Is Philippe Gilbert Doping?

[JMBeaushrimp]

Regardless of his 'cleanliness', I just love watching this guy race. He and the whole OPL squad were awesome this spring. Entirely commited, and tactically astute.

Since we're not in charge of testing, and he hasn't been tainted yet (yes... I said 'taint'), I'm working under the premise that he SO good at his selective skills (steep power finishes) and has the nuts to take charge and dictate the finish in his favour, I'm gonna stay mum on this one.

Besides, regardless of the state of affairs, you gotta cheer for someone if you love cycling. Did I mention I love how this guy and his team races...

Congrats, Philipe!

 

[movingtarget]

I can't see Gilbert winning more than one stage. It's hard to believe he will be as good as he was in the Spring. But maybe I'm wrong and he will clean up and win four stages ! He made everyone look second rate in April and just had another strong win in the Belgian Road Champs. The TDF is not the Belgian Champs though............

 

[The Hitch]

I agree with this. It seems that like McEwan, Gilbert has become very good at finding the right spot to be at the right time. Unless Gilbert suddenly becomes top ten at the Tour, I don't think he is doping.

Wow this timing thing seems pretty important. It can make you set one of the fastest times ever up the Muur d hoy, making Contador look average.

All simply timing.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Wow this timing thing seems pretty important. It can make you set one of the fastest times ever up the Muur d hoy, making Contador look average.

All simply timing.

And cadence. Don't forget cadence.

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

Just went back and watched the Fleche again.

The questions may be raised, but regardless, that's pure beauty...

Forget the GTs for the little men. Les Ardennes are the sh*t for bike racing!

Until the Shlecklet grows a pair, I'll keep knowing that the classics are the true test of cycling.

All attributes wrapped into one. Lovely!

 

[FabulousCandelabra]

Gilbert is the best in the world at ONE thing: accelerating on a slope. That is not a skill which is augmented greatly by oxygen vector doping, which is the most prevalent and effective technique currently in use.

Wth, you kidding me? "Oxygen vector doping" won't help in surviving to the final km fresher than your opponents in L-B-L? Get real!

 

[Granville57]

Vansevenant accused of importing dope

This very well might warrant its own thread, but for now...

Former Lotto rider Wim Vansevenant has been accused of allegedly importing doping products from Australia

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/vansevenant-alleged-to-have-imported-doping-products

Retired in 2008, Vansevenant was allegedly to be on the receiving end of a package intercepted at Brussels airport two weeks ago by customs officials. According to reports, the package contained ultra-modern doping products designed to increase muscle mass and performance.

Not that OPL has raised any suspicions this year.
This story is only just beginning.

And what was his role really supposed to be here?

Vansevenant, 39, is due to escort VIP guests of the Omega Pharma-Lotto team at the Tour de France, which begins next week.

Now I can no longer use my joke about there only being one clean rider in the peloton.

The Belgian is the only rider to have finished as lanterne rouge in the Tour de France, three times (2006, 2007, 2008).

 

[Frosty]

Het Nieuwsblad has a bit more info (below is automatically translated).


'Research showed that the package contained ultramodern doping products. It would be a brand new drug for animals. The product would be prized by drug users as it increases both muscle mass and endurance would improve.'

 

[42x16ss]

This very well might warrant its own thread, but for now...

Former Lotto rider Wim Vansevenant has been accused of allegedly importing doping products from Australia

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/vansevenant-alleged-to-have-imported-doping-products

Now I can no longer use my joke about there only being one clean rider in the peloton.

Finishing last isn't a guarantee of cleanliness. Sure, Vansevenant got the Lantern 3 times in a row, but that was because he was hauling Cuddles and McHeadbutt around France for most of the race and then softpedalled the TT's (for a pro). Kind of like Bert Grabsch (3rd last overall) last year for Frodo.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

The guy beats the best riders in the world, known dopers, flies out from being a good rider to the best in the world suddenly at age of 28.

Is the tide turning or are these just more too good to be true performances?

Once again, Philippe Gilbert is one of the riders managed by McQuaid's son.
More protected than this, there's nothing in the world.

