Jumbo - QuickStep merger

[Salvarani]

It is everything I feared in my most doomsday predictions.

And as you well know, my most pressimistic outlooks can be, well, pretty pessimistic.

But your self awareness is very good, compared to others.

 

[Ricco']

I'd imagine (we don't know) but it will be a much smaller calendar.

I don't believe any of the big races wants to be part of that. Starting with the Tour, who in my opinion gains nothing with it, in sporting terms (the biggest stars already want to start it every time, nothing would change regarding that) and possibily in TV rights that would be connected to the new series.

The Giro might want to join it but I also doubt because this series would in my opinion also bring another dreadful thing - if they want the riders to ride every race, no more 3 week GTs. We would get instead the 2 week GTs that some people are already talking about.

 

[theyoungest]

How can anybody think that would be a good idea?

I think the idea is that you have the best riders competing in the biggest races. A nightmare for the cycling purists, but from a marketing standpoint it makes more sense than what they're doing now: mostly avoiding each other. Just like the Champions League has killed the charm of football, but has made it very marketable.

 

[samhocking]

I don't believe any of the big races wants to be part of that. Starting with the Tour, who in my opinion gains nothing with it, in sporting terms (the biggest stars already want to start it every time, nothing would change regarding that) and possibily in TV rights that would be connected to the new series.

The Giro might want to join it but I also doubt because this series would in my opinion also bring another dreadful thing - if they want the riders to ride every race, no more 3 week GTs. We would get instead the 2 week GTs that some people are already talking about.

I would imagine the stakeholders (Bakala and Kok + those investing) would essentially buy the rights to a selection of races. As currently happens UCI's ranking continues as largely just a consequence ranking not a real ranking but the Super League series of races are run within the UCI Calendar with separate TV rights etc and the overally winner is the team with most points. Hence joining the best GT & best Classics squad together is almost guaranteed to win and return investment for Bakala & Kok + Lefevere & Plugge no doubt.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

I think the idea is that you have the best riders competing in the biggest races. A nightmare for the cycling purists, but from a marketing standpoint it makes more sense than what they're doing now: mostly avoiding each other. Just like the Champions League has killed the charm of football, but has made it very marketable.

Yes, but this wouldn‘t be the Champions League because there, teams still compete in other competitions, while that would be impossible if all the big riders did all the big races in the Cycling Super League.

 

[Ricco']

I would imagine the stakeholders (Bakala and Kok + those investing) would essentially buy the rights to a selection of races. As currently happens UCI's ranking continues as largely just a consequence ranking not a real ranking but the Super League series of races are run within the UCI Calendar with separate TV rights etc and the overally winner is the team with most points. Hence joining the best GT & best Classics squad together is almost guaranteed to win and return investment for Bakala & Kok + Lefevere & Plugge no doubt.

I remain sceptic. That sounds a lot like what Velon was created for and almost a decade later I can say that cycling would be the same with or without Velon. It didn't went past a fringe organization which even nowadays I don't know what they do of tangible action to grow cycling.

Their supposed groundbreaking series, the dreadful Hammer Series, never went past of being a mockery of the sport and never got to be more of a joke.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I think the idea is that you have the best riders competing in the biggest races. A nightmare for the cycling purists, but from a marketing standpoint it makes more sense than what they're doing now: mostly avoiding each other. Just like the Champions League has killed the charm of football, but has made it very marketable.

The problem would be that it would kill off the organisation of a lot of those ProSeries level and mid-tier races which, while they aren't as important and can attract a decent field still, would be frozen out of having any of those marketable top tier stars who they may have a level of reliance on to attract sponsors to cover organisational costs.

And then the other issue is that once you've locked off the top tier, you end up with a travelling circus that can then be sold off to the highest bidder, much like F1, so say goodbye to accessible races for the sport's fans and hello to more flyaway races in sportswashing nations. And the sport does well, but purely in a Supply Side Jesus fallacy way - average income might be going up, but everybody outside of the top few teams is impoverished. It may not happen immediately, but once some economic difficulties hit, they'll go that way... and then never go back.

