Kimmage unleashes hell, counter-sues Verbruggen & McQuaid

[MarkvW]

You're right this isn't hard, so it is odd that you keep getting it wrong.

You say the fund was kept in a Cyclismas bank account and that they (I assume Lesli & Aaron) had a duty that the "money was properly handed".
Which is exactly what Leslie did, she checked the account to find some funds moved, her request for further info appears to have been ignored so she contacted Kimmage and contacted a lawyer to get access to the info.

If I take five thousand from you and promise to pay that money to another person, and my brother then steals all that money from me, I'm not going to be able to walk away from my obligation to you.

That's about as over-simplified as I can make it for you.

 

[Netserk]

Did they promise that ALL of the money would go to Kimmage?

 

[thirteen]

three tweets from Digger:

So I see Aaron is saying the kimmage fund has ended. Again not true.

Also Aaron talks of paying this put in public. Well I know for a fact that Paul, Andy, Lesli or myself didn't tell any media.

Make of that what you will.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

If I take five thousand from you and promise to pay that money to another person, and my brother then steals all that money from me, I'm not going to be able to walk away from my obligation to you.

That's about as over-simplified as I can make it for you.

Interesting that you have to make up some irrelevant hypothetical to address a "simple" point.

Who said Cohen has walked away from her obligation?
Again, quite the opposite - she is the one who noticed the discrepancy, notified Kimmage and has retained legal representation to find out exactly the state of the account.

 

[MarkvW]

Interesting that you have to make up some irrelevant hypothetical to address a "simple" point.

Who said Cohen has walked away from her obligation?
Again, quite the opposite - she is the one who noticed the discrepancy, notified Kimmage and has retained legal representation to find out exactly the state of the account.

I haven't said Ms. Cohen has walked away from her obligation. We'll see how that turns out. It disturbs me that she hasn't said Cyclismas will make it all good to Kimmage. But it's still early and I'm a little angry. Ms. Cohen's test will be how she responds to this crisis. She likely bears some fault here (but not the fault of a thief).

She's dissolving her business arrangement with Mr. Brown--the accounting is part of that. Mr. Brown has left her out on a legal limb and she's taking the natural steps to protect herself. Your interpretation of those steps isn't entirely persuasive. I am sure that she wants to see Mr. Brown pay Mr. Kimmage his money. The open question is what will she do if Mr. Brown doesn't do the right thing and pay the money.

 

[TheGame]

The money originally went in a cyclismas account.
That account also held cyclismas revenue so for tax purposes was moved to a separate account with Brown taking responsibility.
Kimmage never had access to that account (rightly so)
Cyclismas and Brown part ways.
The press "get wind" of the story and CN publish a piece criticizing both Cyclismas and Brown.
Brown claims that he is concerned over handing over all the money to Kimmage as should he then get hit with a tax bill he will have to recoup money from Kimmage.

What happens next?
Brown reveals all the accounts and proves that nothing is missing.
Brown is exonerated.
Cyclismas, Kimmage, Digger et al look like the bad guys.

So ask yourself?
Who gave the story to his friend Benson in the first place?

Clue..
It wasn't Lesli at Cyclismas. It wasn't Digger. It wasn't Kimmage.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

The money originally went in a cyclismas account.
That account also held cyclismas revenue so for tax purposes was moved to a separate account with Brown taking responsibility.
Kimmage never had access to that account (rightly so)
Cyclismas and Brown part ways.
The press "get wind" of the story and CN publish a piece criticizing both Cyclismas and Brown.
Brown claims that he is concerned over handing over all the money to Kimmage as should he then get hit with a tax bill he will have to recoup money from Kimmage.

What happens next?
Brown reveals all the accounts and proves that nothing is missing.
Brown is exonerated.
Cyclismas, Kimmage, Digger et al look like the bad guys.

So ask yourself?
Who gave the story to his friend Benson in the first place?

