Teams & Riders Pogačar as GOAT: already, never, or when?

[Extinction]

You would have to put Pogacar in that era and Merckx now, but this is impossible.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Of course Pogacar is better when we talk about talent but his palmares is still very inferior to Merckx's palmares. So Merckx is still the GOAT but if Merckx raced nowadays, it's so obvious he wouldn't have half of his palmares. Cycling is way more specialized and professional

 

[Extinction]

Of course Pogacar is better when we talk about talent but his palmares is still very inferior to Merckx's palmares. So Merckx is still the GOAT but if Merckx raced nowadays, it's so obvious he wouldn't have half of his palmares. Cycling is way more specialized and professional

This has been said since the 80s, but give Merckx the same as today and then let's see. Of course, this is not possible.

 

[Froome]

There are lots of explanations in this forum why Tadej Merckx is the GOAT.

Who is Tadej Merckx?

 

[YavorD]

Of course Pogacar is better when we talk about talent but his palmares is still very inferior to Merckx's palmares. So Merckx is still the GOAT but if Merckx raced nowadays, it's so obvious he wouldn't have half of his palmares. Cycling is way more specialized and professional

Yeah, according to PCS 16-17 nations has scored PCS points during Merckx' career. Compare that to 91 in the time frame 2020-2024 and you'll see that cycling was just a glorified friendly event back in the Merckx days.

 

[MikeTichondrius]

Palmarès matters when having GOAT conversations obviously. There is also the matter of comparing Merckx's full career to Pogi at 26.

In my view, Merckx's palmarés is totally impossible to reach in the modern era. It is also true that Pogi is the most impressive rider I've seen in all my years watching (97 onwards). If he keeps at it, I can see him reaching something akin to Hinault's (in my view, the current #2 OAT).

Currently I'd put in about on par with Indurain or Coppi on palmarès alone. There is zero doubt in my mind that he will surpass them. He also has a real shot of being the second ever to win full sets of both GTs and monuments which is a crazy achievement in itself and a testament to his versatility in an era of specialists. This, I feel, would put him at a clear #2 OAT.

 

[Froome]

"He takes the piss!" - Geraint Thomas & Luke Rowe in awe of 'better than Merckx' Tadej Pogacar

Geraint Thomas has had a few battles against Tadej P

cyclinguptodate.com

Not we all - the cycling world. He is the goat for the same reason Jordan is the Goat of NBA and not Bill Russell its very easy.

In your black and white way to say it Roglic is twice the rider Vingegaard is and more and etc etc it doesnt work like that only its more narratives to account for than pure merrits (especially when its vs another era where cyclnig was terrible)

You can do a bunch of posts everyday on this forum, it doesn't mean at the end of the day, Pogacar is the GOAT, because the palmares doesn't say that.

Just enjoy what Pogacar did this year, and forget about those conversations who doesn't make sense.

 

[BullsFan22]

Here we go. Another ‘who is the goat?’ conversation in sports…

I hope Tadej keeps going well for the next 5-8/10 years, and then we’ll see. The guy is 26. Even though he’s been around now for 6 years or so as a pro, it still feels like he’s a relative ‘newcomer.’ Maybe it’s the baby face, maybe it’s youthful exuberance in which he races…I don’t know.

Let’s wait until he’s retired or close to being retired that we make a comparison.

 

[James M]

This has been said since the 80s, but give Merckx the same as today and then let's see. Of course, this is not possible.

Im not the nostalgia guy but put Merckx in this era and he wouldnt top 20 in the Tour or be anywhere close to anyone. Hows that fair to Merckx though peak strenght vs these guys where cycling has evolved 100x times, its just as life in that time that car vc cars today its self explonatory. But put him in today with all the training and make him grow up etc who knows, but imposisble as you say.

Indeed as far as GOAT goes its personal preference he is my goat already for the same reason Jordan is the goat for me in nba over Russell, its still preference thing its not facts. And I do believe since its personal prefernece nostalgia and emotions plays apart, if someone has Pog as goat thats fine i think cause its def a case and more and moer already clearly dub him that in the real world but if someone has Merckx as their goat nothing wrong with that either - IMO. Two best legends of the sport regardless all love.

