Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Quintana just doesn't have it. He improved a lot in the last week of the 2015 Vuelta though, but I'm long past considering mythical peak Quintana reliable. Just slightly more reliable than hypothetical healthy Kelderman

2015 he was also very sick during the 2nd week, which actually explains his dramatic improvement in the 3rd week.

Just looked back at the result. He was pretty consistent apart from dropping 3 minutes on the Andorra stage and having a great ITT and final mountain stage.

Also saw that while Valverde got 3rd in that ITT, he only took 25s out of Quintana and 45s out of Aru, so gaps were still quite small, apart from Dumoulin being Dumoulin and Purito being Purito

 

[spalco]

Is anything known publicly about the relationship between Quintana and Lopez? I understand Quintana is apparently not popular in the peloton and just because they are both Colombian (and even from the same province), doesn't mean they have to help each other, but they appear to be openly hostile towards each other, which is strange.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re:

For someone who doesn't have the legs, he sure responded to lots of attacks personally without much of a problem.

I disagree. He had some issues responding. In some cases he needed help or didn't respond.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re:

Is anything known publicly about the relationship between Quintana and Lopez? I understand Quintana is apparently not popular in the peloton and just because they are both Colombian (and even from the same province), doesn't mean they have to help each other, but they appear to be openly hostile towards each other, which is strange.

Nothing public. In fact they are both from Boyacá.

I wondered about the same thing today.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Is anything known publicly about the relationship between Quintana and Lopez? I understand Quintana is apparently not popular in the peloton and just because they are both Colombian (and even from the same province), doesn't mean they have to help each other, but they appear to be openly hostile towards each other, which is strange.

Apparently he congratulated Miguel Ángel Lopez on a deserved win today...

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

Is anything known publicly about the relationship between Quintana and Lopez? I understand Quintana is apparently not popular in the peloton and just because they are both Colombian (and even from the same province), doesn't mean they have to help each other, but they appear to be openly hostile towards each other, which is strange.

Belgian commentators were talking about that earlier, but I can't remember what they said anymore

 

[May0maniac]

MAL seems to be a nice guy, he's really religious, even for South American standarts, but I've never heard anything bad about him (well, besides not collaborating durning a chase, but that's normal racing stuff).

 

[HelloDolly]

And here is another one with a gripe against Quntana.....but it just hate ...isnt it ??

https://twitter.com/JournalVelo/status/1038821529595928577

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

And here is another one with a gripe against Quntana.....but it just hate ...isnt it ??

https://twitter.com/JournalVelo/status/1038821529595928577

Since when another rider needs to do the chasing for the little arrogant red jersey?

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

And here is another one with a gripe against Quntana.....but it just hate ...isnt it ??

https://twitter.com/JournalVelo/status/1038821529595928577

Since when another rider needs to do the chasing for the little arrogant red jersey?

Lol. What Rollthedice said.

I thought it was something else. Of course he is not going to pull for him.

In fact Lopez and Yates should forget about Quintana if they want to win. They both look to be stronger. So stop worrying about somebody else's race.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

And here is another one with a gripe against Quntana.....but it just hate ...isnt it ??

https://twitter.com/JournalVelo/status/1038821529595928577

Since when another rider needs to do the chasing for the little arrogant red jersey?

There’s nothing arrogant about telling the top favorite for the race, a multiple GT winner who still has a teammate with him, that he’s not going to get an armchair ride to the line. It was in both of their interests to chase down Lopez. Nairo is entitled to develop a sudden onset extreme allergy to getting the wind in his face if he likes, but he can’t expect his rivals to tolerate that kind of passivity from the favorite with good grace. He’s the guy with the GTs under his belt, none of the pretenders to a GT throne will allow him to leech.

 

[hrotha]

What you say it's true, but no less true than the fact that the red jersey shouldn't expect cooperation, especially when he has a better kick than the others for the finale. MAL is a small distance down and not as big a favourite on paper as Simon Yates, it's perfectly legitimate for those not in the leader jersey to leave that chase to the guy who has the most to lose, i.e. the leader.

