Hockey

[marinoni]

I've lost interest in hockey in recent years. Despite the attempt to tighten up the officiating, the meatheads own this game, it's still all about who's the toughest. What really gets me is all the talk about how this is "good, old-school hockey". During the lockout a few years ago, CBC was showing old classic games from as far back as the late 50's. There was a tiny fraction of the hitting and holding that you see now. Absolutely none of this "finishing your checks" crap. Classless little scumbags like Carcillo wouldn't have made it past junior hockey. And no annoying scrums after every single whistle. I get a laugh how every once in a while the players forget their systems and just play. You can see the coaches freaking out. "Hey Guys, you were threatening to be entertaining there. Now shut it down, dump the puck in, cycle it endlessly and suck the life out of a once great sport." Oh, and RDV, I assume you're a Wild fan. Do people in Minny miss the old Northstars? Great jerseys and a goalie with one of the great names in sports history. Cesar Maniago!

 

[Anonymous]

I've lost interest in hockey in recent years. Despite the attempt to tighten up the officiating, the meatheads own this game, it's still all about who's the toughest. What really gets me is all the talk about how this is "good, old-school hockey". During the lockout a few years ago, CBC was showing old classic games from as far back as the late 50's. There was a tiny fraction of the hitting and holding that you see now. Absolutely none of this "finishing your checks" crap. Classless little scumbags like Carcillo wouldn't have made it past junior hockey. And no annoying scrums after every single whistle. I get a laugh how every once in a while the players forget their systems and just play. You can see the coaches freaking out. "Hey Guys, you were threatening to be entertaining there. Now shut it down, dump the puck in, cycle it endlessly and suck the life out of a once great sport." Oh, and RDV, I assume you're a Wild fan. Do people in Minny miss the old Northstars? Great jerseys and a goalie with one of the great names in sports history. Cesar Maniago!

Amen. I used to love the sport until it morphed into Pro Wrestling on ice, with sticks. Remember the old joke, "I went to a (add sport of choice) football gave last night. It got so violent a hockey grame broke out!"

 

[RDV4ROUBAIX]

Oh, and RDV, I assume you're a Wild fan. Do people in Minny miss the old Northstars? Great jerseys and a goalie with one of the great names in sports history. Cesar Maniago!

Yeah, we miss the Stars. Dino Ciccarelli moved up the street from me in when he started with the North Stars in the early 80's. I think he eventually got asked to leave the neighborhood because there were some complaints about him picking up his morning paper with his robe wide open, also streaking in his back yard for all the neighbors to see.

The most famous quote when the Stars departed from here;

"When [Norm Green] came here, he said, 'Only an idiot could lose money on hockey in Minnesota.' Well, I guess he proved that point."

As for the playoffs, and current hockey. Man, you guys are soft!!! If you think the "meatheads" rule the game now, which couldn't be further from the truth, take a look at some historical games from the 70's and you'll see that this era's violence is nothing compared to those days. The skill set of the players in this era is light years beyond those old times what you're talking about. As a spectator it's fun to watch, and I'm thoroughly enjoying these finals, thought the Hawks were going to sweep, but were all tied up.

 

[marinoni]

As for the playoffs, and current hockey. Man, you guys are soft!!! If you think the "meatheads" rule the game now, which couldn't be further from the truth, take a look at some historical games from the 70's and you'll see that this era's violence is nothing compared to those days. The skill set of the players in this era is light years beyond those old times what you're talking about. As a spectator it's fun to watch, and I'm thoroughly enjoying these finals, thought the Hawks were going to sweep, but were all tied up.

I respect your opinion but I do think the game, at least in the playoffs, is mostly about toughness and less about skill and creativity. I do like tough hockey, I am Canadian after all, but all I see is endless scrums, hits from behind, and guys going half the length of the ice to hit someone. If YOU take a look at some historical games from the 70's you'll see there wasn't nearly as much hitting from behind or going to ridiculous extremes to hit someone. Try finding a video of the '75 New Years eve game between Red Army and the Canadiens. Thats hockey the way it was meant to be played. There was a good reason for less hitting in that era: the shoulder and elbow pads in the 70's were awful. If a guy tried hitting someone the way you see it done today, he'd end up with a separated shoulder. For sure there was more fighting and stick work then but there was also more flow and excitement, less dump it in and cycle. You're right, the skill set today is vastly superior but then bike racers are fitter or at least better doped yet racing today often sucks.
One last thing, what I said about coaches freaking out when it gets exciting and toning it down, I've seen it happen and it stinks.
This, of course, is all just my opinion. I could just be full of s***.

