Race Design Thread

Page 87 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
Jun 28, 2012
798
0
0
BTW, can anybody get Stage 16 (Briancon-Bourg d'Oisans) to open up? I can't get it to work, and it's one of the several co-queen stages of the bunch.
 
Jun 28, 2012
798
0
0
Netserk said:
I have no problem opening it.
I got it to work. Forgot that tracks4bikers didn't work very well with Internet Explorer. Google Chrome did the trick.

For those wondering, 7, 14, and 16 are the queen stages, if you will. There's a reason why the mountain stages are balanced out by three individual time trials (one of them a long one, on the last day of the tour) and a long team time trial.
 
Jun 28, 2012
798
0
0
l.Harm said:
Wrong link for stage 19.

Very nice route btw! :)
Pretty sure I got the links right.

Minor issues to pick apart my own race:

1. The first half-dozen stages have virtually no KOMs to reward a failed break.
2. I would have liked to have a few more medium-mountain stages in there. It's a little light in that respect, especially to be going from a flat prologue, a flat team time trial, and five flat stages right into the Pyrenees' queen stage. I could probably expect the peloton to shrink by about 10-15 riders on that day alone, even before the start.
3. I'd like that Strasbourg-Metz route to go through some of the World War I/II fortifications if any of them are still standing and have a road go through them.
4. No Arc D'Triomphe finish, but close enough IMO. Wanted that final time trial to go through all 20 arrondissements of France, and I managed to pull that off. Starting at Jim Morrison's gravesite (or at least the cemetery he's in) was, I thought, a nice touch.
 
It's time for me to return to type, and have another go at the Vuelta. This is a Vuelta designed to be a bit more realistic than my last attempt (which featured 2 stages in the Balearics, 3 in Las Canarias, circuit races in both Ceuta and Melilla and a mountaintop finish on El Peñón de Gibraltar), taking in both areas which regularly pay for the privilege of hosting the race, and areas that enable both myself ans Javier Guillén to leave satisfied with the route. As a result, I have brought some new climbs to the Vuelta, some steep climbs, and some serious puncheur finishes, but there is no room for some of my absolute favourite climbs in Spain - so there's no room for the fantasy stage I designed with the Fumanya-Pradell double climb (like the Aia double climb, but supersized) 50km from the finish and a mountaintop finish on one of Spain's most glorious climbs, the Coll de Pal, though that stage may appear slightly tweaked in a Catalunya parcours somewhere down the line. Similarly, I've gone for a more predictable finish to keep Guillén happy instead of the sweeping scenery of the Puerto de la Cubilla, the Galibier of Spain, which could easily be appended onto a stage with San Lorenzo or La Cobertoria, although there isn't a great deal of space at the top. Again, this may surface in an Asturias parcours or similar one day because it's a travesty that this climb is going there unused. And this time around there's no space for Haza del Lino, since that's been climbed from either side in both of my previous Vuelta parcours - twice in the first one. Furthermore, the Vuelta does not enter País Vasco, despite the region containing a significant number of my favourite climbs in the whole country, as my first route made a big deal of the Basque stages and I've also done a few Basque races in the past. A couple of stages do have alternative routes to offer in case of issues, although the Vuelta does not have the same problem on this front that the Giro does of course.

Stage 1: Santander - Santander (Contrarreloj por Equipos)(14,5km)

5bw5jp.png


2ry4xzb.png


A bit of a collector's item, this - I think I've posted only one solitary Team Time Trial in the thread before this. I don't like them, probably never will, but Javier Guillén seems to, as 7 of the last 10 Vueltas have begun with them (the exceptions being 2005 and 2009, when there was a prologue, and 2007 when the race started with a road stage), and 2013's route is going to follow with that recent tradition.

As a result of this I've thrown Unipublic a bone and given them their beloved CRE. The host this time will be Cantabria, home region of 2011 Vuelta winner Juan José Cobo, as we are starting in Santander, the large port city on the country's northern coast. The route is short and hilly, so hopefully its effect on the GC won't be too extreme. The race starts in the Jardines de Pereda, and the route starts with a simple wide open out-and-back along the waterfront of the Bahia de Santander, returning onto the Paseo Pereda. The second half of the route is hillier, ascending onto the hillside overlooking the city, but also giving good views inland to the Sierra Cantabria, and of course the city is overlooked by a recent belle of the Vuelta, Peña Cabarga (you can see the city in the background). The riders then have a very straight, slightly downhill ride before a sharp right, which means that they can turn right into the finish on Calle Calvo Sotelo shortly after the riders emerge through the arch of the Banco de Santander.

