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Unchained

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Observations about the fragile balance between Herbert and doom is everywhere in the NFL with a good starting QB harder to field than a unicorn. I don't see any decent parity between starters and backups and the teams that surprised everyone w who they named as a starter are the best off. 49ers looked quirky w a 3rd stringer QB leading to some exciting victories..
In my heart I feel that Justin Fields is living the parallel life to RG3 and each time I see the ball snapped and his offensive line I feel sick to my stomach. And as far as predictable coaching calls. Chicago is already not very dynamic and to have plays w tight ends and people in the backfield being designated blockers would be the only logical thing to do to protect Fields and an offense w 2+ less eligible receivers is no offense at all
Man the hype about Aaron Rodgers playing pre season is killing me..
 
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movingtarget

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jmdirt said:
Grier (DAL) with a great job interview for other teams watching! Has Lance ever had a game that good?

Hopefully Bobo makes the SEA roster. He has the makings of one of those crafty, clutch, go to guys.
Click to expand...
Grier looked good. Trouble is they have four QBs now and one will probably be gone. Lance hasn't done anything like that in any NFL game. His only win over the Texans came after a mediocre first half display. The Rams looked putrid in the first half of their game against Denver. They could barely move the ball. 0-27 at half time ! The Vegas rookie QB has also looked good so far. 49ers are always up to something bizarre it seems like losing all their QBs in one game or getting record injuries. This time they lose both of their kickers to injury. One before the game and the second one gets injured attempting his first kick leaving them without a kicker for the rest of the game.
 
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Alpe d'Huez

Alpe d'Huez

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Denver needs to cut Russell Wilson and get it over with, or at least bench him if it's too expensive to cut him. I've seen enough. Granted, this was a lot of back-up players, but THIS Denver team looked like a Sean Payton team. Everyone was on the same page, and the offense was humming, as was the D, which we knew were good already.

Last year in the preseason Jarett Stidham looked very good for the Raiders, their offense looked in sync no matter who was out there, but Vegas of course just started Derek Carr, who promptly went out and threw 3 interceptions in his first game. The only QB who threw more picks over the year was Dak. Carr also could not get the Raiders into the end zone. After 15 weeks, enough was enough and Stidham named the starter. When he played, he stepped right in and looked like he had been playing all year, and damn near beat the 49ers.

I saw the same thing last night. Stidham is a lot better than maybe even he thinks he is. He's certainly just as good as Russell Wilson at this point. No, he's very likely better. I'm not certain Stiddy is the future QB for Denver, but he most certainly could be their bridge QB until they find that guy for the future. And they'll very likely win more games with him. Russ' passer rating this preseason was 58.5. Stidham's was 138.7. I don't care what other players are on the field, this is a staggering disparity.

Wilson was so ineffective this preseason, no matter what other players were on the field, he was outplayed by 3rd string QB Ben DiNucci, who is a bit more dynamic than Stidham, but not as accurate or quick at decision making. But Ben sees the field well and moves well. Better than Wilson even.

Sean Peyton needs to just rip the band-aid off, and be done with it.

So, is Will Grier better than Trey Lance? If I were the Chargers, Bengals or the Rams, I'd seriously look at signing Grier. As to the Rams, Bennett looked good in his first preseason game, decent in the second, but fell back to earth, hard here. Rypien may have looked worse.

Agree Aiden O'Connell looks very good. Had the best preseason of all rookie QBs. Quick decisions, accurate passing, no bad throws.
 
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movingtarget

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Alpe d'Huez said:
Denver needs to cut Russell Wilson and get it over with, or at least bench him if it's too expensive to cut him. I've seen enough. Granted, this was a lot of back-up players, but THIS Denver team looked like a Sean Payton team. Everyone was on the same page, and the offense was humming, as was the D, which we knew were good already.

