Is Armstrong about to admit

[Digger]

Fixed it. It's interesting that the guy they're defending is guilty of the worst accusations he can think up for someone else.

I still don't see the orchestration, but you guys could be right. After Floyd's e-mails were leaked initially, and he'd done a couple of interviews, cycling publications started talking to experts asking what might be happening. I posted the Velonews article from May yesterday, which was one of the places where people were talking about the False Claims Act.
http://velonews.competitor.com/2010...-—-and-rewarded-—-by-whistleblower-law_118741

On June 7th it was announced that Landis had hired Greg LeMond's legal team from the Trek lawsuit. Prior to that he was taking heat from a lot of sources, including a Cease & Desist letter from Verbruggen.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...uscle_in_face_potential_legal_challenges.html

I'm guessing that once that team started advising him, and various legal experts had suggested in cycling and mainstream press that the whistle blower lawsuit might be a viable option, that they decided to go for it.

He said initially that he came forward at the time that he did because the Statute Of Limitations would start to be up for some of his activities, and it would be senseless (my word) to step up after he'd legally gotten away with some things. He was trying to get some of the guys he named immunity when everything went public. Then he had to spend loads of time with the investigators, talk to Ashenden and Catlin, deal with the Tour Of California, etc., then catch his breath and get the new lawyers. They had to file the lawsuit, and the stuff last night couldn't leak until everyone named had been served. I see it as a natural progression of two different things.

It would be interesting to know how and when the defendants were notified. If Bruyneel or Knaggs or Stapleton was served first, for instance, how tough would the other guys have been to track down?

Guys, I stand to be corrected here, but are we jumping ahead here with the latest news, on Floyd's suing the defendants? Because from what news sources say, the gvnt is still only considering its options. It would be brilliant if they did become involved however.

 

[Tubeless]

@Tubeless - Landis is showing a sophistication in his approach and tactics that is blindsiding his detractors. I can only imagine what the next move will be. If the adversary is wounded or stunned, go for the kill, so to speak. I agree with your post 100%. So far, and in hindsight, none of this looks random or to chance. Quite the contrary, this appears to be orchestrated and deliberate, with a very real focus on escalating pressure in sudden and dramatic ways.

We are likely to learn the sequence of events in the near future but here's my guess. Landis was initially trying to get US Cycling and USADA to take action and wasn't getting very far. Someone leaked the emails to the press and suddenly the case attracted interest from several sources. Unbeknownst to Landis, there was already an existing FDA investigation into the Rock Racing team, and Landis got a surprise phone call from Novitzky. He also hooked up with Greg Lemond who arranged Landis to meet with the legal team that had helped Greg in the Trek case.

We were wondering last spring how Landis could afford the kind of legal team he ended up with - and whether Lemond was helping Landis out of his own pocket. It's now easy to see that the lawyers quickly discovered that Landis has a case for a federal false claims act as a whistleblower - which the lawyers could take on as a contingency case since the award could be significant. They decided to file quickly, in part because the statue of limitations was running out, and in part to get access to relevant documents (USPS contract with Tailwind Sports) to confirm their case.

Landis was probably hopeful but could not count on the criminal track move forward with same level of certainty. But the dual track likely helped both - Landis' lawyers may have had access to the USPS contract first which they would have shared with the FDA investigators. As the case moved along, the cooperation increased.

So in the timeline, I'd doubt anyone back in April could have planned this out. It was more likely a lucky sequence of events that indeed required some smart and well-connected lawyers to help connect the dots. You can't tell the feds what to do, but since the facts were on Landis' side and the denials so adamant and personal from Armstrong, this one must have come across to Novitzky like showing a red cloth to an already fighting bull.

And I'd stress the importance of the PR coverage here - what gets written in the press does affect politicians and bureacrats who could affect the course of the criminal track. It also helped shift public opinion and provided cover for many sitting on the fence to come forward and say what they know. The parallel fraud case works well for Novitzky as it shifts the blame game played by Armstrong's team from "waste of taxpayer dollars" to "recovery of taxpayer dollars".

The whistleblower story is front page news in today's online edition of WSJ.

 

[Colm.Murphy]

Let's not forget Landis' cryptic, early season twitter about some type of huge idea, or something to that effect.

From the time before the emails leaked, the emails that released on RS team site paint a picture of Landis already down the road in his effort to inform USADA and the Feds. Now, any FDA investigation into Ball, Rock or other, surely picked up steam once Landis divulged to them his experiences with USPS and doping. Not a shock that the Feds would expand the scope of their inquiry to examine the whole of it all.

