National Football League

[jmdirt]

The concept that Las Vegas stadium uses has a great possibility for what you're after in consistency. A surface that can be rolled out as a whole or in sections can be maintained/replaced and grown. There are always problems with any turf but it would be much easier to adjust a section in a tray than large portions of a field. In the long term the costs would be much less and injury risks dealt with immediately rather than at a season's end. It works well with the multi-use emphasis of most new stadiums as well.
Surprisingly the NFL hasn't publicly suggested they are planning to require something like this. The NFLPA should partner very hard for it as well.

AZ was the first that I remember to roll the field in and out for sun and water, and to protect it from other events in the venue. They blew it this time with the grass not being mature enough (not rooted well enough), and having too much paint in some areas.

 

[jmdirt]

The big problem with artificial "grass" is durability. To make it durable and consistent it becomes much less pliable and relies on granular substrate to create soil-like traction. Older-school granular elements were reclaimed rubber products that caused other issues, too.
You'll notice that most speed players of this era wear forearm protection and shave any area that could slide on turf. No different than unshaved legs sliding on chip seal asphalt; the skin is the larger loop half of a velcro setup and the pavement is the smoother "hook" connection. The hook section always stays in place. Always. Ouch.

The little beads were added for injury reduction not traction because they allow some foot movement (less coefficient of friction than the rug alone), but those same beads are like sand paper to skin. I helped with a summer camp several times on the BSU blue and I would love to play on a surface like that (obviously not the 54 year old me, because one tackle would put me out for months!).

In 1986 I played a state playoff game in the Kibbie Dome (at U of Idaho), and any skin that was not covered was removed by the end of the game. In a bout 48 hours, everything was infected from all of stuff that was growing on the carpet. That was old school indoor-outdoor carpet laid directly over the cement and every time that you hit the ground was so much more painful than usual.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not at all comparing my playing level to NFL players, just sharing my experience and understanding of fake grass.

 

[jmdirt]

Only Natural Grass Can Level The NFL’s Playing Field

nflpa.com

.

One thing in there that I haven't discussed is footwear to help reduce injuries. I didn't check the 'data' in the above, but I hope that the NFLPA wouldn't publish it if it was based on something factual.

BUT:

NFL data shows injury rates same on grass, turf

Data showing the NFL's recent rate of non-contact injuries to the knee, ankle and foot contradicts the calls this season from several players, agents and coaches to convert all surfaces to grass in response to high-profile injuries on artificial turf.

www.espn.com

 

[Oldermanish]

The little beads were added for injury reduction not traction because they allow some foot movement (less coefficient of friction than the rug alone), but those same beads are like sand paper to skin. I helped with a summer camp several times on the BSU blue and I would love to play on a surface like that (obviously not the 54 year old me, because one tackle would put me out for months!).

In 1986 I played a state playoff game in the Kibbie Dome (at U of Idaho), and any skin that was not covered was removed by the end of the game. In a bout 48 hours, everything was infected from all of stuff that was growing on the carpet. That was old school indoor-outdoor carpet laid directly over the cement and every time that you hit the ground was so much more painful than usual.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not at all comparing my playing level to NFL players, just sharing my experience and understanding of fake grass.

You're right; I meant to say meaningful replication of natural grass traction (soil-like). Ultimately those early version beads were phased out as being carcinogenic?

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

That was old school indoor-outdoor carpet laid directly over the cement and every time that you hit the ground was so much more painful than usual.

That stuff was significantly worse than anything else. Ki-Jana Carter's career was ruined before it even started in his rookie year making a cut on that crap turf in Detroit (he was playing for the Bengals). He's not the only one. Curt Warner tore his ACL on it in the Kingdoom.

NFL data shows recent injury rates same on grass, artificial turf

Lots of criticism out there on that report. And counter stats. Here's one link.

Before we get too far talking about how the grass in Arizona was bad, let's not forget the players sliding a lot on the turf field in Buffalo in the AFC Divisional game.

There are of course different types of grass, and different types of turf. Here's a link to what every stadium had at the end of this season. The turf most players dislike the most, and may have the most injuries is a type of slit-turf (UBU Speed Series S5-M primarily. Shaw Sports Momentum may also be slit turf. I believe Field Turf Classic is also apparently a slit turf, but there are a couple different types of Field Turf™, with HD or Revolution being the newest). Detroit got rid of their slit-turf and replaced it with something newer. USB Speed Series is what's used in the Meadowlands, and being removed this coming year. Starting in 2023 the Giants and Jets will both play on Bermuda grass.