Last year in the preseason Jarett Stidham looked very good for the Raiders, their offense looked in sync no matter who was out there, but Vegas of course just started Derek Carr, who promptly went out and threw 3 interceptions in his first game. The only QB who threw more picks over the year was Dak. Carr also could not get the Raiders into the end zone. After 15 weeks, enough was enough and Stidham named the starter. When he played, he stepped right in and looked like he had been playing all year, and damn near beat the 49ers.

I saw the same thing last night. Stidham is a lot better than maybe even he thinks he is. He's certainly just as good as Russell Wilson at this point. No, he's very likely better. I'm not certain Stiddy is the future QB for Denver, but he most certainly could be their bridge QB until they find that guy for the future. And they'll very likely win more games with him. Russ' passer rating this preseason was 58.5. Stidham's was 138.7. I don't care what other players are on the field, this is a staggering disparity.

Wilson was so ineffective this preseason, no matter what other players were on the field, he was outplayed by 3rd string QB Ben DiNucci, who is a bit more dynamic than Stidham, but not as accurate or quick at decision making. But Ben sees the field well and moves well. Better than Wilson even.

Sean Peyton needs to just rip the band-aid off, and be done with it.

So, is Will Grier better than Trey Lance? If I were the Chargers, Bengals or the Rams, I'd seriously look at signing Grier. As to the Rams, Bennett looked good in his first preseason game, decent in the second, but fell back to earth, hard here. Rypien may have looked worse.

Agree Aiden O'Connell looks very good. Had the best preseason of all rookie QBs. Quick decisions, accurate passing, no bad throws.
Click to expand...
I think the Denver head office probably have the head spins by now over their QB selections. It took the Jets a long time to find a good QB after Joe Namath and Rodgers is in the twilight of his career if last year was anything to go by. Denver haven't had to wait that long but it's been a while since Manning left the scene.It's been crickets at QB at least in finding a franchise QB and if Purdy has an off year Shanahan is another coach that will be under the pump at least in the short term by many fans that also think he mismanaged the Lance pick from the start and it was a pick that never should have been made anyway according to most people.
 
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Nomad

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Alpe d'Huez said:
Denver needs to cut Russell Wilson and get it over with, or at least bench him if it's too expensive to cut him. I've seen enough. Granted, this was a lot of back-up players, but THIS Denver team looked like a Sean Payton team. Everyone was on the same page, and the offense was humming, as was the D, which we knew were good already.

Last year in the preseason Jarett Stidham looked very good for the Raiders, their offense looked in sync no matter who was out there, but Vegas of course just started Derek Carr, who promptly went out and threw 3 interceptions in his first game. The only QB who threw more picks over the year was Dak. Carr also could not get the Raiders into the end zone. After 15 weeks, enough was enough and Stidham named the starter. When he played, he stepped right in and looked like he had been playing all year, and damn near beat the 49ers.

I saw the same thing last night. Stidham is a lot better than maybe even he thinks he is. He's certainly just as good as Russell Wilson at this point. No, he's very likely better. I'm not certain Stiddy is the future QB for Denver, but he most certainly could be their bridge QB until they find that guy for the future. And they'll very likely win more games with him. Russ' passer rating this preseason was 58.5. Stidham's was 138.7. I don't care what other players are on the field, this is a staggering disparity.

Wilson was so ineffective this preseason, no matter what other players were on the field, he was outplayed by 3rd string QB Ben DiNucci, who is a bit more dynamic than Stidham, but not as accurate or quick at decision making. But Ben sees the field well and moves well. Better than Wilson even.

Sean Peyton needs to just rip the band-aid off, and be done with it.

So, is Will Grier better than Trey Lance? If I were the Chargers, Bengals or the Rams, I'd seriously look at signing Grier. As to the Rams, Bennett looked good in his first preseason game, decent in the second, but fell back to earth, hard here. Rypien may have looked worse.

Agree Aiden O'Connell looks very good. Had the best preseason of all rookie QBs. Quick decisions, accurate passing, no bad throws.
Click to expand...
They're not going to cut or bench Wilson anytime soon. He's a SB winning QB & future HOF - he can do no wrong. If the Broncos stink up the joint & fail to make the playoffs - and Wilson performs poorly - it'll be on Payton not Wilson. That's how the NFL works when you're dealing with these imperious SB winning, future HOF QBs. They decide when they want to step down & leave the game not the other way around (e.g. Brady, Rivers, Big Ben, etc.).