But hey, small price to pay for making sure Jonathan Vaughters' team can't be relegated anymore, right?

 

[Panda Claws]

Super league time baby!

 

[joseph89]

These numbers surrounding the team's budget should a merger happen are huge

Visma - €20m
Amazon - €15m conflicting reports of them being a title or co-sponsor
Specialized - €15m
Soudal - €??

🤯

Fusieteam gaat vol voor Remco: Jumbo-Visma en Evenepoel zaten al rond tafel, snel duidelijkheid verwacht over superfusie

‘The sky’ lijkt ‘the limit’ voor Richard Plugge en co in het fusieverhaal op het allerhoogste wielerniveau. Visma leidt de dans. Amazon sluit alvast aan. Volgt Soudal? Groot ‘target’ wordt ook fietsenconstructeur Specialized. En wie Specialized zegt, denkt... Remco Evenepoel. Jumbo-Visma en de...

www.hln.be

 

[Samamba]

These nunbers surrounding the team's budget should a merger happen are huge

Visma - €20m
Amazon - €15m conflicting reports of them being a title or co-sponsor
Specialized - €15m
Soudal - €??

🤯

Fusieteam gaat vol voor Remco: Jumbo-Visma en Evenepoel zaten al rond tafel, snel duidelijkheid verwacht over superfusie

‘The sky’ lijkt ‘the limit’ voor Richard Plugge en co in het fusieverhaal op het allerhoogste wielerniveau. Visma leidt de dans. Amazon sluit alvast aan. Volgt Soudal? Groot ‘target’ wordt ook fietsenconstructeur Specialized. En wie Specialized zegt, denkt... Remco Evenepoel. Jumbo-Visma en de...

www.hln.be

"OMG Jumbo can't find sponsors"

 

[Rob5091]

I suppose it's one small part in this overall soap opera (or Reality TV show, for you kids) but Foss has signed for Ineos from Jumbo. There was a story about him waiting to see what happened, so whatever he was waiting for, it happened.
I have not been counting but it's not been many days since the Vuelta ended and Roglic was announced as a free man (Redhead Dane is the math expert here, I seem to recall ...)

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

So if there is any substance to this Amazon involvement with a big budget; if there is no desire on Evenepoel's part to play second string to Vingegaard; if Roglic is giving financial relief to Jumbo-Visma (or whatever its successor is to be called) by moving on; if Soudal want increased profile that they won't get from being the third sponsor on the team; if Cervelo don't want out and Specialised have no particular need of another team on their bikes; if Lefevre is saying that he doesn't want to stop being involved yet: now what is this all about?

 

[samhocking]

I remain sceptic. That sounds a lot like what Velon was created for and almost a decade later I can say that cycling would be the same with or without Velon. It didn't went past a fringe organization which even nowadays I don't know what they do of tangible action to grow cycling.

Their supposed groundbreaking series, the dreadful Hammer Series, never went past of being a mockery of the sport and never got to be more of a joke.

True, but Bakala & Kok are Ratlcliffe-level of wealth ie $Billions, Plugge is head of AIGCP

 

[yaco]

I am interested in how competitive Jayco are in their pitch to get Roglic - The back story is that when Alula visited the TDF they fell in love with the race and pressed jayco management how much it would cost to get a Roglic type rider who could possibly win the TDF - Apparently a certain allocation of money was added to the normal budget if this opportunity presented itself. The money is there !

 

[OlavEH]

Money issues

For both, and not just QS?

 

[Lequack]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1707667944820371568

View: https://twitter.com/tourdetietema/status/1707667944820371568

 

[noob]

View: https://youtu.be/nZ5vspsNS1g?si=roXlde6o3n6htP84

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

I am interested in how competitive Jayco are in their pitch to get Roglic - The back story is that when Alula visited the TDF they fell in love with the race and pressed jayco management how much it would cost to get a Roglic type rider who could possibly win the TDF - Apparently a certain allocation of money was added to the normal budget if this opportunity presented itself. The money is there !