As usual, these things are more about looking cool and showing off the city, so hopefully it won't affect the GC too negatively, and will look nice in the late August sun.

Santander:
Santander_Waterfront_2_900x600_Autoridad_Portuaria_de_Santander.ashx


Santander_Waterfront_1_900x600_Autoridad_Portuaria_de_Santander.ashx
 
Stage 2: Castro Urdiales - Haro, 185km

2u7x8ic.png


14topih.png


Climbs:
Puerto de la Granja (cat.3) 6,6km @ 5,2%
Puerto de los Tornos (cat.1) 18,8km @ 4,5%
Alto de Cellorigo (cat.3) 7,6km @ 3,2%

The first road stage of the Vuelta is likely to be a sprint as we move inland from the Cantabrian coast to the plains of La Rioja, however the sprinters aren't so likely to have it all their own way, for they will have to work pretty hard to make sure they're there to compete for the win, because there are some notable difficulties in the early parts of the stage, including our first category 1 climb, the long and gradually steepening Puerto de los Tornos that takes us out of the lush hillside of the Sierra Cantabria and onto the plains of Burgos. This has its last 7km at 7%, although the rest is merely false flat; with this being the second climb of the day and cresting after under 60 kilometres it will be interesting to see if a strong break results, or who thinks to pick up any remaining mountains points from the bunch when the group has gone through.

The sprinters have plenty of time to make their way back, however, as the plains of Burgos are very flat and straight and if they have teammates with them they can definitely make their way back on given that this early in the race I doubt too many teams will want to risk burning themselves out for little reward. There is as brief as can be a detour into País Vasco, literally for about a kilometre of adjoining road into Miranda de Ebro, before we have our final obstacle of the day, the very gradual ascent to the dramatically-situated village of Cellorigo, underneath a rocky outcrop protruding vertically from the Riojan side of the Sierra Álavesa. For the most part the rise up to the village is just false flat, or even fully flat, however the last 1,6km average 8%, and right at the top it reaches 15%; the summit is, however, 21km from the finish, so while it will give a platform for an attack from the bunch or possibly even from the break, it's not likely to prevent it being a sprint, especially given how straight and open those 21 kilometres are - it's just going to be worth questioning which sprinters will make it there to contest it. The final corner comes with 250m to go; these 250m into Plaza Mayor are slightly uphill (around 4-5%), however this is still very much one for the fast men. My tip on a stage like this, if the guys like Cavendish are dropped, would be John Degenkolb, however Sagan, Ventoso, Bennati, Demare and Kristoff are all useful shouts as well.

Castro Urdiales:
S-012.jpg


Haro:
safe_image.php
 
Stage 3: Pamplona - Estación de Esquí de Candanchú, 187km

2zohn9w.png


2ui9ams.png


Climbs:
Alto de Undüés (cat.3) 6,7km @ 5,2%
Alto Bagüés (cat.3) 8,2km @ 3,6%
Alto de Aisa (cat.3) 12,6km @ 3,3%
Estación de Esquí de Candanchú (cat.2) 19,5km @ 3,2%

The Vuelta, as in recent years, does not waste much time in going to the mountains, and so it is with this route, which begins in Navarra, ends in Aragón, with an uphill finish right on the border with France. It's really not a very difficult stage, despite four categorised climbs and the mountaintop finish; gradients seldom get very tough at all. However, the Vuelta does have a history of these low gradient mountaintops, with the likes of Formigal, Fuentes de Invierno and Fuente Dé making Cerler look like Anglirú. Here we add another such climb to the race's history. Formigal is on the way to the Pourtalet; Candanchú, famous for its Nordic skiing trails and boasting Spain's only international standard biathlon facilities, is next door, on the way to the Somport.

After a transfer from Haro (riders will probably have overnighted in Logroño, Estella-Lizarra or Vitória-Gasteiz, all of which are convenient cities with plenty of facilities between Haro and Pamplona, the riders set sail from Pamplona, much as they did in the 2012 Vuelta. This time, however, they're headed east, over a few small climbs on the way to Jacá, which held a hilltop finish on the Hoz de Jacá in 2012 and has been campaigning to host the Winter Olympics for some time. Presumably were that to happen Alpine sports would likely be handled by the Formigal ski station, while Candanchú would handle the Nordic events. From Jacá we take a long and gradual rise up to the Alto de Aisa, which is very gradual, with only the last 3km at 6% being any real challenge, which is then followed mid-descent by another, uncategorised ascent averaging 7% for just under 2km.

