Moderation

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I get super annoyed by a lot of nicknames but definitely do not think they should be forbidden.

There are far too many restrictions on this board in the first place, let's not make even more.
They are often used to troll other forum members or fans, and trolling should need to be moderated. The issue is that trolling is difficult to pin down into rules. Some people on the forum have mastered it and have avoided moderation for years. So i understand moderators wanting to outline what can and can't, into clear guidelines. Trolling is something that is often quite apparent and everybody knows it's trolling, but still difficult to pinpoint exactly what is breaking the rules.

I think we need to consider that the feeling of being offended, while perhaps not deliberate, is strategic in nature.
The opposite is just as true. Purposely offending or trolling as vaguely as possible not to "get caught" by the rules.
 
The fact is, some folks are more easily "trolled" than others, and have a very different definition of trolling than others. Good news is the mods get to decide, not the crowd. Want to define trolling? Become a mod.

Of course trolling is subjective and hard to stop, that's why it's been happening since the internet was created. No one here is going to solve it with a new rule, or by debating the definition in this thread.

The answers are relatively simple.
  • Mods get to decide what trolling is.
  • Don't attack the poster, debate their content. Or ignore them. If the word "you" or some form of it is used, it's probably an attack on the poster not the content.
  • If someone is skirting the edge of trolling, then the trolling is really not that bad. Ignore it. Don't respond. The only person who will notice is you. No one is following your posts that closely to see if you "won", and once a little war starts, we all just scroll past the nonsense.
  • Don't assign intent to another poster, it can't be known, no matter how much one thinks they know it. If you can't debate the content, your argument has failed.
  • Don't get your ego wrapped up in what happens on an anonymous internet board. No one cares, no one knows you.
I'm not claiming to have always remembered these guidelines. I've been an arse more times than I should have. But I've never been on another forum that aired out laundry like this one. Crazy. Just causes more friction.
 
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But I've never been on another forum that aired out laundry like this one. Crazy. Just causes more friction.

If a forum has a ban every couple months - if that frequently - and the cause of the ban was clear for everyone to see, then of course people aren't gonna feel the same need to know what the hell is going on.

Here, we rarely go a couple months without a ban, and they often happen out of the blue from the perspective of other posters.
 
If a forum has a ban every couple months - if that frequently - and the cause of the ban was clear for everyone to see, then of course people aren't gonna feel the same need to know what the hell is going on.

Here, we rarely go a couple months without a ban, and they often happen out of the blue from the perspective of other posters.
I don't feel I have any "need to know" what's going on. Rules seem clear. Not my problem.
 
.. they often happen out of the blue from the perspective of other posters.
If somebody incurs a ban, it is unlikely to be out of the blue for them: they have usually presented problematic behaviour before and received warnings for it.
And if the reason is not clear to other users, then:
a) deletion of the material that should not have been posted has been successful,
b) material that might give a bad impression the banned user in the sight of others has been removed, preserving their reputation.
 
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I don't feel I have any "need to know" what's going on. Rules seem clear. Not my problem.

If you've been involved in a conversation with someone, leaves for a couple of hours, only to find that said person been banned with their most recent (available) posts all being perfectly fine, it's gonna feel a bit jarring.
Of course, as I mentioned earlier, part of the issue is that the offensive posts get completely nuked. So, maybe a solution could be to simply edit the offensive post, preferably just removing the offensive parts, leaving everything else intact, but if that's not possible, change the whole post to [Edited by Mod]. That way people still have clear evidence that the banned poster wrote something that was deemed worthy of a ban.

Like it or not, lots of us would like to know what's going on whenever posters get banned, especially since the bans happen so frequently.
And we've never actually been given an explanation for the policy change. A bunch of people, who aren't even members of the forum, pulling a "because we say so" is not an explanation.
 
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If you've been involved in a conversation with someone, leaves for a couple of hours, only to find that said person been banned with their most recent (available) posts all being perfectly fine, it's gonna feel a bit jarring.
Ok, so you find it a bit jarring. Obviously they did something which ran them afoul of the rules and mods. What business is that of ours?
Of course, as I mentioned earlier, part of the issue is that the offensive posts get completely nuked. So, maybe a solution could be to simply edit the offensive post, preferably just removing the offensive parts, leaving everything else intact, but if that's not possible, change the whole post to [Edited by Mod]. That way people still have clear evidence that the banned poster wrote something that was deemed worthy of a ban.
Posts are often "edited by a mod". And if they're deleted...who cares? It was probably some nonsense anyway. Why is informing everyone about what happened so important that we want to make more work for a mod and cause more friction around an already inflamed post? Why do we need to weigh in on what is or isn't ban worthy? Can't fathom it.

If you want to know what's happening behind the scenes, maybe ask to be a mod, goodness knows they need the help. I just don't get this idea that we as contributors "need" to be informed of mod actions.

But that's the gist of this entire back and forth between us here. We disagree on the amount of information we "need" to have about mod actions. Clearly neither of us is gonna see it the other way. To me it's just tilting at the windmills.
 
Yeah... we had a system that worked - it wasn't perfect, but it worked - and then it got nixed without explanation by a bunch of outsiders.
Guess we just all have to accept that the
downgrades in that regard.

