Oscar Pistorius

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Tom375 said:
On holiday lucky you.. hope its somewhere sunny and warm..
very sunny and very warm, thank you :)

even when it rains here, we get rainbows rather than the endless grey of Belgium. we've been smiling looking at the weather forecasts in europe :p

I don't really know much about all this to be honest, were you using a homeopathic preparation of Arnica? or is there a herbal remedy?
The reason i ask is that most homeopathic remedies are diluted in water/alcohol so much that nothing of the original ingredient remains in the so called remedy. However obviously plants are known to have a medicinal effect if it was a cream with enough active arnica in and that active ingredient has been shown to have a medicinal benefit, makes perfect sense.
Either way if it helped you or your believe it helped you who am i to laugh.
It won't change my mind that homeopathy is general quackery though.
Seem to have gone off topic though. sorry folks i'll button it for a bit..
.. it came up because Pistorius was found to have homeopathic steriods in case you must know..


There is this on wikipedia on homeopathy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy
yes, i know what most people think of it, but it's very common in france and i was living there and going through my rehab there. i took the "sugar pills" as did many people going through painful rehab and surgeries. arnica has many of the same properties of aspirin without the digestive side effects, etc. i wasn't the only one that was helped immensely by it.

i think different countries, different groups of people, and perhaps different age groups will look at homeopathy in various lights. i've found that most of the people who make fun of it, have never used it... others are more open-minded and have gotten great relief.

as for the compound found at OP's place, i can't comment. i find it interesting, though, the idea that athletes would combine steroids and such with homeopathic remedies... but i guess this may be a bit like beetroot juice?

right, off to read the page i linked last night... the time difference makes it a bear to keep up!
 
ShrubberyBlue said:
Maybe that is what is needed in cycling right now, homeopathic steroids. Every cyclist will think they are doped up but will actually be as clean as a whistle.

It isn't that ridiculous, years ago there were many alleged health supplement manufacturers who marketed plant sterols as a legal form of steroids.

Of course you would test clean...but then again they weren't really anabolic steroids and did sweet FA.

Much like the powdered deer antler crap.

:D
 
Jul 17, 2012
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The reporting I have heard is that Botha got picked apart and was forced to admit that nothing he found at the scene was inconsistent with the defence's case, looks like the defence do have a strong, reckon he'll make bail and on the basis of today the prosecution will have their work cut out at the proper trial.

And there's me thinking he was bang to rights this morning
 
ShrubberyBlue said:
Maybe that is what is needed in cycling right now, homeopathic steroids. Every cyclist will think they are doped up but will actually be as clean as a whistle.

Just because something may not actually be ergogenic, does not mean it is not doping. That's pretty clear in the WADA code which explains the criteria for inclusion on the list.
 
thirteen said:
as for the compound found at OP's place, i can't comment. i find it interesting, though, the idea that athletes would combine steroids and such with homeopathic remedies... but i guess this may be a bit like beetroot juice?

Homeopathy has no physiological basis for being effectual. Beetroot juice does.
 
Oct 21, 2012
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JimmyFingers said:
The reporting I have heard is that Botha got picked apart and was forced to admit that nothing he found at the scene was inconsistent with the defence's case, looks like the defence do have a strong, reckon he'll make bail and on the basis of today the prosecution will have their work cut out at the proper trial.

And there's me thinking he was bang to rights this morning

it certainly seems Roux did an outstanding job for the defence today. Botha was apparently made to look amateur.
I'd still argue that some of the information that came out today was important for the prosecution i.e witnesses that heard shouting etc between 2 & 3, gun shots fired in between delay of 10 mins, and for me the plan of the apartment itself was the biggest thing.
The balcony isn't that big, and is concentrated in front of the patio doors next to the bed.
If he went to get a fan from outside as he says this shouldn't have taken more than a few moments, would he not of noticed her get out of bed? At this stage the doors were open you'd expect some light to be coming in from outside giving some visibility in the room and onto the bed..
He says he heard a noise in the bathroom, if so why did he close the doors,shutters and curtains making it pitch black in the room?
He had to move past the bed to get to the bathroom the toilet was a tiny cubicle in the bathroom and he didn't check that she was there before getting his gun and going shooting in the bathroom?
Anyway these are the questions that occupy my mind at the moment on it, suppose i'll have to wait until the trial like everyone else to find out the answers.
How reliable the witnesses will also be crucial because if any of their stories show creedance then his story is blown out of the window.
Probably a bit unfair but knocking down witnesses credibility does bring to mind another sporting icon...:eek:
 
Aug 18, 2012
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Roux's credibility is also hinging heavily on whether or not the testoconpasupium was mixed with steroids and how OP's steroid tests come back.

Part of me thinks they went all out at the bail hearing to get him out of there and then their going to do a runner.

Honestly, how is checking your bank account one of the first things to do after killing your girlfriend.
 