Clue..
It wasn't Lesli at Cyclismas. It wasn't Digger. It wasn't Kimmage.

well, some of us will forever view Brown as a clown.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I haven't said Ms. Cohen has walked away from her obligation.

Oh but Mark in your wonderful hypothetical that is exactly what you said - "I'm not going to be able to walk away from my obligation to you."

We'll see how that turns out. It disturbs me that she hasn't said Cyclismas will make it all good to Kimmage. But it's still early and I'm a little angry. Ms. Cohen's test will be how she responds to this crisis. She likely bears some fault here (but not the fault of a thief).

A little late for the highlighted, don't you think?

So, it disturbs you that she has not said something that she can not possibly know until Mr. Brown produces a financial statement?

She's dissolving her business arrangement with Mr. Brown--the accounting is part of that. Mr. Brown has left her out on a legal limb and she's taking the natural steps to protect herself. Your interpretation of those steps isn't entirely persuasive. I am sure that she wants to see Mr. Brown pay Mr. Kimmage his money. The open question is what will she do if Mr. Brown doesn't do the right thing and pay the money.

Again Mark you are making stuff up.
On Saturday Cohen noticed that funds were no longer there, it was Monday before she sent legal notice or attempted to dissolve her 'business arrangement'.

 

[MarkvW]

Interesting that you have to make up some irrelevant hypothetical to address a "simple" point.

Who said Cohen has walked away from her obligation?
Again, quite the opposite - she is the one who noticed the discrepancy, notified Kimmage and has retained legal representation to find out exactly the state of the account.

Oh but Mark in your wonderful hypothetical that is exactly what you said - "I'm not going to be able to walk away from my obligation to you."



A little late for the highlighted, don't you think?

So, it disturbs you that she has not said something that she can not possibly know until Mr. Brown produces a financial statement?



Again Mark you are making stuff up.
On Saturday Cohen noticed that funds were no longer there, it was Monday before she sent legal notice or attempted to dissolve her 'business arrangement'.

AH! The Maserati Vortex is BACK! Sorry! Not playing.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

AH! The Maserati Vortex is BACK! Sorry! Not playing.

Ah, but you did play Mark.
Played and lost.

 

[mewmewmew13]

AH! The Maserati Vortex is BACK! Sorry! Not playing.

ChrisE where are you?






back on topic..I can't see where any of us can really comment...who knows all the info or is privy to the details.

 

[MarkvW]

ChrisE where are you?






back on topic..I can't see where any of us can really comment...who knows all the info or is privy to the details.

Yeah. A lot depends upon what Brown has actually done.

 

[Ferminal]

AH! The Maserati Vortex is BACK! Sorry! Not playing.

Ah, but you did play Mark.
Played and lost.

Sorry That was well done.

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

Stay tuned everybody and step away from your keyboards. Less is more as the likelihood of being deemed an idiot based on prior posts is increasing rapidly....

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Not too much in the Vos thread though?

Are you sure this is about chivalry, or is it really just a continuation of the feud between you and Mark?

So you accuse me of either posting something about Vos that I never posted, and you therefore cannot prove. Or, are you seriously accusing me of not protecting Vos in a thread that I never even visited?

Either way, you're a bit of a coward to post a lie and them PM me and tell me you can't prove your lie, and still not come here and admit you are a liar.

Hey, you wake-up in your shoes...

 

[Tinman]

Stay tuned everybody and step away from your keyboards. Less is more as the likelihood of being deemed an idiot based on prior posts is increasing rapidly....

+1. This thread is more telling on confirming/creating clinic idiots than it offers any clarity on the situation.

Amusing though, and therefore additional return on investment into the fund.

 

[Navigator]

We don't know what's happened in this case, but it is interesting that perhaps someone obsessed with UCI corruption could be involved in the same practises they continually target. The obsession turns out to be a form of jealousy about the idea somebody could be getting away with something they are not in a position to do. The old canard that haters are just jealous, does have a grain of truth to it for some.

