JV talks, sort of

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Oct 16, 2010
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the delgados said:
sniper:
My apologies; I didn't make myself clear in the previous post.
I have no doubt that JV is aware of doping in the peloton. The point I was trying to make is I think that perhaps JV's clean cycling project was meant in part to out Armstrong. I think you'll agree that he did a good job of doing so. I have a hard time believing that JV is overseeing a team-wide project, but i could be wrong.
Cycling has been corrupt since its inception, and I don't think it will ever change. I'm pretty sure everyone involved in the sport feels the same. Again, the point I was trying to make is I think JV's project is and was a part of a game. That's all.
no need to apologize, delgados!

are you suggesting he's not aware of doping on his own team?

I don't think 'team-wide project' is a useful term here, since we already have a much more widespread term for what Vaughters has implanted: internal testing.
A fair question is whether he's using the internal testing (a) with the true and noble purpose of running a clean team, or (b) with the more earthly purpose of guaranteeing that nobody trips the wire. My money is on (b), and the thread is full of evidence to that extent, but feel free to give arguments in favor of (a).

On another note, if his goal was to out Armstrong, and if he hated Armstrong so much, how do you explain the Lance love coming from the likes of Danielson and Wiggins?

Also, don't forget Lance's comeback was embellished with promises of internal testing very similar to Garmin. It was en vogue at that moment.

The best you can say about Vaughters is that he's played the media like none other and has very skillfully positioned himself as an anti-doping crusader. When you go look what he's actually done to fight doping, it's very very little. On the contrary, he's deliberately made a lot of people look the other way. Themes like 'new clean generation', 'now you can win clean', 'the dark era is behind us', etc., would currently not have had such momentum if it wasn't for Vaughters. 'Nothing to see here' has been Vaughters' principal message.
 
May 26, 2010
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sniper said:
the delgados said:
sniper:
My apologies; I didn't make myself clear in the previous post.
I have no doubt that JV is aware of doping in the peloton. The point I was trying to make is I think that perhaps JV's clean cycling project was meant in part to out Armstrong. I think you'll agree that he did a good job of doing so. I have a hard time believing that JV is overseeing a team-wide project, but i could be wrong.
Cycling has been corrupt since its inception, and I don't think it will ever change. I'm pretty sure everyone involved in the sport feels the same. Again, the point I was trying to make is I think JV's project is and was a part of a game. That's all.
no need to apologize, delgados!

are you suggesting he's not aware of doping on his own team?

I don't think 'team-wide project' is a useful term here, since we already have a much more widespread term for what Vaughters has implanted: internal testing.
A fair question is whether he's using the internal testing (a) with the true and noble purpose of running a clean team, or (b) with the more earthly purpose of guaranteeing that nobody trips the wire. My money is on (b), and the thread is full of evidence to that extent, but feel free to give arguments in favor of (a).

On another note, if his goal was to out Armstrong, and if he hated Armstrong so much, how do you explain the Lance love coming from the likes of Danielson and Wiggins?

Also, don't forget Lance's comeback was embellished with promises of internal testing very similar to Garmin. It was en vogue at that moment.

The best you can say about Vaughters is that he's played the media like none other and has very skillfully positioned himself as an anti-doping crusader. When you go look what he's actually done to fight doping, it's very very little. On the contrary, he's deliberately made a lot of people look the other way. Themes like 'new clean generation', 'now you can win clean', 'the dark era is behind us', etc., would currently not have had such momentum if it wasn't for Vaughters. 'Nothing to see here' has been Vaughters' principal message.
^ This is not even a compliment given that the full time cycling journalists are ready to be lied too and will repeat the team lies ad infinitum for a used bidon or old cycling cap. Dont need an MBA for that.......
 
Aug 3, 2010
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Taxus4a said:
sniper said:
Benotti69 said:
Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters · May 27
Try this one on: w 6 rider teams - are able to participate in more races, globally. instead of reducing costs, u increase value for sponsor
Hay JV how about getting rid of the doping and doping enablers and former dopers so when a sponsor puts money into the sport they dont get shat on???

