Jonas Vingegaard: Something is Rotten

[pelotonIQ]

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An "efficiency machine". Seriously?

This must be what Brailsford was talking about ten years ago when he mentioned how 'human evolution' would yield faster riders. They're just so "efficient". It's the future we deserve.

And yes, Vingegaard looks like sh*t on a bike. When the hypocritical Dumoulin had the nerve to say Pogačar looked like a "miner on the bike" after LPDBF whilst he turns a blind eye to whatever eyesore Vingeraard serves us right now, I just take whatever these people say with a pinch of salt.

I know what I see with my own eyes & you know what? That's good enough for me considering the rampant B.S. getting spewed by so called professional pro-cycling commentators & analysts.

To add to your point, the entire pro cycling eco-system relies on doped up riders winning races showcasing sponsors, bikes etc. Cérvelo owners are rubbing their hands after yesterdays victory which in turn fuels cycling journalism & commentary via sponsorships.

 

[caferacer]

That would just make it more obvious to me.

Nah, if you are gonna do it like that he has to win today as well. If he was that much better yesterday, he should be just as good today.

Actually this is the big giveaway. It doesn't matter how fit or powerful you are, you need recovery. You can't go at 100% or near intensity day after day. There are no 'special talents' that are immune to this basic tenet of human physiology.
That's why cyclists talk about firing bullets or using matches. You only have so many during a tour.
Not so with the thermomutants. They can do 100% every day, no problem.

 

[perico]

After sleeping on it, my new theory is that back in the day Jonas had his feelings hurt when Pro Cycling Magazine would have those cover stories on the “future of cycling” and the “young guns” with Bernal and Remco as the next superstars. He wasn’t mentioned one time as a “young gun” or future TDF winner. He wasn’t as cherished as Bernal was by his beloved Ineos squad.

How could a rider with a 97 V02 max and ears less iron not be mentioned one time as a star of the future? Remco Remco Remco… it’s always Remco. Bernal too.

So Jonas turned into Adam Sandler in the Waterboy on Monday and showed everyone who had the real talent.

 

[Salvarani]

Actually this is the big giveaway. It doesn't matter how fit or powerful you are, you need recovery. You can't go at 100% or near intensity day after day. There are no 'special talents' that are immune to this basic tenet of human physiology.
That's why cyclists talk about firing bullets or using matches. You only have so many during a tour.
Not so with the thermomutants. They can do 100% every day, no problem.

But "recovery" in their cases is just an act.

Van Aert been going at it on every stage for years.

Vingegaard for all we know has just been pretending in the mountain stages.

They planned on winning the TT. They just over-did it.

I want to see him go full gas again today.

 

[Pirazziattacks]

An "efficiency machine". Seriously?

This must be what Brailsford was talking about ten years ago when he mentioned how 'human evolution' would yield faster riders. They're just so "efficient". It's the future we deserve.

And yes, Vingegaard looks like sh*t on a bike. When the hypocritical Dumoulin had the nerve to say Pogačar looked like a "miner on the bike" after LPDBF whilst he turns a blind eye to whatever eyesore Vingeraard serves us right now, I just take whatever these people say with a pinch of salt.

I know what I see with my own eyes & you know what? That's good enough for me considering the rampant B.S. getting spewed by so called professional pro-cycling commentators & analysts.

I don't know how you've managed to convince yourself that Vingegaard looks like Froome or whoever on the bike, but it's just so blatantly wrong that I think his power output might've scrambled your brain.

 

[Riek s]

An "efficiency machine". Seriously?

This must be what Brailsford was talking about ten years ago when he mentioned how 'human evolution' would yield faster riders. They're just so "efficient". It's the future we deserve.

And yes, Vingegaard looks like sh*t on a bike. When the hypocritical Dumoulin had the nerve to say Pogačar looked like a "miner on the bike" after LPDBF whilst he turns a blind eye to whatever eyesore Vingeraard serves us right now, I just take whatever these people say with a pinch of salt.

I know what I see with my own eyes & you know what? That's good enough for me considering the rampant B.S. getting spewed by so called professional pro-cycling commentators & analysts.

I disagree a bit. Vingegaard doesn't look terrible on the TT bike. His back has a weird hump (like armstrong), which would indicate a little strained position. But he looks mangnitudes better than Froome on a TT bike. His weird leg movement seemed to be a way to get some release from his position.

I can't critique his TT position, it is much better than most of his climbing competitors. (still think it looks less than WVA.. but aerodynamics are a *** to predict.). But a good TT position doesn't mean he should roflstomp other TTers with an equal or better position. And on this parcour, TT position has a lot less effect then those @ > 50km/h

 

[caferacer]

But "recovery" in their cases is just an act.

