Jonas Vingegaard: Something is Rotten

[Rackham]

It took about two seconds. Even if he did it 20 times that would only be 40 seconds out of a 33 minute effort. It's not like that would negate the effects of being aerodynamic, come on.

Nah, I'm having none of it. Vingegaard looks awkward as hell on a bike.

It's the most grotesque performance in 60 years & there's absolutely nothing worth defending here or explaining. What he did was impossible, end of.

He looks terrible on the bike, he rides faster downhill, on the flat, uphill & has a summer TdF peak which makes his Dauphiné performance look 'human' by comparison. I mean where was his superior cornering & ITT skills when Mikkel Bjerg beat him in the Dauphiné last month? Still in the lab, I assume.

 

[Cookster15]

Vingegaards vilde ridt skriver sig ind i den store Tour-historie
Vingegaards fantomtid overraskede ham selv
'Den bedste enkeltstart nogensinde' giver ro hos Jumbo-Visma
Vingegaard smadrer Holger Rune
Vingegaard sætter vanvittig watt-rekord: 'Jeg har aldrig set noget lignende!'
Lance Armstrong: 'Det er mindblowing'
Verden måber over Jonas Vingegaard: 'Den bedste enkeltstart nogensinde'

Thanks when I have time will try the translator?

 

[ontheroad]

Apparently it was all because he took the corners better 😂

Its the Froome equivalent of 'he just lost the fat'!

 

[Volderke]

The one thing I don't understand is that Vingegaard was 5% better in the TT, and this in uphill, downhill, flat,... after all what we saw the last 2 weeks.

His Cambasque acceleration was in the same line, but everything after indicated suffering / having to undergo the law of Tadej's explosiveness and fear of being dropped.

Okay, Vingegaard could have decided to just sweat it out (and hold back in descents) and wait for the TT and Col de la Loze, but his performances in the last 1.5 weeks didn't give any indications about having a 5% gap (IN FAVOUR) to Pogacar.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

we just had a rest day, that's why it;s incomparable to the mts before

 

[Fatclimber]

Lump me in with the rest of the "haven't posted for years" guys, but I was legitimately enjoying the race this year prior to this performance. Some things never change. Fix that ear piece Jonas! Once he caught up to Pog's team car a quick thinker would have faked a mechanical or kindly gone off course to give back some time. I would love to see that power and skeleton combo unleashed on a climb. Marco eat your heart out.

 

[Blobs]

Nah, I'm having none of it. Vingegaard looks awkward as hell on a bike.

It's the most grotesque performance in 60 years & there's absolutely nothing worth defending here or explaining. What he did was impossible, end of.

He looks terrible on the bike, he rides faster downhill, on the flat, uphill & has a summer TdF peak which makes his Dauphiné performance look 'human' by comparison. I mean where was his superior cornering & ITT skills when Mikkel Bjerg beat him in the Dauphiné last month? Still in the lab, I assume.

You're right. Aerodynamics are a lie. Vingegaard having his knees out for a couple of seconds proves it, beyond any doubt.

 

[Volderke]

Tom Dumoulin gave it away last night in Vive le Velo on Sporza:

Tom Dumoulin keek vol bewondering naar Jonas Vingegaard in "de beste tijdrit ooit": "Dit was tijdritporno" | sporza

Tadej Pogacar en Jonas Vingegaard losten elkaar twee weken lang van geen vin. Aan elkaar gewaagd in een spannend secondenspel voor geel in Parijs. Dat scenario werd in de tijdrit plots abrupt verstoord door een fenomenale uithaal van de Deense geletruidrager. Ook in Vive le Vélo zochten ze naar...

sporza.be

translated:
"This was time trial porno"

We, men of culture, all know one thing about porno:
it's fake.

 

[ppanther92]

I guess pundits are a topic for themselves but just listening to ARD Tourfunk and the whole team there said Vingegaard must have something the rest is not using. They at least give him the possibility of it being something legal or not illegal yet better said. Also said that they talked to their Belgium collegues yesterday (e.g. Pauwels) and they were in absolute disbelief as well and had the same view.

I can’t remember ARD being that direct.At least for sure not since they are back but I also can’t remember a similar innuendo towards Armstrong or Ullrich.