Whats however is facts is that Pogacar is the best cyclist that has ever put his ass on a bike its beyond any doubt and its with a margin which is comical at this point..

 

[BullsFan22]

Palmarès matters when having GOAT conversations obviously. There is also the matter of comparing Merckx's full career to Pogi at 26.

In my view, Merckx's palmarés is totally impossible to reach in the modern era. It is also true that Pogi is the most impressive rider I've seen in all my years watching (97 onwards). If he keeps at it, I can see him reaching something akin to Hinault's (in my view, the current #2 OAT).

Currently I'd put in about on par with Indurain or Coppi on palmarès alone. There is zero doubt in my mind that he will surpass them. He also has a real shot of being the second ever to win full sets of both GTs and monuments which is a crazy achievement in itself and a testament to his versatility in an era of specialists. This, I feel, would put him at a clear #2 OAT.

I want to see Pogi smashing the Roubaix to pieces, attacking halfway on a tough section of cobbles and dropping those around him. That will be some spectacle.

 

[James M]

You can do a bunch of posts everyday on this forum, it doesn't mean at the end of the day, Pogacar is the GOAT, because the palmares doesn't say that.

Just enjoy what Pogacar did this year, and forget about those conversations who doesn't make sense.

Neither does Jordan but he is and so is Pogacar for most people ive seen already in the age of 25 it is what it is my view on it dosent matter in grand scheme of things indeed but the cycling world does and the message is loud and clear wether or not you like it.

But Roglic is twice the rider as Vingegaard cause his palmares says so I do wonder if your ready to say that at the same time too then with the same logic applied

Anyway idc about goat as said before he is my goat aswell as many others already and he is 25 and if someone else has Merckx as their goat thats totally fine too, who cares its not facts its personal preference.

 

[Peyroteo94]

One thing that it is obvious, cycling in Merckx's era was popular and raced by 6/7 nations with France, Italy, Belgium, Netherlands and Spain as big nations. Talent is around the world but some guys didn't get the opportunity to become cyclists in many countries. Let's not pretend it is the same winning 3 WC from a country like Slovakia (Sagan) and winning 3 WC from a country like Spain or Belgium (Freire and Merckx)

 

[James M]

One thing that it is obvious, cycling in Merckx's era was popular and raced by 6/7 nations with France, Italy, Belgium, Netherlands and Spain as big nations. Talent is around the world but some guys didn't get the opportunity to become cyclists in many countries. Let's not pretend it is the same winning 3 WC from a country like Slovakia (Sagan) and winning 3 WC from a country like Spain or Belgium (Freire and Merckx)

just let whoever gets something from doing that do it. The message from the cycling world is loud and clear all that matters - its not rocket science its becoming very obvious and the guy is still 25. Rest is personal preference which are okei.

The fashion of the win today tells it all, in this era vs the best its never been seen before. 100km, bending the entire peleton with entire Belgian and Holland team to their knees along with their respective captains. The funny part the same handful (granted) guys will come in two weeks to try to debate if lets say Roglic is better than Pogacar on a certain hill I saw somone said and couldnt agree more and its getting old and weird nothing else at this point, it makes you wonder what certain ppl do real life

 

[scribers]

I feel in no way anxious to rush Pogi's career. Going to sit back and enjoy as long as his health (and luck) are willing. What happens after all that can be measured against history before and after.

 

[E_F_]

Well he did the triple crown. An his triple crown season is better than either the previous two. So I think that's probably the best season ever. Longevity is needed for him to be the greatest of all time.

 

[Izzyeviel]

He just needs 19 more tour stages & a Vuelta to be considered the Goat.

 

[E_F_]

He just needs 19 more tour stages & a Vuelta to be considered the Goat.

Kinda needs a lot more than that to match Eddy's palmares tbh

 

[Lorzenz08]

I think a realistic scenario for Pogi for the next 5-6 years is something like :
- GT : 3 more TdF / 2 more Giro / 1 Vuelta
- 2 more Liege
- 1 or 2 MSR
- 1 other WC
- 1 Paris-Roubaix
- 3 more Lombardia

 

[scribers]

If Pogi can lay MSR to bed, I am thinking he stops racing it. Too early and too much to chance to prepare for. Starting a little later in the season would make for a much stronger heart of the season.