Michael Rogers positive for clenbuterol

[gillan1969]

I can conclude herby that you do not agree that anti-doping rules are there to eradicate doping?



I'd advice to look for another hobby if your life is unbearable simply because professional sports are a circus.



About your work: That is 24/7 I assume? When you walk down a stairs or ladder at home you do a security check? When you are going to do groceries you double check every site you pass? Or is this just at work and does that end at the end of the working day?

If the latter it's not exactly the same, wouldn't you agree?

my life is not unbearable...you introduced 'unbearable'..i was merely comparing fan vs cyclist in that regard...besides my hobby is cycling which remains unaffected by australian dopers

nope...but if I got pis+ed the night before a site visit and fell off a ladder and turned out to be over the limit...whoops....my fault, probably never work for client again and get sacked....

so...mr rogers is doing a race...should he eat meat which is widely known to cause positive tests before race he might get tested in? eh...what do you think????

 

[BroDeal]

That is the problem with a threshold of zero - accidental contamination can happen far too easily. Of course we don't know the numbers yet to know whether we are in that area.

Complicating matters for the athlete is that two months have passed between giving the sample and being informed that it was positive. There is no possibility of testing others who ate the same thing. Any supplements consumed at the time may be gone. The process is set up so there is no defense possible.

 

[thehog]

I note he doesn't state that he's never doped

“I would like to make it very clear, in the strongest terms possible, that I have never knowingly or deliberately ingested Clenbuterol,” Rogers said in a statement released on his Twitter account.

 

[SundayRider]

I note he doesn't state that he's never doped

Or that he has always raced clean.

 

[Morbius]

if contamination were so prevalent in all testing disciplines, would there not be a wealth of positives through mere contamination.

We will know more in due course, but there have probably been relatively few athletes in any discipline subject to the same high sensitivity tests done in Cologne. Was this the level for Rogers? We don't know.

 

[Benotti69]

We will know more in due course, but there have probably been relatively few athletes in any discipline subject to the same high sensitivity tests done in Cologne. Was this the level for Rogers? We don't know.

Rogers test was done in Japan.

Does Rogers have an IQ below 50? As even the Chinese athletes have been warned not to eat meat in China to avoid testing positive. So Rogers doped and deserves his ban or the guy is an idiot and deserves his ban for sheer stupidity.

 

[thehog]

In the Mantova investigation one of the drugs found was Clen. And a lot of it.

http://www.dopeology.org/incidents/Mantova-investigation/

It's not an accidental drug.

 

[Benotti69]

In the Mantova one of the drugs found was Clen. And a lot of it.

http://www.dopeology.org/incidents/Mantova-investigation/

It's not an accidental drug.

Why am I not surprised!

 

[gillan1969]

a thought just jumped at me - the reason we don’t know rogers’ clen urine concentration is perhaps that the present uci admins have not yet… corrupted to the level of mcquaid/verbruggen admins.

the logic would go something like this.

clen is still a non-threshold substance according to wada. thus, an anti-doping authority (read: the uci) is not required to indicate the specific concentration in the official letter to an athlete - just that the presence of clen was found. thus rogers himself likely does not know more than we, the clinicians. of course, the uci by now knows the concentration as it is most likely already had inquired the concentration from the tokyo lab. but they did not leak it, like the mcquid admin did with conti’s values, because they did not try to cover it up…recall the uci sat on conti’s case and finally announced in the official uci press release the very small concentration to justify own slowness due to case complexity.

this may or may not be the case, but i thought it is a possibility

yup...hopefully will result in less room for manuevre from those with positives. If you know the level you can defend it specifically...if you come to fight it without knowing the level however you could end of looking very very foolish....

 

[Coolair2970]

How many of Riis's riders have tested positive now?

So Rogers doped on T-Mob and now Saxo but not Sky where he had his best season?

2 while riding for Riis. Bo Hamburger in 2000 and Rogers a few days ago

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

As long as Mick doesn't shave his head, it sounds like this could easily be answered with a hair test.

Now, if I was a jilted rider in Mick's position I'd be publicly running to the best lab in the world with a TV crew and get my f*cking hair tested!

Rather, we get the "never used clen" defence presented in a tepid PR release....

http://www.dopeology.org/products/Clenbuterol/

 

[thehog]

Why am I not surprised!

I'm surprised that everyone has already accepted the meat defense.

Cyclists know what the drug does. That's why they use it.

You think all those skinny Italians at Lampre got that way on pasta?

 

[Coolair2970]

Surely if the levels of clen are the same or more than AC's then they can't let him get off with it, as a precedent will have been set but then this is the UCI...