Me, at the time I was thinking there's no way Quintana should pull. Either have Valverde work, or a better option, leave it to Yates before hopefully finishing him off with his own attack. The multiple GT winner thing cuts both ways - can Yates afford to throw away a chance like this when he hasn't won any GTs yet?

 

[Koronin]

Re:

What you say it's true, but no less true than the fact that the red jersey shouldn't expect cooperation, especially when he has a better kick than the others for the finale. MAL is a small distance down and not as big a favourite on paper as Simon Yates, it's perfectly legitimate for those not in the leader jersey to leave that chase to the guy who has the most to lose, i.e. the leader.

Me, at the time I was thinking there's no way Quintana should pull. Either have Valverde work, or a better option, leave it to Yates before hopefully finishing him off with his own attack. The multiple GT winner thing cuts both ways - can Yates afford to throw away a chance like this when he hasn't won any GTs yet?

Why should he force Valverde to work when he should be working for Valverde.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re:

What you say it's true, but no less true than the fact that the red jersey shouldn't expect cooperation, especially when he has a better kick than the others for the finale. MAL is a small distance down and not as big a favourite on paper as Simon Yates, it's perfectly legitimate for those not in the leader jersey to leave that chase to the guy who has the most to lose, i.e. the leader.

Me, at the time I was thinking there's no way Quintana should pull. Either have Valverde work, or a better option, leave it to Yates before hopefully finishing him off with his own attack. The multiple GT winner thing cuts both ways - can Yates afford to throw away a chance like this when he hasn't won any GTs yet?

I don’t think that either of them have committed some terrible crime. Of course they would each prefer the other to pull if they are stupid enough to do so alone, but ultimately cooperation is in both’s interests and both are aware of that. That’s why Yates wasn’t having any of it when Nairo tried to sit on and it’s why Nairo did actually come through when Yates yelled at him (and then quickly looked around for Valverde). Seeing if Yates was too eager for his own good was a reasonable thing for Quintana to do. But he knows that Movistar have two in the group, that he’s the favorite and Valverde is the fastest sprinter, that Lopez is a direct rival and that they can’t let him ride away. So Movistar did start pulling.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

What you say it's true, but no less true than the fact that the red jersey shouldn't expect cooperation, especially when he has a better kick than the others for the finale. MAL is a small distance down and not as big a favourite on paper as Simon Yates, it's perfectly legitimate for those not in the leader jersey to leave that chase to the guy who has the most to lose, i.e. the leader.

Me, at the time I was thinking there's no way Quintana should pull. Either have Valverde work, or a better option, leave it to Yates before hopefully finishing him off with his own attack. The multiple GT winner thing cuts both ways - can Yates afford to throw away a chance like this when he hasn't won any GTs yet?

Why should he force Valverde to work when he should be working for Valverde.

Valverde did start pulling after Nairo went through himself.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

What you say it's true, but no less true than the fact that the red jersey shouldn't expect cooperation, especially when he has a better kick than the others for the finale. MAL is a small distance down and not as big a favourite on paper as Simon Yates, it's perfectly legitimate for those not in the leader jersey to leave that chase to the guy who has the most to lose, i.e. the leader.

Me, at the time I was thinking there's no way Quintana should pull. Either have Valverde work, or a better option, leave it to Yates before hopefully finishing him off with his own attack. The multiple GT winner thing cuts both ways - can Yates afford to throw away a chance like this when he hasn't won any GTs yet?

Why should he force Valverde to work when he should be working for Valverde.

Valverde did start pulling after Nairo went through himself.

Valverde's comment after the stage was he wasn't willing to give up time that everyone else seemed happy to give up or something to that effect.

 

[Scarponi]

Correct call from Quintana with Yates, not having the legs combined with not wanting to drag the 800m sprinter to the end to cede another 12 seconds even though you are equal.

 

[hrotha]

Re: Re:

Why should he force Valverde to work when he should be working for Valverde.