For the record; I recently had a post deleted for stating that while it might have seemed like a poster got banned for a perfectly innocent mistake, then that obviously wasn't the cause, so there had probably been an actual offensive post somewhere.
 
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Posts are often "edited by a mod". And if they're deleted...who cares? It was probably some nonsense anyway. Why is informing everyone about what happened so important that we want to make more work for a mod and cause more friction around an already inflamed post? Why do we need to weigh in on what is or isn't ban worthy? Can't fathom it.

If you want to know what's happening behind the scenes, maybe ask to be a mod, goodness knows they need the help. I just don't get this idea that we as contributors "need" to be informed of mod actions.

But that's the gist of this entire back and forth between us here. We disagree on the amount of information we "need" to have about mod actions. Clearly neither of us is gonna see it the other way. To me it's just tilting at the windmills.
It's not quantum physics. Just a post 'member x is banned for y time for reason z'. Done, clear. It happens on other forums as well. People actually care for other people, also on a forum. If you suddenly find someone you like or appreciate has disappeared, it's normal to want to know why and for how long. To give this minor bit of information should be considered part of community building.
 
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Ok, so you find it a bit jarring. Obviously they did something which ran them afoul of the rules and mods. What business is that of ours?
I don't think it should be hard to understand why some people in a community might want to know what happened when other members of the community disappear? Like, you don't need to care yourself, or even agree that those people have a right to know, but it's hardly baffling why they'd want to know
 
I wonder whether you are using this thread to send these appeals for return of the bans explanation thread to me.

It has nothing to do with me, I am as bound by the rule as anyone else. Either admit that you are venting impotently, or write to the administrators if you think that their minds can be changed. Try community@futurenet.com

Oh, I know it's not your fault, or any of the earlier mods'.
It's all the admins' fault!
They should just stick to taking care of the technical parts of the forum, and let those who are actual members of the forum deal with the posting-related issues.
 
There aren't that many rules, and even fewer that need regular application. You can probably guess in 90% of cases.


If what people are expecting is a quoting of the remarks that shouldn't have been put up in the first place, that's not going to happen.
I think it's more a case of, if you're in the middle of a conversation in a completely unrelated thread to where the actions that caused the ban took place, and then suddenly that poster is banned.

I don't think it necessarily needs to be a dedicated thread since that original thread became a subject of its own thread which became disruptive and argumentative; nor should you be expected to reproduce material that had to be removed from the forum in the first place, but at the same time if somebody is innocently requesting clarification, it seems a bit Kafkaesque to not be able to be informed of the rules that are broken lest we fall foul of them ourselves, especially if these pertain to rules of interpretation as to what oversteps the mark.

I get that we don't want a bearpit of people arguing over moderation decisions or demanding posters they agree with be reinstated or posters they disagree with be banned, but at the same time, I don't often go into some very long threads, especially rider-specific ones, while conversation moves very quickly during major races, especially stages where a lot is happening, and so comments that may have had consequences can easily be missed or overlooked at the time, so (if on request only) a simple, appropriately vague response like "[poster X] is on a short cool-off for losing their temper in a race thread" or "[poster Y] is on a longer-term vacation for getting way too personal with another poster", maybe just even "[poster Z] continued patterns of posting they'd already been warned about" would go a long way to assuaging concerns, I feel. No need to reproduce offensive comments, or level accusations of trolling which is always subjective (and hell, sometimes can be done in a good-natured fashion in and of itself).

Take something like the Race Design Thread for example. That thread has had pretty much zero trolling nor bad tempered arguments at all, it's very much not a kind of environment or discussion topic that lends itself to that other than possibly some political disagreement or another and even that was minimal at most. Railxmig was a frequent and illuminating poster in there, and I had some decent discussion with them on the subject of course design principles and ideas, and then one day they were banned. Now, I did see the comments for which they were banned, so I do understand it, but we were mid-discussion in another thread, had I not seen what they were banned for, it would have been unclear whether or not conversation could or would continue, as a short cooling-off ban would not have been disruptive to the flow of discussion in a slow-moving thread like the Race Design Thread, but obviously a longer-term or permanent ban would.
 
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b) material that might give a bad impression the banned user in the sight of others has been removed, preserving their reputation.
I absolutely don't think that is how this works. Given that it doesn't really take that much to incur a ban, the deletion of posts make it very hard to judge how bad the behavior was. [[content deleted]]
 
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I'm new I get it I properly don't get all and know as much regarding inner circles, how it was before and all the details being discussed here and that's fine as its before my time and things I've yet to see and so on. Also I get its constructive criticism is healthy and just to make it a better place which is just good!

But when I log on this forum it literally says their seeking moderators? I don't think its the most appreciated job but I'm sure is grateful someone are willing to take on such a job which I'm sure is a lot of hassle and not the most appreciated. I'm sure everyone appreciate the job regardless if some jokes are not tolerated or not that was all.

(A place without a mod would just be twitter 2.0 and I don't want that. Just needed to be said in between and if it can help me to not get banned one time when I'm suppose to then so be it:kissingsmiling:)