Hot racing coming up in Australia

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Actually, there can be loads of doubt.

Exactly ...some posters on here decide something is true then they spin the facts as evidence

Porte was the second best climber in the Tour 2016. He is also a far better TTer than Chaves, Mollema & both Yates

Chaves can still get better and is a great talent but as far as climbing in GTs I donlt think he is better than Porte . Porte has had problems and mechanicals & crashes etc. while Chaves has has been consistent but better climber ...no

In all GTs there is luck ...just ask Nibali and sometimes like Porte has been you can be on the wrong end

I think Porte is more relaxed and confident and if he can keep form till July he is for me the only rider (bar Quintana dpendent on post Giro form) who can challenge Froome on the climbs

What a load of rubbish. Porte is going to be 32 in a couple of weeks and has never finished on a GT podium. For a supposed GC rider, he's got an appalling record in GTs. Nothing he has done so far this season suggests that is going to change.

Chaves already achieved way more last season than Porte has done in his whole career in GTs. Porte is like a slightly better version of Spilak or Costa. Not fit to be mentioned alongside Quintana, Froome, Nibali or even Chaves as a GC contender in the big races.

C'mon, Porte has already had a TdF podium performance last year. Without losing almost 2 minutes to a puncture he finishes 2nd, so that "never finished on a GT podium" doesn't mean much. And let's not forget that Porte's spent the majority of his GTs working for Froome and Contador.

Barring a major form drop from Froome, in the next 1-2 years, the only guys I'd see as having any real chance of really contending with him in a GT are Nairo, Contador, Porte, and maybe Chaves. Chaves because he appears to be on an upward trajectory. There are other guys with better GT résumés than some of those guys but I don't see them able to compete with Froome.

And so it starts again for another year. One of the names on that list clearly doesn't belong there. There are at least ten riders more likely to win a GT this year than Porte.

And none of them are peaking in January.

Contador has not made a Tour podium since 2010 but some people keep pushing him as a possible winner. Bike fans will be bike fans. Porte's ride in 2016 was full of merit and there is no reason to think he can't do better in 2017 now that there is no uncertainty about the team leader role.

 

[Jancouver]

Re: Re:

Actually, there can be loads of doubt.

Exactly ...some posters on here decide something is true then they spin the facts as evidence

Porte was the second best climber in the Tour 2016. He is also a far better TTer than Chaves, Mollema & both Yates

Chaves can still get better and is a great talent but as far as climbing in GTs I donlt think he is better than Porte . Porte has had problems and mechanicals & crashes etc. while Chaves has has been consistent but better climber ...no

In all GTs there is luck ...just ask Nibali and sometimes like Porte has been you can be on the wrong end

I think Porte is more relaxed and confident and if he can keep form till July he is for me the only rider (bar Quintana dpendent on post Giro form) who can challenge Froome on the climbs

What a load of rubbish. Porte is going to be 32 in a couple of weeks and has never finished on a GT podium. For a supposed GC rider, he's got an appalling record in GTs. Nothing he has done so far this season suggests that is going to change.

Chaves already achieved way more last season than Porte has done in his whole career in GTs. Porte is like a slightly better version of Spilak or Costa. Not fit to be mentioned alongside Quintana, Froome, Nibali or even Chaves as a GC contender in the big races.

C'mon, Porte has already had a TdF podium performance last year. Without losing almost 2 minutes to a puncture he finishes 2nd, so that "never finished on a GT podium" doesn't mean much. And let's not forget that Porte's spent the majority of his GTs working for Froome and Contador.

Barring a major form drop from Froome, in the next 1-2 years, the only guys I'd see as having any real chance of really contending with him in a GT are Nairo, Contador, Porte, and maybe Chaves. Chaves because he appears to be on an upward trajectory. There are other guys with better GT résumés than some of those guys but I don't see them able to compete with Froome.

And so it starts again for another year. One of the names on that list clearly doesn't belong there. There are at least ten riders more likely to win a GT this year than Porte.

And none of them are peaking in January.

