Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

[Singer01]

The only thing that makes any sense is that he was actually about 32 when he made his breakthrough. How has he fallen so far?

 

[Lequack]

Maybe the lack of more strict training program. Apparently a lot of Colombians like to train at home so you never truly know their form until they come to race.

 

[hrotha]

Re:

The only thing that makes any sense is that he was actually about 32 when he made his breakthrough. How has he fallen so far?

How would it make any sense that he improved so much between l'Avenir at 29 and the Tour at 32?

Quintana is not the first rider to fade early and he won't be the last, but you won't see these insinuations thrown at other riders. This casual racism thing doesn't do anyone any favours.

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re: Re:

The only thing that makes any sense is that he was actually about 32 when he made his breakthrough. How has he fallen so far?

How would it make any sense that he improved so much between l'Avenir at 29 and the Tour at 32?

Quintana is not the first rider to fade early and he won't be the last, but you won't see these insinuations thrown at other riders. This casual racism thing doesn't do anyone any favours.

How is it casual racism? Quintana does look old for his age, not because of his race or colour, but because of his facial appearance. You don't see people saying the same about the other Colombians

 

[hrotha]

You do see it about other athletes, though, and they all happen to be POC. But I'm sure it's all a huge coincidence.

There's also the unspoken assumption: "He's from Colombia, this kind of thing happens in a place like Colombia".

 

[perico]

Re:

Maybe the lack of more strict training program. Apparently a lot of Colombians like to train at home so you never truly know their form until they come to race.

My theory has always been that Colombian climbers born at high altitude may start their decline sooner because of the time at altitude (not talking about the larger, allrounders like Uran). They come into the peloton with their climbing ability closer to their maximum capabilities than riders from other countries. It goes back to Herrera who was basically washed up as a contender by 1990. Fabio Parra was 30 at the time. Meija (though that may have been due to his resistance to joining a clinic in the 1990s). Now Nairo has hit the same age where many other compatriots started to fade.

It's just a theory, but he hasn't done anything in almost three years in a major race and this is the 2nd GT in a row where he can't even stay with Valverde.

 

[Escarabajo]

It is hard to talk about the early decline with riders like Herrera when the EPO came into the scene when he hit his 30's. Soler crashed out and Botero was involved in Puerto. Now we have Uran performing well into his 30's and the jury is still watching Chaves. Hard to tell. We'll see with Bernal.

As for the comments about not telling that he was having a bad day here is Quintana's answer:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/quintana-i-told-the-team-i-was-in-difficulty-before-the-tourmalet/

That is different from what we heard 2 days ago. Something is not right here.

 

[No_Balls]

Re: Re:

Looks like he have burned every kind of bridges in his team. Like a true douche he failed to communicate with his team yesterday and wasnt remotely intrested in riding an inch for Landa today:

”Asked about Quintana, all Landa would say was "it was a pity he couldn't help more than he did. A couple of kilometres of work for me would have been welcome."

He isnt very popular it seems for good reasons.

Tonight's dinner would have been an interesting one.

He’s fighting his corner but looks close to the situation in Astana back in 2009 with Armstrong/Contador. Says he told them on Soulor but on the other hand he also told them to take it easy because he didnt feel well. Guess they dont take any more of that ***. We’ve seen far too many times Movi implode due to the unclear leader status in the team.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/quintana-i-told-the-team-i-was-in-difficulty-before-the-tourmalet/

Valverde doesnt sound too happy.

 

[Rollthedice]

He does look a bit old, don't you think?

More faces here:
cyclingtips.com/2019/07/a-glimpse-into-the-tour-de-france-2070-grand-masters-edition/

 

[rick james]

Re:

He does look a bit old, don't you think?

More faces here:
cyclingtips.com/2019/07/a-glimpse-into-the-tour-de-france-2070-grand-masters-edition/

stop the casual racism please

 

[Singer01]

Re: Re:

The only thing that makes any sense is that he was actually about 32 when he made his breakthrough. How has he fallen so far?

How would it make any sense that he improved so much between l'Avenir at 29 and the Tour at 32?

Quintana is not the first rider to fade early and he won't be the last, but you won't see these insinuations thrown at other riders. This casual racism thing doesn't do anyone any favours.

How is it casual racism? Quintana does look old for his age, not because of his race or colour, but because of his facial appearance. You don't see people saying the same about the other Colombians

No, he is correct, I was being racist. What I said had nothing to do with the fact that he does look old as fu(k, or that his career trajectory since his breakthrough would be consistent with that of someone who was in their mid to late 30s now.
Accusing someone of racism in these circumstances is absolutely fair and in no way a massive idiotic leap.

 

[hrotha]

Yes racism is a fairy tale, no one is racist, no one has internalized racism, pointing out the systemic racism that permeates our culture and affects us all (including me) is a personal attack, moving on.

 

[Amazinmets87]

"You don't see people saying the same about the other Colombians"

Speak for yourself; Uran has always looked older than his age

 

[tobydawq]

Re:

Yes racism is a fairy tale, no one is racist, no one has internalized racism, pointing out the systemic racism that permeates our culture and affects us all (including me) is a personal attack, moving on.

