Jonathan Tiernan-Locke written to by UCI, asked to explain blood values

[thehog]

Between page 28-33 you will find him mentioned lots of times. Which is already more than enough.

So you can't quote me anything. Because on those pages everyone was taking about Carlton Kirby and his poor commentary.

One poster said "Simon goes" and other "maybe he'll hang on".

And that's it!!

And that's for forum discussing Simon? You are kidding me right?

That thread everyone couldn't help but ignore his attack and talk about Kirby, TVG, Froome, the Clinic.

Barely a mention of Simon.

I mean seriously.

 

[kingjr]

I mean seriously who here has ever heard of El Fares or Simon?

So you can show me a post on this forum in regards to Simon? In the PRR thread?

Speaks volumes really

So we showed you more than one, from the biggest bike race in the world. And I'm sure if you go back to 2012 you will find him mentioned in here too, he had a reputation as a good sprinter on tough finishes long before the Tour 2013. 2013 was when the broader audience who is not as enthusiastic as most members of this forum first heard about him.

 

[thehog]

Speaks volumes really

So we showed you more than one, from the biggest bike race in the world. And I'm sure if you go back to 2012 you will find him mentioned in here too, he had a reputation as a good sprinter on tough finishes long before the Tour 2013. 2013 was when the broader audience who is not as enthusiastic as most members of this forum first heard about him.

What you showed me was race commentary whereby the forum was ignoring his ill fainted attack.

The guy doesn't have his own thread and I can't see you ever mentioning his name.

But apparently now he's a super talent and because JTL beat him once, JTL must have been doping.

French guys attacking on a non-day at the Tour. That's occurred how many times?

Those French guys with the wild card enteries into the Tour. Watch out for them..,

 

[thehog]

So you can't quote me anything. Because on those pages everyone was taking about Carlton Kirby and his poor commentary.

One poster said "Simon goes" and other "maybe he'll hang on".

And that's it!!

And that's for forum discussing Simon? You are kidding me right?

That thread everyone couldn't help but ignore his attack and talk about Kirby, TVG, Froome, the Clinic.

Barely a mention of Simon.

I mean seriously.

That is funny.

Can I quote the JTL threads about the bots saying he'll win the tour?

 

[kingjr]

But apparently now he's a super talent

Please don't make stuff up. No one ever said that. You put him down as a rider who no one in here has ever heard of. Period.

Why not make a poll in the PRR section "Have you heard of Julien Simon, yes or no"?

 

[Mellow Velo]

French guy attacks in Tour stage and didn't win.... Seriously?

You mean to say a French rider attacked in the Tour de France, on a stage that didn't matter and he didn't win? Really. Not like that's never happened before.

Must be a deign for success! Lol!

And your posts on Simon in that thread are...... and you were saying he was a guy to watch out for? And detailed his talents.

Now that is Bot-Logic personified!

My Velogames TDF team from last year.

http://www.velogames.com/tour-de-france/2013/teamroster.php?tid=51c2d7eeb9c99141

My game, I think.

 

[thehog]

Please don't make stuff up. No one ever said that. You put him down as a rider who no one in here has ever heard of. Period.

Why not make a poll in the PRR section "Have you heard of Julien Simon, yes or no"?

I was just reading the JTL thread in the PRR:

Comment from Gilbert is interesting:

"This parcours was much too hard for a February race," he jokingly told Sportwereld as he reached the finish on Sunday.

"The problem is that you can't really compete with the guys that have Haut-Var as an objective," Gilbert explained. "Take the Brit who won: I don't know the boy, and I may not ride against him again this year [Jonathan Tiernan-Locke]. My conclusion of Sunday's race is that my condition is good. I came to this two-day race in order to sweat, training for what is to follow. Mission accomplished."

and

''The Tour de Haut Var was my favorite pro race. The day before the 2005 edition, I was out riding around the circuit with my Italian team mates and we were stopped by the police so the amateur version could go by. As we stood about chatting and waiting, but not really paying much attention, the race shot past and out of the breakaway some kid shouted "Southam!" and waved. It was Jonathan Tiernan-Locke. I found out that night that JTL had won, and now, seven years later, he has won the real thing too. ''

Tom Southam

 

[kingjr]

How is that a reply to my post? And if it's not why did you quote it

 

[thehog]

My Velogames TDF team from last year.

http://www.velogames.com/tour-de-france/2013/teamroster.php?tid=51c2d7eeb9c99141

My game, I think.

Nice one!

So random French guy was unclassed or wild card?

Each team must contain 2 All-Rounders, 2 Climbers, 1 Sprinter, 3 Unclassed Riders and 1 Wild Card. The Wild Card selection may be from any rider category, and allows a team manager to specialise somewhat in the team they pick.

 

[thehog]

He was never going to be a team leader. Its a massive step up from where he was to where he is now. Just the level of riders he is riding against is a massive step up, so going in straight away is silly.

It will be interesting however what he will be for L-B-L etc though.

How is that a reply to my post? And if it's not why did you quote it

Sorry I was just reading through the JTL thread on PRR.

Anyway I look forward to the Simon thread. I'll start it and let's see the responses we get. I'm sure they'll be multiple pages

 

[kingjr]

Sorry I was just reading through the JTL thread on PRR.

Anyway I look forward to the Simon thread. I'll start it and let's see the responses we get. I'm sure they'll be multiple pages

And what would be the purpose of that?

 

[Mellow Velo]

Nice one!

So random French guy was unclassed or wild card?

Unclassed.
A pretty good points return for a cheap buy.
Picked him on seeing those 3 wins the year before
and his form coming into Le Tour.

You kind of walked into that one.

 

[thehog]

Unclassed.
A pretty good points return for a cheap buy.
Picked him on seeing those 3 wins the year before
and his form coming into Le Tour.