 

[Rackham]

You're right. Aerodynamics are a lie. Vingegaard having his knees out for a couple of seconds proves it, beyond any doubt.

'for a couple of seconds'

I believe the need by some to explain, downplay or rationalize the inexplicable is itself... inexplicable.

We're watching a rider who defies the laws of physics with his power weight ratio & yes, his position on the bike as well. All those 'marginal gains' in ITT technology for 30 years just went out the window & a guy went full gas like a maniac for 22.4km's without a single concern for any of the limitations everyone else deals with.

Doesn't this shock you? Personally I thought it was a disgusting spectacle which ruined an already thermonuclear unreal Tour (which 'at least' had some suspense... until yesterday). And I'm quite relieved many others can see what's what with their own eyes. Vingegaard & Jumbo made a mockery of all the specialists who obsess over the most minute details when it comes to ITT's & bike racing. Positioning, aero, cadence, weight, whatever.

He just dropped the watts & nothing else mattered. The end.

 

[QuickZulu]

He was actually 3'' faster. But your point still stands.

And talking in his post-stage interview, he said he took it a bit easy on that section

 

[Barnacle Bill]

Early in his ride the team radio snippet we got, "show the world you are the strongest" surprised me a bit, pretty bullish even by the standards of team car cheerleading I thought, given the performances Pogi can pull out at crunch times and how close they've been. Guess they were right to be confident.

Have enjoyed reading various bit of coverage from around the world today, have the impression people are still a bit shocked and trying to put what we saw into some kind of perspective.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Who's paying for Vingo not getting busted?
GCN and the new global media push?

 

[Blobs]

'for a couple of seconds'

I believe the need by some to explain, downplay or rationalize the inexplicable is itself... inexplicable.

We're watching a rider who defies the laws of physics with his power weight ratio & yes, his position on the bike as well. All those 'marginal gains' in ITT technology for 30 years just went out the window & a guy went full gas like a maniac for 22.4km's without a single concern for any of the limitations everyone else deals with.

Doesn't this shock you? Personally I thought it was a disgusting spectacle which ruined an already thermonuclear unreal Tour (which 'at least' had some suspense... until yesterday). And I'm quite relieved many others can see what's what with their own eyes. Vingegaard & Jumbo made a mockery of all the specialists who obsess over the most minute details when it comes to ITT's & bike racing. Positioning, aero, cadence, weight, whatever.

He just dropped the watts & nothing else mattered. The end.

It literally took 2 seconds. How much time do you think he can realistically lose in 2 seconds? Let's say it slows him down by 10% (which it doesn't), and he did it 20 times during the time trial, that would be 4 seconds for entire stage.

I agree it was a shocking performance, but let's at least try to keep our critique of it somewhat rational, instead of this nonsense.

 

[Rackham]

It literally took 2 seconds. How much time do you think he can realistically lose in 2 seconds? Let's say it slows him down by 10% (which it doesn't), and he did it 20 times during the time trial, that would be 4 seconds for entire stage.

I agree it was a shocking performance, but let's at least try to keep our critique of it somewhat rational, instead of this nonsense.

The cameras aren't exactly on Vingegaard at all times, FYI. Whenever we saw him, he was just hammering down the power whilst shifting all over his machine. Froomey stuff. And yes, when Froome's unorthodox style was repeatedly mentioned as a "wtf" element in his dominance, I reckon the same applies with Vingegaard. Unless someone is overly defensive & doesn't like that level of criticism.

And this Tweet by Brian Smith really hits hard:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681562731890057218

View: https://twitter.com/BriSmithy/status/1681562731890057218


I mean 'no comment', really.

 

[hrotha]

Lol at the talk about Pogačar doing badly because he could only improve so much on one of the most shocking, most spectacular performances of the last decade

 

[Escarabajo]

Tom Dumoulin gave it away last night in Vive le Velo on Sporza:

Tom Dumoulin keek vol bewondering naar Jonas Vingegaard in "de beste tijdrit ooit": "Dit was tijdritporno" | sporza

Tadej Pogacar en Jonas Vingegaard losten elkaar twee weken lang van geen vin. Aan elkaar gewaagd in een spannend secondenspel voor geel in Parijs. Dat scenario werd in de tijdrit plots abrupt verstoord door een fenomenale uithaal van de Deense geletruidrager. Ook in Vive le Vélo zochten ze naar...

sporza.be

translated:
"This was time trial porno"

We, men of culture, all know one thing about porno:
it's fake.