That takes us to the junction at 8km on this profile of the Somport. Then we will continue on this until the turnoff at the 26km mark, whereupon we will continue into the Candanchú ski station with a final ascent of 1,5km averaging 5,2%. As you can tell from the profile, for the most part this is false flat and it's only going to be the final 5km that really causes much action here; the steepest kilometre (averaging 7,6%) is between 3,5 and 4,5km from the line. The last 5,5km averages 6%, so this is still plenty enough considering the amount of false flat to dislodge many of the less adept climbers, however this is likely to be one settled in the last 2-3km by the late attack or sprint-on-a-hilltop specialists like Betancur, Rodríguez, Valverde, Gerrans, Henao and co.

This is my attempt to produce a stage that removes anybody who is clearly not going to have it from the GC mix, enables a marker to be put down, but is likely to be a sprint of the elites, a bit like the San Martino di Castrozza stage of the 2009 Giro or the Sierra Nevada in the 2011 Vuelta.Yes, and also continue my obsession with including biathlon venues.

Pamplona:
pamplona-plaza-del-castillo.jpg


Estación de Esquí de Candanchú:
P1134218.jpg
 
Stage 4: Huesca - Lleida, 156km

2zs389e.png


voodu0.png


No categorised climbs at all today, instead this is all for the sprinters, a totally flat transitional stage linking two provincial capitals and taking us from Aragón into Catalunya. It isn't a long stage, but given the possibility of high heat that may be a good thing. The riders head from Huesca to Lleida by about the most direct route possible without using the Autovía, before a 16km circuit to the north of the old city.

Not really a lot to say about this one, except that it'll be one for the pure sprinters preparing for the Worlds, and keep the points situation interesting. Both cities have been fairly solid sponsors of cycling lately (Huesca on the route of the 2003, 2007 and 2012 Vueltas, Lleida in 2010 and 2012, although it no longer hosts its own .2 race as it did prior to 2008).

Huesca:
images


Lleida:
4-Lleida1.jpg
 
SetonHallPirate said:
Pretty sure I got the links right.

Minor issues to pick apart my own race:

1. The first half-dozen stages have virtually no KOMs to reward a failed break.
2. I would have liked to have a few more medium-mountain stages in there. It's a little light in that respect, especially to be going from a flat prologue, a flat team time trial, and five flat stages right into the Pyrenees' queen stage. I could probably expect the peloton to shrink by about 10-15 riders on that day alone, even before the start.
...

I agree with those two points of "criticism", and you seem to have included some goat tracks ( I have done that a couple of times too, when I got carried away) on the way to Vignemale and on the alternative climb towards l'Alpe d'Huez. But I have to say I really like your stage to the Col de Granon and even more so the one to Arinsal. The tt in Nice/Monaco seems pretty entertaining too, quite technical and not a metre flat, but still not too difficult.
 
Stage 5: Tremp - Els Cortals d'Encamp (AND), 180km

28whrts.png


2u74sn9.png


Climbs:
Port del Cantó (cat.1) 19,3km @ 5,4%
Coll de la Rabassa (cat.1) 13,2km @ 6,8%
Coll d'Ordino (cat.1) 17,9km @ 5,3%
Els Cortals d'Encamp (cat.1) 9,8km @ 8,4%

If the Candanchú stage enabled us to learn who would not be competing for the GC at the Vuelta, this, our first real mountain stage, certainly will tell us who will. The folks at Andorra seem to like having the Vuelta (or the Tour, or even the Volta a Catalunya) rocking up into town, so ahead of some perhaps more dramatic Catalan climbs, I've elected to go for this, a 'best-case-scenario' type of Andorra stage. To be fair to Unipublic, 2013 sees the best-designed Andorra stage in a long time; certainly an improvement on 2012's anæmic run-in, 2010's harbinger of Unipublic's things to come, or the 2009 Tour's abysmal Arcalis stage. A better job was done in 2008, with the double La Rabassa stage, but the one to which my attention was drawn was the short, but infinitely better than most of the previously-mentioned stages, 1999 stage to Arcalis, and it is to this that I have turned for inspiration.

Now, obviously, I am not a fan of Arcalis, as you probably well know. I have devised a stage instead which uses the other - harder - side of Ordino and then a new climb unknown to racing; however, if this were to be impossible for whatever reason (and if they can finish at Canolich like in 2012 and 2013 it really, really shouldn't), then I would utilise this alternative stage route, which uses the east side of Ordino descending into La Massana, and since it would typically be Vallnord paying for the stages (which usually end in Arcalis or Pal), finishing at Vallnord Sector Arinsal, which as you can see from the profile is an infinitely better finish than either of them. However, it's also an easier finish than Els Cortals, hence today's stage, which looks to shake the GC up properly for the first time, is looking to that.