Nov 27, 2012
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This is a drawing of the bedroom/bathroom layout.

http://huisgenoot.com/fokus/oscar-saak-vloerplan-van-badkamer-en-slaapkamer/

Google translate:
Found at the scene
- cricket bat by sink
- firearm, 2 phones on the mat by shower door
- gun belt, slippers and overnight bag on the left side of the bed

So the gun was under the bed or in nightstand next to the bed? And OP did not notice Reeva was not in the bed when he grabbed the gun? Very strange.
 
Jan 20, 2013
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Tom375 said:

Something I just don't like about this trial by media - the defence is giving me the creeps. As for Pistorius's family, shoving their mugs infront of the media with their Zero chance of OP having murdered his girl friend. And the World will see what a wonderful human being OP is....yeh ok. Any one who talks with such confidence and conviction and do the ultimate PR job on you brain cells is not something I entertain any trust in at all.

I hope they took Reeva Steenkamp’s cortisone levels to show that they may have been sky high as she ran to the bathroom for her life.
 
Here’s a good description of the paranoia that is typical among S.A. residents. Well, now I know there is no way I would live in that country by choice. Sounds a lot like the NRA's dream society. I imagine BroDeal et al would love to live in a place like this. Not for me:

On my first night in Johannesburg, I accidentally shut the rape door behind me, trapping myself in the bedroom.

Most middle-class homes in South Africa feature “rape doors” — sliding jail doors that compartmentalize a house so that no intruder can get at you if — and this is the phrase commonly used — “your perimeter is breached.”

It was funny for a minute. Then I realized that since all the windows in the bedroom were barred, I had no way to get out in case of a fire.
We phoned the couple we’d rented our pleasant bungalow from and explained the situation. The owner laughed a long time, and then said he’d be by in the morning to release me.

South Africans are afraid of many things. Fire ranks very low on the list.

This is the atmosphere in which Oscar Pistorius’s credulity stretching explanation of why he shot girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp to death as she cowered in a bathroom will be received. It’s the reason he’s going to get off.

We spent six weeks there covering the 2010 World Cup. There is no sufficient way to explain the paranoia about home security that grips average South Africans, except to say that fear animates much of their lives. The home we rented was typical.

It was surrounded by 10-foot walls. The walls were topped by electric fencing. When you look down a Jo’burg street, it gives the appearance of the frontage of a prison — all high walls, topped by electric fencing (for the well off) or razor wire (for the not-so-well off).

A submarine door accessed the street, but we were warned never to use it. People enter and exit using the garage door, which was solid oak, three inches thick and would not stop once it began coming down. This is to prevent anyone driving in behind you as you enter — an infamous home-invasion tactic.

Inside were the aforementioned rape doors. There was a gun locker (empty) in the master bedroom. Each room had a white button labelled “Panic.”

“What happens if I hit the button?” I asked the landlord as lightly as possible. I presumed it triggered a silent alarm. No, it summons the private-security company that is constantly roaming the neighbourhood in SUVs with blacked-out windows. The country is wracked by violence, but South Africans do not trust the police and would not bother calling them.

“If you hit that button, someone will be here in 90 seconds with a machine gun,” he said. He wasn’t kidding.

Why didn’t Oscar use that button? For that matter, why didn’t Reeva?

Alex, thanks for your contribution. I had no idea that these artificial limbs had to be replaced so often, that they cost so much over time. Wrt the stumps, an article I read quoted OP as saying he would “put on the stumps”, that was why I was under the impression there was something one put over the stumps other than a prosthetic limb. Apparently the writer of the article got that wrong.

Though there has been much talk of how the defense is demolishing the prosecution’s case, I’m again in agreement with Tom that the points the defense made yesterday don’t address what I still regard as the two major weaknesses of their case: that OP was right by the bed when he got his gun (in fact, would have had to be, coming back from the balcony), and therefore could have checked to see if Reeva was still in bed, and that when he screamed at the alleged intruder, Reeva would have responded and told him it was her. Also, if the neighbor who claimed hearing a woman screaming before and after gunshots can be corroborated, that evidence alone would completely demolish Pistorius’s story, though I understand the defense is arguing the neighbor would have been too far away to hear.

Still, as we learned in the Contador case, what matters is the plausibility not of the defense scenario, but of the prosecution's story. If reasonable doubt can be cast on the latter, Pistorius will walk, though he certainly seems guilty. A key question that I would think the defense would raise is, if Reeva feared for her life, why did she take refuge in the bathroom, where she was effectively trapped? Why not leave the bedroom and the house? Without his artificial limbs, it would have been hard for OP to chase her very far. Was Pistorius blocking that escape route? According to the map, the door to the bedroom is right in front of the bed, certainly closer that the bathroom. Maybe OP could have caught her before she unlocked the bedroom door, so she thought her chances were better outrunning him to the bathroom?

Or was it possible that Reeva at that time did not think OP was trying to kill her, and thought if she took temporary refuge in the toilet he would calm down? It now seems there was no shot fired in the bedroom, so what was OP doing there that would compel Reeva to run away from him? Pointing the gun at her? Trying to hit her with the bat? Or was it just angry words at that point?
 
