Official "another interesting piece I found on Alberto Contador" Thread

[sniper]

How come Cadel hasn't said anything? He lost to Contador by 23 seconds in 2007. You'd think he'd be ****ed.

I guess by asking the question you've answered it.

 

[Sanitiser]

auscyclefan ask him on twitter!

 

[roundabout]

Cadel was beaten by a clean and honest rider in 2007.

It's true. McQuaid said so.

 

[Nearly]

True, but first somebody has to appeal for that to happen.

Anyway, indeed a great opinion article by Bonnie. A similarly critical one was recently written in the German Süddeutsche Zeitung. The Spanish are making themselves look really bad (even though most here in the CLinic agree that the problem is not only within Spain).

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/55N38S/3862619/Fuenf-Tuermchen-statt-drei.html

They do but between the UCI & WADA this seems to happening on a regular basis (e.g. Vino). You have to feel sorry for fringe riders like Fuyu as mounting a CAS would be a real challenge financially and otherwise (and you do have to wonder what process the Chinese fed may have followed and what it and its friends may think of anyone who drags them off to Switzerland to challenge the result).

Interesting SDZ article but somewhat more ambitious (and less supported) than Bonnie Ford's! To oversimply paraphrase it says 'in cycling they all do it and in Spain they all do it in all sports'!

Interesting reference to the use and apparent (non)detectability of new generation Clenbuterol quoting a Humanplasma player " ... Eine Kernfigur der Österreich-Affäre, Langlauftrainer Walter Mayer, teilt im Buch eines Freundes mit, dass heute Clenbuterol mit verändertem Genprofil in Gebrauch sei: 'Da sieht man in der Auswertung fünf statt drei Türmchen, und keiner weiß, was es ist.'".

 

[Nearly]

So, you think you're going to get the same punishment in real life regardless of how expensive your lawyers are and regardless of the country you live in? China even gives the death penalty for drug smuggle lol.

Contador threw more money at it, so he had a better defence then that chinese boy. Is it fair? No.
Is it normal? Yes.

And otherwise you're living in a dream world.

Dream world? Not sure about that. Alberto and Fuyu are both going to end up with 2 years - but yes, they won't have received equal treatment along the way.

 

[180mmCrank]

It cant be doping, because we know now that Carl Lewis was doping too.

...but Calvin Smith (3rd) probably wasn't ... Linford Christie (4th) probably was. I sat next to Linford on the plane on the back from Seoul he told me his false positive was from drinking too much ginseng tea! Well there you go.

 

[The Hitch]

...but Calvin Smith (3rd) probably wasn't ... Linford Christie (4th) probably was..

But the quote was about Carl Lewis.

I sat next to Linford on the plane on the back from Seoul he told me his false positive was from drinking too much ginseng tea! Well there you go

You sat next to Christie on the way back from the olympics and talked to him abou it?
Do tell

 

[Anonymous]

David Etxebarria has a pop at contador.

http://www.eitb.com/sports/en/detai...david-etxebarria-criticizes-contador-twitter/

 

[sniper]

Astana guy Martinelli advices AC to take 1 year ban:

http://es.eurosport.yahoo.com/02022011/47/tour-francia-aconsejan-contador-cumpla-castigo.html

 

[thorny59]

AC Cleared by Federation's Doping-Clearing Board

now this is funny but very true

http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/contador-cleared-of-doping-by-international-cyclin,19237/

 

[BotanyBay]

now this is funny but very true

http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/contador-cleared-of-doping-by-international-cyclin,19237/

OMG is that funny (and sad... but true)!

 

[Andynonomous]

Pro cycling's reputation.

Unfortunately it shows what sort of reputation pro cycling now has for non-cyclists.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Unfortunately it shows what sort of reputation pro cycling now has for non-cyclists.

It is so much worse than Baseball wherre they take their 2 week suspension and come back totally rehabilitated.

 

[Andynonomous]

It is so much worse than Baseball wherre they take their 2 week suspension and come back totally rehabilitated.

So, you compare cycling to a VERY dirty sport like pro baseball to argue cycling isn't so bad ?

Weird logic. (It's like Stalin complaining that Hitler was worse).

 

[Altitude]

So, you compare cycling to a VERY dirty sport like pro baseball to argue cycling isn't so bad ?

Weird logic. (It's like Stalin complaining that Hitler was worse).

Which professional sport isn't VERY dirty?

Stalin was much worse than Hitler by the way.

 

[Andynonomous]

Which professional sport isn't VERY dirty?

Stalin was much worse than Hitler by the way.

What do people do when they are in denial ?


They change the subject.

 

[The Hitch]

Andy i usualy like your posts, and seeing as you are often here to talk about doping in tennis am surprised to see you argue against Alttitude when he says that all sports are dirty.

He is right on both points. All sports are dirty and Stalin was worse than Hitler.

On the first i dont see how altitude is changing the subject. He made his point.
And you talked about reputation. No sport has as bad a reputation as cycling even though they all are just as bad.

As for the second its a close thing but ultimately uncle jo wins.

 

[Trailzz]

pretty funny

http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/contador-cleared-of-doping-by-international-cyclin,19237/

 

[Andynonomous]

I'll call it a tie.

Andy i usualy like your posts, and seeing as you are often here to talk about doping in tennis am surprised to see you argue against Alttitude when he says that all sports are dirty.

He is right on both points. All sports are dirty and Stalin was worse than Hitler.

