Pre Giro d' Italia-thread!

[Koronin]

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

I just saw Israel Academys team.

How come Sondre Holst Enger not get picked?

Is he injured?

He finished the Tour of Croatia on Sunday, so I doubt he is injured, but I don't know.

But speaking of the ICA team, has a rider ever started (assuming that he does) a grand tour with as modest a palmares as Guy Niv? Lifetime total of 0 CQ points (yes, I've been doing preliminary work on the CQ game spreadsheet), only turned pro in August, his two highest finishes are 22nd and 25th, but that was 22nd and 25th team in a TTT. Highest individual finish is 4 minutes behind Tom Skujins in one of the Mallorcan January races.

Obviously they ned to put in some of their Israeli guys to justify the outlay of the city council, but others seem to have a greater claim to being the flagwaver.

 

[Escarabajo]

The Sky team has Sergio Luis Henao instead of Sebastian Henao. If he wants Henao and Poels then Froome could be even more serious about winning the Giro than the Tour. Actually that Sky team looks very strong.

It could be that he is playing his cards to what could be more certain versus actually riding theTour.

 

[Escarabajo]

I just saw Israel Academys team.

How come Sondre Holst Enger not get picked?

Is he injured?

He finished the Tour of Croatia on Sunday, so I doubt he is injured, but I don't know.

But speaking of the ICA team, has a rider ever started (assuming that he does) a grand tour with as modest a palmares as Guy Niv? Lifetime total of 0 CQ points (yes, I've been doing preliminary work on the CQ game spreadsheet), only turned pro in August, his two highest finishes are 22nd and 25th, but that was 22nd and 25th team in a TTT. Highest individual finish is 4 minutes behind Tom Skujins in one of the Mallorcan January races.

Obviously they ned to put in some of their Israeli guys to justify the outlay of the city council, but others seem to have a greater claim to being the flagwaver.

And what about Edwin Avila? I thought he was decent rider to animate stages at the Tour.

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

The Sky team has Sergio Luis Henao instead of Sebastian Henao. If he wants Henao and Poels then Froome could be even more serious about winning the Giro than the Tour. It is just my opinion. Actually that Sky team looks very strong.

It could be that he is playing his cards to what could be more certain versus actually riding theTour.

Henao isn't that special in the high mountains. I actually think that that team is surprisingly light on the climbing.

I had expected Diego Rosa and Kenny Elissonde to be there.

But Sky has definitely dropped the ball a bit on monster domestiques in favour of getting Bernal and Sivakov for the future.

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

I have no idea what they've been thinking ever since they got Landa while they already had Quintana and Valverde.

And then bringing all 3 to a Tour with cobbles and a TTT?

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

Re:

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

Ok, but why only Valverde to Vuelta? Why wouldnt they send Landa as well? For instance
taking into account Colombian's squad in WC..

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

The Sky team has Sergio Luis Henao instead of Sebastian Henao. If he wants Henao and Poels then Froome could be even more serious about winning the Giro than the Tour. It is just my opinion. Actually that Sky team looks very strong.

It could be that he is playing his cards to what could be more certain versus actually riding theTour.

Henao isn't that special in the high mountains. I actually think that that team is surprisingly light on the climbing.

I had expected Diego Rosa and Kenny Elissonde to be there.

But Sky has definitely dropped the ball a bit on monster domestiques in favour of getting Bernal and Sivakov for the future.

Maybe now Elissonde deserves a mention. But Henao has been building up his form lately. He looked good in last couple of races. And Poels will probably be in better form during the third week.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

Ok, but why only Valverde to Vuelta? Why wouldnt they send Landa as well? For instance
taking into account Colombian's squad in WC..