Wake up....

Holy mackerel. My mind is about to tilt like a pin-ball machine! First the question posed by Hitch. Then, recently, the revelation and subsequent questions concerning a package intercepted at a Brussels airport two weeks ago by customs officials containing ultra-modern doping products allegedly destined for Vansevenant. At 39 years of age and retired, Vansevenant most likely would not be using the stuff. So who are these doping products intended for? That's part of what authorities will be investigating.

And now Gilbert is managed by McQuaid's son? In what capacity is this manager associated with Gilbert? As a business manager? Anyone know? It does not appear that the manager is part of the OPL team. Depending on what young manager McQuaid actually does for Gilbert and/or OPL, McQuaid could have a conflict of interest. In my country an example of a conflict of interest (some places call it a competition of interest) is where a person could potentially use their job postion to benefit a friend or family member who works for some other company or group. The Wiki short definition of a conflict of interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conflict_of_interest is:

A conflict of interest (COI) occurs when an individual or organization is involved in multiple interests, one of which could possibly corrupt the motivation for an act in the other.

TILT.

Meh, it's all speculation at this point anyway. But in my company if I have a conflict of interest I am required to report it. The conflict of interest itself is not an offense. But making business decisions to benefit my external business associates, who could be family members, is an offense that is grounds for termination from the job.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

And now Gilbert is managed by McQuaid's son?

Apparently, it's just one forum member spreading lies.

 

[euanli]

Its not even hard to disprove the manager lie:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/gilbert-wants-three-year-contract-stability

Philippe Gilbert is not in a hurry to sign a contract for next year. The new King of Belgian Classics is giving potential teams enough time to sort out their long-term finances, as his manager, Vincent Wathelet, pointed out that Gilbert's primary concern is a three-year deal and the stability that comes with it.

 

[hrotha]

Apparently, it's just one forum member spreading lies.

Sheesh, it's not spreading lies, it's repeating rumours that upon closer investigation turn out to be unfounded. It's not like that forumer was out on an evil difamation crusade.

 

[L'arriviste]

Now I can no longer use my joke about there only being one clean rider in the peloton.

Vansevenant wasn't clean anyway. He had a high haematocrit violation in 1997.

 

[D-Queued]

Vansevenant wasn't clean anyway. He had a high haematocrit violation in 1997.

Ah, c'mon. He probably has a naturally high HCT. Just like all the other guys in the peloton.

Dave.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

Ah, c'mon. He probably has a naturally high HCT. Just like all the other guys in the peloton.

Dave.

Don't you know its the result of the naturally high altitude in which he was born?

 

[blackcat]

Don't you know its the result of the naturally high altitude in which he was born?

mom was prolly high on meth

 

[blackcat]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/photos/photo-gallery-the-tour-de-france-team-presentation/180081

Jean Claude Damn Damn Damn him, or Philippe Gilbert

 

[L'arriviste]

Le Soir has another "alternative" interview today, this time with Antoine Vayer. Vayer rode as a junior with Chiotti and Bassons, was a trainer at Festina at the time of the blonde bombshell (1998), is a virulent anti-doper and sometime contributor to Le Monde, for which he'll be writing a column throughout this year's Tour. Today he runs a training research centre in the Mayenne, France.

Source interview: « Les victoires de Gilbert ? Pas crédible », Le Soir, 01 July 2011. (Edited heavily for reasons of brevity and interest. Any errors are mine!)

Is the Tour de France still credible?
The sport isn't credible at the professional level, because all it takes is ten guys prepared like bandits and maybe three teams to screw things up. Since 1999, people have been dissecting races by measuring power ratings on the cols. And what we've all seen is nothing to rejoice about, even if there's some hope with guys who aren't contesting the victory. So you could say that there are some out there with a conscience.

But not Contador?
No way! What he showed in the Giro suggests that he'll still go out and do inhuman things at the Tour, like he did last year. And this time without meat!

He wasn't even at his limit
Exactly. What he does, like some other top riders is quite frankly grotesque. At the Crit&#233]

... continues next post...