Oct 6, 2009
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Merckx index said:
Here’s a good description of the paranoia that is typical among S.A. residents.

<snipped for brevity>

Thanks for that. It does look like he'll have a better chance of convincing folks he was afraid of an intruder given such a fearful environment. It also makes me wonder about the cyclists who train in SA in winter - do they not also have fear about riding around backroads to train? Or is the paranoia only in certain cities/regions within SA?
 
Oct 21, 2012
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Beech Mtn said:
Thanks for that. It does look like he'll have a better chance of convincing folks he was afraid of an intruder given such a fearful environment. It also makes me wonder about the cyclists who train in SA in winter - do they not also have fear about riding around backroads to train? Or is the paranoia only in certain cities/regions within SA?

Joburg was/probably still is the murder capital of the world. I don't think it is like this everywhere in SA. Don't about Pretoria where this murder took place.
 
Don't know if this was mentioned up thread but I'm not reading back too far....

It's bothering me after the explanation by OP affidavit that Reeva was in bed..he went out momentarily to get the fan etc..came back in and she was in the bathroom...but she was FULLY DRESSED when found. How did she leap up from sleeping in bed and get dressed instantaneously??
Also, if using the toilet when shot accidentally why weren't her pants down or even unzipped..snapped whatever?

It just doesn't add up.
If she had been cowering/ hiding from him then she would more likely be fully dressed.
 
It should bother you mew, because the OP defense is a pack of lies invented by his newly employed legal and PR machine.

There are gaping holes all over his story, but they know that a police investigation less than a week old is not going to be watertight and know the burden of proof and onus is on the cops, not them.
 
sittingbison said:
It should bother you mew, because the OP defense is a pack of lies invented by his newly employed legal and PR machine.

There are gaping holes all over his story, but they know that a police investigation less than a week old is not going to be watertight and know the burden of proof and onus is on the cops, not them.

Yep. It is too watertight and without logic...
 
Jul 7, 2009
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As this is only a bail hearing much of the back and forth doesn't mean much.
Oscar's council needs to show "exceptional circumstances" in order to be granted bail on a schedule six charge,ie: premeditated murder.
The judge has already agreed with the prosecution that this is a premeditated
murder charge. Oscar's atty. will be trying to get it reduced to a schedule five charge, ie:manslaughter. From what I've read, bail is rarely granted for a schedule six charge.
Now if you are the judge, what do you do with a schedule six charge?
What is the upside of granting bail? Oscar will be free to A) await trial B) flee
C)kill himself.
Denying bail is the safe bet that this goes to trial.
I don't see Oscar being granted bail.
South Africa does not have jury trials. Cases are heard before a judge.
I am sure the judge is aware that what he has heard thus far sounds as if something is amiss.
 
sittingbison said:
It should bother you mew, because the OP defense is a pack of lies invented by his newly employed legal and PR machine.

There are gaping holes all over his story, but they know that a police investigation less than a week old is not going to be watertight and know the burden of proof and onus is on the cops, not them.

When did Fabiani and Herman start taking on South African clients?

Dave.
 
sounds like a Lance PR stunt from Fabiani et al... Lets try and discredit the prosecution.

Can it get any more redunculous? The biggest crime case in South African history and the lead cop is facing murder charges? Ultimately though I couldn't give a rats, Bothas problems have nothing to do with Oscars prosecution, the two are entirely separate and Botha will no doubt be relieved.

EDIT:
haha DQ ;)
 
sittingbison said:
sounds like a Lance PR stunt from Fabiani et al... Lets try and discredit the prosecution.

Can it get any more redunculous? The biggest crime case in South African history and the lead cop is facing murder charges? Ultimately though I couldn't give a rats, Bothas problems have nothing to do with Oscars prosecution, the two are entirely separate and Botha will no doubt be relieved.

Got ya by a whisker!

Dave.
 
mewmewmew13 said:
Don't know if this was mentioned up thread but I'm not reading back too far....

It's bothering me after the explanation by OP affidavit that Reeva was in bed..he went out momentarily to get the fan etc..came back in and she was in the bathroom...but she was FULLY DRESSED when found. How did she leap up from sleeping in bed and get dressed instantaneously??
Also, if using the toilet when shot accidentally why weren't her pants down or even unzipped..snapped whatever?

It just doesn't add up.
If she had been cowering/ hiding from him then she would more likely be fully dressed.
agreed, but... there wasn't a full description of what she wore and there are little cami and shorts that are sold to sleep in, so there is that possibility...

i guess what made me even think of this was that they said her slippers were by the bed. seriously??? i mean, mew, when you were dating did you ever bring your slippers to your boyfriend's house?

so i'm not quite sure i trust if a slipper is a slipper or if fully dressed couldn't be some trendy sleep set after the testosterone turned out not to necessarily be testosterone... are there no women on the force? it sure as f*** sounds like they could use some :rolleyes: