Teams & Riders Jonas Vingegaard thread: Love in Iberia

[dazaau]

Wout races plenty anytime he is able.

Jonas not coming back until the Dauphine was the most predictable thing. Having said that I have no doubt he will come back in terrifying shape. Pog will have a fight on his hands.

People hoping for him to come out and race LBL or Fleche were dreaming. Most likely if he was in full health you wouldn't see him at these races.

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

I don't like this return to the Armstrong calendar. One thing it´s to have a reduced calendar or only one-week races, but not even Froome did this.

The comparison should rightly be with Greg Lemond here, not Lance. Similar situation, Vinge forced to a very reduced calendar.

And a general term should rightly be a "Greg Calendar"

Spoiler

(a reduced Gregorian)

when his hunting accident coincidentally caused a revolutionary pivot change in the peleton, the riders hereafter with much more targeted season planning.

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

People hoping for him to come out and race LBL or Fleche were dreaming. Most likely if he was in full health you wouldn't see him at these races.

But you would still have seen him in Catalunya and Romandie.

 

[Netserk]

But you would still have seen him in Catalunya and Romandie.

There has been no indications that he would race Romandie, there has only ever been the hope of fans and false rumours/free speculation in the press. There has been no news, nothing to announce. He sticks to the schedule already announced, so he hasn't owed anyone any answers since they said he wouldn't be ready for Catalunya.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

when his hunting accident coincidentally caused a revolutionary pivot change in the peleton, the riders hereafter with much more targeted season planning.

Hunting accidents skyrocketed among amateur cyclists.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

So 3 months in a chamber...during a season. Even Pogi fans will miss him but is he missing cycling?

 

[Hugh Januss]

when his hunting accident coincidentally caused a revolutionary pivot change in the peleton, the riders hereafter with much more targeted season planning.

Which is ironic because with better targeting it would have never happened.

 

[Rackham]

There has been no indications that he would race Romandie, there has only ever been the hope of fans and false rumours/free speculation in the press. There has been no news, nothing to announce. He sticks to the schedule already announced, so he hasn't owed anyone any answers since they said he wouldn't be ready for Catalunya.

The impression of Vingegaard as a MIA (missing in action) rider also stems from the fact he ended his 2024 season early last August. So it's accumulative. Add his pre-2024 TdF crash into the picture and it basically looks like there was a pre-Itzulia 2024 Vinge and now a post-Itzulia 2024 Vinge.

He wasn't exactly setting Paris-Nice on fire either before his DNF. I mean maybe some people have forgotten (it might seem that way because people now say he's all about the TdF and nothing else) but his spring 2023 season was insane and his Itzulia demolition was on par with Pog's best non-TdF performances at the time.

It means Vinge was pretty much the best stage racer in the world back then, i.e. whether it was in the Tour or not.

 

[Netserk]

The impression of Vingegaard as a MIA (missing in action) rider also stems from the fact he ended his 2024 season early last August. So it's accumulative. Add his pre-2024 TdF crash into the picture and it basically looks like there was a pre-Itzulia 2024 Vinge and now a post-Itzulia 2024 Vinge.

He wasn't exactly setting Paris-Nice on fire either before his DNF. I mean maybe some people have forgotten (it might seem that way because people now say he's all about the TdF and nothing else) but his spring 2023 season was insane and his Itzulia demolition was on par with Pog's best non-TdF performances at the time.

It means Vinge was pretty much the best stage racer in the world back then, i.e. whether it was in the Tour or not.

He already said before(?) Algarve that he approached the spring differently this year, with no altitude camp before PN. And the only stage in PN before his crash where he was in action was a temporarily neutralised stage in the cold. Without his crash and concussion, I think he'd have been at least top-2 in both PN and Catalunya and there really wouldn't have been any grounds for this conversation.

 

[Sciatic]

The comparison should rightly be with Greg Lemond here, not Lance. Similar situation, Vinge forced to a very reduced calendar.

And a general term should rightly be a "Greg Calendar"

Spoiler

(a reduced Gregorian)

when his hunting accident coincidentally caused a revolutionary pivot change in the peleton, the riders hereafter with much more targeted season planning.

I don’t think that’s fair to Lemond. Prior to the accident he road all the classics that a GC guy of that era would do, with several podiums. In his comeback year 1989, he road the Giro (poorly) before winning the Tour. Post Tour he rode (and I think was 3rd) at championships of Zurich, then won the road world’s title. And prior to this year, the last time the prior year’s Tour champion rode Roubaix was Lemond. Does that sound like Vingegaard? He did change his approach racing less in 91-93 as his form was fading.

 

[dazaau]

The comparison should rightly be with Greg Lemond here, not Lance. Similar situation, Vinge forced to a very reduced calendar.

And a general term should rightly be a "Greg Calendar"

Spoiler

(a reduced Gregorian)

when his hunting accident coincidentally caused a revolutionary pivot change in the peleton, the riders hereafter with much more targeted season planning.

Lance's calendar would be being very generous. He raced (ok, participated in) MSR, Flanders, GW, san Sebastian, Amstel gold, LBL as well as the usual week long stage races...

