Official Lance Armstrong Thread **READ POST #1 BEFORE POSTING**

[Velodude]

Why should I be like you and leave them alone?
I do not hope for sad faces.
I do not expect sad faces.
And I do see sad faces.
Just hopeful discussions. Honest discussions.
Cyclist discussions. Don't care about SSDD.
Don't care. Sorry.

Which came first, Polish.

Your abhorrence of cancer.

Or your adulation of Armstrong.

And if the latter, was a day in July 1999 the defining date?

 

[thehog]

Well, I DO talk about Armstrong SSDD with cancer patients in "real life".
Most are cyclists. And I discuss Armstrong with many other cyclists too in "real life".

Good discussions. Honest discussions.

My experience is that the cancer patients care the LEAST about the SSDD.
They have more important things to care about. Just about everything is more important than SSDD to them.

But Lance said that they tried to call him a doper and now he's coming back for "them"? I'm confused.

Then he said at the SCA trial that he wouldn't dope and wreck his body. And said he wouldn't risk it all to upset the millions of cancer patients who look up to him.

They care alright. They may not care that he doped but they will care that he lied.

 

[Polish]

They care alright. They may not care that he doped but they will care that he lied.

So you say the "poor chaps" will care, and I say they won't.
Thats ok. We disagree.

Either way, however, it will be best if Lance is not caught up in a lie.
And FDA/IRS/FBI not finding anything amiss goes a long way towards helping.
Rebuild any damaged credibility from the smear hunt.

 

[thehog]

So you say the "poor chaps" will care, and I say they won't.
Thats ok. We disagree.

Either way, however, it will be best if Lance is not caught up in a lie.
And FDA/IRS/FBI not finding anything amiss goes a long way towards helping.
Rebuild any damaged credibility from the smear hunt.

Perhaps Lance, being the inspiration that he is, could stand up and clarify some of the issues? Just to put our minds at rest. He’s never been shy in coming forward and stating his position. Methinks he’s scared of the reaction, scared of letting a lot of people down. He lied. He lied big. He also used “poor chaps” to deflect criticism. Not good using cancer patients as human shields to deflect the truth.

Bono cared.

 

[ChrisE]

Good grief. Think of your blood pressure.

Yes, the blog was interesting, and the man has done brilliantly to lose so much weight.

Which only makes LA's behaviour even more despicable. Poor people like this have been totally taken in.

LOL. We should lock up all religious leaders as well for "taken in" believers.

 

[Neworld]

...Right you are it will be a sad day when this poor chap finds out that his “hero” was just a regular drug using, drug trafficking, philandering, pilfer of tax except foundation donations sort of guy.

That’s how much Lance loved his fans – he used them...

Interesting you use the word 'hero' as it made me think of the captain of the Italian cruise liner that run-aground the other day. He was certainly no hero, and neither was Lance, nor is he now.

Everyday people tackle cancer, most cancer patients have poorer odds than Lance did and they still acting in heroic means. They lead by example, give of themselves to others benefit, are honest and honourable, enroll in experimental treatments that may fail or succeed but help future research etc...

Hero:
1a : a mythological or legendary figure often of divine descent endowed with great strength or ability.
Not Lance, not a positive legend that's for sure.

b : an illustrious warrior.
Nope.

c : a man admired for his achievements and noble qualities.
Nothing noble, he undermines that when he takes money from dying people.

d : one who shows great courage.
He is not courageous, his wife will find that out shortly.

Lance is NOT the kind of person that we want future cycling fans, riders or society in general to ever look up to. Unless they want to see what not to do or become.

NW

 

[Neworld]

Well, I DO talk about Armstrong SSDD with cancer patients in "real life".
Most are cyclists. And I discuss Armstrong with many other cyclists too in "real life".

Good discussions. Honest discussions.

My experience is that the cancer patients care the LEAST about the SSDD.
They have more important things to care about. Just about everything is more important than SSDD to them.

So using your vast experience in medical epidemiology Polish, how many 'cancer patients' do you talk to in a day, a week ...? are they the same 3 Trek riding dudes that you cleaned bottom-brackets for last year? Do you volunteer at your local Oncology ward or perhaps at the Hospice in your city? Stick to bikes and slapstick gibberish.

I work in a hospital. Our Oncologists 25 of them, have removed all 'yellow' facades, and anything to do with Live$trong in the department and more and more patients remove their bands every day. They care not about cycling. They care about honesty and helping themselves and others live. As expected make a tangential joke about that, or detail your robust experience with oncology patients.

NW

 

[Berzin]

Great post, Neworld.

Bringing cancer patients into the discussion in such a facetious and disingenuous manner is absolutely despicable on Polishs' part.

But since the mods do almost nothing to curb his drivel, the more he feels empowered to take his schtick ever lower down the rungs of incivility and bad taste.

 

[thehog]

Interesting you use the word 'hero' as it made me think of the captain of the Italian cruise liner that run-aground the other day. He was certainly no hero, and neither was Lance, nor is he now.

Everyday people tackle cancer, most cancer patients have poorer odds than Lance did and they still acting in heroic means. They lead by example, give of themselves to others benefit, are honest and honourable, enroll in experimental treatments that may fail or succeed but help future research etc...

