Ivan Basso Discussion Thread

[karlboss]

His Giro winning day's are past, first off he wants to win le Tour after winning the Giro already so has used it (so he says) for training or to support Nibali or to have Nibali support him at le Tour after his support at the Giro. Unless Nibali has switched with him and they're aiming for different goals this year. I think he'll take a cameo stage and then take part in pack fill 2012.

I think Basso knows he can't win the Tour this year. While we all make fun of Andy Schleck's TT ability, Basso is worse.
He could however be a great domestique for Nibali at the tour. I would think Basso will ride the Giro and then be a domestique for the tour, while Nibali should skip the Giro, peak for the Tour then think about la Vuelta.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Basso could go anywhere from top to outside the first 10 and that is the problem for Liquigas. Basso on his own against a formidable Lampre machine seems almost unfair on paper.

 

[Parrulo]

Basso could go anywhere from top to outside the first 10 and that is the problem for Liquigas. Basso on his own against a formidable Lampre machine seems almost unfair on paper.

if basso is in good shape he will get ride of cunego before he can do any damage, so the lampre due shouldn't be a big problem

 

[Dazed and Confused]

if basso is in good shape he will get ride of cunego before he can do any damage, so the lampre due shouldn't be a big problem

Basso is usually worthless in the first two weeks, so Cunego could do some damage on some of the "smaller" stages before Basso even enter the race for real. Liquigas simply needs a stronger hand going into the game.

 

[hfer07]

Basso knows "how" to win Il Giro-BUT- his current shape is a mystery(maybe bluffing a bit) he hasn't shown any sort of form at all...

on the other hand- he only has Scarponi as his main contender........

 

[Parrulo]

Basso is usually worthless in the first two weeks, so Cunego could do some damage on some of the "smaller" stages before Basso even enter the race for real. Liquigas simply needs a stronger hand going into the game.

as much damage as cunego can make he will most likely lose minutes on the stelvio alone if basso is indeed in good shape ofc.

 

[Pippo_San]

OK, we're on. Purito vs Basso in GC for one month.
We can talk specifics of the avatars to be chosen afterwards (of course it has to be cycling related, or at least not offensive, I wouldn't expect the loser of this to post with a Hitler avatar for a month )

I wanna join this **** too. I'm betting on Basso winner. And I wanna bet BIG, so show me some real challenge here

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

I wanna join this **** too. I'm betting on Basso winner. And I wanna bet BIG, so show me some real challenge here

rrrreeeaaaalllllyyyyy?

 

[greenedge]

Yeah i'd say he will be really good in the third week. But Scarponi is still going to be tough to beat as he also knows how to recover and can hang with Basso on most of the climbs. I still wouldnt mind seeing Basso win though.

On Etna though he blew himself up and after that the race was done.

 

[Woody22]

There is no way Basso will win the Giro and it is 50/50 if he will even finish it.

I am open to any avitar bets on this but when he doesn't win you will have to have an Evans avitar until the start of the Tour.

If he wins.... well, your wish is my comand.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

There is no way Basso will win the Giro and it is 50/50 if he will even finish it.

I am open to any avitar bets on this but when he doesn't win you will have to have an Evans avitar until the start of the Tour.

If he wins.... well, your wish is my comand.

sounds interesting

 

[Woody22]

sounds interesting

Hope I get some takers as I would love to see a forum full of Evans avitars staring back at me

 

[rhubroma]

He is a big enigma, Basso, right now.

Basso has had two careers, pre-OP and post-OP. At the apogee, before the fall, Basso truly seemed to be the best stage racer in the world after the Texan retired, having also finished 3rd in L-B-L as well as good placing’s in other important events. He even became a good time trialist, the ability of which, in the second part of his career, has dissipated completely.

Of all the consequences of OP, this is perhaps the most sensational. His non-ability to ride fast against the clock. Whereas it seemed as if Basso, the climber, had returned to his former level, when winning on the Zoncolon and as a result his second Giro. But then we had the lackluster performances at the Tours and the Giro since then, so that one can only conclude that when he was racing for Riis against Armstrong, Basso was on the best of programs, without that he isn't at the same level. Does this mean that his 2010 Giro victory was on pane et aqua?

As far as this Giro goes, of course, it all depends if Basso can reach the level of 2010. If he does, then yes, if not, no. Right now that's impossible to say. We have to wait till the 12th stage of the Giro to get a response to our inquiry. One factor in his favor, however, is the lack of competition. Scarponi doesn't seem to be at a high level like last year. Cunego? Fuglsang is out, but Frank Schleck is in, though as a last minute sub. Does the Luxembourgese have the form and the will to fight for the Giro till Milan? In any case the French race suits him more, though this appears to be a "lite" Giro without the usual sadistic climbs. At the same time the Tour of California has siphoned off the rest who may have been present, purely due to the commercial interests, which is a shame. The Giro deserves more respect from the UCI and it is scandalous that they moved the US event to the Giro time in the calendar. In the age of hyper-specialization and sponsorship priorities this has meant that the Giro stopped being fought over by the biggest international champions, who didn't want to risk-sacrifice a Tour by taking on two Grand Tours in one season (Contador’s failure last season may have ended all possibility that this will change); so the Giro didn't need another obstacle from the official governing body of pro cycling to its history and dignity. While many who ride two GTs now opt for the Vuelta instead, in light of the subsequent Worlds event. I think this is why Zomengan tried to make the Giro parcours as spectacular as possible to compensate.

