Phil and Paul

[craig1985]

The thing is that gets me with Paul Sherwen is that he actually makes up stuff. He constantly harps on about Euskaltel's Egoi Martínez who he claimed rode for Armstrong at the TDF. True, he did ride two Tour's for Discovery Channel, but that was in '06 and '07, but Armstrong was retired then. I mean if I can know that, then surely he would. Other gems include saying that Samu is not a good bike handler, sure he may not be the descender that he used to be, but he's no Fränk Schleck.

Isso has mentioned that Paulo Martins is good for making up things as well.

 

[auscyclefan94]

to be fair to Phil and Paul, racing in general is better training for something that just training on your own. Van Petegem could have only told Bertie so much but it is much harder to put it in practise when the pace is really hard.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

The thing is that gets me with Paul Sherwen is that he actually makes up stuff. He constantly harps on about Euskaltel's Egoi Martínez who he claimed rode for Armstrong at the TDF. True, he did ride two Tour's for Discovery Channel, but that was in '06 and '07, but Armstrong was retired then. I mean if I can know that, then surely he would. Other gems include saying that Samu is not a good bike handler, sure he may not be the descender that he used to be, but he's no Fränk Schleck.

Isso has mentioned that Paulo Martins is good for making up things as well.

The best Paulo Martins nonsense is when he insists that the gap from breakaway to péloton is not accurate because of the speed difference when one is descending and the other still climbing.

 

[craig1985]

It's comments like that that make me wish I could understand Portuguese.

 

[greenedge]

Oh and did anyone else notice the constant Greenedge love?

Me. However i only watched two minutes highlights when down in Adelaide.


I don't mind them, the Kelly/Harmon is worse.

 

[thehog]

to be fair to Phil and Paul, racing in general is better training for something that just training on your own. Van Petegem could have only told Bertie so much but it is much harder to put it in practise when the pace is really hard.

Yeah you're right.

As such in 2010 Contador road a full season leading up to the Tour including several races on cobbles and Armstrong pulled out of most of appearances bar Flanders.

 

[thehog]

Yeah you're right.

As such in 2010 Contador road a full season leading up to the Tour including several races on cobbles and Armstrong pulled out of most of appearances bar Flanders.

I think the other problem with P&P was the 2009 Tour with the "Contador is a poor team-mate" story and he was letting Armstrong down.

It really got silly because what was happening on screen was entirely different than how Phil and Paul were portraying it.

Thats the year the tide really turned on Armstrong and people began to see what he was like.... (and then Floyd Landis helped a little also).

 

[No_Balls]

I think the other problem with P&P was the 2009 Tour with the "Contador is a poor team-mate" story and he was letting Armstrong down.

It really got silly because what was happening on screen was entirely different than how Phil and Paul were portraying it.

Thats the year the tide really turned on Armstrong and people began to see what he was like.... (and then Floyd Landis helped a little also).

Of course with a little help from Internet. Listening to some guys saying the rider is "a poor teammate" (not knowing why he is a bad teammate) and then reading what really is going behind the closet is not good PR for the commentators (nor the rider).

 

[rzombie1988]

I like Phil and Paul but I think it's hilarious how Phil cannot get Valverde's first name right. I'm watching the 05 Tour and it's super apparent. I've heard Alexander, Alessandro and I think even Alexio.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Todd Gogulski and Steve Schlanger are pretty decent commentators. I watched the Giro last year and they commentated the whole thing for Universal Sports. They handled the Giro tragedy really well, and they actually seem to call out the riders names fairly accurately (though often their last name pronunciations are all over the place). I also like that there are stretches of time when they don't say anything and it is just the road and motorcycle sounds.

Phil and Paul...I could do without them. But, sadly, they cover 90% of the races that are shown in the U.S. market.

They are really good at this. or were....
did NBC bring Schlanger along with Gogo or did they just dump him?
I liked the chemistry and give & take between them as announcers.
I will greatly miss them on Universal coverage and sure enjoyed it while it lasted.