You kind of walked into that one.

Not at all & good for you.

JTL was able outclimb on a 2km climb in February a "unclassed" Frenchman who once attacked on a Tour stage and lost.

Impressive. Good work. Must mean JTL is a doper but stopped at Sky

Yes? (but not at the Worlds, he was still doping then under Sky's prep and training).

 

[kingjr]

He also won a stage in a race in February where he left the likes of Garzelli, Moncoutie, Pinot and Quintana behind on a climb.

 

[DirtyWorks]

He also won a stage in a race in February where he left the likes of Garzelli, Moncoutie, Pinot and Quintana behind on a climb.

In February. Which, for most elite cyclists is not a peak month. Well, except for Sky who could (??) peak for months at a time.

 

[DirtyWorks]

He also won a stage in a race in February where he left the likes of Garzelli, Moncoutie, Pinot and Quintana behind on a climb.

In February. Which, for most elite cyclists is not a peak month. Well, except for Sky who could (??) peak for months at a time. 2014 seems different though.

 

[thehog]

In February. Which, for most elite cyclists is not a peak month. Well, except for Sky who could (??) peak for months at a time. 2014 seems different though.

Correct.

Steve Cummings won in 2014. So you can see the big hitters really come out play in Feb!

In 2012 there were four stages. 135km, 140km, 110km and 77km.

Tough race

And 2012

Once again, the winter weather was the real winner in this race, as there was debate as to whether the stage should even be held. Heavy snowfall shut down roads on Mont Faron, the planned finish. The stage was then reduced to only 77km, with the finish atop the Col de Garde.

Sounds like ProTour rider heaven!

 

[pmcg76]

So still waiting for Hog to come up with a rider who jumped from decent continental level to winning 2.1 races in the space of a few months. I think it's going to be a very long wait but just watch him avoid this one for as long as he can

 

[thehog]

So still waiting for Hog to come up with a rider who jumped from decent continental level to winning 2.1 races in the space of a few months. I think it's going to be a very long wait but just watch him avoid this one for as long as he can

I'm not avoiding anything. If you wish to prove a point then supply the details.

I've provided more than enough data to support my position. If you're struggling to find a rebuttal then maybe there's no supporting data for your argument?

Have a think about it.

 

[kingjr]

And in march that year he climbed together with Quintana in the Vuelta de Murcia who dropped him in the end but he came in third still just after Poels ahead the likes of Sanchez and Gesink. No snow there. Not bad.

 

[kingjr]

@Hog, btw, I haven't been following this thread for so long, so it would be great if you could outline your exact position on JTL in a few words, or if you have done that before in this thread name me the respective page, thanks in advance!

 

[pmcg76]

I'm not avoiding anything. If you wish to prove a point then supply the details.

I've provided more than enough data to support my position. If you're struggling to find a rebuttal then maybe there's no supporting data for your argument?

Have a think about it.

Well you are claiming that going from decent continental level to winning 2.1 stage races is natural progression. I am saying that is BS and backing that up by saying there are no riders who have made that jump like JTL did, so if it is a natural progression like you claim, there should be lots of riders who you can find to counter my claim. I guess there was Sayer and Gabrovski

In case you are wondering, the supporting data would be the highlighted part.

 

[thehog]

And in march that year he climbed together with Quintana in the Vuelta de Murcia who dropped him in the end but he came in third still just after Poels ahead the likes of Sanchez and Gesink. No snow there. Not bad.

Agreed. At Murica Italians are banned from racing. It's also two stages, one being a 12km ITT. It's not Paris-Nice!

I linked the video earlier and stated it looked like a Dad's Sunday ride for the PT teams involved.

The teams on the front towards the end were all lower ranked. And understandably so, it makes sense the lower ranked teams target smaller early season races whereas PT riders and teams have bigger objectives later in the year.

And truth be told no one is watching Murica on TV for it to be of interest for sponsors.

Trying to pretend these races are bigger than they are is foolhardy. Read the GC list in that race. It's not who's who of stage racing or one day racing. You make it sound like it was Liege or something. It was March 2nd the pros are just getting warmed up.

Sure JTL did very well but he wasn't wining Amstel, LBL or coming 2nd at the Vuelta.

 

[kingjr]

With that sort of performance I'm seeing I'm almost certain he would have been up there in Liege. Top 20 at least, without bad luck.

Anyway

"I came really focused to this Vuelta a Murcia," Quintana said at the finish.

"I knew that, despite the last descent, this was a stage suiting me really well, and that's why I rode really concentrated to my objective. The team left me in perfect position before the climb, Tiernan-Locke attacked really hard at the foot and I went for him. He pushed hard all climb and tried to drop me like he did in Haut Var, but I stood his pace and made my attack with 1.5k from the summit."

Really not bad.

 

[thehog]

Well you are claiming that going from decent continental level to winning 2.1 stage races is natural progression. I am saying that is BS and backing that up by saying there are no riders who have made that jump like JTL did, so if it is a natural progression like you claim, there should be lots of riders who you can find to counter my claim. I guess there was Sayer and Gabrovski

In case you are wondering, the supporting data would be the highlighted part.

That's just stupid. Because you've made up the criteria and said this is "binary". What you're saying is "it can only be this way"; which is very poor reasoning.

I guess the question to ask you is; what is the correct way for natural progression?

I've shown his progression through the junior ranks, sickness and then the slow build back from 2008 to his 2012 results.

The races he won in 2012 he was also fortunate with weather, shorten stages and the were all in jan/feb/March.

After that he trained with Sky was injured and then came back to win ToB and perform very well at WC.

But seriously the fact that he won a 77km stage where Mont Faron was cut from the stage is obvious. Steve Cummings won in 2014 with Mont Faron included. Does that tell you something?