Because Landa wanted to go to the Tour. So this year if they were to send two riders to the Giro it would be Landa and Quintana. They both really want to go to the Tour. Valverde just wants any 2 GTs as long as one of them is la Vuelta. Based on his comments after LBL there's no way he could have gone to the Giro this year. Of course you could send Landa alone to the Giro. Then send Quintana/Valverde to the Tour then all 3 to la Vuelta. Or you send all 3 to the Tour and Quintana/Valverde to la Vuelta.
Of course my original thought was Valverde/Landa to the Giro. Landa/Quintana to the Tour. Valverde/Quintana to la Vuelta. That seemed to make sense, but now won't work.
Now the way things are going it appears they'll be sending all 3 to both the Tour and la Vuelta.

 

[rick james]

Re: Re:

The Sky team has Sergio Luis Henao instead of Sebastian Henao. If he wants Henao and Poels then Froome could be even more serious about winning the Giro than the Tour. It is just my opinion. Actually that Sky team looks very strong.

It could be that he is playing his cards to what could be more certain versus actually riding theTour.

Henao isn't that special in the high mountains. I actually think that that team is surprisingly light on the climbing.

I had expected Diego Rosa and Kenny Elissonde to be there.

But Sky has definitely dropped the ball a bit on monster domestiques in favour of getting Bernal and Sivakov for the future.

Maybe now Elissonde deserves a mention. But Henao has been building up his form lately. He looked good in last couple of races. And Poels will probably be in better form during the third week.

We know that when Poels is with the dawg that he’s only needed for the 3rd week

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

Re: Re:

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

Ok, but why only Valverde to Vuelta? Why wouldnt they send Landa as well? For instance
taking into account Colombian's squad in WC..

Because Landa wanted to go to the Tour. So this year if they were to send two riders to the Giro it would be Landa and Quintana. They both really want to go to the Tour. Valverde just wants any 2 GTs as long as one of them is la Vuelta. Based on his comments after LBL there's no way he could have gone to the Giro this year. Of course you could send Landa alone to the Giro. Then send Quintana/Valverde to the Tour then all 3 to la Vuelta. Or you send all 3 to the Tour and Quintana/Valverde to la Vuelta.
Of course my original thought was Valverde/Landa to the Giro. Landa/Quintana to the Tour. Valverde/Quintana to la Vuelta. That seemed to make sense, but now won't work.
Now the way things are going it appears they'll be sending all 3 to both the Tour and la Vuelta.

It's really complicated, but it seems like Landa finally may appeaer at WC (thanks to his participation in Vuelta)?

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

As for what is Movistar thinking? Who the heck knows. I'm not sure anyone has any idea what they've been thinking all year or even if they are thinking. Although Valverde actually DID want to go to the Giro, after his winter/spring campaign there is no way he was going to be able to. He said after LBL that his body is telling him it needs a break. So in truth there was no way they were going to be able to send 2 of their big 3 riders to the Giro this year unless they sent Landa AND Quintana, which is highly unlikely. Then send all 3 to the Tour and only Valverde to la Vuelta. Thus meaning Landa would not being going to the Worlds. (The Spanish national coach basically won't take riders to the Worlds if they didn't ride la Vuelta.)

Ok, but why only Valverde to Vuelta? Why wouldnt they send Landa as well? For instance
taking into account Colombian's squad in WC..

Because Landa wanted to go to the Tour. So this year if they were to send two riders to the Giro it would be Landa and Quintana. They both really want to go to the Tour. Valverde just wants any 2 GTs as long as one of them is la Vuelta. Based on his comments after LBL there's no way he could have gone to the Giro this year. Of course you could send Landa alone to the Giro. Then send Quintana/Valverde to the Tour then all 3 to la Vuelta. Or you send all 3 to the Tour and Quintana/Valverde to la Vuelta.
Of course my original thought was Valverde/Landa to the Giro. Landa/Quintana to the Tour. Valverde/Quintana to la Vuelta. That seemed to make sense, but now won't work.
Now the way things are going it appears they'll be sending all 3 to both the Tour and la Vuelta.

It's really complicated, but it seems like Landa finally may appeaer at WC (thanks to his participation in Vuelta)?