Some teams have gone back and forth. New England comes to mind. Now on Field Turf Revolution. I believe Carolina has as well.

More research finds both Carolina and Cincinnati have had considerations for replacing their turf with grass. Buffalo will probably go with grass in their new stadium. Pete Carroll has spoken more than once in favor of putting actual grass down for the Seahawks. Anyone who saw Jamal Adams injury this last year can see a good example of a non-contact, stuck foot injury on turf. Would he have had a similar injury on grass, considering the way he plays? Who knows?

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Some notable dates:

XFL (III) starts this coming Saturday. You can watch games on ABC, ESPN, online in a few places, and more. XFL (II) was actually doing okay with some decent play in 2020, better than the AAF I think. It was probably losing money faster than Vince McMahon wanted (even though he stated early on he expected a loss leader for the first full season), then Covid did it in. It is now owed by a group headed by Dwayne Johnson and his wife.

NFL Combine is from February 28th through March 6th. I really like the combine because you get to see players you may not have heard much about, as position players get a lot of attention, instead of it all being a bunch of quarterback (over)hype.

Franchise tags due, and Pro Days start on March 7th.

Free Agency begins on March 15th. History has shown that teams who act fast have been both effective at getting key players, and/or blown way too much money...depending on the year, and team!

USFL season starts April 15 - The league lost money last year, but it also didn't spend a whole lot, with nearly every game played in Birmingham, Alabama. This year many games will be played in Birmingham, but some "home" games will finally be played at teams home stadium. Fox Sports owns the USFL, but the players are also part of a union. 2023 will be a key year to see if they can not lose money, and last. Since the XFL championship game is on May 15th, it will be very interesting to see if anyone is paying attention to either sport, especially after the...

NFL Draft - April 27 - This is where most dedicated football fans stop watching, when the second day of the draft ends.

Minicamp starts May 5 for most teams.

 

[Oldermanish]

That stuff was significantly worse than anything else. Ki-Jana Carter's career was ruined before it even started in his rookie year making a cut on that crap turf in Detroit (he was playing for the Bengals). He's not the only one. Curt Warner tore his ACL on it in the Kingdoom.

Lots of criticism out there on that report. And counter stats. Here's one link.

Before we get too far talking about how the grass in Arizona was bad, let's not forget the players sliding a lot on the turf field in Buffalo in the AFC Divisional game.

There are of course different types of grass, and different types of turf. Here's a link to what every stadium had at the end of this season. The turf most players dislike the most, and may have the most injuries is a type of slit-turf (UBU Speed Series S5-M primarily. Shaw Sports Momentum may also be slit turf. I believe Field Turf Classic is also apparently a slit turf, but there are a couple different types of Field Turf™, with HD or Revolution being the newest). Detroit got rid of their slit-turf and replaced it with something newer. USB Speed Series is what's used in the Meadowlands, and being removed this coming year. Starting in 2023 the Giants and Jets will both play on Bermuda grass.

Some teams have gone back and forth. New England comes to mind. Now on Field Turf Revolution. I believe Carolina has as well.

More research finds both Carolina and Cincinnati have had considerations for replacing their turf with grass. Buffalo will probably go with grass in their new stadium. Pete Carroll has spoken more than once in favor of putting actual grass down for the Seahawks. Anyone who saw Jamal Adams injury this last year can see a good example of a non-contact, stuck foot injury on turf. Would he have had a similar injury on grass, considering the way he plays? Who knows?

Thanks for the actual technical update on turf types as they all have Owner/user related benefits and downsides.
Curt Warner's stellar career was cut short by crap outdoor carpet over asphalt base, although he kept going. Bike racers would appreciate his ability to endure pain.

He recovered (off base) in a gym and started riding indoor bikes when he saw me and an encouraging pursuiter/coach were doing indoor bike intervals. I was recovering from a skiing and shoulder injury and could only do so much weight training. I ended up on the unfortunate road of track and stage racing.
He came back as far as he could but never had that committed side-step that left people grabbing for their own jocks IMO. Very Barry Sanders skills. He was a stunning runner that would kill in this era and a really nice, honest dude. He had good local and personal trainers and seemed wary of the Seahawks med/strength staff. This was in the Kenny Easely era, so his instincts were on the money. Thats why he ended up in LA.