At any rate Basso can win this Giro, but that all depends on him.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

The Aye seems to be picking up steem.

 

[orangerider]

Basso has a solid good chance to win. He's focused, as the Tour is just not something he's ever going to win so he's dismissed it entirely. Basso has a great big engine with excellent recovery; no fast legs but don't need it to win the Giro. Just consistency.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

There is no way Basso will win the Giro and it is 50/50 if he will even finish it.

I am open to any avitar bets on this but when he doesn't win you will have to have an Evans avitar until the start of the Tour.

If he wins.... well, your wish is my comand.

I'll do an avatar bet with you.. If he finishes, you take a Basso avatar of my choice until the start of the tour - if he doesn't finish, I'll take your Evans avatar until the start of the Tour.

Deal?

 

[Woody22]

I'll do an avatar bet with you.. If he finishes, you take a Basso avatar of my choice until the start of the tour - if he doesn't finish, I'll take your Evans avatar until the start of the Tour.

Deal?

If we can make it that Basso will not finish in the top 10 then we have a deal.

What do you say??

 

[movingtarget]

He is a big enigma, Basso, right now.

Basso has had two careers, pre-OP and post-OP. At the apogee, before the fall, Basso truly seemed to be the best stage racer in the world after the Texan retired, having also finished 3rd in L-B-L as well as good placing’s in other important events. He even became a good time trialist, the ability of which, in the second part of his career, has dissipated completely.

Of all the consequences of OP, this is perhaps the most sensational. His non-ability to ride fast against the clock. Whereas it seemed as if Basso, the climber, had returned to his former level, when winning on the Zoncolon and as a result his second Giro. But then we had the lackluster performances at the Tours and the Giro since then, so that one can only conclude that when he was racing for Riis against Armstrong, Basso was on the best of programs, without that he isn't at the same level. Does this mean that his 2010 Giro victory was on pane et aqua?

As far as this Giro goes, of course, it all depends if Basso can reach the level of 2010. If he does, then yes, if not, no. Right now that's impossible to say. We have to wait till the 12th stage of the Giro to get a response to our inquiry. One factor in his favor, however, is the lack of competition. Scarponi doesn't seem to be at a high level like last year. Cunego? Fuglsang is out, but Frank Schleck is in, though as a last minute sub. Does the Luxembourgese have the form and the will to fight for the Giro till Milan? In any case the French race suits him more, though this appears to be a "lite" Giro without the usual sadistic climbs. At the same time the Tour of California has siphoned off the rest who may have been present, purely due to the commercial interests, which is a shame. The Giro deserves more respect from the UCI and it is scandalous that they moved the US event to the Giro time in the calendar. In the age of hyper-specialization and sponsorship priorities this has meant that the Giro stopped being fought over by the biggest international champions, who didn't want to risk-sacrifice a Tour by taking on two Grand Tours in one season (Contador’s failure last season may have ended all possibility that this will change); so the Giro didn't need another obstacle from the official governing body of pro cycling to its history and dignity. While many who ride two GTs now opt for the Vuelta instead, in light of the subsequent Worlds event. I think this is why Zomengan tried to make the Giro parcours as spectacular as possible to compensate.

At any rate Basso can win this Giro, but that all depends on him.

I tend to agree. He indicates that he is not in super shape but does he have to be to win this Giro ? The other contenders are more inconsistent than Basso and their TT is weaker. I expect Gadret to podium. Scarponi is a bit of an enigma these days. The field for this race is not as strong as previous editions which works in Basso's favour also. I actually think Nibali could have won it if he rode. Cunego could be the interesting rider. He was much improved in the Tour last year but the TT is always a problem. Frank Schleck was training for the Tour so he may struggle and may even prefer to look for stage wins and save something for the Tour to help his brother unless he is in a position on GC to make the podium.

 

[rhubroma]

I tend to agree. He indicates that he is not in super shape but does he have to be to win this Giro ? The other contenders are more inconsistent than Basso and their TT is weaker. I expect Gadret to podium. Scarponi is a bit of an enigma these days. The field for this race is not as strong as previous editions which works in Basso's favour also. I actually think Nibali could have won it if he rode. Cunego could be the interesting rider. He was much improved in the Tour last year but the TT is always a problem. Frank Schleck was training for the Tour so he may struggle and may even prefer to look for stage wins and save something for the Tour to help his brother unless he is in a position on GC to make the podium.