 

[pedaling squares]

I have to disagree with some opinions. Today's game is far more about skill and speed than it has ever been. As much as I loved watching the Habs in the 70's, that era was about beating your opponent half to death if you couldn't catch him. And those fabulously talented Russians? Incredible players but some of the dirtiest stick artists I've seen. The 80's were more about speed but nothing like today. 25 years ago a 225 lb d-man was a monster but he could hardly skate. Now some forwards are 245 lbs and skate like the wind. The 90's were about clutching and grabbing and defensive systems. Speed and ingenuity were coached out of fashion.

The reason IMO why we're seeing so many players taking huge runs and half killing their opponent these days is not because their mindset has changed. It's because when a forward dumps the puck in to the offensive zone, one d-man has to go back to get it but the other d-man is no longer allowed to hold up the oncoming forward. Without that interference the forward is on the d-man too quickly and the poor guy gets crushed. We have much bigger, much fitter, much better skating players with more advanced equipment playing inside the same 200' X 85' cage, with new rules allowing them more freedom to move. The end of the equation is inevitable.

But the game is not ruled by the tough guys. Have you seen any fights in the playoffs this year? Are any tough guys even in the lineups? Have you seen any brawls in the past 25 years? Except in basebrawl where they charge the mound and hug each other, and maybe *****slap a fat old manager. The game is ruled today by guys like Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews, Kane, Richards, Carter, Malkin, Ovechkin etc. Guys with incredible skill. Having said all that, I sure love watching Pronger play in the playoffs. So skilled, so smart, and so mean. Facing him would be a painful experience.

 

[Anonymous]

I have to disagree with some opinions. Today's game is far more about skill and speed than it has ever been. As much as I loved watching the Habs in the 70's, that era was about beating your opponent half to death if you couldn't catch him. And those fabulously talented Russians? Incredible players but some of the dirtiest stick artists I've seen. The 80's were more about speed but nothing like today. 25 years ago a 225 lb d-man was a monster but he could hardly skate. Now some forwards are 245 lbs and skate like the wind. The 90's were about clutching and grabbing and defensive systems. Speed and ingenuity were coached out of fashion.

The reason IMO why we're seeing so many players taking huge runs and half killing their opponent these days is not because their mindset has changed. It's because when a forward dumps the puck in to the offensive zone, one d-man has to go back to get it but the other d-man is no longer allowed to hold up the oncoming forward. Without that interference the forward is on the d-man too quickly and the poor guy gets crushed. We have much bigger, much fitter, much better skating players with more advanced equipment playing inside the same 200' X 85' cage, with new rules allowing them more freedom to move. The end of the equation is inevitable.

But the game is not ruled by the tough guys. Have you seen any fights in the playoffs this year? Are any tough guys even in the lineups? Have you seen any brawls in the past 25 years? Except in basebrawl where they charge the mound and hug each other, and maybe *****slap a fat old manager. The game is ruled today by guys like Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews, Kane, Richards, Carter, Malkin, Ovechkin etc. Guys with incredible skill. Having said all that, I sure love watching Pronger play in the playoffs. So skilled, so smart, and so mean. Facing him would be a painful experience.

Sounds like they've found "The Secret" for massive bodies, like baseball, and football, and weightlifting. Do hockey forums have a clinic thread too?

 

[trompe le monde]

Hawks win! Hawks win!

I'm glad the Hawks won as I really find the Flyers to be one of the most obnoxious franchises in the NHL - I have nothing against Philadelphia the city though. But even more than that, it was a victory for those that favour an offensively minded, skill-based ethos. Of course to secure that you have to draft well and embrace a period of general suckitude in order to get high draft picks, but I digress.

Congrats to the Hawks, a well-deserved and long awaited Stanley Cup.

 

[quadsRme]

Hawks win! Hawks win!

I'm glad the Hawks won as I really find the Flyers to be one of the most obnoxious franchises in the NHL - I have nothing against Philadelphia the city though. But even more than that, it was a victory for those that favour an offensively minded, skill-based ethos. Of course to secure that you have to draft well and embrace a period of general suckitude in order to get high draft picks, but I digress.

Congrats to the Hawks, a well-deserved and long awaited Stanley Cup.

+1000 on that trompe le monde!!!!

I have been waiting anxiously for this celebration which is long over due!!

CHICAGO BLACKHAWKS STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS 2010 !!!!!

Yea Baby!!

 

[pedaling squares]

Sounds like they've found "The Secret" for massive bodies, like baseball, and football, and weightlifting. Do hockey forums have a clinic thread too?

Ha. No doubt there is a benefit to using HGH and stimulants, but I don't know about anabolics. I remember a defenceman coming to camp a few years ago after a summer of bulking up (considerably) by "hitting the weights." His massive upper body was surprisingly useless and his mobility was greatly affected. He was told to get in hockey shape or lose his job. Most players' workouts are designed to gain explosiveness, core strength, and flexibility in lieu of muscle mass. An enforcer (goon) named Tony Twist had a rapid weight gain that was attributed to anabolics and he was suddenly a monster at his job.