Combination of la Vuelta participation and his keeping his word to work for Valverde in the Ardennes. Landa said something during the off season that he wanted to go to the Giro, really wanted to go to the Tour, but had to go to la Vuelta because he wanted a shot at the Spanish National team for the Worlds. If he didn't go to the Vuelta there was no way he'd get to go to the Worlds. Of the current Spaniards only Valverde and LL Sanchez can be on the National team for the Worlds without the Vuelta participation as a requirement. Yet they both prefer to be at la Vuelta anyway.

 

[Red Rick]

I'm wondering how Chaves will bounce back from last year. I can't see him winning, and I think he missed his best shot in that Giro, but boy did he take that loss graciously. He's one of the good guys.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

I'm wondering how Chaves will bounce back from last year. I can't see him winning, and I think he missed his best shot in that Giro, but boy did he take that loss graciously. He's one of the good guys.

Agree, it would be great to see a rider like Chaves take the win. He's got a great team for it as well. He'd probably have to do something really spectacular on stage 19 though - to take back the time that he will lose to the 'power-meter climbers' in the TT.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re: Re:

I'm wondering how Chaves will bounce back from last year. I can't see him winning, and I think he missed his best shot in that Giro, but boy did he take that loss graciously. He's one of the good guys.

Agree, it would be great to see a rider like Chaves take the win. He's got a great team for it as well. He'd probably have to do something really spectacular on stage 19 though - to take back the time that he will lose to the 'power-meter climbers' in the TT.

Chaves has a great team, but I don't think he is ready after his 2017 going up against Froomey and Dumo. I can see him winning next year, but for now Ill me looking much more out for Lopez. But I really hope Im wrong as a flying Chaves would make this Giro great.

 

[sir fly]

Chaves will do great.
When I'm having a year - he isn't, and vice versa.
I couldn't make his year, but he can mine.

 

[Tonton]

Re:

"over-hyped Spanish speaking riders"

Let me clarify this, which I meant to do, but forgot as I was writing my long post. I hate long posts, except in the design thread or when LS dissects a newly-released GT course.

First, there's a sense of brotherhood between same-language speaking counties. Natural feeling, common heritage, that's why for example the Phils and Pauls of the world have embraced LA, Cav, McEwen, Porte, Hesjedal, Landis. There are reasons for it that are market, broadcast related, et caetera...

From a Spanish speaking prospective, it's mostly about stage racers, the pipeline feeds a lot of excellent riders, who get over-hyped, come and go. They are easy to overlook. With so many duds in the box, when the real piece of fireworks ignites, the surprise results in a podium or a win. Once proven to be real (Contador, Valverde, Quintana, Landa), there is no sneak attack, free pass.

What are Dumoulin and Froome's DS thinking of Chavez and Lopez? What was Legeay thinking when he let Chiappucci go clear and take a massive lead in '90?

That's my point. In short .

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

I'm wondering how Chaves will bounce back from last year. I can't see him winning, and I think he missed his best shot in that Giro, but boy did he take that loss graciously. He's one of the good guys.

Agree, it would be great to see a rider like Chaves take the win. He's got a great team for it as well. He'd probably have to do something really spectacular on stage 19 though - to take back the time that he will lose to the 'power-meter climbers' in the TT.

Chaves has a great team, but I don't think he is ready after his 2017 going up against Froomey and Dumo. I can see him winning next year, but for now Ill me looking much more out for Lopez. But I really hope Im wrong as a flying Chaves would make this Giro great.

Yeah, Lopez is much more of an unknown quantity with regards to what he can do in a GT - and the Giro should suit him well. We've seen enough of Chaves now to know roughly where he stands in the GC pecking order, but if he can ride as well as in 2016 then I think he has a chance.

Froome is a bit of an unknown quantity regarding form and other things right now, while we are yet to see whether Dumoulin is the next Indurain or just the next Wiggins. Hopefully with his team, Chaves can at least ask questions of the bigger favourites, and there is a chance they could collapse.