The guys that ran the gym knew more about conditioning and building players than the Hawks staff, then.

 

[jmdirt]

Before we get too far talking about how the grass in Arizona was bad, let's not forget the players sliding a lot on the turf field in Buffalo in the AFC Divisional game.

That wouldn't have happened in climate controlled facility. We can all point to 'slippery' games on all surfaces in Dec/Jan at outdoor venues. The point with AZ is there was no excuse.

I'm looking forward to digging in to all of the info from your post, thanks!

 

[jmdirt]

Anyone who saw Jamal Adams injury this last year can see a good example of a non-contact, stuck foot injury on turf. Would he have had a similar injury on grass, considering the way he plays? Who knows?

Who knows is correct. What if he was wearing 3/4 cleats and caught just the same? Consistency is probably the biggest issue with real grass, and you can't match your shoes to every part of the field. Rushing the edge, and chasing downplays like he does, I'm sure that he is going for max traction, which is also the worst for foot release.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Curt Warner's stellar career was cut short by crap outdoor carpet over asphalt base, although he kept going. Bike racers would appreciate his ability to endure pain.

Great post! I remember when he came back he did run much more north/south, but still had a couple very good seasons. Still, one has to wonder had he not been injured like that in his sophomore season? It was Dave Kreig's breakout year, and the defense on that team was incredible. They just blew out some teams. I seem to recall Todd Christensen of the Raiders later saying in the two games he lined up against Easley, not one single time was a ball even thrown at him. Neither Plunkett or Mark Wilson were even going to test Easley. And Christensen was a pro bowl level, receiver type TE! That's how good Easley was in his prime. But their offense did lack a running game, and Air Knox could only take them so far. Not saying the Seahawks would have won the Super Bowl with Warner, but...

That wouldn't have happened in climate controlled facility.

Or grass, likely.

The point with AZ is there was no excuse.

True.

I think part of what my little research showed is it's not just a simple issue of grass/turf. There are not only several different kinds of each, there are a lot of other factors that come into play. Not only surface, but weather, timing, more. Then game to game, even season to season things can be different. Sports Illustrated did an article about four years ago talking about which NFL fields and crews were the best, and they had Arizona at the top!

 

[movingtarget]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okL0zQP2qlc&t=337s

looks like he has accepted the job at Washington

 

[jmdirt]

I think part of what my little research showed is it's not just a simple issue of grass/turf. There are not only several different kinds of each, there are a lot of other factors that come into play. Not only surface, but weather, timing, more. Then game to game, even season to season things can be different.

This is really the basis for my desire for all game to be played indoors. Eliminating the weather reduces many/most of the factors (rain, snow, temperature...) that change the playing surface. This is two fold: player safety and good football (each team playing their game, not the game dealt by the conditions).

Obviously a crew can really mess things up like they did in AZ even when they are inside.

In one of our exchanges about playing surface you said "like the NBA" which confused me because I thought that you meant not having the NFL play on a wood surface (I'm still not sure what you meant). But the NBA is actually a good example because it doesn't matter where you play, the surface is fairly similar. Teams don't have to change who they are to play in Boston: "We can't fast break at the Garden". "Don't wear your high tops in Utah." If I'm not mistaken the NBA has parameters that all floors must fall within.

While I still lean to real grass out of the weather, I wonder if the real answer for consistency/player safety lies in a fake grass AND base that isn't developed yet.

Or grass, likely

Or wet, hard, cold grass would have been even worse. And likely more inconsistent.

 

[jmdirt]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okL0zQP2qlc&t=337s

looks like he has accepted the job at Washington

This boggles my mind. I would rather be one of the water boys at KC than the HC for WA. My assumption is that he is expecting to be the HC in WA in few years. The thought that getting out from under Andy will make it easier for him to showcase his talents is absurd at best. Plus, he has to showcase his talents with WA!

I can't get inside of EB's head obviously, but I feel like he just became a part of his own beast. Does he really want a HC job as bad as the 'story' has made it? Bad enough to go to WA?! I feel this way with a lot of the coaches who desire the money and power of a HC job only to find out that that isn't their skill set/true desire (Nagy on the KC staff as an example).