Yeah, I don't actually think Valverde should have worked in that situation, but I was trying to empathize with what forumers with more conservative racing instincts might posit.

 

[Flamin]

The "siempre a rueda"-message from Quintana might have reached Yates as well, therefore causing Yates to overly react like he did.

But whoever should or shouldn't pull in that situation, it was quite an effective technique from Yates to invite Movistar to help him out. A calm and simple elbow probably wouldn't have had the same effect.

 

[Blanco]

Correct call from Quintana with Yates, not having the legs combined with not wanting to drag the 800m sprinter to the end to cede another 12 seconds even though you are equal.

No. Correct thing would be to work that last downhill part for superior sprinter from your team.
This way he lost 8 sec, and had he worked, Bala would out sprint Yates and he would lose less to him.

 

[Red Rick]

Correct call from Quintana with Yates, not having the legs combined with not wanting to drag the 800m sprinter to the end to cede another 12 seconds even though you are equal.

No. Correct thing would be to work that last downhill part for superior sprinter from your team.
This way he lost 8 sec, and had he worked, Bala would out sprint Yates and he would lose less to him.

Valverde didn't do that much work in the last 2km. He lost that sprint because he was more roasted than Yates, despite Yates spending way more energy on the final climb.

 

[Blanco]

Correct call from Quintana with Yates, not having the legs combined with not wanting to drag the 800m sprinter to the end to cede another 12 seconds even though you are equal.

No. Correct thing would be to work that last downhill part for superior sprinter from your team.
This way he lost 8 sec, and had he worked, Bala would out sprint Yates and he would lose less to him.

Valverde didn't do that much work in the last 2km. He lost that sprint because he was more roasted than Yates, despite Yates spending way more energy on the final climb.

He was on the front from the moment Yates waved at Quintana, and that was some 1.3-1.5 km from the finish. Although it's not about how he spent himself there, because he didn't, but about how Quintana should led that descent so Valverde could comfortably sit on Yates wheel and jumped him in that last 200m. This way he was jumped by Yates. Roasted or not he usually always have the strength for that last sprint.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

And here is another one with a gripe against Quntana.....but it just hate ...isnt it ??

https://twitter.com/JournalVelo/status/1038821529595928577

Since when another rider needs to do the chasing for the little arrogant red jersey?

There’s nothing arrogant about telling the top favorite for the race, a multiple GT winner who still has a teammate with him, that he’s not going to get an armchair ride to the line. It was in both of their interests to chase down Lopez. Nairo is entitled to develop a sudden onset extreme allergy to getting the wind in his face if he likes, but he can’t expect his rivals to tolerate that kind of passivity from the favorite with good grace. He’s the guy with the GTs under his belt, none of the pretenders to a GT throne will allow him to leech.

I really expected more from you as I enjoy your posts and respect your opinion. Here I think you are mistaken. Red jersey and his team has to be responsible for defending his leadership status. Quintana did his share of chasing down some attacks. For Yates to gesticulate that someone should be doing his job is rather comical. Maybe he should be complaining to his ds that he's not getting the support that he needs from his team.

 

[Moviestar]

Re:

The most important GT of Quintana, will it be a confirmation that his development stagnates, or is there some future by winning the Vuelta ( and also a future with Movistar). Somehow i can't see Landa and Quintana in one team next year, especially with all the rumours about a troubled relationship between the two.

The end concerning GT's sadly enough. :Neutral:

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

The most important GT of Quintana, will it be a confirmation that his development stagnates, or is there some future by winning the Vuelta ( and also a future with Movistar). Somehow i can't see Landa and Quintana in one team next year, especially with all the rumours about a troubled relationship between the two.

The end concerning GT's sadly enough. :Neutral:

I think he's riding a pretty solid race for a guy who went full-on for GC in the Tour and who crashed in the third week there. His form gradually dropping off in the third week as you'd expect.

Not amazing by any means, but he's comfortably the best of the GC guys who went really deep at the Tour. I agree he should probably leave Movistar though if he can - its turning into too much of a circus and they have messed up Quintana's peaking too many times now.