Teams & Riders He's coming home!!!! Alejandro Valverde comeback thread.

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Need more 2 hour 1 climb stages to test the hypothesis

This!

Don't give them any ideas.

 

[wheresmybrakes]

Valverde rides for himself.


The stat of him having most top 10s in GT's being something to shout about? All those people giving $hit when other riders protect their 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th 10th place instead of sacrificing everything for the win, but it's ok for Valverde to get himself in the top 10 without even trying for the win.


I wonder where the problem really lies within Movistar.

 

[Blanco]

Re:

Valverde rides for himself.


The stat of him having most top 10s in GT's being something to shout about? All those people giving $hit when other riders protect their 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th 10th place instead of sacrificing everything for the win, but it's ok for Valverde to get himself in the top 10 without even trying for the win.


I wonder where the problem really lies within Movistar.

Keep wondering, cause you obviously don't have a clue..

Oh yeah, and that stat you mentioned put him in some nice company: Gino Bartali, Felice Gimondi and Pedro Delgado.

 

[Koronin]

The question is are these last two stages worth my time to watch when I get home or not?
@whereybrakes most of those GT GC top 10's ate when he's been racing for GC himself. Those include 8 podiums. At the Vuelta he has the opportunity to break that record. He likely will finish his career with more GT GC top 10s than the number of GT's most riders will ever attempt.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re:

The question is are these last two stages worth my time to watch when I get home or not?
@whereybrakes most of those GT GC top 10's ate when he's been racing for GC himself. Those include 8 podiums. At the Vuelta he has the opportunity to break that record. He likely will finish his career with more GT GC top 10s than the number of GT's most riders will ever attempt.

Go watch stage 19. Its a fantastic stage from start to "finish", some of the best cycling you'll ever see in the Tour. Unfortunately, we know the rest of the story. As for Valverde, he struggled mightily on Iseran as expected.

 

[Red Rick]

Very hard for me to blame Valverde alone when the entire team lacked coordination almost throughout this Tour.

As for the Vuelta, I think Bala at this point isn't consistent enough in the mountains to be a big contender.

 

[Blanco]

He was surprisingly good at altitude. I think he has the problem with altitude only the first day, each day after he gets better.

 

[SafeBet]

I for one wasn't expecting this kind of consistency from Valverde, in what was supposed to be a prep race before the Vuelta. This man never ceases to amaze me. I'm curious to see what he can do in the Vuelta, normally he shouldn't be on the podium, but who knows?

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

He was surprisingly good at altitude. I think he has the problem with altitude only the first day, each day after he gets better.

I think people focused too much on altitude rather than the overall amount of climbing in a stage and how hard the climbs are ridden.

And very high altitude climbs tend to be very big climbs. Also, the Vuelta generally hits high altitudes less, so I understand where the idea comes from.

 

[echelon]

I would say he did a good tour but I still cannot say what the objective was , I guess he stealthed his way into the top 10 by staying with the GC group in the mountain stages. Without throwing time away unnecessarily on stage 6 by sitting up after riding on the front to La Planche he would have finished 1-2 places higher in GC.

On similar form in La Vuelta he can do top 5 and possibly podium depending on which other GC riders decide to race it. The parcour is always good for his abilities and the team and himself always ride better on home soil. Valverde and Carapaz as leaders and Landa as a super dom plus the riders from the Giro would give a strong team.

 

[Angliru]

Re:

Valverde rides for himself.


The stat of him having most top 10s in GT's being something to shout about? All those people giving $hit when other riders protect their 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th 10th place instead of sacrificing everything for the win, but it's ok for Valverde to get himself in the top 10 without even trying for the win.


I wonder where the problem really lies within Movistar.

Yup, he was riding for himself when he had his nose in the wind, leading the gc group up a mountain pass, dropped off after his extended effort, drifted to back of the pack........and then after taking a break, returned to front. Yup, that sounds like someone riding for numero uno.

 

[Nirvana]

Re: Re:

He was surprisingly good at altitude. I think he has the problem with altitude only the first day, each day after he gets better.

I think people focused too much on altitude rather than the overall amount of climbing in a stage and how hard the climbs are ridden.

And very high altitude climbs tend to be very big climbs. Also, the Vuelta generally hits high altitudes less, so I understand where the idea comes from.

Yeah, I've always said that in the past, for sure he suffers a bit compared to other riders at high altitude but when is in short and not too hard stages he can do well, we've seen already more than one time at the Vuelta on Sierra Nevada or in the final mountain stage of the 2016 Giro, the real problems come when the altitude comes in long and hard stages like the Dolomitic marathon staying in the 2016 Giro.

Anyway looks very good for the rest of the season, he's a totally different rider climbing wise compared to the spring and probably even his best version since the injury in high mountains.