Secondly, I wouldn't put a lot of emphasis on preseason when it comes to the starters. Preseason is basically meaningless & just a gimmick for the owners to make some extra dough. The season is egregiously so long that preseason isn't necessary and subjects players to injuries. Many starters & even the backups don't give 100% during preseason games. Why would they? They'd be risking injury before the season even started & especially when they're already penciled in on the 53. This year two preseason games were called in the 2nd half because of serious injuries where the player was carted off the field. And players are already getting hurt in just practice during the preseason (no coach wants to open up the season with some of his best players already injured).

I'm not defending Wilson & you certainly bring up some good points on his current lack of performance. But let's wait & see how the season unfolds & evaluate him & the team's progress at the halfway point. FWIW, he's already entering the season with a handicap losing Patrick, and now Jeudy looks to miss the opener - and possibly more games - with that moderate hamstring pull sustained in a scrimmage in last week's joint practice with the Rams. And not having the services of Jeudy is a big deal for Wilson.

Lastly, I'm not sold on Stidham like you are. If he is so wonderful as you say -why did the Raiders release him? Doesn't the hotshot McDaniels know a thing or two about QBs? Why didn't he keep Stidham & let him compete with Jimmy G for the starting job? So, Stidham performed really well in preseason - big deal. Let's see if he could perform that well in the regular season when games mean something & defenses are playing at 100% intensity ready to wallop QBs at every given opportunity & make their life miserable. Lol.
 
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Alpe d'Huez

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Nomad said:
Lastly, I'm not sold on Stidham like you are. If he is so wonderful as you say -why did the Raiders release him? Doesn't the hotshot McDaniels know a thing or two about QBs? Why didn't he keep Stidham & let him compete with Jimmy G for the starting job? So, Stidham performed really well in preseason - big deal. Let's see if he could perform that well in the regular season when games mean something & defenses are playing at 100% intensity ready to wallop QBs at every given opportunity & make their life miserable. Lol.
Click to expand...
Stidham wasn't cut. He was a FA at the end of last year, and Denver offered him as much if not more money than the Raiders did, and Stidham chose to sign with Denver. It's that simple. Stidham actually did play in three regular season games last year, and looked better than Derek Carr, even though the Raiders didn't win any of those games (played 4Q vs. Saints, lost at SF and at KC). He actually looked quite good against the 49ers, and almost pulled off the win.

I'm mostly sold him on as a decent bridge QB, for a low rate of pay, until Denver can draft (or find) their QB for the future, because Wilson isn't it. He's thus only "wonderful" by relative comparison. :openmouth:

I have said it myself that players get coaches fired, not vice-versa. We even now know that Wilson tried to get both Pete Carroll and John Schneider fired. But Denver, now, is one case where co-owner Greg Penner specifically sought out Payton, talked about having a coach that is a "CEO type" who is the true leader of the organization. Payton is now the de facto GM as well, plus director of player personnel. Coaches contracts are not public, but it's reportedly about $18m a year, just below Belicheck, but with bonuses. Plus they gave up draft picks to get him. My point is this, if Wilson has a crap year, I can see actually Payton cutting Wilson, then letting Penner know. I don't see a path of a crummy Wilson, after another crummy season, getting Payton fired.

But who knows, there are people out there who think Russ is going to return to his 2019 glory days. Maybe I'm completely wrong and he'll have an MVP season. We'll soon see...
 