Contador has not made a Tour podium since 2010 but some people keep pushing him as a possible winner. Bike fans will be bike fans. Porte's ride in 2016 was full of merit and there is no reason to think he can't do better in 2017 now that there is no uncertainty about the team leader role.

I agree and Oleg Tinkov was not joking when he said that Contador will never win another GT.

 

[Night Rider]

Re: Re:

What a load of rubbish. Porte is going to be 32 in a couple of weeks and has never finished on a GT podium. For a supposed GC rider, he's got an appalling record in GTs. Nothing he has done so far this season suggests that is going to change.

Chaves already achieved way more last season than Porte has done in his whole career in GTs. Porte is like a slightly better version of Spilak or Costa. Not fit to be mentioned alongside Quintana, Froome, Nibali or even Chaves as a GC contender in the big races.

Porte has twice left Quintana and the entire GC field but Froome behind at the most crucial time. He has simply shown a much, much higher ceiling than any Spilak, Costa, Nibali or Chaves.

The problem for LRP is he can't string those moments together for 3 weeks, that's why he shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Nibali or Chaves when talking about future GT wins.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

Exactly ...some posters on here decide something is true then they spin the facts as evidence

Porte was the second best climber in the Tour 2016. He is also a far better TTer than Chaves, Mollema & both Yates

Chaves can still get better and is a great talent but as far as climbing in GTs I donlt think he is better than Porte . Porte has had problems and mechanicals & crashes etc. while Chaves has has been consistent but better climber ...no

In all GTs there is luck ...just ask Nibali and sometimes like Porte has been you can be on the wrong end

I think Porte is more relaxed and confident and if he can keep form till July he is for me the only rider (bar Quintana dpendent on post Giro form) who can challenge Froome on the climbs

What a load of rubbish. Porte is going to be 32 in a couple of weeks and has never finished on a GT podium. For a supposed GC rider, he's got an appalling record in GTs. Nothing he has done so far this season suggests that is going to change.

Chaves already achieved way more last season than Porte has done in his whole career in GTs. Porte is like a slightly better version of Spilak or Costa. Not fit to be mentioned alongside Quintana, Froome, Nibali or even Chaves as a GC contender in the big races.

C'mon, Porte has already had a TdF podium performance last year. Without losing almost 2 minutes to a puncture he finishes 2nd, so that "never finished on a GT podium" doesn't mean much. And let's not forget that Porte's spent the majority of his GTs working for Froome and Contador.

Barring a major form drop from Froome, in the next 1-2 years, the only guys I'd see as having any real chance of really contending with him in a GT are Nairo, Contador, Porte, and maybe Chaves. Chaves because he appears to be on an upward trajectory. There are other guys with better GT résumés than some of those guys but I don't see them able to compete with Froome.

And so it starts again for another year. One of the names on that list clearly doesn't belong there. There are at least ten riders more likely to win a GT this year than Porte.

And none of them are peaking in January.

Contador has not made a Tour podium since 2010 but some people keep pushing him as a possible winner. Bike fans will be bike fans. Porte's ride in 2016 was full of merit and there is no reason to think he can't do better in 2017 now that there is no uncertainty about the team leader role.[/quote]
Call me crazy but winning two Vueltas and a Giro since 2012 might have something to do with that...

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

Actually, there can be loads of doubt.

Exactly ...some posters on here decide something is true then they spin the facts as evidence

Porte was the second best climber in the Tour 2016. He is also a far better TTer than Chaves, Mollema & both Yates

Chaves can still get better and is a great talent but as far as climbing in GTs I donlt think he is better than Porte . Porte has had problems and mechanicals & crashes etc. while Chaves has has been consistent but better climber ...no

In all GTs there is luck ...just ask Nibali and sometimes like Porte has been you can be on the wrong end

I think Porte is more relaxed and confident and if he can keep form till July he is for me the only rider (bar Quintana dpendent on post Giro form) who can challenge Froome on the climbs

What a load of rubbish. Porte is going to be 32 in a couple of weeks and has never finished on a GT podium. For a supposed GC rider, he's got an appalling record in GTs. Nothing he has done so far this season suggests that is going to change.

