa will be an all out effort for the last 6,5 km at this point, but its still such an easy stage its hard to see Dumoulin lose more than 20-30 seconds.

Oropa is a decent climb, but when the peloton should be wrecked the climb should almost be over. Gaps could be bigger if Dumoulin blows up, but he could also hang in there and not lose any time.

 

[Scarponi]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

Good on shirt punchy climbs ( veulta 15) TTs well ( probably better then Cadel but Cadel on form wouldn't lose more then a minute) grind type of climber who finishes 30 seconds to 1 min back. Or do you rate Cadel higher ?

Evans was a diesel climber with a punchy kick who used to blow himself up every climb. Dumoulin has done that like once. Furthermore, Evans was a natural mix between a climber, Dumoulin is a natural TT'er who happened to be thin enough to climb very well.

That's not to start talking about the style and charisma.

You can pick and choose positives and negativitys but in a general sense dumo will have to grind up behind Quintana like Cadel did with Contador and TT the gap. To be fair to Cadel about the blowing up Cadel is a far better climber then Tom and he had to see off some brutal Ras + Contador attacks in his time. Wish he just held his own pace that 2007 tour. Unlike a lot on this forum style mean nothing in Australia and we don't fawn on weird little points like that. Still shocks me about the amount of issues people have with colour clashes on here. Probably my weakness

 

[Cookster15]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

Good on shirt punchy climbs ( veulta 15) TTs well ( probably better then Cadel but Cadel on form wouldn't lose more then a minute) grind type of climber who finishes 30 seconds to 1 min back. Or do you rate Cadel higher ?

Evans was a diesel climber with a punchy kick who used to blow himself up every climb. Dumoulin has done that like once. Furthermore, Evans was a natural mix between a climber, Dumoulin is a natural TT'er who happened to be thin enough to climb very well.

That's not to start talking about the style and charisma.

Evans was a diesel climber who blew himself up on long climbs like PdB following the wheels of explosive climbers like Contador and Rasmussen prior to 2010. 2011 was the year Evans learned to hold his own pace and look what transpired. Evans in top form was only slightly below Tom's TT but Evans was maybe 2-3Kg lighter too, no doubt helpful for recovery in 3rd week of back ended GTs. Hopefully Tom D can learn from Evans.

 

[Geraint Too Fast]

I thought Danielson had retired.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

No.

Good on shirt punchy climbs ( veulta 15) TTs well ( probably better then Cadel but Cadel on form wouldn't lose more then a minute) grind type of climber who finishes 30 seconds to 1 min back. Or do you rate Cadel higher ?

Evans was a diesel climber with a punchy kick who used to blow himself up every climb. Dumoulin has done that like once. Furthermore, Evans was a natural mix between a climber, Dumoulin is a natural TT'er who happened to be thin enough to climb very well.

That's not to start talking about the style and charisma.

Evans was a diesel climber who blew himself up on long climbs like PdB following the wheels of explosive climbers like Contador and Rasmussen prior to 2010. 2011 was the year Evans learned to hold his own pace and look what transpired. Evans in top form was only slightly below Tom's TT but Evans was maybe 2-3Kg lighter too, no doubt helpful for recovery in 3rd week of back ended GTs. Hopefully Tom D can learn from Evans.

Zoncolan 2010. Blew up following the mother of all diesels, on not the longest climb.

 

[Cookster15]

Yes Evans held on too long to Basso in 2010 Giro but Zoncolan is 11km @ 11.9% so plenty long and equal to the hardest climb now ridden in GTs. He did learn by 2011 though and as I mention Tom D might have this Giro in the bag if he can take a leaf out of Evan's 2011 book in defending against Quintana and Movistar's attacks. Quintana will need to pull at least 3 minutes on Dumoulin between now and the Milan TT.

 

[Scarponi]

Plus Evans was riding for Tour de France form and basso was robobasso that yearc

 

[python]

Re:

The race is on! Good to see there are still stages where the TT lads (Dumo/Jungles/Thomas) can get their own back and make up a couple of minutes.

Biggest loser today I guess is Pinot, I'd have to go back and look at all his good TT results but were they all in hilly courses and so obfuscated his actual raw power on the flat? I mean even Quintana has won TT's when they chuck some hills in them.