 

[Extinction]

I don’t think that’s fair to Lemond. Prior to the accident he road all the classics that a GC guy of that era would do, with several podiums. In his comeback year 1989, he road the Giro (poorly) before winning the Tour. Post Tour he rode (and I think was 3rd) at championships of Zurich, then won the road world’s title. And prior to this year, the last time the prior year’s Tour champion rode Roubaix was Lemond. Does that sound like Vingegaard? He did change his approach racing less in 91-93 as his form was fading.

Lemond was an American pioneer in Europe, which overshadowed his physical talent. He was cast into a world that wasn't Kansas anymore, an Oz without national accommodations such as english speaking riders have today. In his first years he had to deal with language barriers, a homesick wife, no social media to offset his trials and tribulations, no team structure, unlike Armstrong, to cater to his cultural needs. I'd say this is why he entered seasons so below form, to then have to overcome the deficit to be good in the Tour. Even so, a suboptimal Lemond managed 4th in Roubaix and the Giro. Today, however, he'd be riding from March to October at the level his 92 Vo2 max, power and resistence merited. He'd also have better cadence, better physiological understanding and superior support. I mean he, on a French team, had to overcome Hinault and Fignon back then, when national allegiances took precedent over pure talent.

 

[theyoungest]

The impression of Vingegaard as a MIA (missing in action) rider also stems from the fact he ended his 2024 season early last August. So it's accumulative. Add his pre-2024 TdF crash into the picture and it basically looks like there was a pre-Itzulia 2024 Vinge and now a post-Itzulia 2024 Vinge.

He wasn't exactly setting Paris-Nice on fire either before his DNF. I mean maybe some people have forgotten (it might seem that way because people now say he's all about the TdF and nothing else) but his spring 2023 season was insane and his Itzulia demolition was on par with Pog's best non-TdF performances at the time.

It means Vinge was pretty much the best stage racer in the world back then, i.e. whether it was in the Tour or not.

His 2024 before Pais Vasco was amazing as well. People just don't give him credit for that sort of stuff, they want to see him in races that don't suit him (i.e. the classics).

Personally I'd just be happy if we see him in anything approaching his best form, come the Dauphiné. His climbing has been below par for more than a year now, there's multiple reasons for that of course but still. He's the only one who can challenge Pogacar for the Tour win, plain and simple. If he doesn't have it, it will be another pretty predictable July.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

His 2024 before Pais Vasco was amazing as well. People just don't give him credit for that sort of stuff, they want to see him in races that don't suit him (i.e. the classics).

Personally I'd just be happy if we see him in anything approaching his best form, come the Dauphiné. His climbing has been below par for more than a year now, there's multiple reasons for that of course but still. He's the only one who can challenge Pogacar for the Tour win, plain and simple. If he doesn't have it, it will be another pretty predictable July.

His climbing wasn't really below par on Plateau de Beille, so it's not been over a year straight.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Vingegaard was the second best climber at the Tour and without Pogacar would have had an easy win. Climbing this year hasn’t been to his norm but the TTs have been good and he still has time for it to all come together. If he can come back last year crazy strong, he should have no doubt unless he absolutely stinks at CDD.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Lemond was an American pioneer in Europe, which overshadowed his physical talent. He was cast into a world that wasn't Kansas anymore, an Oz without national accommodations such as english speaking riders have today. In his first years he had to deal with language barriers, a homesick wife, no social media to offset his trials and tribulations, no team structure, unlike Armstrong, to cater to his cultural needs. I'd say this is why he entered seasons so below form, to then have to overcome the deficit to be good in the Tour. Even so, a suboptimal Lemond managed 4th in Roubaix and the Giro. Today, however, he'd be riding from March to October at the level his 92 Vo2 max, power and resistence merited. He'd also have better cadence, better physiological understanding and superior support. I mean he, on a French team, had to overcome Hinault and Fignon back then, when national allegiances took precedent over pure talent.

Obviously this is an exercise in fantasy, but just to pass the time, how do you think he would do if you plunked him down and had him born in 1998?

 

[Extinction]

Obviously this is an exercise in fantasy, but just to pass the time, how do you think he would do if you plunked him down and had him born in 1998?

Well, that's a tough call, because the differences between generations are too large in terms of how riders prepare and race today. But on physical prowess alone, I'd put him up there with today's best. Perhaps he'd be like Rogilc or Remco today. The former because of his incredible resiliance to adversity, the latter because of his aerodynamics and power. He also had a formidable sprint amongst non-specialists and could have won, I think, any monument today, given how they would prepare him now (he was excellent on the pave, short explosive climbs and long distances). In this sense, Pogacar comes to mind. He was similarly a true all-rounder. Mentally, however, Greg was subject to mood swings, so I don't think he would be as placid as Tadej.

 

[RJH]

When I read of a collapsed lung for Jonas after his Itzulia 2024 crash, I feared some permanent damage.

I hope this is not the case, and that he will come back stronger in the Tour of 2025…

 

[AupaPyama]

What a boring rider! Should be racing in the Armstrong era.

 

[noob]

No.
In 2021 he was strong enough to stay with Pog in Itzulia, in 2022 he became famous not knowing the jerseys in TA and crashing uphill into people in Itzulia and in 2023 and 2024... we know.

He really isn't discreet towards his shape through the year except for 2025.

Maybe this is the reasons his team and teammates didn't notice his concussion in Paris-Nice!

I am only half joking. If Jonas talked like concussed Horner it would make more sense than Horner talking like concussed Horner.