Chaves already achieved way more last season than Porte has done in his whole career in GTs. Porte is like a slightly better version of Spilak or Costa. Not fit to be mentioned alongside Quintana, Froome, Nibali or even Chaves as a GC contender in the big races.

No you are talking rubbish
As I said Porte showed at Tour 2016 he was the 2nd best climber ...He has a mechanical but would have come 2nd....His results at GTs have to be measured both by his mechanicals but also because he spent the years before riding as a Domestique for Froome and Wiggins

I will re-iterate my point ...Porte is a better climber than Chaves ...Chaves rade againt a lesser field at the Giro and against a more tired field at the Vuelta. I htink Chaves will get better but at the moment only Porte and Quintana can challenge Froome

 

[hfer07]

I hate the new Astana kit !!! looks so dull!!

 

[claude cat]

Ewan 4/4

 

[Jancouver]

6 Stages = 6 wins for Aus
Overall win for Aus
4 Aus riders in top 6

definitely fair event and a well-deserved boat load of WT/UCI points for Australia

Dear UCI, please cancel this sh*t-show. It's not funny anymore

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Re: Re:

Moan moan moan....nothing but moaners on here...If the race is so bad go to bed

I know right? Even the Tour of Beijing didn't get panned like this race does. I guess that it's because the TDU is financially healthy with very good crowds.

Not sure being essentially a government event is 'financially healthy' although I guess it is universally supported in SA so that will never change.

The balance sheet of the title sponsor though!

The race has been turning a tidy profit since it's inception. It also attracts huge crowds to local businesses. How's that not financially healthy?

It's only healthy as long as the SA govt keeps sponsoring it. This race, like almost all races around the world, are heavily reliant on govt/taxpayer money to survive.

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Re:

I dont know if its much different as Froome rides the Arabian races which are only a couple weeks later and often does well on the mountains of Oman.

Froome won the Sun Tour last year. Not on peak form though and of course the competition isn't quite the same.

 

[RedheadDane]

Okay, now I'm confused.
If Haas and McCarthy had the exact same time (after the bonus sprint), and Haas had placed better than McCarthy on four stages, then how come McCarthy got ahead of Haas and onto the podium? Can't be because of the points competition either, because Haas is - obviously - ahead of McCarthy there too...

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

I agree. It's good for an early season race. And that's where it ends. This race has no business giving out that many WT points, if at all. Only Aussies remotely target it, it has no variety, and it has little history. So the question why this is WT boils down to the one reason the UCI ever do anything. Money.

This is the bit I don't get. If the race provides so many cheap easy points, then why on earth do not more riders and teams take advantage of that? Seems a perfect opportunity to rack up points. No one else to blame if the Aussies clean up the points on offer. Seems a smart move for a pro to rack up a lot of WT points and increase their market value.

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Re: Re:

With all of the whining on this thread why bother watching at all if it's that bad ? The same things are said year after year. Everyone knows what sort of race it is, Go watch replays if you think the whole thing is pointless. Australians enjoy it for what it is. It's too hot, too many UCI points, not enough climbs. Tune in for the Cadel Evans race for more of the same : it's not hard enough, it's too short. The answer is simple : click fade to black.

Hahaha! So true!

The one race that should get more coverage and surely nobody could complain about the parcours over the last few years in the Sun Tour, the scenery is far more interesting than what we have at the TDU and the course design has really stepped up but unfortunately we won't get anywhere near the same coverage of it.

The trouble is they have shortened the Sun Tour. Yes it has a better course than the TDU but it used to be much longer. Froome probably would not have ridden the old style Sun Tour so early in the season. The old Commonwealth Bank Tour was a good race as well once they started going into the Hunter Valley and using some of the decent climbs in the Illawarra, Southern Highlands and the South Coast. If they cut out some of the criteriums that would have been a very good race but it was a logistical nightmare traveling down the east coast of Australia and causing some major traffic disruptions on roads that could not be avoided. Between Sydney Canberra, Wollongong and Nowra there are plenty of decent climbs they could use in a stage race. There would be no need to start on the north coast. If they found sponsors I'm sure they could design a decent one week long race maybe starting in Sydney and finishing in Canberra or vice versa.