All this talk of 'fixing' the sport for the sponsors but not fixing the cheating......that is really gonna work.

Congrats on Ryder in the 3rd week of a GT catching Contador on a climb. Clean riding at its best. :rolleyes:

Doping never went away.
good spot. the hypocrisy is epic.
Vaughters pretending to be some major clean cycling reformer will go down in the history books as one of the most blatant lies ever sold to the public.
Not sure why there aren't more people in the Clinic holding him to account for his pro-active lying (amongst others here on this very forum), demonstrable lies about clean cycling, the passport, calibration errors, not to mention his covering for Sky.
The whole "new clean generation" and "now you can win clean" talk owes its momentum to JV.

He played it well though. Coming in here was a smart move, caused several long-term posters to give him the benefit of the doubt, and the press was all like "wow, he's engaging with the fans on an internet doping forum".
Rider is an endurance rider, an amazing rider, and of course is a better rider for a 3rd week than Contador, specially in stages as today, long. And we will see how Hesjedal still treat the podium. I predicted that before this Giro in this forum,a s the same way i said hesjedal could won the Giro the year he won in an spanish forum.

You can think what you want, I want to tell the truth.

In the year previous to his Giro win, he was one of the best at the end of the Tour, he was just behind Contador, andy and Purito on Tourmalet stage, the only one for endurance riders of that Tour, the last one, with some climbs, quite long and a hard and long finish. He was very strong as well in the cobblestone stage. But that was in the transitional era, and Contador and Andy werent totally clean riders. Contador was ban for that Tour positive.

One year later he managed to win the Giro. They dont put time on him as Astana did this year the first week, they forgive him, and at the end he was one of the best on the mountains, and he had the ITT, where is is better than Purito.

He is not a very strong rider with hot, he isbetter with rain and cold...that was bad for him in some races, but when he has been good, he has show his strenth and his endurace in the clean era. He was key rider in the victories of Dan Martin in la Volta and Lieje, more than key, half the victory is for him. He crashed last Vuelta, but he managed to win in la Camperona, and he was almost with Quintana in the Giro in the best stage of the colombian last year. and quintana is a better climber than Contador, he wanst at his best 2014 Tirreno, but this year he beat Contador (none at his best).


You can go on with your logics of the past, but reallity is another one. and it is not only that reallity make sense, it is that your logics has no sense when you look at Mortirolo times records climbing, or when you look at Heutacam, Alp d huez.. you can live in the fantasy Pantani was a super rider, and for that his times are much better... or you can assume reality, although would be less funny for you, of course.

I think that is useless to be here trying to argue with some of you, and I think that JV or any other people that know well how is today cycling are going to lose his time in that, but, as I thought as you in the past, maybe is not ueless for everybody, and I have enought time to writte.

As Landa is not allowed to attack, O hope today Hesjedal put 5 minutes on Contador and get close to the podium.
amd that would be a proof of cleanliness, of course. (not with your logic, that is wrong from the begining)
You should write longer posts more often. Your use of the English language is much improved when you have enough on your mind to forget to include all the typos and misuses. :eek:
 
1. why would you be shocked if you haven't been living in a cave for the past 20 years.
2. 'some systematic team-wide doping project'? Don't overstate things, it's nothing spectacular. Managing a team in JV's case is about making sure nobody trips the wire. You doubt he's involved in that? lol. He basically invented internal testing. Has been closely involved in the development of the passport, known to spend big parts of the team budget on medical science in cycling.
3. have you read the thread? If you have, you wouldn't be shocked to hear JV is an enabler. Tell me what you think Vaughters was thinking when he hired Johnny Weltz, Alan Lim, Matt White, Hesjedal? "Gonna run a clean team and hire as much ex-USPS-ers as possible".
4. reading the thread, you will also come across the topic of calibration errors, including demonstrable lies from JV on the issue. To summarize that issue: you gotta be pretty gullible to believe USPS 1999, Wiggins 2009 and Hesjedal 2012 all suffered calibration errors while performing like they had never done before in their carreers.[/quote]

After Alan Lim stated in a long interview he knew nothing about doping at USPS I was pretty pissed off. A clear lie.