The first 40km are just flat valley roads, before the first climb of the day, the long but relatively uncomplicated west side of the Port del Cantó. This well known Vuelta (& Volta) climb is wide and well maintained, and shouldn't pose any great difficulties. The long and gradual descent is mostly very fast, but has some technical sections near the bottom. Then there's an intermediate sprint in La Seu d'Urgell before a lengthy stretch of uphill false flat where we cross the border from España to Andorra. Almost immediately we hit Sant Julia de Lòria and turn right to hit the climb to La Rabassa. As you can see from this profile, the steepest stuff here is at the bottom, with some kilometres averaging over 9-10%. We only climb to about kilometre 13 on that profile however, marked at the Coll de la Rabassa with a turning towards Aixirivall, rather than heading all the way, as in 2008, to Naturlandia La Rabassa, Andorra's only dedicated Nordic skiing facility. From there it's a technical descent back to Sant Julia de Lòria, and back to our uphill false flat that takes us to our second intermediate sprint in the country's scenic capital. Here, where in the alternative stage we would continue northwards, we turn to the west, through the towns of La Massana and Ordino, and head up to the Coll d'Ordino - it is the left of these two profiles - though we will be descending the right one from the summit as far as Encamp. This popular climb appears in almost any Andorran stage, since its lacets and switchbacks make up one of very few real transitional passes that can be used in Andorra to link climbs. The descent is very technical, though the road surface is enough to satisfy even Bavarianrider, but then the riders must face the final climb.

Given the comparatively low gradients of Cantó and Ordino, I anticipate that this will come down to the final climb, although the lower slopes of La Rabassa are tough they are just too far from the finish. A strong break will no doubt need quite an advantage for this final climb, for this is one of the tougher Andorran summits, a roughly 10km ascent to Els Cortals d'Encamp. The profile you see there notes it as 15km at 6,8%, but we are only climbing from Encamp, so about 5km can be knocked off the length there, however all of the climb's most difficult stretches remain intact. It announces its intentions early, with the second kilometre averaging 11%, then three more between 9 and 10% mean that the bunch should be shredded by the time they get to the ramps later on. Els Cortals is a small ski station, but located in a tight, scenic valley, with tough switchbacks and views to die for. The Vuelta is go, and hopefully, having sacrificed letting him have a TTT, Javier Guillén will see my plea for designing stages with everything Andorra has to offer us, if the country continues to wish to promote itself through cycle racing (and why not?).

Tremp:
Plaza-de-la-Creu.jpg


Els Cortals d'Encamp:
20100728_elscortals12.JPG
 
Yea, the Volta did Els Cortals three years running '99-'01 in fact, but it's not been used in a decade now. Arinsal was used in 2007. I don't remember the '05 Volta but it had a stage to "Estación de Esquí Pal-Arinsal", so whether that's Pal or Arinsal I don't know, as they are two separate ski stations, but certainly no other uses of Arinsal this millennium, which is a shame as both Els Cortals and Arinsal are better than Pal and especially Arcalis. However while the Volta may have used them both in years gone by I believe either one would be a new summit finish for the Vuelta.

I also wish they'd finish paving the Encamp side of Beixalis to give a tougher alternative to Ordino as well.
 
Jun 28, 2012
798
0
0
Libertine Seguros said:
Yea, the Volta did Els Cortals three years running '99-'01 in fact, but it's not been used in a decade now. Arinsal was used in 2007. I don't remember the '05 Volta but it had a stage to "Estación de Esquí Pal-Arinsal", so whether that's Pal or Arinsal I don't know, as they are two separate ski stations, but certainly no other uses of Arinsal this millennium, which is a shame as both Els Cortals and Arinsal are better than Pal and especially Arcalis. However while the Volta may have used them both in years gone by I believe either one would be a new summit finish for the Vuelta.

I also wish they'd finish paving the Encamp side of Beixalis to give a tougher alternative to Ordino as well.
That's one thing...I always figure the major tours (Giro, Tour, Vuelta) could pave the roads (or have the roads paved for them) whenever they so desired.
 
Stage 6: Andorra-la-Vella (AND) - Barcelona, 198km

8wdzid.png


amvcso.png


Climbs:
Alto de la Collada de Clara (cat.3) 5,4km @ 6,2%

The next stage after the GC-shaking mountaintop finish at Els Cortals takes us back out of Andorra and back down through Catalunya to Barcelona. The linking of these two cities is fairly typical; the 2009 Tour connected them in the opposite direction before a mountaintop finish at Arcalis, while last year's Vuelta featured an almost identical stage to this one, although there is one key difference.