On the first i dont see how altitude is changing the subject. He made his point.
And you talked about reputation. No sport has as bad a reputation as cycling even though they all are just as bad.

As for the second its a close thing but ultimately uncle jo wins.

This is a cycling board, so the constant "ya, well other sports are dirty too" gets VERY tiring after a while. I get this on the tennis boards all the time ("ya well if you think tennis is dirty, you should see what is going on in cycling"). Even the biggest doper in tennis (Nadal) has called doping a "cycling problem". You are NEVER going to deal with the problem of doping in cycling, by passing the buck to other sports.

The Onion s.p.o.o.f. basically says that even when a doper gets caught, fair and square, the cycling authorities will "find a way" to "clear" him (if he has political clout).

Just think what non-cyclists are going to think this summer, if dopador is challenging for the TDF. "Ya so what, one doped up cyclist is challenging other doped up cyclists for a meaningless prize" (most doped up cyclist).

I don't think pro cycling fans realize how much damage has been done to the reputation of the sport, from the Contador affair (guy got caught fair and square, and was "cleared" via an extremely corrupt process for all of the world to see).





As far as Hitler and Stalin, it doesn't matter which is worse. The point was that one shouldn't use the other as a reference, since they both are bad.

 

[The Hitch]

I don't think pro cycling fans realize how much damage has been done to the reputation of the sport, from the Contador affair (guy got caught fair and square, and was "cleared" via an extremely corrupt process for all of the world to see).

Well i dont see how this is too different from the revelation that Aggasi had his meth problem covered up, and tennis didnt get a scratch on it from that.

 

[Digger]

Well i dont see how this is too different from the revelation that Aggasi had his meth problem covered up, and tennis didnt get a scratch on it from that.

Meth is and wasn't performance enhancing.

 

[Andynonomous]

Well i dont see how this is too different from the revelation that Aggasi had his meth problem covered up, and tennis didnt get a scratch on it from that.

Actually I think the Agassi case openned a lot of eyes. Although Agassi's drug is considered "recreational", and not "performance enhancing", the two cases are similar (the authorities tried to "cover them up" because the athletes were "popular").

Every time a top tennis player gets "injured", many people now suspect a "silent ban" (which is what McQuaid tried to arrange for Contador). NOBODY believes Nadal's or Serena's injury claims anymore (not even their biggest fans).

The same thing will now happen in cycling (every time a top cyclist fails to show up at a major event, the whispers will start). This is not healthy for the sport.

 

[JPM London]

I don't think pro cycling fans realize how much damage has been done to the reputation of the sport, from the Contador affair (guy got caught fair and square, and was "cleared" via an extremely corrupt process for all of the world to see).

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=da&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsporten.tv2.dk%2Fcykling%2Farticle.php%2Fid-37484374%3Aekspert-bl%25C3%25A5stempler-contadorsag.html

Google translate has mangled this article completely, but the point made by the guy interviewed is, that after reading RFEC's 35 page decision it's clear their decision is based on thorough investigation and is a proper piece of legal work.

Who he is? A professor at law and chair of the Danish Anti Doping organisation, so he knows the subject matter.

Just because you - and arguably a bunch of other clinicians - have one view doesn't mean other might not see it differently.

Is it better we do a witch hunt based on poor evidence (as might be the case on Valjavec) simply so that we can show that "cycling is fighting the problem" and rather risk the reputation of a rider that might be innocent than risking the reputation of the sport's fundamental setup?

Before anybody lynches me, let me make it clear I'm not saying AC is innocent, I'm just pointing out that it's difficult to pass judgment on a decision for which you haven't even read the reasoning.

It's simply way to easy to play Pat and go "the Spanish are stupid"...

 

[The Hitch]

Meth is and wasn't performance enhancing.

So. In both cases it was covered up.

But if you want a better example, Greg Rusedski tested positive for nandrolone and was cleared of doping. Sounds very very similar to me.

 

[Andynonomous]

Puhlease .

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=da&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsporten.tv2.dk%2Fcykling%2Farticle.php%2Fid-37484374%3Aekspert-bl%25C3%25A5stempler-contadorsag.html

Google translate has mangled this article completely, but the point made by the guy interviewed is, that after reading RFEC's 35 page decision it's clear their decision is based on thorough investigation and is a proper piece of legal work.

Who he is? A professor at law and chair of the Danish Anti Doping organisation, so he knows the subject matter.

Just because you - and arguably a bunch of other clinicians - have one view doesn't mean other might not see it differently.

Is it better we do a witch hunt based on poor evidence (as might be the case on Valjavec) simply so that we can show that "cycling is fighting the problem" and rather risk the reputation of a rider that might be innocent than risking the reputation of the sport's fundamental setup?

Before anybody lynches me, let me make it clear I'm not saying AC is innocent, I'm just pointing out that it's difficult to pass judgment on a decision for which you haven't even read the reasoning.

It's simply way to easy to play Pat and go "the Spanish are stupid"...

Don't insult my intelligence by saying "some lawyers wrote a long report, and they know law, and you don't, so this is the correct decision.".

The decision states that blood doping is unlikely, and meat ingestion is likely. THE EXACT OPPOSITE IS THE TRUTH.


You can write ANYTHING in a verbose report to come to whatever conclusion you want. This is the problem ! It is CLEAR as glass the RFEC WANTED to clear Contador, and they spent a LOT of time figuring out a way to do it. Any "legal report" justifying their pre-arranged decision is MEANINGLESS.