What really, really pisses me off now is that all these hipster anti-roadie roadie/gravel/crossers are all wet over Skratch Labs. Pure marketing trick, somehow he has these guys who actually dislike the PRO peloton now all hot for road cycling.

I'll never buy one of that dude's damn products after his lies. F him, F all the hipster dummies who think he's so cool and the anti-Power Bar/etc.
 
I could forgive JVs awful sense of style (sorry, just wearing a bunch of horrible patterns and retro glasses isn't "style" at all) if he were on hallucinogens, but blood doping should screw up your mind that badly.
 
Sep 29, 2012
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spetsa said:
You should write longer posts more often. Your use of the English language is much improved when you have enough on your mind to forget to include all the typos and misuses. :eek:
So I'm not the only one who sees the incongruity.
 
May 26, 2010
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So JV, the biggest sporting federation gets FBI'd and now Saalzar and not a peep. Thanks. Thanks for no longer pretending to care about corruption in sport, dopers or doping.

Last tweet about Formolo, Basso's protege kind tells me JV just cares about the porsches, flying, fine wines and $$$$$. The real JV.
 
May 26, 2009
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Benotti69 said:
So JV, the biggest sporting federation gets FBI'd and now Saalzar and not a peep. Thanks. Thanks for no longer pretending to care about corruption in sport, dopers or doping.

Last tweet about Formolo, Basso's protege kind tells me JV just cares about the porsches, flying, fine wines and $$$$$. The real JV.
Dude cut him some slack!! He's probably during a World Tour, making sure that all testing machines are working properly. MCE's are a huge problem in sports. :D
 
Oct 6, 2009
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Benotti69 said:
So JV, the biggest sporting federation gets FBI'd and now Saalzar and not a peep. Thanks. Thanks for no longer pretending to care about corruption in sport, dopers or doping.

Last tweet about Formolo, Basso's protege kind tells me JV just cares about the porsches, flying, fine wines and $$$$$. The real JV.
Why would JV tweet about that stuff? It appears that his dream is to one day become a fatcat sports bureaucrat too. Run the UCI. The next Hein Verbruggen. Get into bed with Johan. Business deals with Oleg. Money and power. Change World Champ jersey into rainbow argyle. If he's lucky, move up to the IOC where the real money is. Don't cross JV.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Benotti69 said:
Puckfiend said:
I hope JV remembers all us little people when he hits the big time!
For sure, he'll need someone to polish the cars...............
blackcat wont be polishing anything else for JV. /thirdperson

might be able to produce a few private dance concessions at Yellow Rose thru CSE if JV is down Austin

*Capital Sports & Entertainment, Knaggs and Stapleton
 
May 26, 2010
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educated man with a MBA and all he can do is call names...

Jonathan Vaughters ‏@Vaughters 19h19 hours ago
@Doefnix I only regret ever interacting with that posse of cretinous mommy's basement dwellers.
But hey he has the floor on twitter and no word on Kreuziger and the ABP case dropped. The backbone of UCI's effort on doping is the ABP and it has been shown to be a joke and what has the man who has dedicated his life to anti doping got to say when asked? Insults to people who discuss the doping and ignore the dopers....
 