WA was 8-8-1, but who are they building beyond 500 with? The current owner is horrible. If they mange to get him out before June, it will still be difficult, but if he dangles on through the summer the distractions will be insurmountable. Plus, what's to keep him from really F ing things on his way out? Best case scenario, EB is building for 2024. So 24 and 25 as OC in WA, and then HC in WA? 6-11 and 8-9 is going to get him a HC job elsewhere in 26?

Bad move IMO. But congrats to him if he is happy!

Bad on the NFL too!

Looking forward:
Do they bring in Carr (might be Jets or Saints?), Mayfield, Garop? Is is required to list Kaep as well? Howell isn't the immediate answer, and maybe not the future either. Who is going to come out of backfield? Robinson? He could develop, but he isn't Pacheco (who benefits from PM being in the backfield with him). Gibson? Together they make one "OK" back, but neither of them are really threats. The O line? The D will be better with Young back, but they ranked in mid 20s in all areas which won't support a struggling/building O.

 

[movingtarget]

This boggles my mind. I would rather be one of the water boys at KC than the HC for WA. My assumption is that he is expecting to be the HC in WA in few years. The thought that getting out from under Andy will make it easier for him to showcase his talents is absurd at best. Plus, he has to showcase his talents with WA!

I can't get inside of EB's head obviously, but I feel like he just became a part of his own beast. Does he really want a HC job as bad as the 'story' has made it? Bad enough to go to WA?! I feel this way with a lot of the coaches who desire the money and power of a HC job only to find out that that isn't their skill set/true desire (Nagy on the KC staff as an example).

WA was 8-8-1, but who are they building beyond 500 with? The current owner is horrible. If they mange to get him out before June, it will still be difficult, but if he dangles on through the summer the distractions will be insurmountable. Plus, what's to keep him from really F ing things on his way out? Best case scenario, EB is building for 2024. So 24 and 25 as OC in WA, and then HC in WA? 6-11 and 8-9 is going to get him a HC job elsewhere in 26?

Bad move IMO. But congrats to him if he is happy!

Bad on the NFL too!

Looking forward:
Do they bring in Carr (might be Jets or Saints?), Mayfield, Garop? Is is required to list Kaep as well? Howell isn't the immediate answer, and maybe not the future either. Who is going to come out of backfield? Robinson? He could develop, but he isn't Pacheco (who benefits from PM being in the backfield with him). Gibson? Together they make one "OK" back, but neither of them are really threats. The O line? The D will be better with Young back, but they ranked in mid 20s in all areas which won't support a struggling/building O.

Yes its a strange one. He's going to a team with no established QB, that needs more weapons and didn't make the playoffs. I'm assuming that he thinks he will never get credit coaching under Andy Reid with Mahomes as QB. Maybe he doesn't handle the job process as good as others ? Who knows ? But they won't make the playoffs until they get the QB situation sorted out. Its obviously a risk because if Washington fails so do his head coaching aims, at least they will be further away than if he stayed at Kansas and if the team is sold everything is up in the air including the staffing. Some new owners just want to wipe the slate clean. Even if Rivera got canned it doesn't necessarily mean Bieniemy will be favoured to get the job.

 

[Nomad]

Let's hope it's a stepping stone for his long-awaited chance at a HC job. Since Rivera is a defensive-minded coach & essentially the DC, Bieniemy will be fully in charge of the offense calling the plays unlike having to share that duty with Reid.

And if Wash fail to make the playoffs again & they end up canning Rivera, perhaps Bieniemy will get the promotion.

My prediction - you'll see Bieniemy as a HC somewhere in 2024.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1626650921571680256

View: https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1626650921571680256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1626650921571680256%7Ctwgr%5E94bd0875f75ffa6c9e9b85d04fcd411256181e7b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-4438746151862448154.ampproject.net%2F2301261900000%2Fframe.html

 

[Oldermanish]

Let's hope it's a stepping stone for his long-awaited chance at a HC job. Since Rivera is a defensive-minded coach & essentially the DC, Bieniemy will be fully in charge of the offense calling the plays unlike having to share that duty with Reid.

And if Wash fail to make the playoffs again & they end up canning Rivera, perhaps Bieniemy will get the promotion.