With the NSW coastal freeway almost complete, there are many more potential race stage routes that could avoid traffic issues. I reckon I could come up with a cracking race route that would work. But you'd need many $millions to run such a race, and consider that in NSW we have one of the most anti-cycling governments in the world with one of the most openly hostile to cycling roads ministers in the world.

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Re: Re:

With all of the whining on this thread why bother watching at all if it's that bad ? The same things are said year after year. Everyone knows what sort of race it is, Go watch replays if you think the whole thing is pointless. Australians enjoy it for what it is. It's too hot, too many UCI points, not enough climbs. Tune in for the Cadel Evans race for more of the same : it's not hard enough, it's too short. The answer is simple : click fade to black.

Hahaha! So true!

The one race that should get more coverage and surely nobody could complain about the parcours over the last few years in the Sun Tour, the scenery is far more interesting than what we have at the TDU and the course design has really stepped up but unfortunately we won't get anywhere near the same coverage of it.

The trouble is they have shortened the Sun Tour. Yes it has a better course than the TDU but it used to be much longer. Froome probably would not have ridden the old style Sun Tour so early in the season. The old Commonwealth Bank Tour was a good race as well once they started going into the Hunter Valley and using some of the decent climbs in the Illawarra, Southern Highlands and the South Coast. If they cut out some of the criteriums that would have been a very good race but it was a logistical nightmare traveling down the east coast of Australia and causing some major traffic disruptions on roads that could not be avoided. Between Sydney Canberra, Wollongong and Nowra there are plenty of decent climbs they could use in a stage race. There would be no need to start on the north coast. If they found sponsors I'm sure they could design a decent one week long race maybe starting in Sydney and finishing in Canberra or vice versa.

I think its inevitable it will move back east eventually.
South Australia is bankrupt and people are leaving the place in their droves hence why the local govt is desperate for tourism in Australia's least interesting region.

They must be paying that fat sunburnt guy a lot who is doing the presenting on Channel 9 to say everything is beautiful. :lol: He sounds like such an insincere pitch man.

Typical front man. He knows nothing about the sport and it's just his job to talk for the public not cycling fans. Too bad SBS lost the contract for the race as the quality of the presentation dipped after it left SBS. The first half hour of every stage is tourism promotion which they keep coming back to through the stage.

SBS had P&P, all the tourism placements, ads and Tomalaris. Don't really see where it was better. At least being on Ch9 the sport of road cycling reaches a much bigger lay audience than it ever would on SBS.

 

[sir fly]

Re:

Okay, now I'm confused.
If Haas and McCarthy had the exact same time (after the bonus sprint), and Haas had placed better than McCarthy on four stages, then how come McCarthy got ahead of Haas and onto the podium? Can't be because of the points competition either, because Haas is - obviously - ahead of McCarthy there too...

And it can't be that fractions have decided, since there was no tt.
Must be a mistake.

Overall impression about the 6 stages - according to vast expectations.
Maybe too dominant for the first race (in both fields).

 

[Lupi33x]

Re: Re:

Hahaha! So true!

The one race that should get more coverage and surely nobody could complain about the parcours over the last few years in the Sun Tour, the scenery is far more interesting than what we have at the TDU and the course design has really stepped up but unfortunately we won't get anywhere near the same coverage of it.

The trouble is they have shortened the Sun Tour. Yes it has a better course than the TDU but it used to be much longer. Froome probably would not have ridden the old style Sun Tour so early in the season. The old Commonwealth Bank Tour was a good race as well once they started going into the Hunter Valley and using some of the decent climbs in the Illawarra, Southern Highlands and the South Coast. If they cut out some of the criteriums that would have been a very good race but it was a logistical nightmare traveling down the east coast of Australia and causing some major traffic disruptions on roads that could not be avoided. Between Sydney Canberra, Wollongong and Nowra there are plenty of decent climbs they could use in a stage race. There would be no need to start on the north coast. If they found sponsors I'm sure they could design a decent one week long race maybe starting in Sydney and finishing in Canberra or vice versa.