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movingtarget

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Some people forget that Wilson's last two seasons at the Hawks were mediocre by his standards which is why many were surprised with the size of the contract that Denver offered him and it also shows how desperate Denver have become to find a franchise QB. If anything Wilson has been declining for three seasons now so I'd be surprised to see him return to his pre 2020 form. The same qestions are also being asked about Rodgers even though Rodgers drop off hasn't bee so severe. Just because Brady can do it it doesn't mean that every aging QB will be able to keep it together until they retire. even the talented ones. Big Ben hit the wall when he got older so did Manning and Cam Newton was never the same after his SB loss. Drew Brees' last two seasons were not good maybe even before that
 
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Nomad

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Alpe d'Huez said:
Stidham wasn't cut. He was a FA at the end of last year, and Denver offered him as much if not more money than the Raiders did, and Stidham chose to sign with Denver. It's that simple. Stidham actually did play in three regular season games last year, and looked better than Derek Carr, even though the Raiders didn't win any of those games (played 4Q vs. Saints, lost at SF and at KC). He actually looked quite good against the 49ers, and almost pulled off the win.

I'm mostly sold him on as a decent bridge QB, for a low rate of pay, until Denver can draft (or find) their QB for the future, because Wilson isn't it. He's thus only "wonderful" by relative comparison. :openmouth:

I have said it myself that players get coaches fired, not vice-versa. We even now know that Wilson tried to get both Pete Carroll and John Schneider fired. But Denver, now, is one case where co-owner Greg Penner specifically sought out Payton, talked about having a coach that is a "CEO type" who is the true leader of the organization. Payton is now the de facto GM as well, plus director of player personnel. Coaches contracts are not public, but it's reportedly about $18m a year, just below Belicheck, but with bonuses. Plus they gave up draft picks to get him. My point is this, if Wilson has a crap year, I can see actually Payton cutting Wilson, then letting Penner know. I don't see a path of a crummy Wilson, after another crummy season, getting Payton fired.

But who knows, there are people out there who think Russ is going to return to his 2019 glory days. Maybe I'm completely wrong and he'll have an MVP season. We'll soon see...
Click to expand...
I don't think Payton would ever cut Wilson. In this interview back in July at the start of training camp, Payton says Wilson "still has it" & "has a lot of gas in the tank." He blames none of last season's offensive problems on Wilson & says it was all on Hackett (penalties, couldn't get the plays in on time, wrong player substitutions, etc).

Now maybe Payton had to refrain from publicly criticizing Wilson so as to not create any distractions before the season has even started (that would be a media frenzy if Payton dares criticizes Wilson. Lol). Or perhaps Payton really does believe in Wilson & thinks his system will clean up the offense & get production out of Wilson. It will be interesting to see that if the offense is struggling & the team is losing by say mid-season or so - if Payton would ever make a QB change. Now that would be a sight to see - Stidham at the helm & Wilson holding a clipboard. Lol

The other thing here is that in cutting Wilson the Broncos would have to eat north of 134 million in dead money over the next seasons compliments of that sweet 245 mil contract extension he got. Is ownership willing to bite the bullet & eat this kind of loss?

One thing is for certain: All eyes will be on Wilson - as well as Rodgers - this season more than any other QBs for the very high expectations that has been set by ownership for these future Hall of Famers to lead their respective teams to the promised land. The Monday morning pundits & talking heads will be analyzing & dissecting ad nuseam every game these two play. Lol.

Sean Payton pinpoints blame for Broncos' collapse, Russell Wilson's woes: '20 dirty hands'

Sean Payton has been tasked with repairing a Broncos team that cratered last season after the much-hyped addition of Russell Wilson.
www.usatoday.com www.usatoday.com
 
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Unchained

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Potomac said:
WTF....Chargers booted Brees out of bed for the inferior Rivers.

By rights you should hate Brees because you know he was done wrong and HE WILL NEVER LOVE YOU
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Excellent point.. and I have belly ached about it for years when Spanks family booted Brees, Spells and John Carney out of town!! But Rivers couldn't run or scramble but he was a good 1_dimensional quarterback..
 
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Nomad

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WTH is going on in Arizona?


McCoy cut & Murray put on the PUP list? (the team has given no indication of when, or if, Murray is going to play this season).

This leaves Arizona with 5th rd rookie Clayton Tune who has zero playing experience & journeyman backup Josh Dobbs, who in 6 seasons has all but two starts to his name (both losses).