My prediction - you'll see Bieniemy as a HC somewhere in 2024.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1626650921571680256

View: https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1626650921571680256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1626650921571680256%7Ctwgr%5E94bd0875f75ffa6c9e9b85d04fcd411256181e7b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-4438746151862448154.ampproject.net%2F2301261900000%2Fframe.html

Rivera seems like a great mentor. Patient on the outside, anyway.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

An issue is no one really knows just how much control Daniel Snyder has in Washington. He's supposedly not running the team, his wife is. And his contact with the team has been restricted. But let's be real here, he's still the owner. Then there's the issue of him possibly having a J. Edgar Hoover book of dirt on all the other owners, coaches, Goodell, etc. and is ready with TMZ on speed dial to go scorched earth on the rest of the NFL if they take his baby away from him.

This is really the basis for my desire for all game to be played indoors. Eliminating the weather reduces many/most of the factors (rain, snow, temperature...) that change the playing surface. This is two fold: player safety and good football (each team playing their game, not the game dealt by the conditions).

And the Tour de france should thus be on trainers, on Zwift. Think about it. Weather no longer a factor. No more crashes. Mechanicals would be almost non-existent. Significantly "greener". Much easier, and far less expensive event to put on.

The NBA reference is: if one wants to watch an indoor sport, the NBA is for you.

A thought about the next QB in Washington similar to an issue the Raiders currently have. Vocal fans and people on social media, and even some sports writers focus almost everything on a QB. As if that one player does everything. It would be I think a mistake for the Commanders to think they must find their franchise QB now. As if the team were that one player away from the Super Bowl (Brady to Tampa, Stafford to LA). The Commanders have a good defense, but are in a period of transition. Maybe Bienemy can develop Howell, maybe not. Maybe they can find a QB in the draft that falls to them. Maybe someone in FA will fit into the puzzle. But making a rash decision to quickly sign Carr, trade for Rodgers, or give up players and picks to move up in the draft, I think would be a mistake. The Raiders are a far better example, with a LOT of fans wanting the team to trade for Aaron Rodgers. Af if all of a sudden that would make the Raiders competitive with Kansas City!!! The Raiders defense was between 24th, and 32nd in every category last year. I posted about this before.

More on Rodgers, as well as QBs in the upcoming draft soon...

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Packers reporter Bob McGinn yesterday stated on a podcast the Packers are done with Aaron Rodgers, disgusted with him, and he's not coming back. Or if they are somehow stuck with him, he'll be the back-up to Jordan Love, who the team believes in. It's a combination of attitude, arrogance, and lack of preparation - at least in cohesion with the team and coaching staff. Quite the bombshell, but it doesn't surprise me that much as I reflect upon it, and look back at the last couple years, especially 2022.

The question is, what can they get in return for him? The Jets want him, but considering this report, the Raiders seem more likely. Even though as I noted before, that would result in a near disaster for the team, setting them back years. But Mark Davis has a long history of making snap, emotional decisions and forcing them upon his GM and coaching staff at the worst time.

 

[Nomad]

A thought about the next QB in Washington similar to an issue the Raiders currently have.

Speaking of the Raiders - what's going on with their QB situation now that Carr was booted out of there? I see Stidham is listed #1 on depth chart. And what about this kid Chase Garbers, currently listed as #2? (I've never heard of him - undrafted & played at Rodger's alma mater). Is Stidham going to be given the car keys & expected to lead the Silver & Black back to some kind of respectability?

I just realized next year's SB is in Allegiant Stadium - it's too bad the Raiders aren't good enough to be SB contenders & have a chance at hosting the game.

 

[Nomad]

Packers reporter Bob McGinn yesterday stated on a podcast the Packers are done with Aaron Rodgers, disgusted with him, and he's not coming back. Or if they are somehow stuck with him, he'll be the back-up to Jordan Love, who the team believes in.

The future HOFer & one of the greatest QBs in league history backing up Love? Now that would be a sight for sore eyes. I can just imagine all the cameras constantly zooming in on him during games as he angrily stands on the sideline holding a clipboard. Lol. Imagine Love trying to get some in-game advice from Rodgers; "Hey...Aaron...I could use a some advice here on these audibles...can you help me a little?" Lol.

 

[jmdirt]

An issue is no one really knows just how much control Daniel Snyder has in Washington. He's supposedly not running the team, his wife is. And his contact with the team has been restricted. But let's be real here, he's still the owner. Then there's the issue of him possibly having a J. Edgar Hoover book of dirt on all the other owners, coaches, Goodell, etc. and is ready with TMZ on speed dial to go scorched earth on the rest of the NFL if they take his baby away from him.

