LeMond II

[ChewbaccaD]

Yup, same person who thought it would be great if Betsy's head was smashed in with a baseball bat

Hard to keep track of all the flip flopping. At this rate it is only a matter of time before Brailsford is hailed a victim by the same folks who buried him.

Only a matter of time. Armstrong lied, doped, and destroyed people's lives. Johan aided it every step of the way.

Froome dopes and lies, and has a significant other who likes to goad people. Brailsford has to know.

Both sets are just misunderstood people who are taking the blame for everyone else's doping.

I cannot wait to watch the flip-flop to the narrative...

Then again, maybe they just have a personal beef with you? Seems interesting that you keep being the one picked out.

 

[Race Radio]

Then again, maybe they just have a personal beef with you? Seems interesting that you keep being the one picked out.

There is a phase for that

unhinged obsession

 

[Gavandope]

Only a matter of time. Armstrong lied, doped, and destroyed people's lives. Johan aided it every step of the way.

Froome dopes and lies, and has a significant other who likes to goad people. Brailsford has to know.

Both sets are just misunderstood people who are taking the blame for everyone else's doping.

I cannot wait to watch the flip-flop to the narrative...

Then again, maybe they just have a personal beef with you? Seems interesting that you keep being the one picked out.

I simply cannot see how anyone can compare Armstrong with anyone else in cycling who dopes, period. Doping is one thing, lying about it another. But they are like a pair of hand grenades compared to a bunker buster.

For me his ban from all sport for life unless he spills everything which he most obviously won't isn't justified from doping - but what he did to others to conceal his lies.

Perjury, tampering with witnesses, libellous accusations, malicious influence to close businesses of those who had to audacity to oppose him, corruption of politicians to close a federal investigation to name just a few are serious criminal acts. He's got away lightly not being in jail never mind banned from sport.

Minus the acts of violence, extortion, racketeering and money laundering it's not far off a list of charges someone in organised crime would get. Not even the mafia dons could make a federal investigation go away.

Comparable to "no I didn't dope" - really? If so methinks the perspective between doping and criminal/malicious acts is rather skewed on this forum compared to reality!

 

[the sceptic]

Only a matter of time. Armstrong lied, doped, and destroyed people's lives. Johan aided it every step of the way.

Froome dopes and lies, and has a significant other who likes to goad people. Brailsford has to know.

Both sets are just misunderstood people who are taking the blame for everyone else's doping.

I cannot wait to watch the flip-flop to the narrative...

Then again, maybe they just have a personal beef with you? Seems interesting that you keep being the one picked out.

I would guess its because RR will argue with everyone that isnt a believer of his paranoid mantra. But not to worry, once he has finished reporting every post in this thread a mod will show up, and then you guys can go back to finding new reasons to hate Lance.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

I would guess its because RR will argue with everyone that isnt a believer of his paranoid mantra. But not to worry, once he has finished reporting every post in this thread a mod will show up, and then you guys can go back to finding new reasons to hate Lance.

I don't need any new reasons.

But thanks for proving my point about RR. Irony much?

 

[sittingbison]

Closed while I sort out this mess.

Good grief you've outdone yourselves gents. Chapeau

OPEN
If this happens again you're gone for good. You know who you are

 

[Granville57]

Closed while I sort out this mess.

I thought you meant in order to change the thread title to LeMond.

What say? Please?



[Edit]
Thanks you. In appreciation, I have reduced the size of this image.

EDIT:
mercy bow koo, and in appreciation I have reduced it again

 

[hiero2]

I thought you meant in order to change the thread title to LeMond.

What say? Please?



[Edit]
Thanks you. In appreciation, I have reduced the size of this image.

EDIT:
mercy bow koo, and in appreciation I have reduced it again

I have a great deal of respect for Greg LeMond. As you will know if you have read anything of what I have written about the man. However, if I recall correctly, his family spelled their last name Lemond until sometime about when Greg went pro in Europe.

What I mean to say is, that I don't think you are honking on about something that Greg himself would care all that much about. I don't think it's a big deal, to him, or to the world. Thus, I find it odd that you would think this is somehow disrespectful. However, should I not convince you, please do not stop with your attempts to get people to use the LeMond spelling. By all means, carry on.

 

[hiero2]

Ok...but if you get chased down or screwed by your teammates at a later date don't moan greg...oh wait.