You can hardly have less than Contador. What they found in Cologne was 400 times less than is required to be passed as a WADA lab.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I'm sorry but if athletes can't be allowed to eat something if they have not homegrown it and kept under constant surveillance this Anti-doping hunt has become a witch-hunt.

Because (and this needs to be driven home by a sledgehammer) foodcontaminations are everyday occurence even in the pure and noble USA and Europe. It's not just those evil Chinese and Mexicans who play loose and fast with regulations.

Anti-doping should be aimed at eradicating doping. It should not be made so that an athletes life becomes unbearable. And yes, I assume a full round of agreement here, even from Benotti and Gilan.

Couldnt agree more. Yet the thought of Freiburg Ferrari Mick busted did sound funny as hell.

But also for the Dodger justice should be in place.

 

[maltiv]

I'm surprised that everyone has already accepted the meat defense.

Cyclists know what the drug does. That's why they use it.

You think all those skinny Italians at Lampre got that way on pasta?

Many pro cyclists also put on a little weight on purpose during the winter to reduce the probability of catching an infection.

So taking Clenbuterol when the season has ended would make no sense.

 

[thehog]

Many pro cyclists also put on a little weight on purpose during the winter to reduce the probability of catching an infection.

So taking Clenbuterol when the season has ended would make no sense.

As explained a thousand times.

It's not only a weight loss drug. It was designed to open up the airways in horses and treat livestock asthma.

Go read the bodybuilding forums and they'll tell you want it does to their breathing.

 

[GJB123]

yup...hopefully will result in less room for manuevre from those with positives. If you know the level you can defend it specifically...if you come to fight it without knowing the level however you could end of looking very very foolish....

Trust by the time this gets to a hearing he will have full knowledge of what was found and in what quantities. The mere idea you think it is fine that Rogers or anybody else should have defend themselves with less than the full access to their files is laughable. It would make any justice system a mockery.

Let's just wait and see until we get to see the numbers before we pass judgement on wether it likely to have been intentional or unintentional. Me personally I haven't accepted one or the other but would rather keep an open mind for both.

 

[hrotha]

I don't know why everybody keeps talking about thresholds or about a particular amount of clen being enough to determine whether or not there was intentional use. In the past, among normal consumers, clenbuterol has appeared in such high concentrations as to make people physically sick:

Clenbuterol was detected in 47 urine samples in amounts ranging from 11 to 486 parts per billion.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1382130/

In a country with less strict controls compared to the EU, where the farmers can risk using higher doses, how would a high concentration prove anything, and how would a threshold help?

 

[Taxus4a]

Of course is quite supicious that someone test positive with clembuterol in the same team than Contador, but anyway I think that clembuterol is a real problem in meat in China, and it could be the reason. I hope so.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

I understand one of Saxo's "dope" doctors changed job and moved to katusha prior to the 2013 season. The Saxo team was under pressure to perform at the very end of the 2013 season. Could it be that a less experienced doctor got the cocktail wrong?

 

[Benotti69]

I understand one of Saxo's "dope" doctors changed job and moved to katusha prior to the 2013 season. The Saxo team was under pressure to perform at the very end of the 2013 season. Could it be that a less experienced doctor got the cocktail wrong?

They were under pressure to get Sponosrs, but as it turned out Tinkov bought them, but was that known in October.

 

[SundayRider]

Rogers might have a win bonus in his contract and afterall he had not won a race up until then.

 

[IzzyStradlin]

They were under pressure to get Sponosrs, but as it turned out Tinkov bought them, but was that known in October.

That's what's really strange about this. What did Dodger have to prove in China?
- Everybody knew that UCI points would be fairly worthless.
- You think any sponsors really care about a good result in China? Nobody that Riis was dealing with at least....certainly not Oleg
- Not training for anything. WCs already over.

Preparing for a promo tour? Does he need to ramp up performance for holiday?

 

[Dazed and Confused]

They were under pressure to get Sponosrs, but as it turned out Tinkov bought them, but was that known in October.

and yet the team started to fire people in November (?)? I think they were under massive pressure to perform late in the season.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

That's what's really strange about this. What did Dodger have to prove in China?
- Everybody knew that UCI points would be fairly worthless.
- You think any sponsors really care about a good result in China? Nobody that Riis was dealing with at least....certainly not Oleg
- Not training for anything. WCs already over.

Preparing for a promo tour? Does he need to ramp up performance for holiday?

Gotta remember the team's win sheet was particularly bad in 2013. Desperation imo.