 

[Blanco]

Re:

I would say he did a good tour but I still cannot say what the objective was , I guess he stealthed his way into the top 10 by staying with the GC group in the mountain stages. Without throwing time away unnecessarily on stage 6 by sitting up after riding on the front to La Planche he would have finished 1-2 places higher in GC.

On similar form in La Vuelta he can do top 5 and possibly podium depending on which other GC riders decide to race it. The parcour is always good for his abilities and the team and himself always ride better on home soil. Valverde and Carapaz as leaders and Landa as a super dom plus the riders from the Giro would give a strong team.

Landa won't be there, the man did two GT's already. Bala, Carapaz, Pedrero, Betancur, Fernandez, Rojas, Sutterlin and one more, take a pick.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

The question is are these last two stages worth my time to watch when I get home or not?
@whereybrakes most of those GT GC top 10's ate when he's been racing for GC himself. Those include 8 podiums. At the Vuelta he has the opportunity to break that record. He likely will finish his career with more GT GC top 10s than the number of GT's most riders will ever attempt.

Go watch stage 19. Its a fantastic stage from start to "finish", some of the best cycling you'll ever see in the Tour. Unfortunately, we know the rest of the story. As for Valverde, he struggled mightily on Iseran as expected.

Thank you. I'll watch it this week. Glad to hear the stage is really worth going back and watching. We're home from the Science Fiction Convention and of course that means back to work tomorrow.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

I would say he did a good tour but I still cannot say what the objective was , I guess he stealthed his way into the top 10 by staying with the GC group in the mountain stages. Without throwing time away unnecessarily on stage 6 by sitting up after riding on the front to La Planche he would have finished 1-2 places higher in GC.

On similar form in La Vuelta he can do top 5 and possibly podium depending on which other GC riders decide to race it. The parcour is always good for his abilities and the team and himself always ride better on home soil. Valverde and Carapaz as leaders and Landa as a super dom plus the riders from the Giro would give a strong team.

Landa won't be there, the man did two GT's already. Bala, Carapaz, Pedrero, Betancur, Fernandez, Rojas, Sutterlin and one more, take a pick.

Sounds like Quintana is the other rider going to la Vuelta for Movistar. Obviously Movistar hasn't released their roster yet.

 

[Blanco]

Re: Re:

I would say he did a good tour but I still cannot say what the objective was , I guess he stealthed his way into the top 10 by staying with the GC group in the mountain stages. Without throwing time away unnecessarily on stage 6 by sitting up after riding on the front to La Planche he would have finished 1-2 places higher in GC.

On similar form in La Vuelta he can do top 5 and possibly podium depending on which other GC riders decide to race it. The parcour is always good for his abilities and the team and himself always ride better on home soil. Valverde and Carapaz as leaders and Landa as a super dom plus the riders from the Giro would give a strong team.

Landa won't be there, the man did two GT's already. Bala, Carapaz, Pedrero, Betancur, Fernandez, Rojas, Sutterlin and one more, take a pick.

Sounds like Quintana is the other rider going to la Vuelta for Movistar. Obviously Movistar hasn't released their roster yet.

I don't think so. His riding at the Tour was disgraceful, and by that I don't talking about quality of his individual ride, I'm talking about team ride. He didn't turn a single pedal stroke in favor of his team, and the climax was at penultimate stage when he pulled his earpiece some 3-4 km from finish and didn't want to work for Valverde's stage win. Valverde didn't even mention his near miss on that stage, and that alone indicates how disappointed he is, and you can see in Unzue statement on the team site how disappointed he is because of Valverde's near miss. Knowing that these two are mostly calling the shots at Movistar, I would say that he won't ride Vuelta.

 

[wheresmybrakes]

Serious question guys. How do you think Valverde will ride next year and do you think he will have a serious chance of competing/winning any of the big races again as he did in the past? Yes, he has the know how of winning big stages, but he will be older (obviously) and no doubt his strength/ability would diminish a bit. With Alaphilippe amongst one or two other riders now growing stronger in the races that Valverde would normally dominate, do you think he would take a bit of a step backwards to help any up and coming younger riders, or would he still demand that number one status in the team regardless if he's in form/able to go for the win in the big races?

 

[Red Rick]

Serious question guys. How do you think Valverde will ride next year and do you think he will have a serious chance of competing/winning any of the big races again as he did in the past? Yes, he has the know how of winning big stages, but he will be older (obviously) and no doubt his strength/ability would diminish a bit. With Alaphilippe amongst one or two other riders now growing stronger in the races that Valverde would normally dominate, do you think he would take a bit of a step backwards to help any up and coming younger riders, or would he still demand that number one status in the team regardless if he's in form/able to go for the win in the big races?

