Joe Papp on the BBC

[Barrus]

Stop it with the personal attacks, approach the post not the poster

 

[Benotti69]

i dont read anywhere in my post where i say "joe is excused for his PED dealing"

there are a lot of bigger targets than him in cycling. Joe is currently under investigation and is doing all he can to help authorities, whether to save his own neck for which i cant blame him or because he has seen the stupidity of his actions, which are deplorable or both he will get what is coming to him.

as for bigger targets, Fuentes, Riis, Bruyneel, Ferarri, Saiz, McQ, Hein to name a few.

 

[Digger]

I think if Joe's motives were about cleaning the sport, he wouldn't have been dealing whilst gaining notoriety by volunteering his testimony in floyd's case. But i do believe him when he talks of that fear. I genuinely hopes he avoids jail and goes on to piece his life together. There was one post he had recently though where he talked of the testers not being fair to the rights of the riders. I found this nonsensical though as the riders have lied and cheated their way through tests for years. It was a but much coming from Joe I must say. So that's an example of what I mean by sometimes questioning his angle.

 

[patricknd]

Joe Papp did what he did and did so knowing it was wrong. He is an educated man who had other avenues to pursue to make a living, but chose to pedal PEDs on the internet.

Society feels no pity towards street dealers who peddle crack, crystal meth and heroin. But this suburban middle-class kid selling steroids online should get a break why?

Because it's easier for many on this forum to emphasize with Papp. He is not a character that is demonized by society. He is the prototypical suburban kid-next-door, smart enough to articulate his circumstances as "punishment enough".

I'm of two minds about this. I feel he found religion not from some genuine sense of remorse but as an attempt to keep himself out of jail.

If the judge looks at him and gets a sense that he was just a dumb kid who strayed from the straight and narrow, he'll get off with no jail time. All the judge has to do is take one look at him and, if he feels that this young man standing in front of me could very well have been his son, he's home free.

I feel that society being how it is, PED use has become de rigueur amongst those for whom vanity and insecurity have taken over their lives. In the coming years PED use will become no big deal, the more aging yuppies consume HgH and testosterone in search of that elusive fountain of youth. Eventually we will look upon this time in sport and consider it no big deal.

But what Papp engaged in was different. For those who want to see guys like Armstrong do jail time for playing a dominant role in procuring PEDs and fostering an environment within his team that drug use was not only mandatory for Tour selection but essential for their success, then I don't see why Papp should get off just because of his recently-found state of contrition.

very good post, and consistent with your oft stated beliefs, which is admirable. too many apologists depending on the person in question.

 

[Captain_Cavman]

Joe Papp did what he did and did so knowing it was wrong. He is an educated man who had other avenues to pursue to make a living, but chose to pedal PEDs on the internet.

Society feels no pity towards street dealers who peddle crack, crystal meth and heroin. But this suburban middle-class kid selling steroids online should get a break why?

Because it's easier for many on this forum to emphasize with Papp. He is not a character that is demonized by society. He is the prototypical suburban kid-next-door, smart enough to articulate his circumstances as "punishment enough".

I'm of two minds about this. I feel he found religion not from some genuine sense of remorse but as an attempt to keep himself out of jail.

If the judge gets a sense he was just a dumb kid who strayed from the straight and narrow, he'll get off with no jail time. All the judge has to do is take one look at him and if he feels that Papp could be his own son, he's home free.

I feel that society being how it is, PED use has become de rigueur amongst those for whom vanity and insecurity have taken over their lives. In the coming years PED use will become no big deal, the more aging yuppies consume HgH and testosterone in search of that elusive fountain of youth. Eventually we will look upon this time in sport and consider it no big deal.

But what Papp engaged in was different. For those who want to see guys like Armstrong do jail time for playing a dominant role in procuring PEDs and fostering an environment within his team that drug use was not only mandatory for Tour selection but essential for their success, then I don't see why Papp should get off just because of his recently-found state of contrition.

For me it's about whether pursuing dealers can be an effective way of identifying dopers. Joe Papp and his customers are pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things but what happens to him is setting a precedent. If we want dealers to enable the authorities to identify their customers then we have to make it worth their while. Carrot and stick.

Putting Papp through purgatory for years and then jailing him will send a message to anyone caught doing the same thing... keep your mouth shut and hope for the best - Collaboration with the authorities isn't worth it.