What would be the most dramatic timing for all of this to occur? With the Tour of California happening and the chief "suspects" in local proximity to himself and the investigator already snooping Ball and Rock, it an easy link.

The publicity of LA racing again, Tour de France hype, new sponsor, same cast of characters in the background, same air of invulnerability....all come crashing down, literally crashing into the pavement, over and over and over, from May to end of July.

Could Landis reasonably expect the Feds to want to look into Lance? Yes. Of course he could presume they (and USADA, who coincidentally had been targeting him for years) would pick up the cause.

Could Landis reasonably expect that once this information became public that the Fed Govt would want to get to the bottom of what transpired during their time sponsoring Lance and company? Sure, any quick look into whistle blower cases shows the govt has a distinct penchant for hammering those who rip them off. Paired with the FDA criminal inquiry, it is pretty easy to see that coordinating these, form a timing perspective, would be easy and smart.

Pair all of this with Landis' mentions of "doing it now, or never doing it" as it applies to Statute of Lim's, and it should be quite convincing that this is not some stumbling along, one item to the next. I give credit to Landis for realizing that restoring his dignity and integrity could happen and he took the best and smartest steps to do it at the highest legal level.

If anything, the underestimation of Landis by so many could be the greatest single thing leading to their undoing.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Watch Out

Landis was initially trying to get US Cycling and USADA to take action and wasn't getting very far

There was no way in H-E-Double-Hockey-Sticks USAC was going to do ANYTHING to impune team Pharmstrong. No way. The same people behind Pharmstrong run USAC. Armstrong is on the board of directors for Weisel's man-crush club, the USA Cycling Development Foundation.

Lastly, as much as it is raining cats and dogs for Pharmstrong, remember he's hired someone to sell his myth to Congress. Congress controls Law Enforcement's budget. This sets up a scenario where the low-end of law enforcement may have a solid case, but can't prosecute because their budget would get slashed. That's how Washington works. It's well documented and hardly unique to Pharmstrong's situation.

 

[Benotti69]

Let's not forget Landis' cryptic, early season twitter about some type of huge idea, or something to that effect.

From the time before the emails leaked, the emails that released on RS team site paint a picture of Landis already down the road in his effort to inform USADA and the Feds. Now, any FDA investigation into Ball, Rock or other, surely picked up steam once Landis divulged to them his experiences with USPS and doping. Not a shock that the Feds would expand the scope of their inquiry to examine the whole of it all.

What would be the most dramatic timing for all of this to occur? With the Tour of California happening and the chief "suspects" in local proximity to himself and the investigator already snooping Ball and Rock, it an easy link.

The publicity of LA racing again, Tour de France hype, new sponsor, same cast of characters in the background, same air of invulnerability....all come crashing down, literally crashing into the pavement, over and over and over, from May to end of July.

Could Landis reasonably expect the Feds to want to look into Lance? Yes. Of course he could presume they (and USADA, who coincidentally had been targeting him for years) would pick up the cause.

Could Landis reasonably expect that once this information became public that the Fed Govt would want to get to the bottom of what transpired during their time sponsoring Lance and company? Sure, any quick look into whistle blower cases shows the govt has a distinct penchant for hammering those who rip them off. Paired with the FDA criminal inquiry, it is pretty easy to see that coordinating these, form a timing perspective, would be easy and smart.

Pair all of this with Landis' mentions of "doing it now, or never doing it" as it applies to Statute of Lim's, and it should be quite convincing that this is not some stumbling along, one item to the next. I give credit to Landis for realizing that restoring his dignity and integrity could happen and he took the best and smartest steps to do it at the highest legal level.

If anything, the underestimation of Landis by so many could be the greatest single thing leading to their undoing.

This is quite amazing when looked at from LA/Hog/Weisel's side of the fence how this country Mennonite bumpkin got the drop on them, they must be kicking themselves.

But well done Floyd for showing up the Omerta for what it is, an extremely selfish an unwelcoming place but for the chosen few.

 

[ChrisE]

This is quite amazing when looked at from LA/Hog/Weisel's side of the fence how this country Mennonite bumpkin got the drop on them, they must be kicking themselves.

But well done Floyd for showing up the Omerta for what it is, an extremely selfish an unwelcoming place but for the chosen few.

They were arrogant. As somebody said on another thread if they would have hired him on RS then this wouldn't have happened.

Racing for RS vs your "conscience". We know what trumps what.

 

[Benotti69]

They were arrogant. As somebody said on another thread if they would have hired him on RS then this wouldn't have happened.

Racing for RS vs your "conscience". We know what trumps what.

coke, marijuana and a strip club i believe....

 

[wiggintona]

what factual articles?

the hog. i couldn't agree more. everyone should read theswordsan's link.

if i'm recalling all the factual articles about the matter including the wsj and nyt etc, this one contains the most damaging information for mr armstrong.

it turns out, landis was 'on the attack' all along.

I haven't heard of any facts, only the opinions of a few biased sources. Landis cannot be viewed as a reliable source. No jury could believe him.
As far as Armstrongs atty's meeting with Justice Dept. If any of you have been an innocent party in a lawsuit you will know that it is just as expensive to defend yourself whether innocent or guilty, and your attorney should meet with the opposition to try and mitigate the costs. The government should not pursue this with taxpayer money unless they have some hard evidence(photos, logs,letters,audio tapes). Landis is pursuing this for money. The blackmail approach failed so now he tries the whistleblower suit.

 

[jimmypop]

I haven't heard of any facts, only the opinions of a few biased sources. Landis cannot be viewed as a reliable source. No jury could believe him.
As far as Armstrongs atty's meeting with Justice Dept. If any of you have been an innocent party in a lawsuit you will know that it is just as expensive to defend yourself whether innocent or guilty, and your attorney should meet with the opposition to try and mitigate the costs. The government should not pursue this with taxpayer money unless they have some hard evidence(photos, logs,letters,audio tapes). Landis is pursuing this for money. The blackmail approach failed so now he tries the whistleblower suit.

I guess they'll need to pay you a bit more to post something remotely authentic? This is so..... April. Step it up, guys! Pay for the quality, not per post!

 

[Tubeless]

I haven't heard of any facts, only the opinions of a few biased sources. Landis cannot be viewed as a reliable source. No jury could believe him.
As far as Armstrongs atty's meeting with Justice Dept. If any of you have been an innocent party in a lawsuit you will know that it is just as expensive to defend yourself whether innocent or guilty, and your attorney should meet with the opposition to try and mitigate the costs. The government should not pursue this with taxpayer money unless they have some hard evidence(photos, logs,letters,audio tapes). Landis is pursuing this for money. The blackmail approach failed so now he tries the whistleblower suit.

Couple of points:

1. You may want to do a bit more reading first, there are several cooperating witnesses so Landis is not alone.

2. The government would join the whistlerblower suit to RECOVER taxpayer monies. You can make the case about wasting taxpayer monies for the criminal investigation - here that argument won't work.

3. If Landis is pursuing this for money, he'd have to first win the case to collect anything, right?

4. If Landis did in fact try to blackmail someone, why is there no case (civil or criminal) about that accusation? Is it because the target(s) of the blackmail concluded they don't have a case?

 

[thehog]

This is quite amazing when looked at from LA/Hog/Weisel's side of the fence how this country Mennonite bumpkin got the drop on them, they must be kicking themselves.

But well done Floyd for showing up the Omerta for what it is, an extremely selfish an unwelcoming place but for the chosen few.

At the time if the ToC the Hog and Armstrong just pushed aside the Landis claims. They appeared confident that the general public and the media would just brush Landis aside. The UCI came out and said Landis is a tool and Lance is the greatest. All seemed good. It was there credibility v Landis and Lance liked his credibility. Hog and Lance seemed very confident as they spoke to the press at ToC.

When they published the Landis emails on the Radioshack website I honestly think they thought this would be easy and Landis would just fall away in shame.

But the Landis strategy was well planned and thought through.

Landis has one thing on his side that Armstrong doesn't. And that's the truth. He can't lose.

 

[Barrus]

I'm getting really annoyed at the allegations of blackmail. If you state this as a fact you'd better have something to base this assertion up, other than your presumption. Look I myself believe it is a likely thing to have happened, however I have not seen a shred of proof

@ thehog, I see some more reasons why Landis has the upper hand. Firstly he has nothing to lose, nothing at all. Nothing that Lance can do or say will financially hurt Landis, not can it hurt his reputation, this means that Lance his normal tactics don't work. The second is the fact that Landis and the general media are the acting party, and as Lance does not know what info they have, nor what they'll print there is no way he can act with pre-emptive media campaign, as he does not know what he needs to target. These two factors mean that Lance his normal approach does not work and as such already appears to be on the ropes

 

[bianchigirl]

Those Public Strategies sound bites are getting so old and tired - let alone unconvincing.

Ever heard of the scream test? It's what they use when announcing legislation designed to hit certain interests e.g. the smoking lobby to test just how much it hits them where it hurts. For example, in the UK there are plans to ban people smoking in their cars - such a load of hollering about civil liberties and the right to choose that the scream test was well and truly passed. Seems to me that the Fabricator, the Height of ****e, has passed with flying colours. This has team Armstrong rattled and they're screaming their heads off.