This is coming from a rider that was in a team. That is not good by any means, not good.

 

[Escarabajo]

The face from Wout when he saw Vingegaard's check points times. He must have been thinking, "We did a transfusion together yesterday, wtf happened?" "maybe they gave him an extra bag when he went to his room, that is not fair!" LOL.

 

[D. Pecher]

I can’t remember ARD being that direct.At least for sure not since they are back but I also can’t remember a similar innuendo towards Armstrong or Ullrich.

ARD have always been that direct, even more so after their temporarily ditching the TdF coverage. When they returned, they pretty much said : "We will talk openly about it when we think things seem wrong."

 

[Escarabajo]

Pog's gap to WvA is more impressive though yesterday because the ITT was much shorter. 1:13 gain over 22.4km is much more impressive than 1:31 over 36.2km. And Van Aert is a stronger rider now as well, all things considered.

And someone is going to have to explain the marginal aero gains here...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681407721298378753

View: https://twitter.com/1ddenis1/status/1681407721298378753


It's like Froomey's elbows... with his knees!

He is just opening his legs because he is going too fast and want to slow down without hitting his brakes!

 

[Rackham]

This is coming from a rider that was in a team. That is not good by any means, not good.

It's a bit sad tbh, considering recent history.

I recommend the 'code yellow' Dutch documentary which showed the behind the scenes Jumbo team during the 2020 Tour. After LPDBF, Roglič was in a quasi state of shock in the car on the way back to the hotel. He said something like "2 minutes over 36km is enormous, with that amount of power he can win races on one leg". Dumoulin was equally shocked & speechless.

Then a guy in their own team comes along & makes that performance look pitiful. I don't know where this is going & I almost don't care anymore. It seems like nothing people used to talk about or believe is important, i.e. rider weight, physiology, energy conservation during stages, teammates & their energy expenditure over the entire Tour, equipment, aerodynamics, wind tunnel work, rider profiles (i.e. rouleur, climber, all rounder). It's just B.S. which occupies us little folk & cycling nerds when the real watts bombs clinically deployed at strategic moments are all that matter now.

Imagine the level of B.S. we swallowed & posted about over the past week or so when we were all discussing Jumbo's tactics & Pog's recovery prospects after a hard stage? (among other nerdisms) It's all just twaddle.

Vinge & Jumbo had this one in the bag & knew it.

 

[magliaroz]

Looong time lurker here (I started to read the Clinic after the unfamous PDBF ITT), but inspired by Jonas I finally decided to jump the shark and say something in this thread.

It really looks like in the peloton's arms race one team managed to create a Tsar Bomb, another a Little Boy and the rest are left throwing Molotov cocktails at each other.

 

[SantiBotero]

Just want to make a summary of how Vingegaard won by 3 minutes a 32-min effort and had the biggest % of difference for Pogacar and the rest of the field:

- How he made the curves;
- The equipment;
- He is better in week 3;
- Rest of the field is not giving 100%;
- Aerodynamic;
- Bowel cleaning;
- Commitment and will to win.

Since all of this has now came to light, I expect more cyclists to copy this stategy - which was now public - and, why not, maybe an Arkea guy may win next year.

 

[The Clogger]

Just want to make a summary of how Vingegaard won by 3 minutes a 32-min effort and had the biggest % of difference for Pogacar and the rest of the field:

- How he made the curves;
- The equipment;
- He is better in week 3;
- Rest of the field is not giving 100%;
- Aerodynamic;
- Bowel cleaning;
- Commitment and will to win.

Since all of this has now came to light, I expect more cyclists to copy this stategy - which was now public - and, why not, maybe an Arkea guy may win next year.

- Pogacar popped his bag already after stage 5 doing half a Landis coming into the TDF undercooked
-Vingo made his move on the 2nd rest day.

 

[ppanther92]

ARD have always been that direct, even more so after their temporarily ditching the TdF coverage. When they returned, they pretty much said : "We will talk openly about it when we think things seem wrong."

Well, they brought on Seppelt for that if needed (thats why they were on no speaking terms with Bauhaus for some stages this year). But not the commentators/experts.