Is Arizona trying to tank the season & get the #1 OA pick?
 
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Unchained

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Nomad said:
WTH is going on in Arizona?


McCoy cut & Murray put on the PUP list? (the team has given no indication of when, or if, Murray is going to play this season).

This leaves Arizona with 5th rd rookie Clayton Tune who has zero playing experience & journeyman backup Josh Dobbs, who in 6 seasons has all but two starts to his name (both losses).

Is Arizona trying to tank the season & get the #1 OA pick?
Click to expand...
Arizona QB just signed a deal to do a series of Kebbler cookie commercials
 
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Alpe d'Huez

Alpe d'Huez

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Nate Suffield was already going to be 3rd string, behind Bridgewater. My guess is he was going to be cut once Hooker was healthy.

I do agree the play of Rodgers and Wilson will be analyzed to death. It will be so bad, such overkill, that the normal pressure from attention a rookie like Young would get, may not be so bad. My prediction is Wilson will be about the same as last season, and Rodgers will be slightly worse. Maybe. Both could be worse, period. I don't see either playing any better, regardless of what Sean Payton says about Hackett. Oh, and I'm sure we all heard Rodgers defend Hackett. Ahhh yes, the overanalysis begins already!

I can only concur the Cardinals are tanking. Or just writing the season off until next year Gannon can start molding a new team in his vision, with players he wants. But I don't know what they will do with Murray after giving him that ridiculous contract. Almost as bad of a deal that Watson and Wilson got. I watched all of the highlights of the Cards, plus Clayton Tune, and he has talent, but he's not ready for the NFL yet. I just don't see it. He played about as well as Haener, Bennett, or Duggan, who were drafted about where he was. Dobbs has to be the guy until Murray can play, I guess.

I don't think the Rams will be that bad. At least as long as Stafford stays healthy. I know, a big if.
 
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Alpe d'Huez

Alpe d'Huez

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I don't see it that way. The key word is "tanking" not winning vs. losing. Here's what my crystal ball tells me. I'm penciling in the first ten games of the season, assuming Murray would be back by then:

Cardinals with McCoy at starting QB 3-7
Cardinals with Dobbs at starting QB 2-8
Cardinals with Tune at starting QB 1-9

The more games you lose ("tank") the better your chances are at getting Williams or Maye in next year's draft. In fact, a lot of pundits believe Rattler, Jefferson Penix, Daniels and Nix may all go in the first round next year, and Williams and Maye would have been drafted above Young in any season. We'll see. The other problem is the Cardinals need help on the DL, or entire front 7 on D, and the need help at receiver. And I don't mean 3nd round draft "prospect" pick help, I mean a true, sure-fire starter.
 
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Nomad

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Eyeballs Out said:
If one thinks that the Cardinals are tanking because they cut Colt McCoy then one must believe that the Cardinals were winning games with Colt McCoy
Click to expand...
Well...in the 6 starts that McCoy had in the 2 seasons with the Cards he's gone 3-3. Last year he was 1-2 with the only win against the Rams (238 yds/1 TD). In 13 seasons in the league he's had 36 starts (played in a total of 56 games) with a dismal 11-25 record. Granted, he's not going to win any backup of the year awards but he's started 6 games & won 3 in relief of Murray.

As I mentioned before, Dobbs has only 2 starts to his name (losing both) & Tune is a 5th rd rookie. Murray is on the PUP - which means he's inactive for 4 games & the earliest he could come back isn't until week #5 against Cinn (10/08).

So, it would seem that the best chance to win & not lose all the first 4 games would be with the veteran McCoy - who has started 36 games in his career vs 2 starts for Dobbs.

Gannon has now given the "official" reason for cutting McCoy but has yet to name a starter for the opening game against Wash. Maybe he'll surprise us all & go with the kid which would be 4 rookies starting on day 1 this season. 4 rookies that will be brutally welcomed to the NFL as they start their on the job training. Lol.

 
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