Re: Re:
jahn said:
samhocking said:
Huapango - Sky's Stages and before that SRM, like nearly all teams, measure off the crank torque, so if a motor is helping to drive the cranks from the bottom bracket axle or drive the rear wheel, it wouldn't actually be measured at the cranks sensors. Your own power would be offset negatively by the additional power in fact reading too low, so some custom head unit programming and strain guages and Ant+/Bluetooth transmitters would be required to combine human and motor PWR numbers. If you install IpPeloton on an android phone, you can read any riders HR, PWR & CAD over Ant+/Bluetooth if you want, so if you see two different device IDs for PWR on one bike, that would be suspicious.
If you were to use motors, you don't need anything like 250w to make a big difference. 50w would be plenty used sparingly.
Indeed, and the power being reported to the head unit would be 100% accurate in terms of measuring your own energy expenditure. This is the primary purpose of power meters in a race.
So in that regard it's even more effective. It's basically a free tailwind so to speak.
Yes, obviously, but what i'm saying, is just stand near Froomes bike with something like IpBike or Wasp and if there's two PWR transmissions coming from his bike, there would be no other explanation for it, other than a motor transmitting that signal so it can be combined with his Stages power at the head unit so he can regulate his actual w/kg to be within the realms of being human over a sustained effort and what Huapango is getting at.
It would be very easy to blast up Alpe Duez with a motor, smash the record by 5 minutes, yet your data files shows you output 100w less than the time and your known weight calculates. Using a motor and publishing believable data is impossible without recording a total PWR at the wheels. Theoretically, you could smudge the data after, to raise your w/kg to take into account the motor negating your recorded PWR, but you would need to know when the motor was used and when it wasn't. The only real way to do that is to record that PWR event at the head unit so you can see from 50:01.30 to 55:08.23 the motor was adding 100w here and then you could drill into the data file and fudge the data before publishing it to make it more believable. You would need to do the same for cadence and bmp too. It gets pretty complicated. i.e. SPEED is rising, RPM is probably rising, BPM & PWR not rising through. This would have to all be adjusted manually.
Riders publishing data would be a good thing based on the above. I think it needs to happen. I think the results of a race, should includes link to the riders file myself simply as part of the transparency of the performance.
Ultimately, if you're riding with a motor and also publishing your power data he needs to know 'while riding' what that w/kg figure is in terms of a sustained effort otherwise he's exposing his efforts to being totally unbelievable. i.e. theoretically he can produce perhaps 6w/kg up a climb, yet a calcualtion shows he was more like 7w/kg and
I think what Huapango is asking, is does Froome look at his PWR all the time to keep a check he's within PWR threshold. If you've ridden with power, you'll realise when attacking it's actually pretty difficult to control your watts, they wander crazily. I would also say, trying to gauge an effort that isn't 100% to factor in the PWR from a motor while racing is actually pretty difficult half way up a mountain when already fatigued and its kicking off all around you.