JV talks, sort of

[Dear Wiggo]

From Vaughters twitter, he denies this

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters 10 t

@Digger_forum I am saying you are lying and fabricating a story regarding Magnus and an internal control. Absolutely.

I just added it so we have JV's take on this close together in the thread.

Thanks - the conversation got so disjointed that even though I looked I did not see much of the response - none of this. Much appreciated.

I hate Twitter.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

And 7 of 9 was a total babe.No such thing's in the clinic.

La Flo has a beautiful mind

 

[horsinabout]

Bahahaha. That is funny.

I never made the Clinic 12 up. Wrong person. Voting? Why would the Clinic 12 need to vote! JV from what I know is the one with the list. Ask him for the names.

Do note I never considered myself apart of the Clinic 12...gotta be really cool to join them. But if you're saying I am an honorary member, then yeah! I'll take that. BC's approval pending of course.

Voting is democtratic. Those who stand for election need to state their intentions, thus giving you, the voter, an opportunity to route out who might be the frauds and who the crack pots are!

 

[Ferminal]

From Vaughters twitter, he denies this

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters 10 t

@Digger_forum I am saying you are lying and fabricating a story regarding Magnus and an internal control. Absolutely.

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters 10 t

@Digger_forum Maybe you should address your extremely dishonest, libelous behavior that you consistently engage in?

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters 10 t

@Digger_forum I really hope Magnus sues you. Nothing would give me more pleasure than having his records put forward under oath.

I just added it so we have JV's take on this close together in the thread.

Doesn't make sense to me, thought Maggie would have given up the sauce by the time he was riding at Slipstream.

 

[Benotti69]

If I had a wet-nurse, I wouldn't need this forum.

Are you not a wet-nurse to your riders keeping them above board at testing?

 

[blackcat]

Are you not a wet-nurse to your riders keeping them above board at testing?

gynecomastia

 

[ToreBear]

Doesn't make sense to me, thought Maggie would have given up the sauce by the time he was riding at Slipstream.

It seems to be Digger forum or someone bringing up the accusation. This seems to have been later deleted. Fraudstrong also took to it. The end result is JV vigorously denies that the accusation is correct. He was not dumped as a result of internal testing.


Whether he did or didn't dope before or after has not been discussed as far as I know.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Retiring in February seems legit.

 

[rinse clear]

Clinc 12 sounds fun can i join.

 

[blackcat]

Clinc 12 sounds fun can i join.

yeah, sure. run it past jonny vee, he is our patron.

 

[rinse clear]

yeah, sure. run it past jonny vee, he is our patron.

Righto thanks for that

 

[rinse clear]

But in all serious Hope Garmin have good tour. Radioshank will not have two big weapons there

 

[Climeon]

Hi Jv, just in the off chance you read this, here are some questions I was hoping you'd answer:
How much of what your riders do in a race e.g. where they (counter)attack is dictated by the riders and how much is dictated by the DS?
You previously said you thought 85% of the peleton was clean. I was wondering where you think the remaining 15% are riding. Is it mainly on a few teams? or is it the case that although some teams have a slightly higher percentage of dopers than others, dopers are spread throughout most teams?
Is it plausible that you can go from being poor (e.g. p30 or worse with no stage wins and not doing much) in one race to being in tour winning form five weeks later
Finally I was wondering what your opinion on Sastre
Many thanks if you do answer these questions

 

[Ripper]

yeah, sure. run it past jonny vee, he is our patron.

Right! Now that I know the process ...

JV - Can I join the Clinic 12 in their mission to ... you know ... stir up stuff in the clinic?

 

[gooner]

Retiring in February seems legit.

And so we should take this accusation as gospel?

The minute JV said Magnus should sue his *** the tweets were automatically deleted.

No basis and substance to it and if there was confidence in what he was tweeting why delete it all in the end.

 

[thehog]

JV if you truly wish to save cycling.

Do something.

You know it's not real.

Your Garmin guys are getting killed.

 

[Galic Ho]

Borg is from Star Trek, not BSG. Good grief.

Wake up. The final 12 (substitute for the Clinic 12) is from BSG. Everybody knows Jeri Ryan is 7 of 9 from Voyager for FRAK sake!

Catching on Wiggo? I am saying the Clinic 12 are Cylons. Robots. Machines. Frakking toasters!

 

[Galic Ho]

Voting is democtratic. Those who stand for election need to state their intentions, thus giving you, the voter, an opportunity to route out who might be the frauds and who the crack pots are!