Hero:
1a : a mythological or legendary figure often of divine descent endowed with great strength or ability.
Not Lance, not a positive legend that's for sure.

b : an illustrious warrior.
Nope.

c : a man admired for his achievements and noble qualities.
Nothing noble, he undermines that when he takes money from dying people.

d : one who shows great courage.
He is not courageous, his wife will find that out shortly.

Lance is NOT the kind of person that we want future cycling fans, riders or society in general to ever look up to. Unless they want to see what not to do or become.

NW

I've posted before but imagine after returning to the peloton in 1997 that Lance took the full anti-doping "I'm doing for them" mantra. But really meaning it and really doing it. He wouldn't have won 7 Tour titles. He may have only won an Amstel and a stage here and there but imagine the impact he could have had. That would be hero status. "Doing what everyone else was doing" was not hero stuff. Thats just following the pack. But if he stood against doping like a Bassons but used the cancer and the foundation to push that cause he could have gone a long way to truly ridding the sport of drugs. People would have listened.

But instead he took the easy option and then used the cancer to sidestep his way around having to deal with his obviously charged victories.

Its such a sad story as I think most of us knew that one day it was all going to unravel.

 

[doolols]

I wish there was a 'LIKE' button or something. The latest posts from Neworld and Thehog are spot on, IMHO.

 

[Stingray34]

I wish there was a 'LIKE' button or something. The latest posts from Neworld and Thehog are spot on, IMHO.

Agree 100%, plus Berzin's too.

 

[Benotti69]

So using your vast experience in medical epidemiology Polish, how many 'cancer patients' do you talk to in a day, a week ...? are they the same 3 Trek riding dudes that you cleaned bottom-brackets for last year? Do you volunteer at your local Oncology ward or perhaps at the Hospice in your city? Stick to bikes and slapstick gibberish.

I work in a hospital. Our Oncologists 25 of them, have removed all 'yellow' facades, and anything to do with Live$trong in the department and more and more patients remove their bands every day. They care not about cycling. They care about honesty and helping themselves and others live. As expected make a tangential joke about that, or detail your robust experience with oncology patients.

NW

+1

Polly is best ignored. But none the less you put 'it' back in its box in very fine manner.

I am also heartened to hear that people are seeing through the yella fog of obfuscation that live$trong is about, 'procuring donations in the name of allegedly doing good work on behalf of those the suffering from cancer'.

 

[frenchfry]

LOL. We should lock up all religious leaders as well for "taken in" believers.

I think there is another place on the forums for political discussion.

 

[Boeing]

LOL. We should lock up all religious leaders as well for "taken in" believers.

no no just tax them. it would solve a world if issues

 

[Polish]

Polish, how many 'cancer patients' do you talk to in a day, a week ...? are they the same 3 Trek riding dudes

Great, mocking "cancer patients" and survivors - real classy.
But not suprising.

I work in a hospital. Our Oncologists 25 of them, have removed all 'yellow' facades, and anything to do with Live$trong in the department and more and more patients remove their bands every day. They care not about cycling.
NW

Oh please, what a drama queen. "More and more patients remove their bands every day" lol. If that is even true, it is probably because they see you coming into the room. "Oh crap, here comes "Mr Sunshine", better take off my Livestrong band before he sees me".

If I WERE to volunteer at a cancer ward, your place sounds like a great place to start. Bummer Central. And all you guys who constantly bring up the "poor unfortunate chaps that will have their hopes crushed when Lance goes down" don't need to worry so much.

Their hopes would not be crushed.
They do not care
And Lance will not go down.
The Myth of Multiple Indictments is just that. A Myth.
The Myth of Prison and the Myth of Prison Boyfriends also.
Sorry to burst your bubbles, but it is time to deal with it.

 

[Cobblestoned]

Agree 100%, plus Berzin's too.

Yeah, 1000%.
Glad you also named Berzin, otherwise I would have done it.
Now I'll just choose Benotti.

All great posters. Sources of thruth, objectivity and superior intelligence.

Anyway, it's always entertaining to watch you guys-
But that's not really terrible, because I am a cyclist preparing his season.
Need to lose weight.

 

[Polish]

Its such a sad story as I think most of us knew that one day it was all going to unravel.

What day is that?
A day next week maybe?

 

[Cobblestoned]

So using your vast experience in medical epidemiology Polish, how many 'cancer patients' do you talk to in a day, a week ...? are they the same 3 Trek riding dudes that you cleaned bottom-brackets for last year? Do you volunteer at your local Oncology ward or perhaps at the Hospice in your city? Stick to bikes and slapstick gibberish.

I work in a hospital. Our Oncologists 25 of them, have removed all 'yellow' facades, and anything to do with Live$trong in the department and more and more patients remove their bands every day. They care not about cycling. They care about honesty and helping themselves and others live. As expected make a tangential joke about that, or detail your robust experience with oncology patients.

NW

You forgot to add that they also burn them and then pee on it.

Would be very interesting to see a photo. Before and after. Should be no problem for you...?