Van Aert been going at it on every stage for years.

Vingegaard for all we know has just been pretending in the mountain stages.

They planned on winning the TT. They just over-did it.

I want to see him go full gas again today.

I mean yeah, you are right, albeit on a slightly different point.
I rather meant it should be obvious even to a layperson that all these riders are on them (but especially the top ones), to one degree or another. Due to no one being (naturally) above the laws of human physiology.
Pidcock's an example. A proven, generational talent. But the big efforts clearly take their toll. Does this mean he's clean? No. But he's perhaps not 'using' to the same degree as Jonas and co.
But yeah in a moral sense, you're either using or not. So if you are, you might as well go all the way!

 

[pastronef]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681561541252984832

View: https://twitter.com/faustocoppi60/status/1681561541252984832

 

[Riek s]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681561541252984832

View: https://twitter.com/faustocoppi60/status/1681561541252984832

which has some good replies:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681606074753863681

View: https://twitter.com/RCCantabria/status/1681606074753863681

 

[Salvarani]

Pretty telling this backlash. Everyone knows.

If it continues or the masses are actually starting to get more and more critical, they might have to step in. We will see, I guess.

 

[RobertCrawley]

4 controls: Jumbo: We are happy to participate in this

Extra doping checks at the start of stage 17 for Jumbo-Visma and UAE Team Emirates - "We are happy to participate in this"

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, str...

cyclinguptodate.com

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, strong performances often lead to questions. The race has taken action immediately, but the team involved were happy to take part in extra testing.

“I applaud this," Richard Plugge told Wielerflits. "In fact, I also worked hard for this. In this way we are taking another step in the fight against doping. Jonas Vingegaard has had no less than four blood tests in the last 48 hours. We are happy to participate in this.” A spokesperson for UAE Team Emirates shared similar thoughts: “I think this is only good for cycling. We have no problem with this."

 

[Red Lobster]

4 controls: Jumbo: We are happy to participate in this

Extra doping checks at the start of stage 17 for Jumbo-Visma and UAE Team Emirates - "We are happy to participate in this"

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, str...

cyclinguptodate.com

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, strong performances often lead to questions. The race has taken action immediately, but the team involved were happy to take part in extra testing.

“I applaud this," Richard Plugge told Wielerflits. "In fact, I also worked hard for this. In this way we are taking another step in the fight against doping. Jonas Vingegaard has had no less than four blood tests in the last 48 hours. We are happy to participate in this.” A spokesperson for UAE Team Emirates shared similar thoughts: “I think this is only good for cycling. We have no problem with this."

Have they now taken from Armstrong the mantle of "most tested" rider?

 

[nightowl]

4 controls: Jumbo: We are happy to participate in this

Extra doping checks at the start of stage 17 for Jumbo-Visma and UAE Team Emirates - "We are happy to participate in this"

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, str...

cyclinguptodate.com

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, strong performances often lead to questions. The race has taken action immediately, but the team involved were happy to take part in extra testing.

“I applaud this," Richard Plugge told Wielerflits. "In fact, I also worked hard for this. In this way we are taking another step in the fight against doping. Jonas Vingegaard has had no less than four blood tests in the last 48 hours. We are happy to participate in this.” A spokesperson for UAE Team Emirates shared similar thoughts: “I think this is only good for cycling. We have no problem with this."

Heh and as we know, never failing a drugs test is 100% proof you are squeaky clean

 

[Nick2413]

4 controls: Jumbo: We are happy to participate in this

Extra doping checks at the start of stage 17 for Jumbo-Visma and UAE Team Emirates - "We are happy to participate in this"

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, str...

cyclinguptodate.com

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, strong performances often lead to questions. The race has taken action immediately, but the team involved were happy to take part in extra testing.

“I applaud this," Richard Plugge told Wielerflits. "In fact, I also worked hard for this. In this way we are taking another step in the fight against doping. Jonas Vingegaard has had no less than four blood tests in the last 48 hours. We are happy to participate in this.” A spokesperson for UAE Team Emirates shared similar thoughts: “I think this is only good for cycling. We have no problem with this."

If people believe this in cycling I have no hope for the human race when it comes to the actual *** we are told on far more serious topics.

 

[Pistolas]

---

4 controls: Jumbo: We are happy to participate in this

Extra doping checks at the start of stage 17 for Jumbo-Visma and UAE Team Emirates - "We are happy to participate in this"

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, str...

cyclinguptodate.com

After the performance of Jonas Vingegaard in the Tour de France's time-trial, speculation and doubts have surged through social media regarding the validity. A fruit of cycling's dark doping past, strong performances often lead to questions. The race has taken action immediately, but the team involved were happy to take part in extra testing.

