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Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement)

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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

fmk_RoI said:
86TDFWinner said:
How about what purists would call 'real' cycling memorabilia, sold at 'real auctions', what was the highest price ever paid at auction for historic bikes, jerseys, etc. ???
Probably not very much for the clothing, if a Merckx yellow jersey sold for £4,200
http://www.thebikecomesfirst.com/eddy-merckx-jersey-sells-for-4200-at-auction/
Historic bikes might be worth a lot



Wonder how much LeMond stuff would fetch if he ever decided to sell any of his historic stuff? Those yellow jerseys and prototype Look bikes, I'm sure would fetch a nice sum of cash.
Four grand's not a bad price when you consider a) he spent something like ten days in yellow in 1975 (that's a lot of jerseys) and b) he had what was it, ninety-something days in yellow throughout his career (that's an awful lot of jerseys)?

LA's Damien Hirst 'butterfly bike' sold at auction for a cool half a mil... Another of his bikes in the same auction approached a quarter of a million. Several other bikes he owned sold for north of a hundred thousand dollars.
I can't imagine what LeMonds bike from his first TDF win in 86 would be worth. Keep in mind, he's the first American to ever win the Tour, that's surely more important than anything Wonderboy has done.
 
Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

86TDFWinner said:
fmk_RoI said:
86TDFWinner said:
How about what purists would call 'real' cycling memorabilia, sold at 'real auctions', what was the highest price ever paid at auction for historic bikes, jerseys, etc. ???
Probably not very much for the clothing, if a Merckx yellow jersey sold for £4,200
http://www.thebikecomesfirst.com/eddy-merckx-jersey-sells-for-4200-at-auction/
Historic bikes might be worth a lot



Wonder how much LeMond stuff would fetch if he ever decided to sell any of his historic stuff? Those yellow jerseys and prototype Look bikes, I'm sure would fetch a nice sum of cash.
Four grand's not a bad price when you consider a) he spent something like ten days in yellow in 1975 (that's a lot of jerseys) and b) he had what was it, ninety-something days in yellow throughout his career (that's an awful lot of jerseys)?

LA's Damien Hirst 'butterfly bike' sold at auction for a cool half a mil... Another of his bikes in the same auction approached a quarter of a million. Several other bikes he owned sold for north of a hundred thousand dollars.
I can't imagine what LeMonds bike from his first TDF win in 86 would be worth. Keep in mind, he's the first American to ever win the Tour, that's surely more important than anything Wonderboy has done.
seven
 
Aug 2, 2012
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..now you're making stuff up alpe................

before anyone shoots me down I did check the records.............

Mark L
 
I'd imagine Obree's Old Faithful would fetch quite a decent amount of money. Arguably the most unique famous bike in all of cycling, and has a lot of historical significance.

That orange thing Merckx rode the hour record on is probably worth quite a lot.
 
Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

Alpe73 said:
86TDFWinner said:
fmk_RoI said:
86TDFWinner said:
How about what purists would call 'real' cycling memorabilia, sold at 'real auctions', what was the highest price ever paid at auction for historic bikes, jerseys, etc. ???
Probably not very much for the clothing, if a Merckx yellow jersey sold for £4,200
http://www.thebikecomesfirst.com/eddy-merckx-jersey-sells-for-4200-at-auction/
Historic bikes might be worth a lot



Wonder how much LeMond stuff would fetch if he ever decided to sell any of his historic stuff? Those yellow jerseys and prototype Look bikes, I'm sure would fetch a nice sum of cash.
Four grand's not a bad price when you consider a) he spent something like ten days in yellow in 1975 (that's a lot of jerseys) and b) he had what was it, ninety-something days in yellow throughout his career (that's an awful lot of jerseys)?

LA's Damien Hirst 'butterfly bike' sold at auction for a cool half a mil... Another of his bikes in the same auction approached a quarter of a million. Several other bikes he owned sold for north of a hundred thousand dollars.
I can't imagine what LeMonds bike from his first TDF win in 86 would be worth. Keep in mind, he's the first American to ever win the Tour, that's surely more important than anything Wonderboy has done.
seven
Not any more.... :lol:
 
Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

86TDFWinner said:
I can't imagine what LeMonds bike from his first TDF win in 86 would be worth. Keep in mind, he's the first American to ever win the Tour, that's surely more important than anything Wonderboy has done.
I'm not sure you're quite grasping why LA's bikes sold for what they did. His name was the least of it. Hirst and Nara's names mattered far more.

How many bikes did LeMond have in his 86 victory and how do you prove that any bike is actually his bike from that race?

In general, I would have thought that supply of this stuff exceeds demand - yellow jerseys, team jumpers, bike frames, they're not unique.
Saint Unix said:
I'd imagine Obree's Old Faithful would fetch quite a decent amount of money. Arguably the most unique famous bike in all of cycling, and has a lot of historical significance.

That orange thing Merckx rode the hour record on is probably worth quite a lot.
Get a unique bike from a unique occasion and have no questions over provenance and you can ask more. But even throttling supply like that I still I think you are facing relatively low demand for this stuff.
 
Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

fmk_RoI said:
86TDFWinner said:
I can't imagine what LeMonds bike from his first TDF win in 86 would be worth. Keep in mind, he's the first American to ever win the Tour, that's surely more important than anything Wonderboy has done.
I'm not sure you're quite grasping why LA's bikes sold for what they did. His name was the least of it. Hirst and Nara's names mattered far more.

How many bikes did LeMond have in his 86 victory and how do you prove that any bike is actually his bike from that race?

In general, I would have thought that supply of this stuff exceeds demand - yellow jerseys, team jumpers, bike frames, they're not unique.
Saint Unix said:
I'd imagine Obree's Old Faithful would fetch quite a decent amount of money. Arguably the most unique famous bike in all of cycling, and has a lot of historical significance.