And the Tour de france should thus be on trainers, on Zwift. Think about it. Weather no longer a factor. No more crashes. Mechanicals would be almost non-existent. Significantly "greener". Much easier, and far less expensive event to put on.

The NBA reference is: if one wants to watch an indoor sport, the NBA is for you.

A thought about the next QB in Washington similar to an issue the Raiders currently have. Vocal fans and people on social media, and even some sports writers focus almost everything on a QB. As if that one player does everything. It would be I think a mistake for the Commanders to think they must find their franchise QB now. As if the team were that one player away from the Super Bowl (Brady to Tampa, Stafford to LA). The Commanders have a good defense, but are in a period of transition. Maybe Bienemy can develop Howell, maybe not. Maybe they can find a QB in the draft that falls to them. Maybe someone in FA will fit into the puzzle. But making a rash decision to quickly sign Carr, trade for Rodgers, or give up players and picks to move up in the draft, I think would be a mistake. The Raiders are a far better example, with a LOT of fans wanting the team to trade for Aaron Rodgers. Af if all of a sudden that would make the Raiders competitive with Kansas City!!! The Raiders defense was between 24th, and 32nd in every category last year. I posted about this before.

More on Rodgers, as well as QBs in the upcoming draft soon...

While I understand the reach that you are making with the TdF comparison, it is grapes to watermelons. That comparison only starts to work if some teams train on stationary bikes, others on dirt roads, others on pave, others on tarmac...

Its not that I want to watch indoor sports, I want every team to play their game. I don't know how many times I can state that. I don't rally care which team can adapt the best. We aren't playing in the city park anymore. Keep in mind that my athletic success has come in motocross and mountain biking so I love/live for 'me against the elements' events, but that has nothing to do with how much it drives me crazy when I watch games on wet, snowy, muddy, cold surfaces (with an equally compromised ball) that completely dictate the game.

I hardly watch the NBA anymore and wouldn't watch it even if they moved it outside.

Maybe the HNL would be a better comparison, an outside game that moved inside (except for the occasional one off). Can you image the great ice in Miami, Phoenix, Dallas, LA, Tampa?! When you come to play us, bring your waders! Who cares about your great skate skills, can you swim?

EDIT: I'm watching an outdoor NHL game tonight!

I agree about WA and LV. Putting all of their money in to QB1 won't make them the division leader, let alone a great team, but they do need to have solid QB play even while building. Is there an affordable vet to bring in to help with the young guy? EDIT: Isn't Mayfield's contract relatively small? I don't know that he's the man, and it doesn't seem like he would be a great mentor, but maybe he's a patch?

 

[Oldermanish]

The future HOFer & one of the greatest QBs in league history backing up Love? Now that would be a sight for sore eyes. I can just imagine all the cameras constantly zooming in on him during games as he angrily stands on the sideline holding a clipboard. Lol. Imagine Love trying to get some in-game advice from Rodgers; "Hey...Aaron...I could use a some advice here on these audibles...can you help me a little?" Lol.

He won't stand. He'll glower from behind his hoodie sitting on a heated seat.

 

[movingtarget]

Packers reporter Bob McGinn yesterday stated on a podcast the Packers are done with Aaron Rodgers, disgusted with him, and he's not coming back. Or if they are somehow stuck with him, he'll be the back-up to Jordan Love, who the team believes in. It's a combination of attitude, arrogance, and lack of preparation - at least in cohesion with the team and coaching staff. Quite the bombshell, but it doesn't surprise me that much as I reflect upon it, and look back at the last couple years, especially 2022.

The question is, what can they get in return for him? The Jets want him, but considering this report, the Raiders seem more likely. Even though as I noted before, that would result in a near disaster for the team, setting them back years. But Mark Davis has a long history of making snap, emotional decisions and forcing them upon his GM and coaching staff at the worst time.

The last few seasons it appeared that Rodgers was playing head games with the GB front office and seemed to be enjoying it. He knew he held all the cards but isolating the performances in the playoffs from the power games, he has nothing to brag about in recent times. Both losses to the 49ers in the recent NFC games were horrendous for differerent reasons and Rodgers was mediocre in both games. They had ample opportunities to get the SB done. Number one seed a few times with the MVP at QB and he just never showed up when it mattered. Considering the price, I wouldn't be signing Rodgers and he's a completely different personality to a Brady.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Rodgers is already under contract next season with Green Bay. The total I believe is $59m fully guaranteed! He's also signed through 2026! (though there an out after next season).