Congrats to the Blackhawks for a much deserved and entertaining cup win. Sure hope you can keep the core group together for a while, that is a great team to watch.

 

[Claudiu]

God forgive me, but i envy you guys so much! Such a great hockey you have there...From the country i come, at the ice-hockey we have, with about 4 ice rinks, 7 teams and about one hnudred players, i'm not even worthy to watch or post in thisd thread...

 

[Siriuscat]

Another thread I've missed....Leafs fan always have been. (I've played since i was 10, coached at club, national and international levels)

Predictions for the new season????

 

[pedaling squares]

Predictions for the new season????

That Vancouver and Washington will finally learn how to win in the playoffs. Sadly for you, the Maple Leafs will not.

 

[Siriuscat]

That Vancouver and Washington will finally learn how to win in the playoffs. Sadly for you, the Maple Leafs will not.

I always go on the basis of see what's happening at the end of November. Leafs will be closer to the playoffs this year, not a cup winning team, then again I don't think Canada has one at the moment. I can see a Hawks v Pens Final but who knows what will happen... Caps will continue to fall flat come April

 

[Anonymous]

New season starts tonight.

Game 1 at home, we're down 1 at the end of the 1st.

Hopefully it comes even in the second.

 

[palmerq]

That Vancouver and Washington will finally learn how to win in the playoffs. Sadly for you, the Maple Leafs will not.

It was going so well untill game 4.... 3-3 now going into tonights game and the canucks are on a 3 game losing streak, surely they can't blow it. I will have to stay up late to watch this(very late :S)

 

[Siriuscat]

Canucks are like a fish on a wet slab......choke choke choke. I don't know why the can't get through round 1. Detroit looked pretty ominous against not stunning opposition and Nashville are playing some damn good grinding hockey. In the east hmmm, Boston and Tampa most likely to join the Caps in round two Buffalo & Philly flip a coin Buffalo hopefully!!

 

[palmerq]

Boston v montreal is on first tonight I think I will watch this before the canucks, I heard these games have been quite good, I'll be supporting the canadians though :S

 

[fatandfast]

was at Rangers-Caps game 4. The air got let out of MSG as the Ranger defense stopped defending. Game 5 was a solo event as they got creamed. The goal they did get was with an empty net offense. Shame that the NHL would not let the Rangers have an additional forward all the time, the series long power play they needed

 

[the delgados]

Earlier someone asked if there was a clinic section on hockey forums.

No, there isn't. Fans of North American pro sports have their heads in the sand when it comes to doping. But that's in large part due to strong player unions and complicity amongst team owners.

Funny, not long ago I was listening to a sports radio call-in show in Canada (home of Ben Johnson) that asked folks if they thought athletes like Usain Bolt were clean.

Everyone who called in said yes.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I haven't read the entire thread, but to me hockey has become as exciting as it was in my youth. I'm not entirely sure what rule changes were made, but seeing teams unable to sit on leads has really increased the action and made games closer.

There's also a lot of parity in hockey, which is great to see. Plus all of these first round match-ups except Washington--NYR have been at least close.

Compared to this, the NBA sucks.

 

[pedaling squares]

The most relevant rule changes to the improved pace of the game were eliminating the red line, which allowed a pass to go directly from blue line to blue line; cracking down on interference calls that prevented players from building speed; and making a team that iced the puck pay a penalty by keeping the same tired players on the ice for the ensuing face-off in their zone.

Now you see players leave their defensive zone sooner to catch a stretch pass, maintain speed throughout the neutral zone, and you don't see teams trapped in their own end just shoot the puck down the ice without penalty.

HUGE monkey off the Canucks back, they really dominated the last two games despite the close results. Now can they adjust to the toughness and tight checking of the Predators?

 

[palmerq]

Great work from the canucks I thought they would fall apart completely in overtime especially as they got a penalty soon after the restart, good goal to win it(even if chicago helped), I didn't watch nashville much this season, the time I did detroit beat em quite easily so I think the canucks will win of course.. No idea how good the sharks or red wings are this season, I know they are usually good every season but I think maybe they are both not at their bests so the canucks can be best of the west I think. or they could easily lose v nashville :S

 

[pedaling squares]

Detroit doesn't have the depth of years past, but they have whatever it is that champions have that makes them so hard to kill. They will be tough.

 

[jobiwan]

Nashville's gonna make it a tough one for the Canucks, I hope the Preds win because that's my home team!!!

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Great analysis Squares. The rule changes definitely worked for the better, way better.