“I applaud this," Richard Plugge told Wielerflits. "In fact, I also worked hard for this. In this way we are taking another step in the fight against doping. Jonas Vingegaard has had no less than four blood tests in the last 48 hours. We are happy to participate in this.” A spokesperson for UAE Team Emirates shared similar thoughts: “I think this is only good for cycling. We have no problem with this."

One can only imagine dark fantasies if Vingo or Poggi or both, test positive this Tour. Omerta is just not for cyclists and teams, commentators, organizations staff, sponsors and all the rest of the circus around remember very well how much they lost in the past.

 

[ashhutch1997]

Have they now taken from Armstrong the mantle of "most tested" rider?

Next thing you know, they'll be paying thousands of ££££ the UCI, help 'fight doping'

 

[Rackham]

I disagree a bit. Vingegaard doesn't look terrible on the TT bike. His back has a weird hump (like armstrong), which would indicate a little strained position. But he looks mangnitudes better than Froome on a TT bike. His weird leg movement seemed to be a way to get some release from his position.

I can't critique his TT position, it is much better than most of his climbing competitors. (still think it looks less than WVA.. but aerodynamics are a *** to predict.). But a good TT position doesn't mean he should roflstomp other TTers with an equal or better position. And on this parcour, TT position has a lot less effect then those @ > 50km/h

I think the point I'm making (which can get lost in the flurry of posts) is by & large a bubble has burst (certainly in my mind), i.e. whereby none of the technological mumbo jumbo relating to a rider's performance on a bike (w/kg, route, rider profile, aero, position on a TT bike, equipment, nutrition etc.) really matters, at all.

Jumbo was quick to post on their social media about how yesterday was the culmination of all those aforementioned elements coming together but what's really going on is they've got themselves a lab rat on a bike. He might as well be a circus monkey. It just doesn't matter how he sits on the bike or what he's riding when he's pushing that sort of unnatural artificial power.

The rest is just inconsequential blablabla for nerds like ourselves to mull over and attempt to use as a means to translate what we see in front of our eyes & create plausible justification for the unjustifiable based on accepted cycling norms. This is a long-winded way of saying it's like Lance Armstrong's dominance being justified by people talking about his hard work, professionalism, stage recons & equipment superiority... when in reality he was sitting in a dark hotel room with the curtains drawn whilst getting a transfusion.

 

[ashhutch1997]

---

One can only imagine dark fantasies if Vingo or Poggi or both, test positive this Tour. Omerta is just not for cyclists and teams, commentators, organizations staff, sponsors and all the rest of the circus around remember very well how much they lost in the past.

I do think if Jumbo keep being greedy and constantly not letting breaks get away, other teams will start to get p*ssed off, and might break the 'omerta'.
Remember when USPS used to gift the yellow jersey to French teams and riders?

 

[Pistolas]

I do think if Jumbo keep being greedy and constantly not letting breaks get away, other teams will start to get p*ssed off, and might break the 'omerta'.
Remember when USPS used to gift the yellow jersey to French teams and riders?

I agree with you, but things are different now and it will not be enough. There will be pressure to let other team and rider win the Tour. It's the best for all.

 

[Peyroteo94]

UAE and Jumbo did extra anti doping tests. If Jonas is not caught, something new in on the menu again.

 

[Salvarani]

I agree with you, but things are different now and it will not be enough. There will be pressure to let other team and rider win the Tour. It's the best for all.

#Remco2024

 

[Salvarani]

UAE and Jumbo did extra anti doping tests. If Jonas is not caught, something new in on the menu again.

Doesnt have to be "something new" at all.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

I'm surprised they've been able to blood test him at all. Surely it must be gasoline that's pumping through his veins.

 

[perico]

If people believe this in cycling I have no hope for the human race when it comes to the actual *** we are told on far more serious topics.

I’m sorry you don’t believe in miracles.

 

[Riek s]

Doesnt have to be "something new" at all.

Or related to the person itself.


Not sure if blood work is the only thing to go by. At best they will see irregularities within the provided margins.
I suppose his power numbers + heartrate etc can also be a good measuring stick. is there a huge difference between certain days? do the power numbers match the speed he is doing.

His bloodwork can be compared to before blood work going years back and graph the complete evolution of some metrics (like they did with lance on his comeback, where most agreed it was doping, but it was within the margins...)