Agree as amazing as he's been in several seasons, he's been equally unimpressive in the playoffs except that astounding comeback win against Dallas a few years back.

The question on trading him is that outrageous contract. Someone is going to have to re-negotiate something. The problem is, he likes money, a lot. So the new contract may reduce his 2023 pay to some $40m, but the back-end would still be somewhat loaded. That means cap hits and/or dead money once he's done. How many more years do people think he'll play?

Speaking of the Raiders - what's going on with their QB situation now that Carr was booted out of there? I see Stidham is listed #1 on depth chart. And what about this kid Chase Garbers, currently listed as #2? (I've never heard of him - undrafted & played at Rodger's alma mater). Is Stidham going to be given the car keys & expected to lead the Silver & Black back to some kind of respectability?

Car was due way too much money. GM Dave Ziegler re-negotiated the contract he wanted, with an out, and signed his buddy Davonte Adams, but Carr couldn't get it done. He threw way too many interceptions, forced the ball way too much, and had several bad decisions and throws at the worst time. His future team will see. For every great throw he makes, get ready for a red zone interception at the worst time.

I can only guess, but I think if Mark Davis asserts himself, he'll push to trade for Rodgers. A lot of loud, dumb fans think signing Rodgers would instantly make the entire team a top contender, which to me is laughable. Davis, as well as Ziegler and McDaniels might be up for signing Jimmy Garappolo. But I think that could be a mistake. Too costly. Can't make it through a season.

I think what the Raiders should do is sign Jacoby Brissett, and keep Stidham. Why? Stiddy played good against SF, and not very good against KC. Hard to tell his future. Brissett didn't win many games last year, but his numbers were actually better than Deshaun Watson, and his teammates on the Browns really liked Brissett. He's also played under McDaniels before. Plus, his price tag would be about $6m. He (and Stiddy) could make a good "bridge" until the Raiders can find their franchise QB, or maybe Stiddy will really step up, and in the meantime the team should sign some key FA players and draft heavily on defense, where they have been terrible. Maybe they find a QB who falls in the draft (Hooker?), maybe they find a QB next season. But the Raiders are not going to win the AFC West this year. That's dreaming.

I think it's possible Ziegler thinks the same as me, and I do have some faith in that guy. McDaniels? I'm not so sure. He's a hell of a lot more human, and humble, than he was in Denver. So...maybe. Ask again in a year. Mark Davis however I don't have much faith in at all. He has a long history of meddling, rash decisions that have really hurt the team. President Sarah Morgan was partly hired for city and political connections, but also as she's a contract attorney. The insider talk was she could help crunch numbers on helping the team not blow their future away. So, if Davis pushes the team to trade draft picks away to hire an aging, temperamental, primadonna Rodgers, just so he can watch him throw pretty spirals to Adams, you'll know it was all for nothing. Davis has said he wants to build a solid founding to winning for years to come. But insiders have said he's hinted he's said to Ziegler and McDaniels this year was unacceptable and the team needs to improve if they want to keep their jobs. How true is that? Who the hell knows?! Mark Davis is not like Art Rooney II, or Clark Hunt, who knows to hire the right people, give them a positive work environment, be patient, then stay the hell away. So, 50/50 chance Raiders trading to get Rodgers happens.

 

[Oldermanish]

The last few seasons it appeared that Rodgers was playing head games with the GB front office and seemed to be enjoying it. He knew he held all the cards but isolating the performances in the playoffs from the power games, he has nothing to brag about in recent times. Both losses to the 49ers in the recent NFC games were horrendous for differerent reasons and Rodgers was mediocre in both games. They had ample opportunities to get the SB done. Number one seed a few times with the MVP at QB and he just never showed up when it mattered. Considering the price, I wouldn't be signing Rodgers and he's a completely different personality to a Brady.

Aaron appears to be just playing social ego games in general. Between courting and dumping high profile media-based women and ruminating on politics as though he was a Sage from the Super Bowl Megaverse, he seems bored with his situation. Either that or he's just delusional which I'd suggest is at least an equal part of his problem. Green Bay has a loyal following that owns the team and has rewarded him completely; the fans deserve better. Let him go to a more attentive, inquisitive and invasive market for his attention and he'll get the love he truly deserves.
The fans will support their guy, Love.