That's a completely valid analysis. One of the problems with assessing the field is that cycling has gotten so screwed up over the last several years (ever since someone retired), with champions being taken down for their doping habits, to make it a mess to try and make sense of it all.

Last year Contador dominated the Giro but not the Tour, whereas the previous year Evans was dropped by Basso in the Giro, was nowhere in the Tour, then wins the Grande Boucle the next year (over Contador and Shleck); at the same time Basso was poor at the Tour after his 2010 Giro victory and last year, when he didn't ride the Italian event, though in 06 looked really capable of doing the double. Is this normal? The cards get reshuffled faster than one knows what he's got in his hand.

Nibali won't be at the Giro because his team's Cannodale sponsor has too many vested commercial interests in California. Again, this is a shame. Especially if he fails at the Tour, which is likely. As for the rest, I agree. One thing’s for sure, in the absence of other champions, this Giro’s shapping up to be like the one Cunego won in 04, which is why in fact he won it: for lack of completion. At least Zomengan entertained us with his follies. Now with these new brilliant Italian minds at work (to save face!?!?!? To not make the Tour look ridiculous!?!?!?!?), they have taken away even that. Poor Italia!

 

[cineteq]

Nibali won't be at the Giro because his team's Cannodale sponsor has too many vested commercial interests in California. Again, this is a shame.

That's great news! It's not a shame to ride the Tour

 

[rhubroma]

That's great news! It's not a shame to ride the Tour

Well that depends on how you look at it. The tifosi would rather see lo squalo di Messina at the Giro, or better yet, ride the Giro, and then the Tour (which isn't going to happen, though Eddie still believes this is still a good route to take). His presence will be missed in Italy, regardless of how he does in France.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I tend to agree. He indicates that he is not in super shape but does he have to be to win this Giro ? The other contenders are more inconsistent than Basso and their TT is weaker. I expect Gadret to podium. Scarponi is a bit of an enigma these days. The field for this race is not as strong as previous editions which works in Basso's favour also. I actually think Nibali could have won it if he rode. Cunego could be the interesting rider. He was much improved in the Tour last year but the TT is always a problem. Frank Schleck was training for the Tour so he may struggle and may even prefer to look for stage wins and save something for the Tour to help his brother unless he is in a position on GC to make the podium.

scarponi and rujano have better itt's than basso. that's for sure

 

[movingtarget]

That's a completely valid analysis. One of the problems with assessing the field is that cycling has gotten so screwed up over the last several years (ever since someone retired), with champions being taken down for their doping habits, to make it a mess to try and make sense of it all.

Last year Contador dominated the Giro but not the Tour, whereas the previous year Evans was dropped by Basso in the Giro, was nowhere in the Tour, then wins the Grande Boucle the next year (over Contador and Shleck); at the same time Basso was poor at the Tour after his 2010 Giro victory and last year, when he didn't ride the Italian event, though in 06 looked really capable of doing the double. Is this normal? The cards get reshuffled faster than one knows what he's got in his hand.

Nibali won't be at the Giro because his team's Cannodale sponsor has too many vested commercial interests in California. Again, this is a shame. Especially if he fails at the Tour, which is likely. As for the rest, I agree. One thing’s for sure, in the absence of other champions, this Giro’s shapping up to be like the one Cunego won in 04, which is why in fact he won it: for lack of completion. At least Zomengan entertained us with his follies. Now with these new brilliant Italian minds at work (to save face!?!?!? To not make the Tour look ridiculous!?!?!?!?), they have taken away even that. Poor Italia!

I would not say Nibali will win the Tour but he will probably cause headaches for the other GC contender because he does not mind taking risks and making unexpected attacks especially if someone like Sanchez is able to go with him. Nibali will have to time trial very well to make the podium I think. Evans said it all when he commented that without Contador, the race will be harder to control and riders will be more daring. I still think that current form suggests that Nibali would have done well in the Giro. If Basso does not win the team will probably rue their decision about Nibali.

 

[jens_attacks]

i have the same opinion as always.
if at 2006 level,he wins it easily but i guess it's impossible for robobasso to come back

if at 2010 level,it will be extremely difficult to win it.rujano last year was above that level and scarponi equal to that.the performances of this spring suggest that this year they will probably climb faster the mountains then in 2010 which was more "meh".so he has to step up his game now

2011 tour was a disaster waiting to happen,something happened after that crash on etna,loss of blood,something medical.he had nothing left for the alps in the last week

personally,i pretty much love ivan basso so i hope he does well(podium?) but he already has two giri.this one is for rujanito

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

I think he'll be at the same level as in 2009, so no unless Rujano and Scarponi fail hard.