So they dug out some wildly optimistic Irish journalism from five years ago and explained that it would cost 5 million to recruit Eddie Dunbar.

 

[theyoungest]

"OMG Jumbo can't find sponsors"

Chris Woerts is known as someone who doesn't exactly stick to the facts, and moreover he doesn't know much about cycling. I wouldn't take these numbers too seriously, even though they suit your narrative. He's been saying similar things about football club Feyenoord, for a decade now, and none of it has come to fruition.

Amazon being a new sponsor is probably true, the rest is quite unsure and quite unlikely. It's not even clear whether Amazon will be a title sponsor, as he claims.

 

[yaco]

So they dug out some wildly optimistic Irish journalism from five years ago and explained that it would cost 5 million to recruit Eddie Dunbar.

Nah - Jayco has actually put in a bid for Roglic and they have the budget. Whether they are successful is doubtful. It's better than your cynicism.

 

[tobydawq]

I think the idea is that you have the best riders competing in the biggest races. A nightmare for the cycling purists, but from a marketing standpoint it makes more sense than what they're doing now: mostly avoiding each other. Just like the Champions League has killed the charm of football, but has made it very marketable.

Okay, but do we really need to see Vingegaard in Roubaix or Philipsen in Lombardia?

 

[pastronef]

"OMG Jumbo can't find sponsors"

just for 2024. in 2025 the Jumbo 20M will be gone

 

[Gotland]

Just did a quick table with possible team. Left out most JV contract ending 2024, all exept Hessmann might stay?
Contract length accourdning to PCS.
Just went cost effective merge. Would have saved Tratnik, Pedersen, Vader and let Hagnes, Van Belle, Lamperti, Gelders and Vangheluwe stay in develop team 1 year.
Bastiaens just signed but feel not needed lot's of strong domestique for flat (and mountains).

New team		Sold/Leave		Buyout/Leave
VINGEGAARD Jonas		ROGLIČ Primož, 2025	Ineos/Movistar	MASNADA Fausto, 2024
EVENEPOEL Remco		ALAPHILIPPE Julian, 2024	French team?	SVRČEK Martin, 2024
VAN WILDER Ilan		TRATNIK Jan, 2024	UAE?	HIRT Jan, 2024
LANDA Mikel				PEDERSEN Casper, 2024
VANSEVENANT Mauri				BASTIAENS Ayco, 2025
VALTER Attila				ČERNÝ Josef, 2025
KELDERMAN Wilco				LAMPERTI Luke, 2026
GESINK Robert				HUBY Antoine, 2025
KRUIJSWIJK Steven				SERRY Pieter, 2025
KUSS Sepp				VANGHELUWE Warre, 2025
VAN AERT Wout				WARLOP Jordi, 2025
VAN BAARLE Dylan				HOFSTEDE Lennard, 2024
JORGENSON Matteo				BOUWMAN Koen, 2024
ASGREEN Kasper	Leave? If no JBV get buyout			VADER Milan, 2024
LAPORTE Christophe				VAN DIJKE Mick, 2024
LAMPAERT Yves				VAN DIJKE Tim, 2024
BENOOT Tiesj				HESSMANN Michel, 2024
KOOIJ Olav
MERLIER Tim	Leave? If no JBV get buyout
CATTANEO Mattia	Leave? If no JBV get buyout
AFFINI Edoardo
VERVAEKE Louis	Leave? If no JBV get buyout
TULETT Ben
VAN DER SANDE Tosh
HAGENES Per Strand
STAUNE-MITTET Johannes
VAN BELLE Loe
LECERF William Junior	Leave? If no JBV get buyout
GELDERS Gil	Leave? If no JBV get buyout
GLOAG Thomas

 

[Tim Cahill]

Jumbo-Visma riders about to be asked to opt-out of the European Working TIme Directive, only a matter of time before they get the union busters in too.

 

[Berniece]

For both, and not just QS?

Only Jumbo. QS has no money issues, but Lefevere wants out, and this is a good time to exit.