In another report for that day we have the journalist saying Jock was worth a medal but it was a pity Greg didn't think so...

You know what, let's assume Jock wouldn't have won - but greg doing what he did ensued that Jock didn't even medal.

Ah, the journo's opinion. Is that one of the journos whom we love to hate when it comes to race coverage because they blather on with such drivel?

Well, I was around when all this happened, and following events. Johnathan Boyer was a good (no, make that great) cyclist - and for that he gets my respect. He was also a whining, petty, self-centered can't-use-the-word-here. He was supremely overconfident - but for a winner - we also know this trait seems to be quite necessary to compete at these levels. Most cycling fans in the US at the time did not rate him as good as LeMond.

 

[Granville57]

I find it odd that you would think this is somehow disrespectful.

Entirely your words. Not mine.

However, should I not convince you, please do not stop with your attempts to get people to use the LeMond spelling. By all means, carry on.

It's not a big deal to me. I was half-attempting to make a joke. I was hoping for the change in case some of the sensitive types from the PRR sub-forum showed up and started crying about it, again, in here.

I've no idea if the family ever changed the spelling. But it does make sense that we at least use the currently "accepted" version.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Wait, landis is on the bad guy list now? Bummer, I like that guy

I can understand why some folks would be angry that Greg does not yell about all dopers.......but that does not mean we should re-write history and pretend that Boyer could have won in 82, that is just silly.

Johan liked it though, he just started babbling about it on Twitter. Good to know he reads the forum. Expect he has lots of time on his hands now.

Hi Johan

Since you are not around to reply I hope once you return that you will.

It's not silly as you say that Boyer had a chance. I think that statement simplifies it too much and you have some biased in this also in my opinion.

Getting into the details and looking back on it, In my opinion it sure does look like he stood a good chance to drive it to the line. It all depended on who wanted to chase. That brings in the motivation of it all.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Well, I was around when all this happened, and following events. Johnathan Boyer was a good (no, make that great) cyclist - and for that he gets my respect. He was also a whining, petty, self-centered can't-use-the-word-here. He was supremely overconfident - but for a winner - we also know this trait seems to be quite necessary to compete at these levels. Most cycling fans in the US at the time did not rate him as good as LeMond.

I didn't. It was also the case he didn't come to the sport winning l'Avenir by 10 minutes. Later on, Boyer went on to do a terrible thing and therefore gets only scorn from me. PM me for the published, sordid details.

Was it Lemond's best hour as a teammate? No. Did Boyer have it locked up? No.

 

[D-Queued]

...

Greg was mouthing to the press, then phoned Floyd - no problem with the call - but then went public with the phone call and intimated that Floyd admitted to doping

...

But well done on missing the whole point.


...

I thought Landis phoned up LeMond?

Also, to try and make Landis out as a victim borders on laughable in this scenario.

Based on bisons post, I clearly missed a lot of fireworks.

That said, I would like to offer a clarification to the above conversation thread.

Digger, you have been around long enough to know much more about that call and about the follow up call and circumstances that followed.

Whether Floyd called or Greg called is immaterial in the larger scheme.

It was on that call that Greg confided the abuse he suffered as a child as he pleaded with Floyd to come forward with an honest statement.

It was that abuse that Floyd and Floyd's manager Will Geogahan later used to harass Greg the evening before his testimony at Floyd's arbitration. Will called a number known only to Floyd and pretended to be Greg's abuser while Floyd sat right next to him.

For all of the despicable acts that we have seen in all of the doping in cycling, that call ranks way up there.

How many years did we wait for Floyd to finally come clean after Greg's pleading?

Dave.

 

[ultimobici]

Was it Lemond's best hour as a teammate? No. Did Boyer have it locked up? No.

To the bolded, if the US riders that year were riding for the US championship that day, as I have read several times, as well as paying their own way, then Lemond's actions are both understandable and correct.

As for Boyer's later actions are concerned, it's a matter of public record

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I didn't. It was also the case he didn't come to the sport winning l'Avenir by 10 minutes. Later on, Boyer went on to do a terrible thing and therefore gets only scorn from me. PM me for the published, sordid details.

Was it Lemond's best hour as a teammate? No. Did Boyer have it locked up? No.

Perhaps Digger can twist that too as if it is all LeMonds fault Boyer turned out the way he ended?

 

[red_flanders]

Greg is being very selective in his condemnations, is he not?

I love that this reads like a criticism.