 

[thehog]

What day is that?
A day next week maybe?

…is that all you got?

It is a sad day indeed. You’ve lost your power of retort and would suggest the unrevealing had begun a some time ago.

 

[Neworld]

Great, mocking "cancer patients" and survivors - real classy.

Expectant response Polish, you are self-neutralizing in this forum: sum zero or less.

I am not mocking cancer patient(s)at all, just challenging your statements. I am asking you to define, in your own terms, who are all these patients you have exposure to. How many in your bike shop or when you're riding on those back roads do you talk to? I asked you to state the epidemiological terms of your oncology exposure. You did NOT. Instead, as expected, you attacked me with bizarre examples and deflection. Internet vandalism.

Oh please, what a drama queen. "More and more patients remove their bands every day" lol. If that is even true, it is probably because they see you coming into the room. "Oh crap, here comes "Mr Sunshine", better take off my Livestrong band before he sees me".

Are you ok? Really? Suffice it to say that I sleep with a clear conscious, every day my friend, every day.

...will have their hopes crushed when Lance goes down" don't need to worry so much. but it is time to deal with it.

I am not concerned with Lance or him going down personally, just that his 'story' and sordid past are dealt with appropriately. He needs public humiliation and global exposure to assist in doping 'awareness' (not cancer awareness) and how no matter how big of a bully and/or doper you are, you will be caught and some sort of justice will prevail.

Signed,

Mr. Sunshine (NW)...I like that by the way Polish, thank you.

 

[Polish]

…is that all you got?

It is a sad day indeed. You’ve lost your power of retort and would suggest the unrevealing had begun a some time ago.

Just taking it easy on you Hog, these being such sad days and all.
I apologize. No more "Tuesday" barbs from me. Promise.

Drumroll.

 

[Velodude]

...<snip>...Their hopes would not be crushed.
They do not care
And Lance will not go down.
The Myth of Multiple Indictments is just that. A Myth.
The Myth of Prison and the Myth of Prison Boyfriends also.Sorry to burst your bubbles, but it is time to deal with it.

Polish, a myth is defined as:

1. A traditional, typically ancient story dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serves as a fundamental type in the worldview of a people, as by explaining aspects of the natural world or delineating the psychology, customs, or ideals of society

2. A popular belief or story that has become associated with a person, institution, or occurrence, especially one considered to illustrate a cultural ideal

3. A fiction or half-truth, especially one that forms part of an ideology

Armstrong has created his own supernatural hero from fictions and, rarely, half-truths to justify his dope fueled performances.

But multiple indictments, prison and prison boyfriends are not myths - they are real.

 

[Polish]

Polish, a myth is defined as:

1. A traditional, typically ancient story dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serves as a fundamental type in the worldview of a people, as by explaining aspects of the natural world or delineating the psychology, customs, or ideals of society

2. A popular belief or story that has become associated with a person, institution, or occurrence, especially one considered to illustrate a cultural ideal

3. A fiction or half-truth, especially one that forms part of an ideology

Armstrong has created his own supernatural hero from fictions and, rarely, half-truths to justify his dope fueled performances.

But multiple indictments, prison and prison boyfriends are not myths - they are real.

Velodude, the Multiple Indictment Myth and Prison Myth and Prison Boyfriend Myth all fall under definition #2 - "A popular belief or story that has become associated with a person"

And those Myths are real?

As real as the monkeys flying out of my sphlincter lol.
Oh wait...what?.....geez....oh nevermind. Just gas. A fart.
But it did sound like a drumroll. Ominous?

 

[fatandfast]

Polish you shouldn't feed into all the prison stuff. He has not even been charged with a crime. He has no history of drug use at work and his job tested him for 20 years. He was tested before,during and after work and by different authorities before getting paid. He was not paid by an outside sponsor, and he left with the check in question. He got into a petty feud with the only other famous racer from the home country, the involved parties discussed and concluded that he would be the single direction for a marketing dept of the major bike company in the US.

Armstrong is after all partially human so if he made mistakes he may face penalties both personally and legally. I think any way you calculate it, 20+2 year investigation he has had 22 years of history as a well above average citizen.
No judge is going to pitch the pitchman for a feel good organization for being guilty of following rules of a sport and culture that Americans and the US legal system know anything about

 

[MarkvW]

Polish, a myth is defined as:

1. A traditional, typically ancient story dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serves as a fundamental type in the worldview of a people, as by explaining aspects of the natural world or delineating the psychology, customs, or ideals of society

2. A popular belief or story that has become associated with a person, institution, or occurrence, especially one considered to illustrate a cultural ideal

3. A fiction or half-truth, especially one that forms part of an ideology

Armstrong has created his own supernatural hero from fictions and, rarely, half-truths to justify his dope fueled performances.

But multiple indictments, prison and prison boyfriends are not myths - they are real.

It is a mistake to think that Armstrong has created his own supernatural hero. That hero was created more by the people who are trying to sell things using the Armstrong myth that they created. Things like magazines, books, bikes, nutrition.

Should Armstrong's myth become sufficiently deflated, those mythmakers will create another myth out of another "superhero". It's called advertising, and it's real too.