Jun 2, 2015
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But hey he has the floor on twitter and no word on Kreuziger and the ABP case dropped. The backbone of UCI's effort on doping is the ABP and it has been shown to be a joke and what has the man who has dedicated his life to anti doping got to say when asked? Insults to people who discuss the doping and ignore the dopers....
Not only the backbone of the UCI's system, but also of his own internal control system. So many doubts about the effectiveness of the WADA/UCI ABP and testing now, so we are to believe that Slipstreams internal testing, with hardly the same level of resources was/is any more effective? Anyway that is what so many people bought hook line and sinker and media have quoted ad nauseum as the proof the Slipstream riders are doin it all cleans and by the book.

Interesting how JV is choosing to use his public platform in a time of crisis in the faith of antidoping controls. Jokes and pictures of small plane dashboards???
 
May 26, 2010
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Anaconda said:
But hey he has the floor on twitter and no word on Kreuziger and the ABP case dropped. The backbone of UCI's effort on doping is the ABP and it has been shown to be a joke and what has the man who has dedicated his life to anti doping got to say when asked? Insults to people who discuss the doping and ignore the dopers....
Not only the backbone of the UCI's system, but also of his own internal control system. So many doubts about the effectiveness of the WADA/UCI ABP and testing now, so we are to believe that Slipstreams internal testing, with hardly the same level of resources was/is any more effective? Anyway that is what so many people bought hook line and sinker and media have quoted ad nauseum as the proof the Slipstream riders are doin it all cleans and by the book.

Interesting how JV is choosing to use his public platform in a time of crisis in the faith of antidoping controls. Jokes and pictures of small plane dashboards???
It tells us how serious JV takes the doping...............
 
Oct 16, 2010
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Anaconda said:
But hey he has the floor on twitter and no word on Kreuziger and the ABP case dropped. The backbone of UCI's effort on doping is the ABP and it has been shown to be a joke and what has the man who has dedicated his life to anti doping got to say when asked? Insults to people who discuss the doping and ignore the dopers....

Not only the backbone of the UCI's system, but also of his own internal control system.
So many doubts about the effectiveness of the WADA/UCI ABP and testing now, so we are to believe that Slipstreams internal testing, with hardly the same level of resources was/is any more effective? Anyway that is what so many people bought hook line and sinker and media have quoted ad nauseum as the proof the Slipstream riders are doin it all cleans and by the book.

Interesting how JV is choosing to use his public platform in a time of crisis in the faith of antidoping controls. Jokes and pictures of small plane dashboards???
that is a very good point.
 
May 26, 2010
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JV admits to not knowing anything about Kreuziger's case. Way to keep on top of what is happening in the sport....


Jonathan Vaughters ‏@Vaughters 35m35 minutes ago
@Doefnix I do not know the specifics of case (such as collection time, delivery method, sample temp) so, can't make educated conclusion.
JV takes another pop at the clinic....

Jonathan VaughtersVerified account
‏@Vaughters
@forearms @Doefnix all I ever saw was sneering self righteousness+poorly thought out arguments. Plus, it's not actually helping clean guys.
Why would talking about doping help clean guys?

But then again Vaughters tweets are really helpful.........to secondhand porsche owners and wannebe winos and the odd pilot...i suppose....
 
May 26, 2010
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BYOP88 said:
Just like that other American cyclist from years ago, having a go at the clinic. :D
Yep he is in good company.

But then if JV wanted to get some real information out there to clean cyclists he could write a blog instead of all the innuendo he tried in here to get some kudos.


edit; grammar....
 
Mar 25, 2013
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Benotti69 said:
BYOP88 said:
Just like that other American cyclist from years ago, having a go at the clinic. :D
Yep he is in good company.

But then if JV wanted to get some real information out there to clean cyclists he could write a blog instead of all the innuendo he tried here in to here to get some kudos.
That has made my night.
 
May 26, 2009
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Benotti69 said:
BYOP88 said:
Just like that other American cyclist from years ago, having a go at the clinic. :D
Yep he is in good company.

But then if JV wanted to get some real information out there to clean cyclists he could write a blog instead of all the innuendo he tried here in to here to get some kudos.

Anyway I've got a plane to catch, my parents basements don't clean themselves.
 
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