And it goes the other way. It wouldn't surprise me if Armstrong himself, had he not had the talent to be a pro, would have been a huge anti doping advocate. I think it would be of the mentality: if I can't do it, nobody gets to do it, and he would be extremely vindictive about those that he believed were getting away with something he wasn't able to do.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Encouraging a person to donate money to a fund kept in your business bank account IS inducing if the person relies on your encouragement to make the donation.

There is no way I would have donated to that fund if I knew it was just that anonymous UCI Overlord guy managing it.

If I have a partner and you deal with my partnership and get ripped off in the process, I can't say "He took it, go after him--but leave me out of it." It doesn't work that way. If my partner ripped you off in that circumstance, then I'm going to be liable for his misdeeds (even if that partner is a thief).

Using Lance Armstrong as a moral benchmark for anything is just ridiculous.

That you didn't ask questions before sending your money, and now feel all butthurt over it really isn't any of our problems. I don't regret my donation, and I'd donate again under the same circumstances.

If you have regrets because you feel like a fool for sending your money to people you don't know, talk to a priest.

bark bark bark bark grrrrrr grrrrrrrrr

 

[BroDeal]

It's been fun watching Marky Mark start a hole then dig it deeper, but the numbers are close enough to being explainable that I can see this thing turning out to be much ado about nothing, just a misunderstanding between parties.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

The fund was kept in a Cyclismas bank account! Cyclismas thus assumed a duty to see that the money was properly handled. Did it? Nooooooo.

This isn't hard stuff . . ..

You get to make up facts too!! How you ever became an attorney is a mystery to me.

 

[Tinman]

And it goes the other way. It wouldn't surprise me if Armstrong himself, had he not had the talent to be a pro, would have been a huge anti doping advocate. I think it would be of the mentality: if I can't do it, nobody gets to do it, and he would be extremely vindictive about those that he believed were getting away with something he wasn't able to do.

that possibility still exists. From Cancer Jesus to 'Pro-Cycling Jesus'. Don't discount a miraculous Lazarus effect and a tell all on UCI. I sUspect that is what Tygart is trying to induce.

 

[mewmewmew13]

We don't know what's happened in this case, but it is interesting that perhaps someone obsessed with UCI corruption could be involved in the same practises they continually target. The obsession turns out to be a form of jealousy about the idea somebody could be getting away with something they are not in a position to do. The old canard that haters are just jealous, does have a grain of truth to it for some.

And it goes the other way. It wouldn't surprise me if Armstrong himself, had he not had the talent to be a pro, would have been a huge anti doping advocate. I think it would be of the mentality: if I can't do it, nobody gets to do it, and he would be extremely vindictive about those that he believed were getting away with something he wasn't able to do.

hmm..
I'm letting this entire pile alone

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Stay tuned everybody and step away from your keyboards. Less is more as the likelihood of being deemed an idiot based on prior posts is increasing rapidly....

I've defended Lesli, and will continue to do so whatever the numbers end up being and feel no idiocy for doing so. What I do see however are lots of promises that the numbers are forthcoming, and no numbers seem to show up. This pattern is repeating. Lets hope it doesn't repeat for long.

There is a reason that the number one thing they tell you in ethics classes in school is that when you have fiduciary responsibility to someone over an account, you'd better account to the penny regularly. Good people do things with other people's money intending to make everything okay all the time. Problems arise when the day to make everything okay comes earlier than you anticipated...

Not saying that is what happened, but continued promises of money showing up for several days looks like a stalling tactic to me, but I hope it isn't.

 

[Jethro_A]

Is there a way to get a message to Paul to let him know that those of us with any reading comprehension still support him and hold him completely harmless in this? And I'd donate again if needed too.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Is there a way to get a message to Paul to let him know that those of us with any reading comprehension still support him and hold him completely harmless in this? And I'd donate again if needed too.

Twitter is the best link I can give you.