 

[pedaling squares]

The thing about Phil and Paul is that they are actually quite capable. And they can be enjoyable to listen to. Particularly Phil who, at his best, conveys just the right mixture of passion, professional detachment, and sophistication.

Which makes what I'm about to say all the more regrettable. Like everything else Armstrong and company touch, Phil and Paul were long ago corrupted. A long time ago they may have asked themselves: maintain my credibility; or say something I get paid to say even though it makes me look like an utter fool?

Well said. I think Phil was at one time quite decent and his passion for the sport and admiration for the riders made him enjoyable to listen to. But now he's a shill. Plus, I really think dementia is setting in. The sheer volume of inaccuracies insofar as what is happening and who is involved is comical.

Granville57 - great post. Bruins suck.

 

[Dancing On The Pedals]

Wholeheartedly agree with much of what has been said on here. What really annoys me is that they give the impression that they don't bother to do any research, read any cycling magazines or websites to keep up to date with results/what people are up to etc., or display an awareness of more than a few races in the calendar. I accept that we, as fans, are always going to be in a position to be critical of commentators, be they P and P, Harmon or Kirby, or whoever else it might be, but it's their staggering ignorance of cycling as a sport that galls me. Yes P and P can no doubt talk for hours about the Tour, Lance, or California, but you get the impression that beneath that, they don't know that much - I remember in last years Tour when Geraint was in a mountian break and all they could talk about was how this naturally translated into him becoming a GC contender, not a word about how he is also rather good at those races called the Classics... And what is worse, I get the impression that they don't care about learning more than they need to.

 

[Benotti69]

P&P are complete muppets in thrall to the likes of McQuaid, Armstrong and anyone else that they think will throw some scraps for their troughs.

 

[craig1985]

Can Eurosport give Brian Smith a pay increase please?

 

[CatsNK]

Todd Gogulski and Steve Schlanger are pretty decent commentators. I watched the Giro last year and they commentated the whole thing for Universal Sports. They handled the Giro tragedy really well, and they actually seem to call out the riders names fairly accurately (though often their last name pronunciations are all over the place). I also like that there are stretches of time when they don't say anything and it is just the road and motorcycle sounds.

You hit the nail on the head. I like that there are quiet times in their coverage. I don't need to hear talking for three hours straight. I echo your sentiments about the Giro tragedy - they did an excellent job that day. Very respectful.

What I like about Gogo is that he appears to talk to each of the team directors and/or many riders every day. He clearly spends his time off-air on the phone and in person talking to people, getting the inside scoop. That adds some real value to his coverage.

I'll be paying for US coverage this year, since I lost it OTA.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Gogo IS terrific!


He has responded several times to my tweets and said that he and Steve S will be doing basically the same schedule as last year.

 

[Christian]

Hello

I usually don't follow Phil and Paul's commentary because I am fortunate enough to be able to watch most races on TV and when I watch streams I usually try to find a French one. But yesterday I was following the RadioShack Tour tracker which I must say is pretty cool with good quality stream and a lot of nice graphics as well as text updates.

So I was listening to Phil and Paul and of course I am somewhat aware that they are often ridiculed for mispronouncing names or misidentifying riders and so on. That was also the case yesterday but personally I don't think that's so bad so I didn't care.

From what I understand people mostly criticize Phil, but yesterday he didn't speak much because I think his voice is still recovering. What really started to bug me after a while though was Paul's commentating style. Let me explain. I feel like he very often tried to explain tactics by putting words into riders mouths, such as:

And here is Liquigas pulling on the front, going "We made a big mistake letting these guys go and we now have to work very hard to get them back"

I suppose when it serves the purpose of explaining race tactics it's somewhat OK but often there was simply no point to it:

Sylvain Georges being offered a bottle by a fan, saying "No thank you" and just powering on...