 

[TexPat]

At the time if the ToC the Hog and Armstrong just pushed aside the Landis claims. They appeared confident that the general public and the media would just brush Landis aside. The UCI came out and said Landis is a tool and Lance is the greatest. All seemed good. It was there credibility v Landis and Lance liked his credibility. Hog and Lance seemed very confident as they spoke to the press at ToC.

When they published the Landis emails on the Radioshack website I honestly think they thought this would be easy and Landis would just fall away in shame.

But the Landis strategy was well planned and thought through.

Landis has one thing on his side that Armstrong doesn't. And that's the truth. He can't lose.

That's what I thought at the time.
I certainly don't want to take the wind from your sails, but I will remain skeptical. For all of its purported beauty, the system of justice in the US is deeply flawed, especially when it comes to prosecuting cases against the well-heeled, wealthy and well-connected. Of course, I'm hopeful.

 

[theswordsman]

That's what I thought at the time.
I certainly don't want to take the wind from your sails, but I will remain skeptical. For all of it's purported beauty, the system of justice in the US is deeply flawed, especially when it comes to prosecuting cases against the well-heeled, wealthy and well-connected. Of course, I'm hopeful.

Hopefully this time it works. If the Feds do pursue the lawsuit, Novitsky keeps investigating, and the grand jury works, this has a lot more gravitas than the civil cases in the past. Now that some people are willing to break omerta, others will be compelled to do so. Hopefully international agencies are pursuing investigations of their own. The stories of wrongdoing are reaching a lot of people with at best a passing interest in cycling. I have hopes that the sport will be cleaner because of this process, and that all the people who have been wronged, maligned, bullied or threatened in the past will be avenged and vindicated. Godspeed.

 

[Bike Opera]

This is quite amazing when looked at from LA/Hog/Weisel's side of the fence how this country Mennonite bumpkin got the drop on them, they must be kicking themselves.

But well done Floyd for showing up the Omerta for what it is, an extremely selfish an unwelcoming place but for the chosen few.

Lance and company wouldn't be having such a downer of a summer had Bruyneel replied yes to Floyd's "blackmail" email back in Sep 09 --"I'd like to know if there is any possibility of riding with you guys next year. Hope you are well. Thanks. Floyd." Instead Hog turned him away because it would be a bad PR move...

Lance has been completely checkmated by Landis. Like Floyd, the "seven-time Tour de France champion" will soon need to get used to seeing his name permanently preceded by the word "disgraced".

 

[oldschoolnik]

That's what I thought at the time.
I certainly don't want to take the wind from your sails, but I will remain skeptical. For all of its purported beauty, the system of justice in the US is deeply flawed, especially when it comes to prosecuting cases against the well-heeled, wealthy and well-connected. Of course, I'm hopeful.

This is kinda what I was saying earlier. I want it to be so serious for Fraudstrong that he has to some clean but somehow I just think it might still get squashed...

 

[Dr. Maserati]

This is kinda what I was saying earlier. I want it to be so serious for Fraudstrong that he has to some clean but somehow I just think it might still get squashed...

This goes back to the original OP question - "Is Armstrong about to admit".

I don't believe he can - because if he admits it is imperative that he would tell the truth about everything, he cannot 'cherrypick' the points to address anymore.

Knowing Armstrongs full history, I believe this is pretty much impossible to do.

 

[Neworld]

This goes back to the original OP question - "Is Armstrong about to admit".

I don't believe he can.

Hopefully he will admit the truth, but as with you I doubt it.

I hope his case does not follow down the same complicated legal case as O. North and due to some technicality LA gets off.

Oliver Laurence North (born October 7, 1943) was a US Marine Corps officer. Currently, he is a political commentator, host of War Stories with Oliver North on Fox News Channel, a military historian, and a New York Times best-selling author.