That orange thing Merckx rode the hour record on is probably worth quite a lot.
Get a unique bike from a unique occasion and have no questions over provenance and you can ask more. But even throttling supply like that I still I think you are facing relatively low demand for this stuff.
I totally get what you're saying, and I'm just saying that LeMond could probably fetch a nice sum of money, were he to ever decide to part with that stuff. I'm sure the provenance would check out, as I can't imagine there's that many prototype LOOK bikes from that era, floating around.
 
Re:

ebandit said:
..now you're making stuff up alpe................

before anyone shoots me down I did check the records.............

Mark L
You must have a desk job, right?

That which is written is not that which was raced.

Conjure on. ;)
 
I think a lifetime ban is fair. Would probably like to see more of them, tbh.

Though, he clearly didn't spill any meaningful beans. I can[t imagine that sentence wouldn't have been mitigated in exchange for some actionable information. The only conclusion you can draw is that in exchange for taking the ban he'll continue to have some kind of employment in the cycling world, whatever it might be. Maybe organizing charity rides...
 
Aug 18, 2017
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 4 (Post-Settlement

CAS: 'Bruyneel was the top of the pyramid.'
Dr. Luis Garcia Del Moral, team doctor of US Postal, provided the court with an email exchange in which Bruyneel asked Del Moral to provide Lance Armstrong with EPO, including a real schedule when the rider had to be doping. The conclusion of CAS was that Bruyneel was the instigator of the doping affair and demanded that his suspension be extended to a lifetime ban.
https://www.indeleiderstrui.nl/nieuws/algemeen-nieuws/196770/us-postal-ploegarts-komt-met-belastend-bewijs-bruyneel-was-de-top-van-de-piramide
 
Jul 29, 2016
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Yes, Del Moral throwing JB under the bus. Simple defence - Befehl ist Befehl! (is he German or what?). But it worked, ban reduced to five years.

Interesting to know whether USADA has jurisdiction over JB, who knows ... .
 
In the latest move podcast, Bruyneel admitted he was essentially already on a lifetime ban from the sport and even with the 10 years ban he would not be involved in cycling again. He has a point. The ban doesn't really affect him, his involvement in cycling ended years ago anyway, the rest is just d!ck waving and back scratching.
 
Re:

samhocking said:
In the latest move podcast, Bruyneel admitted he was essentially already on a lifetime ban from the sport and even with the 10 years ban he would not be involved in cycling again. He has a point. The ban doesn't really affect him, his involvement in cycling ended years ago anyway, the rest is just d!ck waving and back scratching.
What you say is true, but SURELY we expect WADA/CAS to follow some sort of legal principles - You have Dr Moral with a sentence, then when he decides to talk, it is then reduced and others have their penalty increased.
 
Reduced sanctions is not unique to this case, it's offered to all isn't it? I'm sure it even exists within WADA's rules that you can have a sentence reduced if information you supply leads to proving others doping violations. In fact wasn't Armstrong and Bruyneel offered this, although more in terms of just coming clean? Obviously Amrstrong is going to protect every $ he can, if he admitted to it all he ends up on the street, so his lawyers would have told him exactly what he needs to do to retain his earnings after the trial. Similar for Bruyneels also,
 
Wasn't it his legal fees, the desire to dispute every allegation in court, that took a decent bite out of his fortune? Of course that along with all of the endorsement dollars that he ultimately lost. The actual penalties as a result of lost cases in court were likely the smallest of the three.
 
Re:

samhocking said:
Reduced sanctions is not unique to this case, it's offered to all isn't it? I'm sure it even exists within WADA's rules that you can have a sentence reduced if information you supply leads to proving others doping violations. In fact wasn't Armstrong and Bruyneel offered this, although more in terms of just coming clean? Obviously Amrstrong is going to protect every $ he can, if he admitted to it all he ends up on the street, so his lawyers would have told him exactly what he needs to do to retain his earnings after the trial. Similar for Bruyneels also,
You miss the point - Dr Moral offered no assistance at the original hearing - He only offered assistance when WADA appealed to CAS - Dr Moral provides assistance at the first hearing and then you can wear a discount.
 
Re: Re:

yaco said:
samhocking said:
Reduced sanctions is not unique to this case, it's offered to all isn't it? I'm sure it even exists within WADA's rules that you can have a sentence reduced if information you supply leads to proving others doping violations. In fact wasn't Armstrong and Bruyneel offered this, although more in terms of just coming clean? Obviously Amrstrong is going to protect every $ he can, if he admitted to it all he ends up on the street, so his lawyers would have told him exactly what he needs to do to retain his earnings after the trial. Similar for Bruyneels also,
You miss the point - Dr Moral offered no assistance at the original hearing - He only offered assistance when WADA appealed to CAS - Dr Moral provides assistance at the first hearing and then you can wear a discount.
:eek:
 
Re: Re:

glassmoon said:
yaco said:
samhocking said:
Reduced sanctions is not unique to this case, it's offered to all isn't it? I'm sure it even exists within WADA's rules that you can have a sentence reduced if information you supply leads to proving others doping violations. In fact wasn't Armstrong and Bruyneel offered this, although more in terms of just coming clean? Obviously Amrstrong is going to protect every $ he can, if he admitted to it all he ends up on the street, so his lawyers would have told him exactly what he needs to do to retain his earnings after the trial. Similar for Bruyneels also,
You miss the point - Dr Moral offered no assistance at the original hearing - He only offered assistance when WADA appealed to CAS - Dr Moral provides assistance at the first hearing and then you can wear a discount.
:eek:
That's generally how it works yaco. Bruyneel decided not to rebut the testimony of Dr. del Moral.
 

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