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

From ca 180 riders in Giro, below we have "BIG-6" with the KMs this season:
...
87. MA Lopez - 3555 km
108. Aru - 3252 km
122. Chaves - 3042 km
161. Froome - 2408
166. Pinot - 2212 km
172. Dumuolin - 1956 km
Only MAL above mediana (3520 km). And amounts of KMs correspond with their TDF plans.

 

[Valv.Piti]

For those watching on British Eurosport, I know Matt Stephens has stopped on GCN and is doing a lot more commentating, including the Giro. A pair of him and Hatch could be great I think, the few times I have listened to Stephens commentating it has been very pleasant and he has a very nice personality.

From ca 180 riders in Giro, below we have "BIG-6" with the KMs this season:
...
87. MA Lopez - 3555 km
108. Aru - 3252 km
122. Chaves - 3042 km
161. Froome - 2408
166. Pinot - 2212 km
172. Dumuolin - 1956 km
Only MAL above mediana (3520 km). And amounts of KMs correspond with their TDF plans.

Nothing too out of the ordinary - Dumoulin probably doesn't have as many kilometres as he would have liked, but I doubt it matters. Froome with a very Froome-esque approach.

 

[DNP-Old]

Only difference between the amount of km's of Dumoulin of last and this year is two relatively short Tirreno stages and a 10k ITT.

 

[GP Blanco]

I just saw Israel Academys team.

How come Sondre Holst Enger not get picked?

Is he injured?

He finished the Tour of Croatia on Sunday, so I doubt he is injured, but I don't know.

But speaking of the ICA team, has a rider ever started (assuming that he does) a grand tour with as modest a palmares as Guy Niv? Lifetime total of 0 CQ points (yes, I've been doing preliminary work on the CQ game spreadsheet), only turned pro in August, his two highest finishes are 22nd and 25th, but that was 22nd and 25th team in a TTT. Highest individual finish is 4 minutes behind Tom Skujins in one of the Mallorcan January races.

Obviously they ned to put in some of their Israeli guys to justify the outlay of the city council, but others seem to have a greater claim to being the flagwaver.

Ramon Carretero needs a worthy successor

 

[yaco]

MS team for Giro is S.Yates, Chaves, Kreuziger, Nieve, Haig, Juul-Jensen, Tuft and Bewley - Plenty of support for the two leaders if they are in form - My understanding is Chaves has been in form all year, training numbers are good, and he has been held back through the season - S.Yates seems to have stepped up this year and should ride well - Actually think Yates will finish ahead of Chaves - Though think MS will do best in the Vuelta.

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

Re: Re:

The Sky team has Sergio Luis Henao instead of Sebastian Henao. If he wants Henao and Poels then Froome could be even more serious about winning the Giro than the Tour. It is just my opinion. Actually that Sky team looks very strong.

It could be that he is playing his cards to what could be more certain versus actually riding theTour.

Henao isn't that special in the high mountains. I actually think that that team is surprisingly light on the climbing.

I had expected Diego Rosa and Kenny Elissonde to be there.

But Sky has definitely dropped the ball a bit on monster domestiques in favour of getting Bernal and Sivakov for the future.

Maybe now Elissonde deserves a mention. But Henao has been building up his form lately. He looked good in last couple of races. And Poels will probably be in better form during the third week.

Velonews:
Despite his strong ride for Froome at the recent Tour of the Alps, Kenny Elissonde does not appear on Sky’s lineup. An insider told VeloNews, however, that the team will officially announce its roster on Friday and that one of the names on its provisional start list is likely to change. It’s unclear who that would be.
I hope Kenny will replace e.g. Knees.

 

[May0maniac]

Apparently the Bora squad will be:
71 FORMOLO Davide
72 BENEDETTI Cesare
73 BENNETT Sam
74 GROSSSCHARTNER Felix
75 KONRAD Patrick
76 PFINGSTEN Christoph
77 SELIG Rüdiger
78 SCHILLINGER Andreas

Konrad suddenly riding the Giro is a bit unexpected, but it's a good sprint train + 2 good climbers to support Formolo, not a bad team.