The Clinic 12 are chosen by a secret means. Ain't no call in that nor any form of democracy. When has pro cycling ever been democratic other than dopers protesting at the side of the road before a stage starts?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

And so we should take this accusation as gospel?

No not at all. Signing a contract for another year with a team, then "retiring" from said team in March and starting your own team instead is perfectly legit.

 

[Galic Ho]

Right! Now that I know the process ...

JV - Can I join the Clinic 12 in their mission to ... you know ... stir up stuff in the clinic?

You have to have JV say something cool to you.

Like he did to me. Said if he did something I had permission to shoot him. Not that I'd do that.

 

[blackcat]

JV if you truly wish to save cycling.

Do something.

You know it's not real.

Your Garmin guys are getting killed.

and you dont see a problem with this post?

premise inherent is and inside and outside peloton. a doping. clean. clean gets killed. if all are clean, someone still gets killed. why does Garmin axiomatically deserve status on the pointy end.

Remember, Sky have their muscular christianity and chariots of fire and gordonstoun. what do you have?the philosophy of muscular christianity

 

[blackcat]

I'll help you out. jay vee responds to me, so i'll get the answer.

<yeah, points below> what he said. his question.

Hi Jv, just in the off chance you read this, here are some questions I was hoping you'd answer:
How much of what your riders do in a race e.g. where they (counter)attack is dictated by the riders and how much is dictated by the DS?
You previously said you thought 85% of the peleton was clean. I was wondering where you think the remaining 15% are riding. Is it mainly on a few teams? or is it the case that although some teams have a slightly higher percentage of dopers than others, dopers are spread throughout most teams?
Is it plausible that you can go from being poor (e.g. p30 or worse with no stage wins and not doing much) in one race to being in tour winning form five weeks later
Finally I was wondering what your opinion on Sastre
Many thanks if you do answer these questions

I'll help you out. jay vee responds to me, so i'll get the answer.

<yeah, points below> what he said.

 

[JV1973]

I'll help you out. jay vee responds to me, so i'll get the answer.

<yeah, points below> what he said. his question.

I'll help you out. jay vee responds to me, so i'll get the answer.

<yeah, points below> what he said.

Complicated questions, which I don't have exact answers for. My general opinion is that the most effective o2 vector methods of doping have been very limited by bio passport, new methods, and outright fear. Limited, does not mean eliminated. But if you limited the gains made by o2 vector doping, even the 15% will not have much of an advantage and it does not preclude a clean rider from winning. That's my greater point, is that doping is far from gone, but it is contained enough to allow superior physiology to win. That is a far cry from 10 yrs ago or even 6 years ago. It's a far cry from perfect too, I realize that.

but, I am an optimist, even when I get made fun of for it.

Sastre, I cannot comment on his early career, but my opinion of his 08 Tour victory is generally positive. in 08 AFLD controlled the testing at the Tour and were pushing it very hard. Patrice Clerq and Gilbert Ysern were the principles at ASO and were willing to make hard, but good, choices to clean up the race. I miss those guys. Absolute tragedy they got fired in the UCI vs ASO scuffle. They did everything they could in 08 to test the riders for a fair race. everything.

Anyhow, if we look at the numbers on climbs, Sastre was within acceptable ranges on the climbs, with the exception of Alpe, which he was exceptional and slightly over 6w/kg. So, I can't say anything with certainty, but if forced to bet my life or my son's life on did Sastre dope or not dope in 2008 TdF? I would choose not dope.

And then I would cringe waiting to see if a gun fired.

JV

 

[JV1973]

JV if you truly wish to save cycling.

Do something.

You know it's not real.

Your Garmin guys are getting killed.

You know this is an impossible debate. If they get beat, I should denounce other teams. If they win, then they are doping. That is the general attitude of many here. How is it possible to have logical discourse when this bifurcated position is pre-established and worshipped?

It just isn't that simple. It used to be, I get that, but the equation is more complex these days.

 

[red_flanders]

You know this is an impossible debate. If they get beat, I should denounce other teams. If they win, then they are doping. That is the general attitude of many here. How is it possible to have logical discourse when this bifurcated position is pre-established and worshipped?

It just isn't that simple. It used to be, I get that, but the equation is more complex these days.

If you can't call out Sky I certainly get it, but I don't think it's credible to say this (Froome in particular) is complicated. Froome is just preposterous and everyone can see it. There's no credible argument that he's clean. You guys are literally being robbed. I guess from the cheap (or free as the case may be) seats, it's hard to swallow anything less than outrage as a genuine human reaction to what's going on.

Your position is complicated, but I don't see how the situation is. Maybe that's what you meant.