North was at the center of national attention during the Iran-Contra affair, a political scandal of the late 1980s. North was a National Security Council member involved in the clandestine sale of weapons to Iran, which served to encourage the release of U.S. hostages from Lebanon. North formulated the second part of the plan: diverting proceeds from the arms sales to support the Contra rebel groups in Nicaragua. North was charged with several felonies and convicted of three, but the convictions were later vacated, and the underlying charges dismissed due to the limited immunity agreement granted for his pre-trial public Congressional testimony about the affair. ref - unreliable Wiki

NW

 

[fatandfast]

I'm getting really annoyed at the allegations of blackmail. If you state this as a fact you'd better have something to base this assertion up, other than your presumption. Look I myself believe it is a likely thing to have happened, however I have not seen a shred of proof

@ thehog, I see some more reasons why Landis has the upper hand. Firstly he has nothing to lose, nothing at all. Nothing that Lance can do or say will financially hurt Landis, not can it hurt his reputation, this means that Lance his normal tactics don't work. The second is the fact that Landis and the general media are the acting party, and as Lance does not know what info they have, nor what they'll print there is no way he can act with pre-emptive media campaign, as he does not know what he needs to target. These two factors mean that Lance his normal approach does not work and as such already appears to be on the ropes

The response over and over that Landis has nothing to lose is only half true. The CN article about his whistle blow suit also has included numbers that you to do your own version of fuzzy math..30% of some part of 30.6 million. That is a number that is 30.6 billion more than Landis is worth as a human. Landis has nothing to loose but has his whole life to gain by playing out a role in the lie he has written and told for years. If Landis makes a penny from any court proceeding they should give Charles Manson back pay for all the books and TV movies made about him..just a start for letting scum profit from their crimes. Sorry Charlie I didn't mean to insult you with the Floyd comparison. He lied again when he said he just wanted to clear his conscience..yeah right.

 

[Hugh Januss]

The response over and over that Landis has nothing to lose is only half true. The CN article about his whistle blow suit also has included numbers that you to do your own version of fuzzy math..30% of some part of 30.6 million. That is a number that is 30.6 billion more than Landis is worth as a human. Landis has nothing to loose but has his whole life to gain by playing out a role in the lie he has written and told for years. If Landis makes a penny from any court proceeding they should give Charles Manson back pay for all the books and TV movies made about him..just a start for letting scum profit from their crimes. Sorry Charlie I didn't mean to insult you with the Floyd comparison. He lied again when he said he just wanted to clear his conscience..yeah right.

Oh yeah, spot on comparison there between Floyd who is blowing the whistle on someone who has basically lied and cheated his way to millions of dollars and a mass murderer. I would compare you to Rain Man but that would be unfair to him.

 

[Anonymous]

Increasingly the fanboy strategy seems to be shifting from "most tested. necer failed, high cadence, bla bla bla" to "Landis is the biggest doper of all, everybody has always done it even that nasty jealous LeMond, he might even be worse than Landis". It would be interesting if that became the official defense. I'd like to see how that works for him.

OT but maybe it's time for a poll Is Toolhand the biggest doosh in the world of cycling forums?

I am not sure there is anyone even close to that kind of douchebagginess. I don't think a poll is needed. I mean, BPC is mentally ill. Coolhand is just a fu*king moron with the power to ban people.

 

[Anonymous]

Wow, some guy that goes by the name lastchild on RBR wrote "the only good that can come of this is the discovery of Floyd's body, hanging from a noose..."

Man, when you challenge a 12 year old girl's crush, she will get mean.

 

[Anonymous]

Wow, some guy that goes by the name lastchild on RBR wrote "the only good that can come of this is the discovery of Floyd's body, hanging from a noose..."

Man, when you challenge a 12 year old girl's crush, she will get mean.

I honestly couldn't believe it when I read this, so I went to look.

I just can't believe that that has been allowed to stay on that site.

Do the owners of the site have any concept of what the hell is going on in that place??

It is quite clear that the moderator is going to do nothing about it as it fits his world view, but really .........

There really needs to be a bright shining light shone on that cesspool.

 

[blackcat]

The response over and over that Landis has nothing to lose is only half true. The CN article about his whistle blow suit also has included numbers that you to do your own version of fuzzy math..30% of some part of 30.6 million. That is a number that is 30.6 billion more than Landis is worth as a human. Landis has nothing to loose but has his whole life to gain by playing out a role in the lie he has written and told for years. If Landis makes a penny from any court proceeding they should give Charles Manson back pay for all the books and TV movies made about him..just a start for letting scum profit from their crimes. Sorry Charlie I didn't mean to insult you with the Floyd comparison. He lied again when he said he just wanted to clear his conscience..yeah right.

A number bandied about on Armstrong's financial worth, 150mill.

And you are pointing the sighter on Landis for lying, with a potential bonanza on the whilstleblower civil suit?

Armstrong is 150mill ahead for lying. Think the numbers are pretty start (typo stark). One point of difference, whatever the motivation, Floyd is telling a semblance of truth now, I dont think he is, or will, come completely clean, as I am convinced he was charging on Mercury.

Armstrong will never tell the truth. If anyone is identifying and living vicariously through him, it behoves one to cease since he is a thoroughly unedifying individual.