 

[L'arriviste]

So it isn't a good sign for the Tour
No. At Paris-Nice there were twenty guys who weren't straight if you look at their power on the Col de la Mure. At the Dauphiné, we saw some abnormal stuff on the Collet d'Allevard. Rodriguez doing 457 watts for 32 minutes and Wiggins putting out 442 watts while some French riders were in that area too. Instead of having a race to the bottom, it's the other way around. That's what tells you which guys are sorted.

Did you look at the Classics? Gilbert's victories?
He beat the record climbing the Mur de Huy whilst still managing to get his hands in the air several dozen metres from the line. He did it in 2m 44s. That would have been less than 2m 40s if he hadn't saluted, but he likes doing that. Di Luca, whom we know well ... did the Mur in 2m 45s in 2005, Valverde in 2m 51s in 2006 ... Both of them without raising their arms.

So you doubt his performances
Is the Pope Catholic? [Is Jupiler Belgian? - yes] Perhaps it's all down to his legs! No, seriously. It's not credible. I'm sure he's a lovely guy but he's pulling our legs here. It's like Rebellin did back then ... walked all over the triptych [FB,FW,LBL] ... then continued racking up the wins after. I cannot believe that there are people who can be this dominant over others, so consistently and for this long.

... continues next post ...

 

[L'arriviste]

Is the Tour worth following then?
Yes. I live in a Breton village. All the shopkeepers have decorated their shops. There'll be a party all day. For those reasons. For downtime. For all those folks who've come here, far from home, eating well and having a good time and bulls**tting each other. For the local economy. For filling the coffers of the ASO, a company that's still not terribly well off... And then because we're talking about the human condition here. The exploits and the achievements and the failures. All that forces us to ask ourselves some questions: on globalisation and what we're doing to ourselves - our naivety and our being resigned to things. We're talking a lot about outrage here but the Tour itself ought not to be the cause of it, even if it sometimes gets used as a shopfront for the stuff that does outrage us. We have a new generation now which has been protected from the doping culture. These are the ones who might have written a new story in the history books of the Tour. But it turns out that it won't be them writing it. It'll be Contador and others who do likewise. They'll be the ones who rehash the story of the past.

------- Ends -----------

Phew, that took a while!

 

[Lanark]

Thanks for the translation L'Arriviste. Some interesting points by Vayer. I do get the impression he is jumping to conclusions a little too much.

He cites some worrying figures and climbing times, but they are all from short stage races and one-day races, he doesn't talk about the Giro where the power levels of Contador et al. where good, but not so good that they can't be theoretically done by a clean rider. I'm no specialist, but Aldo Sassi and the sport scientists guys think that 6.2 w/kg over 40 minutes could be done 'clean' (which doesn't suggest anyone under that level is clean of course). I don't think we have seen anyone do that in a GT in a while, and I wouldn't be surprised if the times on the Platteau de Beille and Alpe D'Huez this year will be significantly slower than past Tours'.

But Rodriguez's time in the Dauphiné was rather extreme. I guess we'll just have to wait till the Tour reaches the mountains to get some idea with how succesfull the anti-doping brigade is.

 

[Parrulo]

lol that guy. so its safe to say that there isn't a single clean victory this year, if he says so it must be true

not saying there is no doping btw. i just think that guy went a bit to far by putting in cause every single result this year.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

Good interview and thanks for the translation. Good to see some more cynicism instead of the usual childlike naivety - it was good to see the results/outputs plotted and contextualised.

Thanks. If you get the chance to translate more of his columns that would be good.

 

[c&cfan]

lol that guy. so its safe to say that there isn't a single clean victory this year, if he says so it must be true

not saying there is no doping btw. i just think that guy went a bit to far by putting in cause every single result this year.

parrulo, why do you think he is wrong?

juniors were busted, amateurs were busted, veterans were busted, bin laden was busted, etc...

I do believe that any major win had some sort of unnatural fuel behind it. Not only that, dope exist an it's being used by every major rider since the beginning of this sport. but that's natural (pun) and fine as long as it is balanced, because i believe that some riders are making this unfair (merckx lance ricco old vino etc).