Everybody thinks Quintana looks old (except apparently for you), I don't know why you keep talking about that being a racist issue.

 

[No_Balls]

Re:

So, running Quintana in Faceapp is racism now? Lmao

Are you setting your sights on social justice warrior of the year, hrotha, or what?

 

[hrotha]

Nice strawmen. I didn't say it's racist to say he looks old or to use Faceapp on him. I said there's casual racism in the theories, commonly put forward in all seriousness, that he's actually older than he claims to be.

 

[Singer01]

Re:

Nice strawmen. I didn't say it's racist to say he looks old or to use Faceapp on him. I said there's casual racism in the theories, commonly put forward in all seriousness, that he's actually older than he claims to be.

It's a joke you big baby. Chill the f out.

 

[Escarabajo]

I am not liking this thread anymore.

Maybe we can close it. We only get insults and silly race jokes.

And for the comments from No_balls, I know the team don't give a s****. That's not the point we are discussing in this thread. The point was that Quintana was not being professional for note telling the team that he was feeling bad and was dropping when he told the story today that he told them well in advance that he was feeling bad and to work for Landa. That makes a difference if true.

And for Valverde's comments he should know better. Quintana has worked for him countless times in the past. Including the start of his career. Never had issues with that. And ridden with him many, many times.

 

[rick james]

Nairo is getting spanked....Close this thread

 

[roundabout]

Re:

Nice strawmen. I didn't say it's racist to say he looks old or to use Faceapp on him. I said there's casual racism in the theories, commonly put forward in all seriousness, that he's actually older than he claims to be.

Ever Rivera got fired from his team for claiming to be 1 year younger than he was

But that is the only case that I know of and it is difficult to imagine that each one of Quintana, Atapuma and Henao lied about their age.

 

[Koronin]

Re:

You do see it about other athletes, though, and they all happen to be POC. But I'm sure it's all a huge coincidence.

There's also the unspoken assumption: "He's from Colombia, this kind of thing happens in a place like Colombia".

Unfortunately there have been cases of this actually happening in Major League Baseball with South American athletes in the past. Not often, but on occasion.

 

[Amazinmets87]

Re: Re:

You do see it about other athletes, though, and they all happen to be POC. But I'm sure it's all a huge coincidence.

There's also the unspoken assumption: "He's from Colombia, this kind of thing happens in a place like Colombia".

Unfortunately there have been cases of this actually happening in Major League Baseball with South American athletes in the past. Not often, but on occasion.

I remember back in the early 2000s one MiLB player was discovered to be 6 years younger than his claimed age and subsequently released. The most famous player caught misrepresenting his age is probably Alfonso Soriano.

It's not nearly as uncommon as many are making it out to be, and unsurprisingly so. The people in question often come from impoverished backgrounds; the money they stand to earn can set themselves their family, heck even their village for life.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

You do see it about other athletes, though, and they all happen to be POC. But I'm sure it's all a huge coincidence.

There's also the unspoken assumption: "He's from Colombia, this kind of thing happens in a place like Colombia".

Unfortunately there have been cases of this actually happening in Major League Baseball with South American athletes in the past. Not often, but on occasion.

I remember back in the early 2000s one MiLB player was discovered to be 6 years younger than his claimed age and subsequently released. The most famous player caught misrepresenting his age is probably Alfonso Soriano.

It's not nearly as uncommon as many are making it out to be, and unsurprisingly so. The people in question often come from impoverished backgrounds; the money they stand to earn can set themselves their family, heck even their village for life.

Here's an article about it from the early 2000's. In this case we're talking most Dominican players if I remember correctly: http://old.post-gazette.com/sports/other/20020317age0317p4.asp

 

[Blanco]

Re:

I am not liking this thread anymore.

Maybe we can close it. We only get insults and silly race jokes.

And for the comments from No_balls, I know the team don't give a s****. That's not the point we are discussing in this thread. The point was that Quintana was not being professional for note telling the team that he was feeling bad and was dropping when he told the story today that he told them well in advance that he was feeling bad and to work for Landa. That makes a difference if true.

And for Valverde's comments he should know better. Quintana has worked for him countless times in the past. Including the start of his career. Never had issues with that. And ridden with him many, many times.[/quote]

And that is exactly the most telling thing in this matter. Valverde never criticize his teammates, I mean literally never! Unzue also.
On one side we have Nairo who, two days after the controversial stage, claims that he told his mates and DS that he's not feeling good, and on the other side we have Unzue, Valverde, Landa... No one backed Quintana's story as far as I know, so to me it's pretty obvious which version is true.
As for Quintana working for Valverde countless times, well I remember also countless opposite cases.

 

[del1962]

Next year with a new team will be crucial for Nairo, if his problems relate to his current team and his relationship with Landa then perhaps a change will be good for him, or it could be all the problems stem from himself which doesn't bode well for his future.

It feels like he has taken his eye of the ball perhaps due to his celebrity status back home in Colombia