For the most part it's the same though; start in Andorra la Vella, descend back to La Seu d'Urgell on the same road that was climbed yesterday, head south to Oliana before turning towards Solsona over the biggest climb of the day, then head to Barcelona by just about the shortest route. The key difference is that after heading through Plaza España, rather than taking the windy Montjuïc climb of the closing stages in the 2012 Vuelta, the riders will simply follow the uphill sector of the old motor racing circuit from Guardia Urbana to the Olympic Stadium - i.e. the same finish as the 2009 Tour stage won by Thor Hushovd. This isn't really an uphill finish for the puncheurs, however it's certainly not a pure sprinter's finish - Tracks4bikers gives me the final 1,7km being 400m at 7%, then 700m more or less flat, 200m at 3% then the final 400m averaging 6%; and indeed that Tour stage that Hushovd won features Freire and Rojas with him in the top 3, however Pellizotti was 5th, Cadel Evans 9th, Cancellara 10th, Klöden 11th, Andy Schleck 13th, Nibali 14th and Cavendish 16th, so it makes for an intriguing mixed stage, both for the points classification and, with time bonuses, for the general classification if a guy like Valverde gets up there, however not as difficult as last year's Vuelta stage when Gilbert and Purito put a few seconds into the field.

Andorra la Vella:
andorra-la-vella-andorra.jpg


Barcelona:
poblesec.jpg
 
Sep 29, 2012
325
1
0
SetonHallPirate said:
That's one thing...I always figure the major tours (Giro, Tour, Vuelta) could pave the roads (or have the roads paved for them) whenever they so desired.
Because they are kinda close to the local authorities and those guys usually call for road refection. So when they find an interesting climb, they ask to the local city hall if they could pave the road so the race can have a big climb near them.

As these races are more than a century old (except for the Vuelta, but nevertheless it's still quite old), they have that kind of "secret power".

But sometimes, people (especially ecologists) don't like what they are doing. For example, La Planche des Belles Filles en 2012. A part of the station was destroyed just to create the final ramp and parkings.

This year, they plan to refect the road to Sarenne, and nearly 12,000 people have marked their opposition to the race passing through Sarenne (as Sarenne is a wildlife protection zone).
 
Mar 13, 2009
2,890
0
0
A Challenge

Not sure if I should make a new thread, but using the start and finish towns of this 2013, design a better one. Then we can vote on it and send it to ASO. Ok, maybe not that last bit, but certainly I want to see what's possible using the start and finish towns of the tour.
 
Dec 16, 2011
345
0
0
karlboss said:
Not sure if I should make a new thread, but using the start and finish towns of this 2013, design a better one. Then we can vote on it and send it to ASO. Ok, maybe not that last bit, but certainly I want to see what's possible using the start and finish towns of the tour.

Sure, you can put it here! It's been done before with the 2009,2012 and 2013 Tours, so this is the right place.
 
I'd kinda forgotten the Giro was starting in Belfast next year. I don't know if they've decided anything about the two stages being held there (or even if there are rumours about the route), but just thought I'd have a go at designing a fantasy TTT in my old home town.

2wobqcw.png


2cxurk2.jpg


You could actually run the course either way, but I'm starting out at Stormont (where the NI Assembly sits).

1e6edh.jpg


Anyway you'd have a nice easy start going down that hill, but shortly after that you'd begin a short climb up onto the Holywood Hills. The profile from mapmyride suggests it's max 7%, but unless my memory is playing tricks on me it's more than that at points, which could make it interesting. Good views from up on the hills of Belfast Lough and of the city itself. Quick descent down into Holywood (former home of Rory McIlroy), then back through into East Belfast via the Old Holywood Road. Unfortunately there may be a few less salubrious places we might have to go through on our route, but eventually we'd arrive at the Titanic Quarter (no doubt they'll be plugging this big style after all the money they've spent).

http://i40.tinypic.com/3323ply.jpg

Which you can see looks great - especially with Samson, or is it Goliath, in the background (the massive crane), but I'm told the exhibition itself is deadly dull.

Chances are though that if one of the stages is a TT, it will just be of a prologue length. Probably from the city centre to the Titanic Quarter, or just round the Titanic Quarter itself (both would probably be around 3km long).

It will be interesting to see what they do with the other stage. I'd be guessing they'd hit the NE coast road - Giant Causeway, Dunluce Castle, Bushmills etc.