I think its inevitable it will move back east eventually.
South Australia is bankrupt and people are leaving the place in their droves hence why the local govt is desperate for tourism in Australia's least interesting region.

They must be paying that fat sunburnt guy a lot who is doing the presenting on Channel 9 to say everything is beautiful. :lol: He sounds like such an insincere pitch man.

Typical front man. He knows nothing about the sport and it's just his job to talk for the public not cycling fans. Too bad SBS lost the contract for the race as the quality of the presentation dipped after it left SBS. The first half hour of every stage is tourism promotion which they keep coming back to through the stage.

SBS had P&P, all the tourism placements, ads and Tomalaris. Don't really see where it was better. At least being on Ch9 the sport of road cycling reaches a much bigger lay audience than it ever would on SBS.

At least Tomalaris didnt try to convince us the scenery was the most beautiful thing he'd ever seen (when clearly it isnt to anyone)

There was a clear delineation between tourism promotions and the persistent native advertising that this Channel 9 guy does.

 

[Ferminal]

Not sure about this Porte Chaves discussion...

Chaves got results in big occasions last year and Porte did not, Chaves by default has a better GT record.

It is not inconsistent with the above to say that Porte would win comfortably if both turned up to a GT for three weeks in their best shape and held it throughout. That may be too theoretical to be of any use though, and it is appropriate to discount Porte based on his record of not showing up.

 

[Ferminal]

Re: Re:

Okay, now I'm confused.
If Haas and McCarthy had the exact same time (after the bonus sprint), and Haas had placed better than McCarthy on four stages, then how come McCarthy got ahead of Haas and onto the podium? Can't be because of the points competition either, because Haas is - obviously - ahead of McCarthy there too...

And it can't be that fractions have decided, since there was no tt.
Must be a mistake.

First countback for GC is always super points or lowest average placing.

McCarthy = 59
Haas = 63

Next tiebreaker is highest placing in a stage iirc.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Re:

Ewan 4/4

Gotta be a record in this race methinks (?).

Congrats to LRP and Ewan.

 

[Ferminal]

Think Greipel and Davis may have managed it?

All Australian stage winners and GC too, Lord Unzue please save us.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Speaking of Gorilla. He would have been a great addition to the race this year.
Not sure anyone else could have come close to Porte when hes in this type of form.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

The sprint:

https://youtu.be/aJEVXvEsei0

Pretty impressive.

 

[Alexandre B.]

That was a pretty dull edition of the race, I must say. It's sad they get rid of Montacute before Campbelltown and the Stirling finish, there was not enough variety.

Ultimately it's always sad to see this race delivering as many points as most prestigious one-week races, but that's UCI's problem. The dullness of this edition is Turtur's one.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

SBS had P&P, all the tourism placements, ads and Tomalaris. Don't really see where it was better. At least being on Ch9 the sport of road cycling reaches a much bigger lay audience than it ever would on SBS.[/quote]

Maybe I'm getting old I suppose it was similar in the presentation but even the Tour of Oman and such races are plugging the tourism side of things as well. I suppose for the smaller races it is more important but with 10 kms to go I don't want to see an ad break I want to see racing. But the idea of missing those valuable insights from Tomo when the race was on SBS, well it's horrible to think about ! Actually Tomo is not as bad as he used to be but every so often he has a brain fade and it seems like he is on his first Tour again. I still like the fact that SBS has the bulk of Australian cycling telecasts. Channel Nine should do what they are best at, presenting those incredibly interesting reality TV programs ! If you like to cook, date,dance and renovate then you are in hog heaven on Channel Nine ! Needless to say I watch more SBS.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Re:

The sprint:

https://youtu.be/aJEVXvEsei0

Pretty impressive.

Awful camera work!