Shouldn't we all be "selective in our condemnations"?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I love that this reads like a criticism.

Shouldn't we all be "selective in our condemnations"? I think the lack of selectiveness in condemnation is the biggest issue I have with your posts.

I think Benotti69 means LeMond is inconsistent. In which case, I tend to agree, and also find Benotti the opposite - consistent - in his condemnation.

If you're going to put Lance down for making something look easy via doping where it should have been difficult, whilst courting the memory of Pantani as a great rider (as an example), it's clearly a narrative that is not really focused or interested in anti-doping per se.

 

[Digger]

Based on bisons post, I clearly missed a lot of fireworks.

That said, I would like to offer a clarification to the above conversation thread.

Digger, you have been around long enough to know much more about that call and about the follow up call and circumstances that followed.

Whether Floyd called or Greg called is immaterial in the larger scheme.

It was on that call that Greg confided the abuse he suffered as a child as he pleaded with Floyd to come forward with an honest statement.

It was that abuse that Floyd and Floyd's manager Will Geogahan later used to harass Greg the evening before his testimony at Floyd's arbitration. Will called a number known only to Floyd and pretended to be Greg's abuser while Floyd sat right next to him.

For all of the despicable acts that we have seen in all of the doping in cycling, that call ranks way up there.

How many years did we wait for Floyd to finally come clean after Greg's pleading?

Dave.

The call is one aspect - if he wants to run to authorities and involve himself in the media in calling out landis (prior to that call) then he needs to be consistent...he's shown himself to be blatantly inconsistent in his approach. Lance and landis verus Indurain and Pantani and others.

Setting aside that...him chasing Boyer. People keep missing the point. Who was going to chase Boyer? Of course Saronni was stronger. But he certainly wasn't going to chase and in doing so bring up Lemond and Kelly. They were all looking at each other and that's why Boyer could have done something - Lemond helped them.
If someone chased, Lemond sat on their wheel and then attacked, fair enough.

My points at the outset - Lemond is hypocritical...people accept this.

Second point, he should not have chased...most say it wasn't his best moment.

So that's it.

BTW what Boyer did thereafter has nothing to do with this and I don't see why people are bringing this up.

And also people are ignoring what Boyer says Lemond said to him that day after the race. But again Greg wouldn't lie.

 

[Benotti69]

I think Benotti69 means LeMond is inconsistent. In which case, I tend to agree, and also find Benotti the opposite - consistent - in his condemnation.

If you're going to put Lance down for making something look easy via doping where it should have been difficult, whilst courting the memory of Pantani as a great rider (as an example), it's clearly a narrative that is not really focused or interested in anti-doping per se.

this^

Cheers DW

 

[sittingbison]

Gentle(wo)men....and digger

dog and a bone

Move along please, this particular narrative is done as nauseum

Cheers

Bisin

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Gentle(wo)men....and digger

dog and a bone

Move along please, this particular narrative is done as nauseum

Cheers

Bisin

Not sure why is it "done as nauseum?" There is discussion going on and I thought it is interesting even if I don't agree with all of it.

Was there some posts I'm missing and that brought out the warning or is it just that you are tired of people discussing Greg Lemond?

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Gentle(wo)men....and digger

dog and a bone

Move along please, this particular narrative is done as nauseum

Cheers

Bisin

My post was deleted, and I cannot imagine why? I didn't directly insult anyone (or indirectly to any significant extent); I just expressed an opinion.

 

[Granville57]

My post was deleted, and I cannot imagine why? I didn't directly insult anyone (or indirectly to any significant extent)

Well therein lies the problem. The mods probably thought your account had been hacked.

 

[sittingbison]

Not sure why is it "done as nauseum?" There is discussion going on and I thought it is interesting even if I don't agree with all of it.

Was there some posts I'm missing and that brought out the warning or is it just that you are tired of people discussing Greg Lemond?

the discussion about Boyer and LeMond has been going on...and on...and on...

the discussion about who called who and who has been going on...and on...and on...

time to move along please

 

[sittingbison]

My post was deleted, and I cannot imagine why? I didn't directly insult anyone (or indirectly to any significant extent); I just expressed an opinion.

I count three chewie posts deleted as part of a mass clean out. Two were personal. One was you expressing an opinion but deleted as part of a greater problem

And therein lies the problem with mass insults, hounding, derailling trolling and baiting. Casualty of war.