Quintana's ride wasn't great but I don't really think it was bad either, he barely lost any time on the rest of the contenders like Mollema, Nibali, Pinot which is what you'd expect from a tiny Colombian.

if i was quintana, id be ver happy with my performance. Tom d apart, as u said, he did not lose all that much in a windy flatish tt agaist the contenders most of whom are at least 10kg heavier than him...reaaaly, the feather weight being top 20 of almost 200 is excellent. Moreover, after his touphest test in the entire giro, he remained 2nd with some time to spare and several climbing stages left where he can excel. I dont see big tom, even if he wins overall, keeping the gap over nairo he got now

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Still it's insane that Dumoulin kept Quintana to 24 seconds on Blockhaus. I'm still more confused on that performance than on this TT. The TT was expected more or less.

I mean, Blockhaus was not exactly softpedalled. After the initial attack, Quintana had 15 seconds. He only gained 9 more on Dumoulin in the remaining 5km.. If Dumoulin can keep that kind of climbing level.. he has to use his team, simple as that. There's no other way.

However, if Dumoulin shows signs of weakness before, he might not even need his team.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

An exciting and dramatic ITT. And now for the defense of Tom's pink jersey. It will be gradually tougher.

 

[Orbit501]

Re:

Top 5 still in the mix for the overall. The next 5 tactical nightmare.
Should be exciting.

4 of the top 5 still in the mix I reckon. I'd be very surprised if Mollema doesn't have his usual bad day and drop down GC.

Very exciting race in prospect now though!

 

[gorigogo]

Re: Re:

This Giro is shaping up beautifully. The first 7 stages were awful but since then it has improved a lot. The second week is pretty abysmal but it also means that the gaps will probably be very close to what they are now, unless someone cracks on Oropa(!). Stelvio will be great and this means the short dolomite stage could be very good, instead of crap. Even the Grappa stage can be good.

Oropa... Seems to be a silly stage, but I think it will deliver... Last 5k should be nice!

Yeah, Oropa will be an all out effort for the last 6,5 km at this point, but its still such an easy stage its hard to see Dumoulin lose more than 20-30 seconds.

As a Quintana fan i am actually excited to see how he and his team approach the rest of this race. he's usually more comfortable defending his lead and not having to make the first move. This will be a good test of what he will surely face in the tdf. i hope to see him attack and be unpredictable even if he does not win the race.

 

[Cookster15]

Re: Re:

Top 5 still in the mix for the overall. The next 5 tactical nightmare.
Should be exciting.

4 of the top 5 still in the mix I reckon. I'd be very surprised if Mollema doesn't have his usual bad day and drop down GC.

Very exciting race in prospect now though!

Yes, Mario Cipollini's comments the other day are now looking embarrassingly premature as are many comments on this forum after the Etna stage. As if a sprinter who got pushed over hills has any idea anyway.

 

[the asian]

Couldn't watch the stage but saw the results and not too happy

Tom D seems to have set an insane time. Nairo lost about 45 seconds too many for comfort.

Now he'll have to work really hard to win the Giro (Still believe he'll do it) and it doesn't augur well for his "Double" ambition.

 

[perico]

Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

So far he looks like the 1990 version of Indurain.

 

[Cookster15]

Re: Re:

Tom D the new Cadel?

So far he looks like the 1990 version of Indurain.

Dumoulin is about 10Kg lighter and 100 watts less powerful than Indurain at his peak (different era). But his look and performance today did resemble Indurain and Banesto.

 

[webvan]

Re:

Still it's insane that Dumoulin kept Quintana to 24 seconds on Blockhaus. I'm still more confused on that performance than on this TT. The TT was expected more or less.

I mean, Blockhaus was not exactly softpedalled. After the initial attack, Quintana had 15 seconds. He only gained 9 more on Dumoulin in the remaining 5km.. If Dumoulin can keep that kind of climbing level.. he has to use his team, simple as that. There's no other way.

However, if Dumoulin shows signs of weakness before, he might not even need his team.

That was just one climb during the first week, x3 in the 3rd week and Dumoulin blows up big time.