Really don't know. With Alaphilippe dominating him in short explosive hills and his climbing not being one of the best anymore the window of races where he's one of the best is getting smaller rapidly. It's probably also more a consistency issue cause the really good singular days are still there, as evidenced by his rainbow jersey.

But the days of being a GT threat are over, and perhaps he can't win races like Catalunya anymore either. Next year should be all about Liege, the Olympics, Worlds, and Lombardia

 

[del1962]

Quintana's stage win saved Movistars tour

 

[Salvarani]

Serious question guys. How do you think Valverde will ride next year and do you think he will have a serious chance of competing/winning any of the big races again as he did in the past? Yes, he has the know how of winning big stages, but he will be older (obviously) and no doubt his strength/ability would diminish a bit. With Alaphilippe amongst one or two other riders now growing stronger in the races that Valverde would normally dominate, do you think he would take a bit of a step backwards to help any up and coming younger riders, or would he still demand that number one status in the team regardless if he's in form/able to go for the win in the big races?

It is cycling. Anyone can win under the right circumstances, even though some are likelier to win than others. With maybe Ala being the rider to beat in FW and so on. If Valverde dont decline rapidly. He is still at a high level and could win.

 

[tobydawq]

Re: Re:

I don't think so. His riding at the Tour was disgraceful, and by that I don't talking about quality of his individual ride, I'm talking about team ride. He didn't turn a single pedal stroke in favor of his team, and the climax was at penultimate stage when he pulled his earpiece some 3-4 km from finish and didn't want to work for Valverde's stage win. Valverde didn't even mention his near miss on that stage, and that alone indicates how disappointed he is, and you can see in Unzue statement on the team site how disappointed he is because of Valverde's near miss. Knowing that these two are mostly calling the shots at Movistar, I would say that he won't ride Vuelta.

Ah, that explains things. I didn't watch the stage until yesterday, and I was quite confused that I couldn't find any comment by Valverde anywhere.

It was quite a sight to see him actually beat the other favourites, and at the same time extremely irritating that he didn't get the stage win.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

I would say he did a good tour but I still cannot say what the objective was , I guess he stealthed his way into the top 10 by staying with the GC group in the mountain stages. Without throwing time away unnecessarily on stage 6 by sitting up after riding on the front to La Planche he would have finished 1-2 places higher in GC.

On similar form in La Vuelta he can do top 5 and possibly podium depending on which other GC riders decide to race it. The parcour is always good for his abilities and the team and himself always ride better on home soil. Valverde and Carapaz as leaders and Landa as a super dom plus the riders from the Giro would give a strong team.

Landa won't be there, the man did two GT's already. Bala, Carapaz, Pedrero, Betancur, Fernandez, Rojas, Sutterlin and one more, take a pick.

Sounds like Quintana is the other rider going to la Vuelta for Movistar. Obviously Movistar hasn't released their roster yet.

I don't think so. His riding at the Tour was disgraceful, and by that I don't talking about quality of his individual ride, I'm talking about team ride. He didn't turn a single pedal stroke in favor of his team, and the climax was at penultimate stage when he pulled his earpiece some 3-4 km from finish and didn't want to work for Valverde's stage win. Valverde didn't even mention his near miss on that stage, and that alone indicates how disappointed he is, and you can see in Unzue statement on the team site how disappointed he is because of Valverde's near miss. Knowing that these two are mostly calling the shots at Movistar, I would say that he won't ride Vuelta.

I really hope the Tour is Quintana's final race at Movistar. Just the way he rode the Tour and especially stage 20 he has no business going to the la Vuelta.

Being out of town over the weekend I had not been able to keep up much with what was going on, but yes his not saying anything at all about his near miss does speak volumes. I think that stage may be even telling that the team has had enough of Quintana and Landa as well.

 

[tobydawq]

Seeing Valverde and Landa goofing off in videos and on the Paris podium tells me that they don't have any problems with each other.

 

[Koronin]

Re:

Seeing Valverde and Landa goofing off in videos and on the Paris podium tells me that they don't have any problems with each other.

Thanks. Yes, if they were goofing off on the Paris podium they're fine with each other.

 

[Blanco]

Re:

Seeing Valverde and Landa goofing off in videos and on the Paris podium tells me that they don't have any problems with each other.

Landa is ok guy, he's a true racer, They get along just fine on and off the bike. But Quintana is not like that, he acts like a primadona, like some kind of campionissimo, he rarely wants to help anybody. Visconti and couple of other guys spoke about him very badly. And now I think even Valverde had enough from him, so I think it will be very interesting who will ride Vuelta. I wouldn't put my money on Nairo...