He is probably wondering "What kind of crazy train have I gotten myself onto"... (about the Australian rider left over from the break who went with Weening and Kelderman)

I mean what is the point of that?! It makes it feel like he is explaining it to a little kid, making everything overly exciting so the kid stays interested and over-explaining everything so to make sure the kid really understands the story. Then he also over-emphazises words such as "really hard" or "big effort", "brutal climb"... I know that this is quite common in the English language compared to others but again it just makes it seem like he is treating the viewers like children. Same with "Peter Sagan, the man you see sitting very comfortably on the right of your screen in the dark green jersey of the points leader surrounded by his Liquigas team mates...", he would repeat that every time, couldn't just say Peter Sagan.

Does anyone else get that feeling? Is it maybe because they assume that there are many viewers who are not cycling experts, who just follow Tour of California because it happens to be on TV?

That is my main criticism. Others include that they kept repeating the same three things about Sylvain Georges but I can excuse that because I guess there are some riders that there's just not that much to tell about and when they are alone in front for 50 km it can get difficult to come up with interesting stuff. Last but not least he tried a little too hard to compare California to Provence, at least 6 times or so. I must say I have been fortunate enough to have visited both places and I don't think it is completely wrong. I often describe Provence as "Like California, except less spectacular and more beautiful". But I don't think any native provençal would find himself reminded of home in a town such as Big Bear Lake, which Paul kept suggesting

 

[Havetts]

Haven't laughed as much about commentary lately as the last few days about P&P.. but that was because of a shoutbox too.

 

[Michele]

Totally agree with you Christian.
I guess the "enphazising" part is very american, at least compared to most EU tv commentary.

Anyway this was one of the most funny topics ever so please keep it coming!

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Does anyone else get that feeling? Is it maybe because they assume that there are many viewers who are not cycling experts, who just follow Tour of California because it happens to be on TV?

That is my main criticism. Others include that they kept repeating the same three things about Sylvain Georges but I can excuse that because I guess there are some riders that there's just not that much to tell about and when they are alone in front for 50 km it can get difficult to come up with interesting stuff. Last but not least he tried a little too hard to compare California to Provence, at least 6 times or so. I must say I have been fortunate enough to have visited both places and I don't think it is completely wrong. I often describe Provence as "Like California, except less spectacular and more beautiful". But I don't think any native provençal would find himself reminded of home in a town such as Big Bear Lake, which Paul kept suggesting

It's not out of the ordinary for them. They spent the whole of the 2010 race describing everything in terms of Alpe d'Huez, so Bonny Doon was "as steep as Alpe d'Huez!", Big Bear was "comparable climbing to Alpe d'Huez" (I kid you not), and the vineyard climb in the last stage was "like a mini Alpe d'Huez".

They commentate every race as if the viewer has never seen bike racing before. It's a bit insulting to the intelligence of the experienced viewer, as opposed to Eurosport, Sporza, RAI, ETB and so on where understanding of how the sport works is pretty much taken as read, though Eurosport do endeavour to explain a lot of the simple things at Tour de France time (but also begging patience of the regular viewers, as they are aware that this can be irritating to those who already know all this and of course the commentators themselves would rather not have to explain the basics).

Once upon a time, Phil and Paul were very good cycling commentators. But those days have passed and they have long since descended into self-parody.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Paul Sherwen ‏@PaulSherwen
African proverb: Ambition is like a dog when it gets angry it can even bite its master

 

[dlwssonic]

is it me or does phil really hate contador??

 

[webvan]

I miss these guys, can their comments be heard in Europe somehow?

 

[Txapeldun]

Harmon & Kelley are certainly tops for English commentary, however you can't beat Teledeporte's crew of Carlos de Andrés and Perico....and Juan Carlos en moto!

ETB's basque crew is the most disappointing. I'm sure they're intelligent and insightful as I understand only 10% of what they're saying, but they about put me to sleep. Seriously, no emotion whatsoever.

 

[Michele]

Italian Rai must be one of the best with Cassani, Savoldelli and Martinello for big events like Giro. Sometimes Bugno on helycopter.